Intermittent Fasting for Strength Training and Fat Loss - Part Two

[NotHereOrThere]

With the added bonus psychologically, strength/performance, and automagically it has increased my daily maintenance calorie intake (more NOM for me).

With the ADDITIONAL added bonus of freaking normal people out when they ask you how you are in such good shape and how you eat.

[limelite]

If there are other females out there who read this thread and can shed light on how you manage these monthly hunger and craving challenges while trying to practice IF'g, please share your experiences here.

As well, there may be other questions or concerns that women may want to share on this thread that relate to intermittent fasting, fat loss, training and/or nutrition.

I started early February, on the first week. It took me three weeks to adjust.. before I was eating 6 meals a day whether or not I was working out. Even until now, I still get hungry especially in the mornings, but the more I'm awake, the more I don't get hungry at all.

I know how Martin says that it should be 14 hrs for women, but I did mine strictly for 16 hours, and now I can go on a few more hours without a meal. Sometimes my eating window is only 5-6 hours instead of 8.

I train fasted, and working out just kills those "fasting" times.. I hit the gym at 9 AM, and find myself back at home by 12 and suddenly you realize how fast time flies. It certainly helps working out earlier, because (I don't know about you, but for me) working out makes me resist food until a couple of hours after.

If you go out of control... let me put it this way... so what? Get back on track, and get back to IF the next day. I've done that before.. I had a family reunion for brunch and it was way too early, but I wasn't gonna let IF ruin my family brunch. I ate earlier than usual, and I ate "normally" - went back on IF the next day. That was the first and only time I've gone off track.

As a lot of people have said, it's supposed to make your life easier. So don't stress about the details. You slip, just get back on track and keep doing what you're doing. One mistake isn't gonna ruin everything for you. Good luck!!

[mameimo]

I know it is widely recommended that your largest meal follows your workout but what should you do if you workout at the morning and have dinner at a buffet or something like that?

[.aeterna]

I know it is widely recommended that your largest meal follows your workout but what should you do if you workout at the morning and have dinner at a buffet or something like that?

8 hour feed
16 hour fast

make it work


e.g,

fasted workout at 9AM-10AM with BCAAS

break fast with a protein shake at 11AM

eat another shake during during the day at work

pig out at ur buffet at 6PM

idk, just make it work or lift after work then go straight to PWO buffet

[FitDad327]

I know it is widely recommended that your largest meal follows your workout but what should you do if you workout at the morning and have dinner at a buffet or something like that?

I personally just try to make sure that the majority of my calories are consumed after working out rather than before. I don't worry if that is in the first meal or last. Martin mentions this on the site in regards to someone who works out in the morning, but prefers to eat a big meal with their family at dinner. Like it's been said here before...IF is supposed to make life easier, make it work for you.

[Jenslyn17]

I know it is widely recommended that your largest meal follows your workout but what should you do if you workout at the morning and have dinner at a buffet or something like that?

Leangains site says the rule is not carved in stone... if you prefer having your largest meal later, do that and maybe your second largest right after you workout. It's not that important

[FitDad327]

Exactly!

People are completely missing the point of Leangains. I dont think its something you should really do unless you first have a good grasp of the irrelevence of meal timing, macronutrient and caloric requirements, and most of all the time and effort applied to reading all the information that Martin has provided FREE OF CHARGE. It bothers me that people are gonna try and use Leangains and its gonna get them ****ty results, and they are going to blame leangains and Martin, not the fact they are lazy and too ignorant to conduct any kind of lengthy research into a method they are living their life by. I can imagine this becoming a problem which could potentially make Martin look bad.....

There is no excuse now as you have been hand fed many valuable links in my other post above. Hand fed like small turtles, mindlessly swimming through the undergrowth of a murky stream.

This is why we need the book lol !

Sadly, even with the book, lazy people are going to ask redundant questions because they don't want to put any work in. Great posts, thanks for bringing this thread back to center.

[PerpetualMotion]

I know it is widely recommended that your largest meal follows your workout but what should you do if you workout at the morning and have dinner at a buffet or something like that?

The answer is a 24-hour fast (or however long the fast is until the buffet). If I know I'm going out (and I still try to make everything fit in my calories and macros) then I fast for 24 hours. Brad Pilon said that people who fudge their diet hard after such a long fast don't screw up their overall physique goals. This way, your meal is always going to be post-workout.

[JavaT]

I am not a female (obviously haha), but i think it is perfectly fine if you simply dont fast during those periods in which you find it difficult. It will not make a difference in the long run.

Nope. Obviously not. (Touche! You look great!)

But I appreciate your input/feedback regardless. That is my hope -- that if I lose control during those few days and eat way more cals/carbs than I intend to, that I can get back to fasting protocol w/o having inflicted too much damage (or backtracking) to my progress.

Thank you.

[JavaT]

I started early February, on the first week. It took me three weeks to adjust.. before I was eating 6 meals a day whether or not I was working out. Even until now, I still get hungry especially in the mornings, but the more I'm awake, the more I don't get hungry at all.

I know how Martin says that it should be 14 hrs for women, but I did mine strictly for 16 hours, and now I can go on a few more hours without a meal. Sometimes my eating window is only 5-6 hours instead of 8.

I train fasted, and working out just kills those "fasting" times.. I hit the gym at 9 AM, and find myself back at home by 12 and suddenly you realize how fast time flies. It certainly helps working out earlier, because (I don't know about you, but for me) working out makes me resist food until a couple of hours after.

If you go out of control... let me put it this way... so what? Get back on track, and get back to IF the next day. I've done that before.. I had a family reunion for brunch and it was way too early, but I wasn't gonna let IF ruin my family brunch. I ate earlier than usual, and I ate "normally" - went back on IF the next day. That was the first and only time I've gone off track.

As a lot of people have said, it's supposed to make your life easier. So don't stress about the details. You slip, just get back on track and keep doing what you're doing. One mistake isn't gonna ruin everything for you. Good luck!!

Thanks for this response, Limelight. I'm eager to hear feedback from other women's experiences with this approach. I've read through practically every word of the LeanGains website/blog, and I see so few references to how this plan can be equally successful for women, comparatively speaking.

You said it took you 3 wks to adjust. That's helpful to know. My hunger pangs come and go. A few days before TOM hit, I was making it through the final hours of the fasting window with relatively no hunger issues at all. Hoping I won't have a challenging "readjustment" given my debauchery.

That's great that you're able to train fasted as often as you do. I have trained fasted only once, last Saturday, and it was FABULOUS. I was amazed that I was able to have the sustainable energy to have such a great workout. I trained hard for 55 mins, followed by 20 mins of s/s cardio. I wish I had the luxury of training fasted more often, but I work M-F and my work hours do not afford that flexibility. So Saturdays will be my only time to make use of that opportunity.

I'm keeping a journal of my IF'g journey -- how I feel, hunger levels, energy levels, nutrition, weight, mirror feedback, (TOM binges!) etc. I'm having my body fat measured at my gym this coming Monday. Anxious to see where all of this takes me and hoping for a positive impact on my insulin response, ability to manage hunger better, and a more favorable body comp. I refuse to let AGE be a detriment.

Thanks again for your feedback.

[J.Thomas]

Was wondering earlier...say a person had do much coffee with cream to break the fast in the body like 2hrs or so earlier. What effects on the body does it present?

[Crash67]

I have slipped up the last 2 days. Between the state legislature winding down and all the stress that has brought my hotel kicked me out 2 days early, I have been not following IF as strictly as i was but once i get back to my apartment and in my normal surroundings. Its time to start back up again and watch the pounds disappear again

[Locavore]

It took me two weeks to adjust, I'd say.

I'm glad you started this thread, Java! You saw a need and made it happen. I don't have a whole lot to contribute right this moment, but I'll be back...

[coopermax]

2 downsides to cutting!!!

Must eat less - but IF makes it much easier, as eating BIG meals suites me pretty well

I am on a mission to lose EVERY bit of the love handles i have left..problem is, i will get pretty small over all trying to accomplish this...BUT then...I get to bump the cals...and do a nice SLOW steady bulk....

thanks to all the guys continually taking the time to help out the new guys on this board...

[milkneggs786]

I asked a stupid question earlier, but found the answer myself. Thought Id post the info id found for others who are new to leangains.

If your wondering if a little creamer/cinnamon/milk to your coffee/tea will break your fast, no it wont. As long as what ever you add is less than 50 calories total during the whole fast, its ok. Just as Mr.Berkhan said, fasting is not a "all or nothing" type of thing. That being said, if you have something small like a slice of cucumber, it may not be such a good idea, because it will actually end up stimulating you hunger instead of satiating you. I made this mistake myself and its much better just to stick with a good amount of coffee/tea and tons of water. (All credit for the info goes to Mr.Berkhan)

Also, I think it would be beneficial if a few of you experienced IF'ers would post your goals and the specifics of your nutrition/training plan to help the IF newbies just starting out. This type of nutrition plan is such a dramatic departure from the norm, that maybe seeing some relate-able stats would ease some of the IF newcomer's minds. I know it would help me. Maybe something like this:

-Whats are your goals (fatloss, recomp, muscle gain)
-Whats your TDEE calories and how far below or above are you consuming everyday?
-How often do you lift (what kind- high volume, HIT, ect.) and do you do any cardio?

Im sure everyone knows the 16 hour fast, 8 hour feed protocol so I dont think there is any need to post that since all the schedules are posted on leangains.com anyway. But if you would like to any way, please be my guest.

Im a total IF newbie, but ill put mine up anyway:

-Goals: get rid of fat covering my lower two abs, hold onto as much muscle as possible and maybe even add a little.
-TDEE: 2800 cal and am eating at 2500 cal a day (High pro/high carb/mod fat).
-I lift 6 days a week using high volume training now, but may switch to something more like HIT later down the road. I dont do any cardio.

[foodpr0n]

So to make some references for people

READ www.leangains.com BEFORE YOU ASK ALREADY ANSWERED QUESTIONS (NEARLY ALL HAVE BEEN ANSWERED)

IMPORTANT READS;

-The LeanGains Guide
-Top Ten Fasting Myths Debunked
-Supplements you might actually find useful
-Brief Primer on popular approaches to IF
-More on What is IF?, How to implement it etc..
-Intermitted Fasting, Set-Point and Leptin
-Intermittent Fasting and Stubborn Body Fat
-Scorch Through your Fat-loss plateau
-Maintaining Low Body fat
-How to look awesome everyday
-The Secret Benefit of being lean
-The truth about alcohol, fat loss and muscle
-Cheat day strategies for a hedonist


And much more on the site

Juuuuust going to bump this

[ErickStevens]

Deadlift PR today: 500 x 2 @ 200lbs. Fasted.

[determined4000]

Juuuuust going to bump this

you have the link to the 'be your own coach' post (or something to that effect)?

[DeltaNitro]

It took me two weeks to adjust, I'd say.

I'm glad you started this thread, Java! You saw a need and made it happen. I don't have a whole lot to contribute right this moment, but I'll be back...

How is the Running coming along? are you still doing it fasted? I remember when i was first reading through this thread or the old thread, you said you were an avid runner and were looking into ways to incorporate it into IF.

ANY details or info would be great.

I may be mixing up the running,hiit,temp runs 3x/week

[Paperplanes]

Since i'm doing IF this week my training is less less intense. I've no big motivition when i'm in the gym. Is this normal in the first week?

I also wanna know if there are people here doing IF with just a normal 4 day split with moderation volume(lets say 24-32 sets each workout), because Martin advices low volume 3 times a week.

[ErickStevens]

Since i'm doing IF this week my training is less less intense. I've no big motivition when i'm in the gym. Is this normal in the first week?

I also wanna know if there are people here doing IF with just a normal 4 day split with moderation volume(lets say 24-32 sets each workout), because Martin advices low volume 3 times a week.

There's a reason Martin recommends low volume for fasted training. I use a 3 day split and never do more than 12 working sets per workout. Cut your volume and frequency down or just don't train fasted.

[Jenslyn17]

I do tons more than that and really don't have a problem training fasted... on a cut! I don't think it's necessarily bad. I've kept my strength just fine during the cut and I feel energized and ready for the entire workout

I do take 10 grams BCAA though... and if I do cardio after my workout (I really prefer to do it there, not because it's optimal) I'll have some more BCAAs or whey before that

[Locavore]

How is the Running coming along? are you still doing it fasted? I remember when i was first reading through this thread or the old thread, you said you were an avid runner and were looking into ways to incorporate it into IF.

ANY details or info would be great.

I may be mixing up the running,hiit,temp runs 3x/week

Still running, still fasted. I did end up wimping out on the longer distances and had 150 total cals of milk and Froot Loops (LOL) beforehand, but that was just for the 10 mile run and the half marathon. Superstition more than anything else. All of my other training up to 9.5 miles was fasted. My regular runs during the week are 4-6 miles and some HIIT, fasted-- no issues. For the longer distances, the key is proper nutrition (higher carbs, little-no deficit) in the two days prior.

Good luck!

[Paperplanes]

There's a reason Martin recommends low volume for fasted training. I use a 3 day split and never do more than 12 working sets per workout. Cut your volume and frequency down or just don't train fasted.

I'n not training fasted, i'm eating about 600 kcal before i'm working out and no cardio. Than a 4 day split is ok don't you think?

[OliFs]

I believe the low volume advocacy is mainly relevant if you're at a caloric deficit but up towards 30 sets is way too much either way

[pro-tein]

Oh boy, it is so hard to convince other people around me, that the 6 meals a day and spent all your money on supplements- attitude is probably not the right one.
I tell people to stop spending money on bars, amino tabs, 7 different proteins, but they are so brainwashed by the dogmas from the last centuries, they really think i am crazy
Glad we have a nice threat here, with people who are openminded.
Anyone els sometimes feels like a jehovas whitness, when talking about IF to others??

[Paperplanes]

I believe the low volume advocacy is mainly relevant if you're at a caloric deficit but up towards 30 sets is way too much either way

I'm 250 kcal up on trainingsdays and about 750/500 down on restdays. 30 sets isn't that much, example:

Back, Rear Delts and Biceps:

4 exercises 4 sets Back
1 exercise 4 sets Rear Delt
3 exercises 4 sets Biceps = 32 sets, just a normal split..

[Dexter3000]

Oh boy, it is so hard to convince other people around me, that the 6 meals a day and spent all your money on supplements- attitude is probably not the right one.
I tell people to stop spending money on bars, amino tabs, 7 different proteins, but they are so brainwashed by the dogmas from the last centuries, they really think i am crazy
Glad we have a nice threat here, with people who are openminded.
Anyone els sometimes feels like a jehovas whitness, when talking about IF to others??

I never talk about training/diet in general actually, it's my own thing and people don't understand anyway. I answer every question I get, but never start about it myself. Saves a lot of time and ignorance

[benwin21]

you have the link to the 'be your own coach' post (or something to that effect)?

you mean this:
http://www.leangains.com/2011/02/how...your-true.html
?

I'm 250 kcal up on trainingsdays and about 750/500 down on restdays. 30 sets isn't that much, example:

Back, Rear Delts and Biceps:

4 exercises 4 sets Back
1 exercise 4 sets Rear Delt
3 exercises 4 sets Biceps = 32 sets, just a normal split..

i'm doing some kind of a similar routine
16 sets for the back
4 sets for traps
2 set rear shoulder
6 sets for biceps

[sportyaccordy]

How much of a swing are people doing for carb cycling in a cut? I am on a slow bulk now doing 2k on off days and 3 k on on days w/3 off days and 4 on for a net 2600/day or so. Thinking of switching to 4 off days and 3 on days at 1.5k/off and 3k on, which will be like 2100 overall, hopefully w/good leptin control. Just curious to see what other people are doing and how they managed hunger in cuts.