Milk, good or bad?

[arose70]

Hi, I have recently added skim milk to my diet to increase my cals a bit. I started with 16 ounces but I may add another glass to up it to 24 ounces of milk. I want to lose fat and was wondering if anyone knew any reasons why I should not be adding the milk to my diet?

I just read a post in the nutrition section about milk and most said they drank it while bulking, which is not what I am trying to accomplish.

Thanks!!!

[txssweetie]

recent studies are saying that people who drink milk have much less of a weight problem than people who dont drink it. scientists are also saying that calcium helps aid weightloss. Plus, you need it for strong bones, ESPECIALLY women. the casien protein in milk is extremely good for your body as well. but keep up the skim milk because anything more than that may do more harm than good. also try to aim for 3 servings a day.

[TAR68]

Yes milk is good for you even if your goal is fat loss.

[Pandora]

There are lots of opinions on this. I opt for unsweetened soymilk, personally. I cannot seem to lean down when I have dairy. But that's a very individual thing. Some can, some cannot.

Recently a study was released by teh FDA (I think.. sorry.. not totally sure, but I can search it out) that said dairy was not so great for weight loss after all. And still more that say it is.

At any rate, I'd not drink 24 oz a day. That amount of milk will have 48 grams of sugars. Granted it is natural sugar.. but it's still sugar.

Jess
www.terrafitness.com

[arose70]

Thanks everyone, I just added it so I'll start with 16 ounces and then see how it effects me. I am not trying to lean down now as I have too much bf to lose. Once I get to a respectable bf% I'll see if I should cut it. Thank you very much

[MissKristi]

recent studies are saying that people who drink milk have much less of a weight problem than people who dont drink it. scientists are also saying that calcium helps aid weightloss. Plus, you need it for strong bones, ESPECIALLY women. the casien protein in milk is extremely good for your body as well. but keep up the skim milk because anything more than that may do more harm than good. also try to aim for 3 servings a day.

yes but the did u also noitice that the people that promote that are the american dairy council?...milk is not good for you, its for cows, not for humans. our bodies are not meant to digest it which is why so many people are lactose intolerant. theres so much hormones that the milk actually helps cause osteoporosis not prevent it. http://www.milksucks.com/index2.html

[terracotta]

LOL - this has to be the one issue MsFit and I disagree with the most.

It has been talked about numerous times in the past:
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hlight=calcium

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hlight=calcium

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hlight=calcium

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hlight=calcium

And some more really good reads here:



Calcium and Dairy Acceleration of Weight and Fat Loss during Energy Restriction in Obese Adults

Mechanisms of Dairy Modulation of Adiposity

Role of calcium and dairy products in energy partitioning and weight management

Role of dietary calcium and dairy products in modulating adiposity.



Here are some other really good reads about the role of dairy in fat loss:

Dietary Proteins in the Regulation of Food Intake and Body Weight in Humans


Manufacture and Use of Dairy Protein Fractions


Anyway - Some important points that I will raise:
- The biological value of calcium in things such as green vegetables is basically null and void. The oxalate in these things bind the calcium in the intestine and prevent the absorption. So if you are really concerned with calcium you are going to have to look for alternative sources other than these... Things like whole bones in salmon/sardines are good...

- Using 'evolution' and not drinking milk as a reason not to drink it now is a good point, but you are forgetting the other evolutionary practices that no longer occur that help in this 'working'. Things like:

• the level of physical activity would have been hugely different - your bones would have constantly been stressed with much heavier loads and much more activity....
• Your diet would have been different too - your would have eaten much more calcium from things such as bone marrow/small bones and whole nuts and seeds.
• You would not have gone through menopause! Biologically, we are not really 'programmed' to reach this age - so the effects of the lack of oestrogen would not have been experienced like it is today... So you simply do not know what would have happened in females if they had of lived to this age!!

If you are really concerned (and you rightly should be) then I would suggest you get yourself a good calcium suppliment. Something that is high in both calcium CITRATE and hyproxyapitate. These are the two most biologically available/digestable and useful forms of calcium suppliment you can get. I would aim for at least 1000mg a day from these, spread over the day so you get some in the morning and some just before bed. These are the times they are most useful (the times when your body has the hormonal balance best for their absorption and encorporation into your bones).

Also, be careful of what you take them with as things such as fibre can hinder their absorption and make them less useful.


At the end of the day it is all a matter of your individual preference for dairy, your bodies ability to cope with lactose and your over-all calorie deficiency... Personally - I would leave the dairy in. I have cut to 9% all the while eating dairy and I did not have a problem at all. To me, my bones and my health are far more important.


Oh - and I really, really do not agree with anything Mercola says... In my opinion he practices voodoo nutrition! Sorry Ms Fit!

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...ighlight=dairy

here you go arose.

[Paichka]

People who are lactose intolerant generally come from populations which did not domesticate the cow -- Native Americans, Asiatic populations, sub-saharan Africans. However, these populations do drink milk -- just not COW'S milk. MOST people descended from European populations have no problem digesting milk. I have a serious problem with people using our evolutionary roots to justify modern dietary practice. "Our ancestors did it, so that must be the natural/right/healthy/etc way to live." This is the fallacious thinking behind the caveman diet, the blood type diet, the hunter-gatherer diet...ugh.

If you don't want to drink milk, don't drink it...but don't scare people with psuedoscience either.

http://www.notmilk.com/
This site claims milk leads to early sexual maturity for girls. (Personally I think the reason young girls look different nowadays has more to do with Britney Spears than the American Dairy Council...but that's just me) It also claims milk causes cancer and blames milk for childhood diabetes, heart disease, cancer, depression, and allergies.

Milksucks.com is a site with a definite agenda...PETA speaks out against a lot of things, and I am leery of taking nutritional advice from an organization that's against ingesting animal products for ethical rather than health reasons.

Dairy is a great source of calcium. There are other sources of course, but I think we can all agree that calcium is important so really, who cares how you get it? If you like dairy and tolerate it well, eat up and be happy. If you hate dairy, don't tolerate it well, are vegan and/or are getting sufficient calcium from other dietary sources, then go forth and drink no milk.

I don't know why people insist on demonizing whole sections of the nutritional pyramid...first it was fats (omigod!), then carbs...what's next? If you can take anything from our evolutionary history, it's that we're omnivores. We need lots of different things and have the ability to utilize many different nutrient sources. If you cut one source out completely, you run the risk of nutritional deficiency.

*shrug*
my 2 cents,
Sunny

[Miranda]

i was a vegan for 4 years and only drank soy milk. apart from getting pretty fat in that period (only tofu and beans doth not muscle make), i didn't feel that healthy either. when i started w/ dairy again i noticed pretty quickly a loss in abdominal fat. these days i rarely drink milk as it is too sweet for my taste, but use buttermilk (love . . .) and ff yogurt. these are especially great if you have problems digesting milk, because the lactose is broken down.

[arose70]

Wow, great, thank you!!!! I will do my reading from Terra and Paichka! Thanks ya'll!!!

[Beklet]

You could also try goats, sheep or buffalo milk - they are supposed to have different health benefits (some have more fat though!)

Personally, I have to admit to drinking whole milk (or semi skimmed if I must). The reasoning being that I don't actually drink that much, and what I do have, I want to enjoy. You might catch me eating low fat yoghurt occasionally, or reduced fat butter, but that's about it.

[Foxy_Blonde]

Personally I think milk isn't meant for humans, only baby cows.

and here's some more info on milk

http://www.freedomyou.com/nutrition_...%20Cookies.htm


I think it's really about calcium!

[tigercat24]

completely agree with the above poster milk=sugar and full of antibiotics yuk!!!!!
eat almond, spinach, brocolli calcium supplements etc...

[Paichka]

As Terra pointed out through Emma's earlier post, the calcium gotten from leafy greens is not a viable source. It isn't well absorbed into the body.

If you have a problem with milk (and if your chief concern is the antibiotics, have you looked into organic milk?) then don't drink it. But don't rely on spinach to build strong bones. Definitely take a supplement.

And not to be a huge pain, but "x isn't meant for humans" is kind of a silly argument. Humans do lots of things we weren't biologically meant to -- we get vasectemies, go skydiving, wear spandex, write books and support our industrial society with the fruits of agriculture. My favorite human trait is our adaptability. Besides, without milk, there would be no ice cream. And as we all know, without ice cream, all would be darkness and chaos.

Sunny

[Miranda]

As Terra pointed out through Emma's earlier post, the calcium gotten from leafy greens is not a viable source. It isn't well absorbed into the body.

If you have a problem with milk (and if your chief concern is the antibiotics, have you looked into organic milk?) then don't drink it. But don't rely on spinach to build strong bones. Definitely take a supplement.

And not to be a huge pain, but "x isn't meant for humans" is kind of a silly argument. Humans do lots of things we weren't biologically meant to -- we get vasectemies, go skydiving, wear spandex, write books and support our industrial society with the fruits of agriculture. My favorite human trait is our adaptability. Besides, without milk, there would be no ice cream. And as we all know, without ice cream, all would be darkness and chaos.

Sunny

luv ya!

[MissKristi]

its not really a silly argumnet when people are trying to figure out why the hell get so sick from eating certain things that arent meant for our bodies. i mean i totally agree wiht you witht eh ice cream thing its fun to enjoy but the reality is, we have a huge promlem in this society, not just with milk but with everything that we eat. sometiems i feel like i have to do serious reserch on everythign that goes in my mouth to make sure that its somehting i want going in there. beacuase we all know we cant always trust the food labels.

[Paichka]

its not really a silly argumnet when people are trying to figure out why the hell get so sick from eating certain things that arent meant for our bodies. i mean i totally agree wiht you witht eh ice cream thing its fun to enjoy but the reality is, we have a huge promlem in this society, not just with milk but with everything that we eat. sometiems i feel like i have to do serious reserch on everythign that goes in my mouth to make sure that its somehting i want going in there. beacuase we all know we cant always trust the food labels.

Hey, I'm with you on that one. It's a good thing I like research.

You SHOULD be well-informed about everything that goes into your body, and the ultimate reality is that some foods are going to bother some people. There's no perfect diet plan or perfect exercise plan or perfect anything that's going to please everyone at the same time. I mean, if I eat less than 160g of carbs a day, I lose my mind, whereas some people on here swear by things like ketosis diets...if I tried a ketosis diet, I would be a danger to myself or others. Ultimately though, we have to gauge "what's right" by what works for us.

I have a problem with people demonizing certain food groups for little to no reason...a lot of the so-called scientific studies on the harmful effects of dairy on the human body are based on shoddy research, are not published in peer-reviewed journals (my acid test for whether or not an article is legit), or were done by a group with a specific agenda rather than by an unbiased third party.

My ultimate point is, no food or food group is evil or "bad" for us, except maybe oreos. Some people will exhibit food sensitivity no matter WHAT the food...take shellfish for example. Because some people have a sensitivity to shellfish, does that mean we should all hop on the "omigod shellfish sucks!" bandwagon? Experiment, figure out what works for you, and be happy. Moderation is the key -- ANY food can have a negative effect on you if you overindulge. Wine, chocolate, peanut butter, avocados, tuna, red meat, carrots, grains...all of those things can really play havok on your system if you go nuts, but have been shown to have a significant health benefit (antioxidants in dark chocolate, for example) in moderation. There's my favorite word again.

Sorry for the essay, this is just a topic I feel strongly about.

cheers,
Sunny