Rick Perry on Evolution

[amtharin]

There isn't one, it's not a scientific term.
Depending on the stage of development, it's actually up for debate. In the case of abortion, however, a legal definition is far more important, especially given that there are circumstances where taking life is completely lawful.

Lol? I'm not a fan of the democratic party, but unless you see democrats having to deny major scientific theories to have a chance in the primaries, you don't have much of a point.

^^^ We have another science denier right here.

[amtharin]

you claimed a fetus is a baby. i asked you to give a scientific definition of what a fetus is. you didn't.

Well that is your dumbass fault. As pointed out, its not a scientific term. You know what they say about asking stupid questions...

now you're saying they're both the same because they're both alive?

No you dumbfuk, I said look up the definition of "alive", and see how that applies to a fetus.

[kel_varnsen]

Well that is your dumbass fault. As pointed out, its not a scientific term. You know what they say about asking stupid questions...



No you dumbfuk, I said look up the definition of "alive", and see how that applies to a fetus.

ok, present a scientific argument for why a fetus is a baby?

[amtharin]

ok, present a scientific argument for why a fetus is a baby?

If "baby" is not a scientific term, the htf do you expect someone to do that?


That is why I defaulted to the term "alive", but you still have not figured that out.



But you're pretty much proving my point, which is that a fetus is a human life, and it is alive, but you will twist the facts anyway you can to say that its not. You're denying the the science behind it.

[kel_varnsen]

That is why I defaulted to the term "alive", but you still have not figured that out.

But you're pretty much proving my point, which is that a fetus is a human live, and it is alive, but you will twist the facts anyway you can to say that its not, and that killing it should not be a big deal. You're denying the the science behind it.

which science am i denying? that a fetus is alive?

ok, so you're now saying a fetus is a human life? define "human" for me and tell me exactly when the zygote becomes a "human".

[amtharin]

which science am i denying? that a fetus is alive?

ok, so you're now saying a fetus is a human life? define "human" for me and tell me exactly when the zygote becomes a "human".

Our DNA makes us human (that is science), a zygote/fetus has human DNA.


Why do you want to deny this obvious science?? Should I be worried that so many people in the democratic party are science deniers??

[cncman]

^^^ We have another science denier right here.

will you shut up and stop grasping for straws you prolife retard?

[amtharin]

will you shut up and stop grasping for straws you prolife retard?

You mean grasping at straws like this entire herp derp talking point that republicans dont believe in science???

[MyLastSerenade]

If you kill a woman, and she is pregnant, it's double murder, but it's okay for her to have an abortion?



I have a question, does everyone who doesn't like Rick Perry in here, (including me) love everything about the candidate they vote for?

[semitope]

How the world's most technologically advanced nation and the sole superpower of Earth still debates this issue is a stain on humanity. If evolution has gaps, then the bible has black holes in it's alternative explanation.

Yeah. Its strange. Strange that a country like China is more liberal about questioning the theory of evolution that the wonderful US of A. Somehow evolution has become the standard that humans are judged by, ignore the fact that it does have some MASSIVE problems. The issue is not the bible so I don't know why you people feel its necessary to always bring it in when someone questions evolution. You have atheist scientists who don't agree with it. The only reason you would need to bring in the Bible is if you consider your belief in evolution to be of a religious nature subconsciously.

On abortion. Do you think you would have been born to some other parents if your parents had chosen to abort you? Do you think you would have existed at all? Would you have the minded being aborted? We think we can decide to just kill any unborn child just because we are around to make that choice. You are still killing someone

[PowerSwede]

Well why are you keeping us all in suspense waiting on this scientific definition?? Post it.

While you're at it, look up the definition of "alive", and see if that applies to a fetus as well.


Then ask yourself the herp derp question, Why don't democrats believe in science???

No, look up human life and see if that applies to a pre week 25 fetus. It doesn't. It's as much alive as any braindead born baby, it has no cerebral cortex activity beyond random impulse.

[amtharin]

Yeah. Its strange. Strange that a country like China is more liberal about questioning the theory of evolution that the wonderful US of A. Somehow evolution has become the standard that humans are judged by, ignore the fact that it does have some MASSIVE problems. The issue is not the bible so I don't know why you people feel its necessary to always bring it in when someone questions evolution. You have atheist scientists who don't agree with it. The only reason you would need to bring in the Bible is if you consider your belief in evolution to be of a religious nature subconsciously

What an excellent point...

I wonder if these talking heads from the left would have the nerve to tell a scientist, they they don't believe in science??

[amtharin]

No, look up human life and see if that applies to a pre week 25 fetus. It doesn't. It's as much alive as any braindead born baby, it has no cerebral cortex activity beyond random impulse.

What does being brain dead have to do with it?? Just because someone is brain dead, does not mean they are not human, or not alive.

Stop denying science man.

[PowerSwede]

Our DNA makes us human (that is science), a zygote/fetus has human DNA.

The umbilical cord has unique DNA, is it a human being? Let's not discard this assemblage of unique DNA, let's keep it alive forever!

[PowerSwede]

What does being brain dead have to do with it?? Just because someone is brain dead, does not mean the are not human, or not alive.

Human life is well defined and someone who is braindead is not alive anymore, they are per definition dead.

[amtharin]

The umbilical cord has unique DNA, is it a human being? Let's not discard this assemblage of unique DNA, let's keep it alive forever!

I said DNA makes it human, and if an umbilical cord has human DNA, then its a "human" umbilical cord. Just like my finger is not a human, but it is a human finger. A human fetus is a living human.


Your analogy sucks.

[PowerSwede]

Yeah. Its strange. Strange that a country like China is more liberal about questioning the theory of evolution that the wonderful US of A. Somehow evolution has become the standard that humans are judged by, ignore the fact that it does have some MASSIVE problems. The issue is not the bible so I don't know why you people feel its necessary to always bring it in when someone questions evolution. You have atheist scientists who don't agree with it. The only reason you would need to bring in the Bible is if you consider your belief in evolution to be of a religious nature subconsciously.

On abortion. Do you think you would have been born to some other parents if your parents had chosen to abort you? Do you think you would have existed at all? Would you have the minded being aborted? We think we can decide to just kill any unborn child just because we are around to make that choice. You are still killing someone

Yet it's observed every day... but don't trust reality, believe some goat herders 2K year old words on the matter.

[amtharin]

Human life is well defined and someone who is braindead is not alive anymore, they are per definition dead.

Post the definition then...

And brain dead people are alive man, are you now denying even more science??

[PowerSwede]

I said DNA makes it human, and if an umbilical cord has human DNA, then its a "human" umbilical cord. Just like my finger is not a human, but it is a human finger.


Your analogy sucks.

You're not getting it, the human umbilical cord is as much alive and has the same amount of cerebral cortex activity as the lump of cells you call a "baby", they are equal when it comes to human life.

[semitope]

Human life is well defined and someone who is braindead is not alive anymore, they are per definition dead.

with no hope of being otherwise. We all know the future of an embryo. No-one would be willing to let a brain-dead man die a real death if they knew he would be up and well 9 months later. They would be considered murderers if they did.

[PowerSwede]

Post the definition then...

And brain dead people are alive man, are you now denying even more science??

No, brain dead people are harvested for organs, it's not murder to do so because the person is by clinical definition dead.

I'm a biochemist, i'm denying what you think is science simply because you're an ignorant fuck who think that your definitions have any bearing on reality.

[amtharin]

You're not getting it, the human umbilical cord is as much alive and has the same amount of cerebral cortex activity as the lump of cells you call a "baby", they are equal when it comes to human life.

No, you're not getting it.

Yeah they are both alive, and they bout have no cerebral cortex activity, but the same can be said for a plant. They are not equal because one is a developing human, the other is just a piece of a human.


Again, why do you have a problem with science??

[amtharin]

No, brain dead people are harvested for organs, it's not murder to do so because the person is by clinical definition dead.

I'm a biochemist, i'm denying what you think is science simply because you're an ignorant fuck who think that your definitions have any bearing on reality.

Stupid is the only thing you are if you continue to say that brain dead people are not alive.

[PowerSwede]

with no hope of being otherwise. We all know the future of an embryo. No-one would be willing to let a brain-dead man die a real death if they knew he would be up and well 9 months later. They would be considered murderers if they did.

First of all, what MIGHT happen (in many cases it doesn't) doesn't change the fact that taking a human life requires killing a living human, by definition a clinically dead person (brain dead) is not alive.

Second, there is no question whether you would have the right to remove a brain dead person occupying your body and parasiting off of you, you would.

[dmc90]

Yeah. Its strange. Strange that a country like China is more liberal about questioning the theory of evolution that the wonderful US of A. Somehow evolution has become the standard that humans are judged by, ignore the fact that it does have some MASSIVE problems. The issue is not the bible so I don't know why you people feel its necessary to always bring it in when someone questions evolution. You have atheist scientists who don't agree with it. The only reason you would need to bring in the Bible is if you consider your belief in evolution to be of a religious nature subconsciously.

On abortion. Do you think you would have been born to some other parents if your parents had chosen to abort you? Do you think you would have existed at all? Would you have the minded being aborted? We think we can decide to just kill any unborn child just because we are around to make that choice. You are still killing someone

Like what?

And on the second bold, who, for example?

[markymark69]

If you kill a woman, and she is pregnant, it's double murder, but it's okay for her to have an abortion?



I have a question, does everyone who doesn't like Rick Perry in here, (including me) love everything about the candidate they vote for?

It's one thing to disagree with a policy belief that candidate has...but when you have a candidate that is denying reality and questions science in general...thinks we should teach mythology and alchemy along with science and allow the people to decide which is true...that is not mere policy debate.

[amtharin]

First of all, what MIGHT happen (in many cases it doesn't) doesn't change the fact that taking a human life requires killing a living human, by definition a clinically dead person (brain dead) is not alive.

Second, there is no question whether you would have the right to remove a brain dead person occupying your body and parasiting off of you, you would.

Well if we are making up weird hypotheticals, then there is no way you would be allowed to kill a fetus if it grew outside of the human body.

[PowerSwede]

Stupid is the only thing you are if you continue to say that brain dead people are not alive.

Not in the US, not since 1976, and not in Sweden either. In all nations with an active organ donor system brain death is accepted as a definition for death.

[PowerSwede]

Well if we are making up weird hypotheticals, then there is no way you would be allowed to kill a fetus if it grew outside of the human body.

If it's dead then you can't kill it, if it's post week 25 then no, there would be no need for it.

[PowerSwede]

with no hope of being otherwise. We all know the future of an embryo. No-one would be willing to let a brain-dead man die a real death if they knew he would be up and well 9 months later. They would be considered murderers if they did.

I'll repeat my earlier statement, you cannot kill what is not alive.

There is no possibility to recover from brain death so the argument is moot. I do realise what you are getting at and sure, if you grew a baby outside any person then no person should have a say about what happens to it, not the biological parents either if they freely participated.

Just to get this out of the way, stop saying "we all know what is the future of an embryo" because no one really does know. It's not semantics either because there is no way of knowing whether it will be born or if it will ever be alive.