AllPro: A Simple Beginner's Routine part IIII

[WalterStark]

Sorry to ask a question on nutrition but I feel I will get a straight answer here. Anyway, my body weight is about 161lbs, and ny body fat is roughly 18-20%. From reading the forums theres a mixed opinion on wether to bulk or cut at my BF. Many seem to think that my BF is to high to bulk. Im also reading that recomp could be a good idea for my size and weight.

Could I ask for peoples opinions on what I should do because im oficially confused and stuck, possibly someone who was in a similar position to me?

[Cranz]

Sorry to ask a question on nutrition but I feel I will get a straight answer here. Anyway, my body weight is about 161lbs, and ny body fat is roughly 18-20%. From reading the forums theres a mixed opinion on wether to bulk or cut at my BF. Many seem to think that my BF is to high to bulk. Im also reading that recomp could be a good idea for my size and weight.

Could I ask for peoples opinions on what I should do because im oficially confused and stuck, possibly someone who was in a similar position to me?

At your age ( done growing ), and being 18-20BF%, you can really do both. My advice would just be either PROPERLY cut or bulk. Don't bother with trying to eat maintenance, and recomp, for most people it won't work.

Bulking will give you nice muscle gains, and probably make you much better than if you were to cut ( you will look less fat even that you'll be gaining both muscle and fat), while cutting might be better if you physiologically can't tolerate your current BF%.

Bottom line, do the one YOU want. Either will work!

[WalterStark]

At your age ( done growing ), and being 18-20BF%, you can really do both. My advice would just be either PROPERLY cut or bulk. Don't bother with trying to eat maintenance, and recomp, for most people it won't work.

Bulking will give you nice muscle gains, and probably make you much better than if you were to cut ( you will look less fat even that you'll be gaining both muscle and fat), while cutting might be better if you physiologically can't tolerate your current BF%.

Bottom line, do the one YOU want. Either will work!

Thanks for that, eases my mind quite a bit! What I might do is bulk for a short while, maybe 3 cycles and then see how I feel then. Just so I can make a small start on muscle gains. Frustrating trying to start!

[pandorakick]

Actually original thread AP says he only included Bicep Curls because people would beg for it and they can be replaced by Upright Standing Rows, which is a much more compound movement. It's the FAQ question 12.

Ah ok, check!

[aceedkins]

Finished cycle 6.

Squat: 200 (failed)
Bench: 135 (failed for the third cycle in a row)
BoR: 135 --> 145
OHP: 90 (failed for the third cycle in a row)
SLDL: 225 (failed)
Curl: 60 (failed for the second cycle in a row)
raises: 215 -->235


I wonder if its time to switch programs. Failing left and right and I haven't been making any real gains visually. I'm slowly losing steam here... I really enjoy lifting but even after 9 months I'm weak as **** and barely look I regularly pick up any weights. Maybe it isn't in the cards. I eat right and calorie count. (2800-3000 calories at 175lb 5'8'') All I do is put on stomach fat.

[Cranz]

Finished cycle 6.

Squat: 200 (failed)
Bench: 135 (failed for the third cycle in a row)
BoR: 135 --> 145
OHP: 90 (failed for the third cycle in a row)
SLDL: 225 (failed)
Curl: 60 (failed for the second cycle in a row)
raises: 215 -->235


I wonder if its time to switch programs. Failing left and right and I haven't been making any real gains visually. I'm slowly losing steam here... I really enjoy lifting but even after 9 months I'm weak as **** and barely look I regularly pick up any weights. Maybe it isn't in the cards. I eat right and calorie count. (2800-3000 calories at 175lb 5'8'') All I do is put on stomach fat.

Stats?
Age?
Starting lifts?

Pictures?

[Cranz]

Starting my first workout ( apart from 10rm test ) on saturday. REALLY excited. If I follow this program correctly and stay on it, I should be an intermediate lifter by May-June.

Maybe even faster if I don't stall.

[Blakeness2]

Hey all, C3W2 here with a question:

What do you guys think about doing a cardio bootcamp class on Tuesdays and Thursdays while on this program? It's a 45 minute high intensity interval cardio class. Does this sound like too much?

To expand on this a bit, I run a few miles on Saturday and take Sunday completely off to recover for my heavy day. Thoughts?

[Cranz]

To expand on this a bit, I run a few miles on Saturday and take Sunday completely off to recover for my heavy day. Thoughts?

When it comes to recovery, it's dependent on everyone.

Someone can already be doing this program + athletic work and recover normally while another might have a hard time recovering from this workout alone itself.

Try for yourself, and see. If you are stalling, stop.

[Ulfit]

Hey all, C3W2 here with a question:

What do you guys think about doing a cardio bootcamp class on Tuesdays and Thursdays while on this program? It's a 45 minute high intensity interval cardio class. Does this sound like too much?

It sounds like a bit too much. I do HIIT 20 minutes on non-lifting days and sometimes it seems a bit difficult. However, if you are aware that it will compromise your evolution on this program and it's ok with you, so why not? I think you should be doing what you enjoy doing.
But be prepared for some frustration along the way, I guess.

Sorry to ask a question on nutrition but I feel I will get a straight answer here. Anyway, my body weight is about 161lbs, and ny body fat is roughly 18-20%. From reading the forums theres a mixed opinion on wether to bulk or cut at my BF. Many seem to think that my BF is to high to bulk. Im also reading that recomp could be a good idea for my size and weight.

Could I ask for peoples opinions on what I should do because im oficially confused and stuck, possibly someone who was in a similar position to me?

I'm on a similar position but stuck on a plateau for some years. I tried to bulk but it was too hard psychologically. I couldn't bear the way clothes were not fitting. So I decided to cut again while lifting in order not to lose lean body mass. However, it seems that it's very difficult not to lose any muscle while going under maintenance levels.

If you can handle some extra fat while getting bigger and stronger, maybe bulking and then cutting could be a good solution. It's not my solution, for sure.

[blakhomer]

Finished cycle 6.

Squat: 200 (failed)
Bench: 135 (failed for the third cycle in a row)
BoR: 135 --> 145
OHP: 90 (failed for the third cycle in a row)
SLDL: 225 (failed)
Curl: 60 (failed for the second cycle in a row)
raises: 215 -->235


I wonder if its time to switch programs. Failing left and right and I haven't been making any real gains visually. I'm slowly losing steam here... I really enjoy lifting but even after 9 months I'm weak as **** and barely look I regularly pick up any weights. Maybe it isn't in the cards. I eat right and calorie count. (2800-3000 calories at 175lb 5'8'') All I do is put on stomach fat.

Change things up. If after 9 months you're not happy with the results then I would suggest you find a new program.

[Lupe16]

For a woman trying to lose weight and tone up is this a good routine

[WalterStark]

I'm on a similar position but stuck on a plateau for some years. I tried to bulk but it was too hard psychologically. I couldn't bear the way clothes were not fitting. So I decided to cut again while lifting in order not to lose lean body mass. However, it seems that it's very difficult not to lose any muscle while going under maintenance levels.

If you can handle some extra fat while getting bigger and stronger, maybe bulking and then cutting could be a good solution. It's not my solution, for sure.

Its a tough position to be in. Getting a bit fatter isn't the most appealing thought, but the muscle gain is (especially coming from a noob perspective, being quite weak). Guess there really isn't a right answer to this!

[AnthropoidApe]

So it's basically the same thing as the RDL?

I would say not... although because they both get done in a... errr... wide range of variants... they could be the same for some people. All Pro said the difference was basically the ROM - you are *meant* to stop just below the knees with RDL, whereas SLDL is as-low-as-you-can-go, because it is all about improving hamstring flex.

This video, imho, gives a good explanation of the difference although Johnny does the SLDLs from the floor instead of from a rack. The other main differences are degree of control in the negative and arm angle. SLDL all the way, imho. Do SLDL and squat and you will be steadily improving your standard deadlifts without even doing any of them.

[AnthropoidApe]

Finished cycle 6.

Squat: 200 (failed)
Bench: 135 (failed for the third cycle in a row)
BoR: 135 --> 145
OHP: 90 (failed for the third cycle in a row)
SLDL: 225 (failed)
Curl: 60 (failed for the second cycle in a row)
raises: 215 -->235


I wonder if its time to switch programs. Failing left and right and I haven't been making any real gains visually. I'm slowly losing steam here... I really enjoy lifting but even after 9 months I'm weak as **** and barely look I regularly pick up any weights. Maybe it isn't in the cards. I eat right and calorie count. (2800-3000 calories at 175lb 5'8'') All I do is put on stomach fat.

Yeah take a break, do something else. Some people just respond better to certain features of a program, eg the 8-12 rep range, than others. Maybe 5x5 or 531 would suit you better. Or do this six-week program and report back; I want to try it next year

BTW, when you say "eat right", are you tracking macros and getting plenty of protein?

[lexisdad2013]

So I did my heavy day c1w4 and I got sick and I wasn't able to do my medium nor light workout. Should I just repeat this weeks reps, next week?

[KeithTheSnake]

So I did my heavy day c1w4 and I got sick and I wasn't able to do my medium nor light workout. Should I just repeat this weeks reps, next week?

I would. I have.

[Rounin]

Finished cycle 6.

Squat: 200 (failed)
Bench: 135 (failed for the third cycle in a row)
BoR: 135 --> 145
OHP: 90 (failed for the third cycle in a row)
SLDL: 225 (failed)
Curl: 60 (failed for the second cycle in a row)
raises: 215 -->235


I wonder if its time to switch programs. Failing left and right and I haven't been making any real gains visually. I'm slowly losing steam here... I really enjoy lifting but even after 9 months I'm weak as **** and barely look I regularly pick up any weights. Maybe it isn't in the cards. I eat right and calorie count. (2800-3000 calories at 175lb 5'8'') All I do is put on stomach fat.

As some already said before and AllPro said a couple of times it would be a very good idea to alternate his program with a Bill Star 5x5 or Glenn Pendlay 5x5 (for recreational lifters), this would allow you to gain a bit more strength on those 5x5 and then come back to this program to kick in more endurance and size. He also mentioned there was a big difference between failed on the first work set or on the second work set - so are you failing on both work sets? The lift which have stalled several times have had no improvement? Exactly stalling at same point as last cycle?

Additionally, I know many people defend you are intermediate when you can Squat 2x and Bench 1.5x your weight as 1RM but if you go on EXRX website for lifting standard you will see they actually consider way a bit less and they differentiate between man and woman.
h t t p : / / w w w . e x r x . n e t /Testing/WeightLifting/BenchStandards . html
h t t p : / / w w w . e x r x . n e t /Testing/WeightLifting/SquatStandards . html
( Sorry for the spacing but I'm not allowed to post links as I'm under 50 posts )
According to those values you are pretty much on the Intermediate Level, maybe bench needs one more upgrade, and you could probably swap to one of AllPro or someone else intermediate programs - AllPro Intermediate 1 looking as a very good first option, he recommended several times as a first upgrade to this program.

[Rounin]

I would say not... although because they both get done in a... errr... wide range of variants... they could be the same for some people. All Pro said the difference was basically the ROM - you are *meant* to stop just below the knees with RDL, whereas SLDL is as-low-as-you-can-go, because it is all about improving hamstring flex.

This video, imho, gives a good explanation of the difference although Johnny does the SLDLs from the floor instead of from a rack. The other main differences are degree of control in the negative and arm angle. SLDL all the way, imho. Do SLDL and squat and you will be steadily improving your standard deadlifts without even doing any of them.

Very good man, you actually just made me realize a mistake I was doing with bar positioning - think I was bringing it way close to my body.

[pandorakick]

For a woman trying to lose weight and tone up is this a good routine

The losing weight part is more dependent on diet then on excercise. That said, this routine is very forgiving to do on a cut, and I myself had excellent results with it.

[mduncan2]

For a woman trying to lose weight and tone up is this a good routine

Yes, this would be a great routine. Just look at user "pandorakick". If you go to her BodySpace page, you will see her fabulous transformation. She has a rocking great body that she should be proud of. She has been at this program for over 6 months and has lost considerable weight and toned up nicely. For a 35yo she looks good. There are other girls/women who have actively posted on here over the last few months, and some of the guys on here are doing the program with their girlfriend/partner/wife. So it is definitely a good program for a woman to lose weight and tone up.

Looks like you beat me to it, Pandora.

[Ulfit]

The losing weight part is more dependent on diet then on excercise. That said, this routine is very forgiving to do on a cut, and I myself had excellent results with it.

Yes, this would be a great routine. Just look at user "pandorakick". If you go to her BodySpace page, you will see her fabulous transformation. She has a rocking great body that she should be proud of. She has been at this program for over 6 months and has lost considerable weight and toned up nicely. For a 35yo she looks good. There are other girls/women who have actively posted on here over the last few months, and some of the guys on here are doing the program with their girlfriend/partner/wife. So it is definitely a good program for a woman to lose weight and tone up.

Looks like you beat me to it, Pandora.

I've just checked on pandorakick's profile. Excellent job! Congratulations on your progress!

[Ulfit]

As some already said before and AllPro said a couple of times it would be a very good idea to alternate his program with a Bill Star 5x5 or Glenn Pendlay 5x5 (for recreational lifters), this would allow you to gain a bit more strength on those 5x5 and then come back to this program to kick in more endurance and size. He also mentioned there was a big difference between failed on the first work set or on the second work set - so are you failing on both work sets? The lift which have stalled several times have had no improvement? Exactly stalling at same point as last cycle?

Additionally, I know many people defend you are intermediate when you can Squat 2x and Bench 1.5x your weight as 1RM but if you go on EXRX website for lifting standard you will see they actually consider way a bit less and they differentiate between man and woman.
h t t p : / / w w w . e x r x . n e t /Testing/WeightLifting/BenchStandards . html
h t t p : / / w w w . e x r x . n e t /Testing/WeightLifting/SquatStandards . html
( Sorry for the spacing but I'm not allowed to post links as I'm under 50 posts )
According to those values you are pretty much on the Intermediate Level, maybe bench needs one more upgrade, and you could probably swap to one of AllPro or someone else intermediate programs - AllPro Intermediate 1 looking as a very good first option, he recommended several times as a first upgrade to this program.

Definitely different numbers. Thanks for the input.

[Cranz]

For a woman trying to lose weight and tone up is this a good routine

There isn't a difference. Any routine out there can be done for either a male or female. ( Even SS ).

[pandorakick]

I've just checked on pandorakick's profile. Excellent job! Congratulations on your progress!

Thank you!

[pandorakick]

There isn't a difference. Any routine out there can be done for either a male or female. ( Even SS ).

^^^ Certainly true!

[Rounin]

Definitely different numbers. Thanks for the input.

It makes sense that it is easier for 50kg lifter to squat 100kg than for a 100kg lifter to squat 200kg. I read a bit on those pages and those numbers seem to make a bit more sense than just 1.5x and 2x your weight on bench press and squat - they also have numbers for deadlifts and presses.

[Ulfit]

It makes sense that it is easier for 50kg lifter to squat 100kg than for a 100kg lifter to squat 200kg. I read a bit on those pages and those numbers seem to make a bit more sense than just 1.5x and 2x your weight on bench press and squat - they also have numbers for deadlifts and presses.

Sure. But I understand AP's intention to have a rough number. If you check the first original thread, you'll see that many people were constantly asking the same. So, stating that 1.5x or 2x on a general way is safer and more straightforward.

[Rounin]

Sure. But I understand AP's intention to have a rough number. If you check the first original thread, you'll see that many people were constantly asking the same. So, stating that 1.5x or 2x on a general way is safer and more straightforward.

I'm not questioning AP nor the general rule of thumb, l was just trying to provide more info regarding his status given he was stalling on most lifts several times and his lifts are not that weak anymore - they are actually in line with many people who started using AP intermediate 1.

[Ulfit]

I'm not questioning AP nor the general rule of thumb, l was just trying to provide more info regarding his status given he was stalling on most lifts several times and his lifts are not that weak anymore - they are actually in line with many people who started using AP intermediate 1.

Yes, sure. Nice input, as I've written above.