how to take havoc(ph)?

[liamw86]

hi ive recently been recommened to use havoc the pro harmone i dont no alot about them so id like some advice how to take it and what else to take with it and also can i take my exsisting supplements with it? im 24 5"11 152lbs with an extremly fast metabolism, work out 5 times a week for the past year,
my max bench is 1 rep of 115kg and usually bench 3 sets of 8 reps of 95kg. i curl 20kg dumbbells.
my supps;
opti-men
axsis labs creatine ethel ester caps/3 pre w and 3 post w
ON hydro whey
ON micronised creatine/teaspoon with each shake
ON casien
no xplod or jack3d/pre workout
ON ZMA

Any info or advice would be greatful thank you!!

[GRAYHORSE]

Try searching for Epistane and how to use.
We arent really allow to talk designer steriods around here anymore.....

[liamw86]

thanks

[_Smitty_]

your height/weight are a red flag... despite a fast metabolism, there's a nutritional component that can't be overlooked before beginning a steroid cycle. reason being, if you don't first have that foundational knowledge, any gains you will make on cycle, will be gone shortly after...

i don't know who recommended this to you, but they're wrong in their recommendation. as greg suggested, you can research elsewhere exactly what this is and how to use it, but i can almost guarantee that it'll be a failure for you.

spend some time training compound lifts and eating everything in sight; put on about 20 more pounds, and then revisit steroid use.

[mer-der-ah]

at 155, eat more.

but if you must do the cycle, check tuned sports for a good guide on this stuff.

you can and should keep all your existing supplements going forward, and introduce cycle support so you minimize risk of sides.

[JohnnyRingo350]

you are taking way to much creatine as well.

[Proposturalized]

you are taking way to much creatine as well.

This. Ditch the CEE (it's garbage) and stick to 5g per day (realize that creatine is in NO-Xplode and Jack3d as well).

[liamw86]

i litreally couldn't eat any more then i do my appeitite is massive and very high in protein and carbs(i love potatoes!ha) even taking weight gainers are to no effect consuming more food isn't my problem

thanks i will drop the cee

[Proposturalized]

i litreally couldn't eat any more then i do my appeitite is massive and very high in protein and carbs(i love potatoes!ha) even taking weight gainers are to no effect consuming more food isn't my problem

thanks i will drop the cee

Start counting calories. Aim for 3000-3500+ calories and you should gain weight.

[PaleVein]

i litreally couldn't eat any more then i do my appeitite is massive and very high in protein and carbs(i love potatoes!ha) even taking weight gainers are to no effect consuming more food isn't my problem

Yes it is. Trust me, if you're below 160lbs at your height and are not seeing gradual weight gain, you are most certainly not getting enough nutrition.

[_Smitty_]

i litreally couldn't eat any more then i do my appeitite is massive and very high in protein and carbs(i love potatoes!ha) even taking weight gainers are to no effect consuming more food isn't my problem

thanks i will drop the cee

you think you can't, but you can... there's no such thing as a hardgainer.

Start counting calories. Aim for 3000-3500+ calories and you should gain weight.

way more than that... for him, i'd recommend upwards of 7,000-7,500/day.

[JohnnyRingo350]

you think you can't, but you can... there's no such thing as a hardgainer.



way more than that... for him, i'd recommend upwards of 7,000-7,500/day.

this. it wasnt until i got in the 7-8k range that i gained ANYTHING.

[JCFobsession]

ok soooo i went through and read a bit of your and what other ppl have said..

ok looking to gain weight take in 3000+ calories a day,.
creatine 5 grams a day is good...
also your BCAA is key to building muscle..

ok about your havoc... FIRST HAVE YOU EVER TAKEN PH BEFORE???

for your weight i recc taking only 2 a day for 4 weeks... it is activated through your liver so get some milk thistle also... and cycle assist.. if you feel your not taking enough or seeing gains strength and size and pumps... you can do 3 but its not recc you will def see higher blood pressure...

i have more to say but this should be good to start dude..

BEFORE YOU EVEN START IT GET A POST CYCLE SERM*********
PM. me and i can go over few that work well with your cycle...

*WINNING THE WAR AGAINST GENETICS*

[liamw86]

breakfast- porridge and toast and whey
11.00-chicken sandwich
lunch-either fish baked potatoe n salad or chicken n rice or pasta
snack- banana or nuts and whey
dinner- mash potatoe beans and some kind of red meat
snack-same as
bed- casien

any recommendations to help me eat more or what else to eat?
i appreciate all replys thank you

[EntropyIncrease]

ok soooo i went through and read a bit of your and what other ppl have said..

ok looking to gain weight take in 3000+ calories a day,.
creatine 5 grams a day is good...
also your BCAA is key to building muscle..

ok about your havoc... FIRST HAVE YOU EVER TAKEN PH BEFORE???

for your weight i recc taking only 2 a day for 4 weeks... it is activated through your liver so get some milk thistle also... and cycle assist.. if you feel your not taking enough or seeing gains strength and size and pumps... you can do 3 but its not recc you will def see higher blood pressure...

i have more to say but this should be good to start dude..

BEFORE YOU EVEN START IT GET A POST CYCLE SERM*********
PM. me and i can go over few that work well with your cycle...

*WINNING THE WAR AGAINST GENETICS*

this post made me lol in real life

[liamw86]

you think you can't, but you can... there's no such thing as a hardgainer.



way more than that... for him, i'd recommend upwards of 7,000-7,500/day.

any advice on what to eat to consume that many calories and when bearing in mind ive quite a busy schedule during the week?
thanks

[Ion26]

What the hell is up with all these pro-hormone threads? Is everyone on this stuff now?

I like how most of the poster are below the age 25...

[liamw86]

ive just been recommend it because i train hard see good strength gains but no much muscle mass gains
havent started a cycle just lookin for advice and information before i commit to it

[_Smitty_]

ok soooo i went through and read a bit of your and what other ppl have said..

ok looking to gain weight take in 3000+ calories a day,.
creatine 5 grams a day is good...
also your BCAA is key to building muscle..

ok about your havoc... FIRST HAVE YOU EVER TAKEN PH BEFORE???

for your weight i recc taking only 2 a day for 4 weeks... it is activated through your liver so get some milk thistle also... and cycle assist.. if you feel your not taking enough or seeing gains strength and size and pumps... you can do 3 but its not recc you will def see higher blood pressure...

i have more to say but this should be good to start dude..

BEFORE YOU EVEN START IT GET A POST CYCLE SERM*********
PM. me and i can go over few that work well with your cycle...

*WINNING THE WAR AGAINST GENETICS*

what the... ?

breakfast- porridge and toast and whey
11.00-chicken sandwich
lunch-either fish baked potatoe n salad or chicken n rice or pasta
snack- banana or nuts and whey
dinner- mash potatoe beans and some kind of red meat
snack-same as
bed- casien

any recommendations to help me eat more or what else to eat?
i appreciate all replys thank you

any advice on what to eat to consume that many calories and when bearing in mind ive quite a busy schedule during the week?
thanks

what you're eating above is quite healthy and a very good way to go; to get in the necessary amount of calories, try doubling the amounts you eat.

add olive oil and/or peanut butter to your shakes, double the proteins (fish, meat, chicken, nuts), double or triple the carbohydrates... your schedule is busy, sure, but you don't necessarily have to alter your eating times.

it's going to be a struggle to get this food down early on, but do your best. you're going to feel full and possibly bloated... but play the game for a bit to get to where you need to be and then you'll adjust again.

[liamw86]

what the... ?





what you're eating above is quite healthy and a very good way to go; to get in the necessary amount of calories, try doubling the amounts you eat.

add olive oil and/or peanut butter to your shakes, double the proteins (fish, meat, chicken, nuts), double or triple the carbohydrates... your schedule is busy, sure, but you don't necessarily have to alter your eating times.

it's going to be a struggle to get this food down early on, but do your best. you're going to feel full and possibly bloated... but play the game for a bit to get to where you need to be and then you'll adjust again.

i will definitly take your advice but usually ive 2 of everthing like 2 fish or 2 steaks or 2 chicken breasts etc. what ever im eating any way ha i do feel full but il try maybe 3??
il start adding peanut butter n olive oil to my shakes starting right now!!
i was just wondering if i drink at the the weekend will that effect my gains? on a saturday night i usually go out?

[JCFobsession]

Ok sooo what kind of questions do you have about taking a PH... From these ppl who are posting laughs on mine post have no idea what there talking about and have not been helpfull to you...

NO **** EVERYONE KNOWS eat eat eat and work out hard work out hard and you will see gains in weight strength...

If you want any ideas on what supplements to take or PH to take ask and i will assist you ok man be sure you wanna do it before you do... and if you do it then make sure you have cycle assist and PCT..

ive just been recommend it because i train hard see good strength gains but no much muscle mass gains
havent started a cycle just lookin for advice and information before i commit to it

[JCFobsession]

The fact that your laughing at my post shows you have no knowledge on PH's...
nothing i said was false... please inlighten me on what you think made you laugh out loud. because i pretty much think your a joke for laughing at my post...

[liamw86]

Ok sooo what kind of questions do you have about taking a PH... From these ppl who are posting laughs on mine post have no idea what there talking about and have not been helpfull to you...

NO **** EVERYONE KNOWS eat eat eat and work out hard work out hard and you will see gains in weight strength...

If you want any ideas on what supplements to take or PH to take ask and i will assist you ok man be sure you wanna do it before you do... and if you do it then make sure you have cycle assist and PCT..

do you think im alright using it because if you read in 1 of the previous threads they think i could be under weight to use?? ive showed my diet and am a hard trainer so if i do go a head with it i will be commited. i also need to no what i must take with it while on a budget.

[_Smitty_]

i will definitly take your advice but usually ive 2 of everthing like 2 fish or 2 steaks or 2 chicken breasts etc. what ever im eating any way ha i do feel full but il try maybe 3??
il start adding peanut butter n olive oil to my shakes starting right now!!
i was just wondering if i drink at the the weekend will that effect my gains? on a saturday night i usually go out?

there you go; work up to 3 items and see if that helps... if it doesn't, you'll be primed to increase to 4.

the PB and EVOO are a great addition to shakes... healthy fats = additional calories.

beers are empty calories. try to limit yourself... if you must, order brews with higher alcohol content and take your time, instead of pounding down 10 light beers. one night a week won't do much harm. but if you enjoy your saturday night, you'll definitely want to postpone this cycle.

if you take this kid's advice below, you're going to fail... plain/simple.

Ok sooo what kind of questions do you have about taking a PH... From these ppl who are posting laughs on mine post have no idea what there talking about and have not been helpfull to you...

NO **** EVERYONE KNOWS eat eat eat and work out hard work out hard and you will see gains in weight strength...

If you want any ideas on what supplements to take or PH to take ask and i will assist you ok man be sure you wanna do it before you do... and if you do it then make sure you have cycle assist and PCT..

right... i have no experience with PH/DS and i haven't been helpful at all.

instead, you're conning this kid into taking a steroid when it's clear that nutrition is his fault. anyone with simple common sense should be able to detect that...

if he contacts you for "help", he'll be back here in two shakes complaining of a shoddy cycle.

[JCFobsession]

NOOOOO I AGREE WITH YOU TOTALLY... was not talking to you about your comments or post..

I agree eating diet is the way to go and for him to stick to increasing food and working out harder.... im not telling him to take any PH's but if he is thinking about it its best he is informed on what to take when and how much and what to do when off....

For his size and weight Id say his diet should go up alot.. also depends on what he wants when i started out it was hard for me to gain any weight so i downed clean food along with taco bell and cheeseburgers and anything else to get me weight on and then cut it up along the way.

[EntropyIncrease]

The fact that your laughing at my post shows you have no knowledge on PH's...
nothing i said was false... please inlighten me on what you think made you laugh out loud. because i pretty much think your a joke for laughing at my post...

I didn't say anything you said was false . . . but I'll break down why I laughed at your post.

ok soooo i went through and read a bit of your and what other ppl have said..

ok looking to gain weight take in 3000+ calories a day,. this is true
creatine 5 grams a day is good... 3g 5days a week is plenty, but this is still accurate
also your BCAA is key to building muscle.. not on a bulk; they are more useful for maintaining muscle on a cut. and even that is debated

ok about your havoc... FIRST HAVE YOU EVER TAKEN PH BEFORE???

for your weight i recc taking only 2 a day for 4 weeks... it is activated through your liver so get some milk thistle also... and cycle assist.. if you feel your not taking enough or seeing gains strength and size and pumps... you can do 3 but its not recc you will def see higher blood pressure... 20mg of epi is nothing. 20 is fine for the first few days, but then you should jump up to 30 for the remainder of your cycle; maybe even up to 40 (weight dependent)

i have more to say but this should be good to start dude..

BEFORE YOU EVEN START IT GET A POST CYCLE SERM********* good advice
PM. me and i can go over few that work well with your cycle...

*WINNING THE WAR AGAINST GENETICS* haha

I laughed at the way you presented your post . . . not necessarily about the info it contained.

but you're right . . . I have no knowledge of ph's . . . I just pretend

[liamw86]

there you go; work up to 3 items and see if that helps... if it doesn't, you'll be primed to increase to 4.

the PB and EVOO are a great addition to shakes... healthy fats = additional calories.

beers are empty calories. try to limit yourself... if you must, order brews with higher alcohol content and take your time, instead of pounding down 10 light beers. one night a week won't do much harm. but if you enjoy your saturday night, you'll definitely want to postpone this cycle.

if you take this kid's advice below, you're going to fail... plain/simple.



right... i have no experience with PH/DS and i haven't been helpful at all.

instead, you're conning this kid into taking a steroid when it's clear that nutrition is his fault. anyone with simple common sense should be able to detect that...

if he contacts you for "help", he'll be back here in two shakes complaining of a shoddy cycle.

i do understand if i do want to cycle id have to give up alcohol during the cycling period but you think i should bump up my food intake and forget about the ph for now? have you personally ever used a ph?

[JCFobsession]

Hey dude okk first off to set the record straight im not telling you to take any PH's people will do what they want and when they do if they have questions It is nice when people can help them...

im only touching base because you asked about it and the whole eat eat eat thing. all i meant was that yes eating more and dieting right will help you gain... but your main thread was about taking Hav*c... so thats what i was touching base on.

Yes one will probably be fine if YOU choose to take it... IF you step up to 2 a day then you may feel the effects of higher BLood pressure and the effects of the cycle...

IF YOU CHOOSE to do this get your proper cycle assist and PCT...

SORRY FOR confussion just trying to stay on topic of your orginal question....

[smt1]

Ok sooo what kind of questions do you have about taking a PH... From these ppl who are posting laughs on mine post have no idea what there talking about and have not been helpfull to you...

No they are spot on. At 155, unless you have a muscle wasting disease like AIDS, you do not need steroids like havoc to grow. You are not giving him good advice.

@OP : Eat more calorie dense foods.

[_Smitty_]

i do understand if i do want to cycle id have to give up alcohol during the cycling period but you think i should bump up my food intake and forget about the ph for now? have you personally ever used a ph?

yes, i think you should focus on nutrition and temporarily shelve the cycle... you should be able to gain weight through diet; do so for a few months, and then revisit the cycle.

i have plenty of PH/DS experience, and i've even used havoc three times... i'm actually currently on cycle with SD.

it'll be worth the wait, and your cycle will be that much more effective if your diet is sound and you know how to manipulate calories to gain or cut.