H-drol + OTC ptc = ??

[724hp]

see my sig.

ran 5 weeks of h-drol with otc pct and had amazing results.

[FlexManlet55]

i think its more likely Hdrol will show up on a drug test than Nolva/Torem/Clomid. HDROL IS A STEROID. Your statement is absolutely silly. Why dont you just say that you dont want to take a SERM, or that you dont want to order it instead and be honest? The research ancillaries (domestic, not overseas) are technically legal for you to possess w/o a scrip, just feed it to the rats. Or go get a blood test in week 3-4 of Hdrol at your docs claiming low test symptoms (google it), he'll run some bloods and freak out that you have levels under 75 - boom scrip. Once you see those bloods, you'll WANT to run a SERM. It will freak you out.

If you are absolutely hell-bent on OTC use Primordial's Test Recovery Stack. It works, plenty of bloods out there to prove it, they are easy to find. Or use Reduce XT and Inhibit E, another good stack. Just dont expect your nuts to swell back up immediately, and dont expect normalized levels for a while. Its safe+effective, but not nearly as....

Forget it.

Sigh@ ppl making assumptions. I work for my family, I'll never get drug tested period. If I get a "CRIME OF MORAL TERPTITUDE" spelling on that idk I lose my LICENSE for my job. The PH I bought was legal, buying Nolva from Iran isn't legal exactly and THIS is what I can't chance. What is hard to understand? You guys are turning this thread into a rage thread... FML guys. I'm aware of what is and isn't good. I'm *stupid* in the first place for even taking a PH according to 99% of the people out there anyway.

What did I lie about bro? Do you think that im scared of your e-pinion of me? I said I can't/not/won't/refuse to order stuff that is in the grey area of the law by the books because I like making 50k a year sitting on my butt, while I go to college. YA FEEL MEH?

And no I'm not claiming 10k/day CEO, I'm going to college currently and work my butt off for the money I do make.

[FlexManlet55]

see my sig.

ran 5 weeks of h-drol with otc pct and had amazing results.

Thanks for the great response that was what i wanted. Cheers.

[cobfab12]

Sigh@ ppl making assumptions. I work for my family, I'll never get drug tested period. If I get a "CRIME OF MORAL TERPTITUDE" spelling on that idk I lose my LICENSE for my job. The PH I bought was legal, buying Nolva from Iran isn't legal exactly and THIS is what I can't chance. What is hard to understand? You guys are turning this thread into a rage thread... FML guys. I'm aware of what is and isn't good. I'm *stupid* in the first place for even taking a PH according to 99% of the people out there anyway.

What did I lie about bro? Do you think that im scared of your e-pinion of me? I said I can't/not/won't/refuse to order stuff that is in the grey area of the law by the books because I like making 50k a year sitting on my butt, while I go to college. YA FEEL MEH?

And no I'm not claiming 10k/day CEO, I'm going to college currently and work my butt off for the money I do make.

There are 300 threads like yours made a day. I dont give a **** what you make, if you get tested, none of that. You say you work hard for the money in one sentence, and in another say you sit on your ass all day. I used to work for family too, I know that life very well. I could give a fuk less about your job, your health however is important. What I care about is someone being irresponsible with these products, having their health suffer, and then come back to these boards with a thread entitled "What to do when OTC PCT fails?" or something the like. It happens, A LOT.

People used to run cycles without a PCT, we know this. When I see someone do an OTC only PCT regimen, I see the same uneducated methodology that took place before the discovery of SERMs and HCG for bodybuilding purposes. In my opinion, a method that recovery is nearly 99% guaranteed over a method that "may" work is simple science- use steroids, use a SERM. Is it honestly worth 5-7 lbs of mass to potentially shut you down, put you on TRT, make you infertile? If you take a steroid, just use a SERM. Do you think your employer would rather hear you are using a drug that reduces symptoms of gyno (Nolva, which a valid and probable case that can be claimed if busted), or that you are using steroids (which have an extremely negative stigma)?

Believe it or not, I am looking out for your health. Dont roll the dice. You arent stupid for wanting to use these products, but not following up and watching out for the end product is. What good are the gains going to be if you cant keep them? You made this thread, then discounted every answer that had the word SERM in it, even though you are asking what will happen if you dont use one. Why even bother to ask in the first place. I have a feeling im wasting my time, but enjoy your new tits.

[FlexManlet55]

There are 300 threads like yours made a day. I dont give a **** what you make, if you get tested, none of that. You say you work hard for the money in one sentence, and in another say you sit on your ass all day. I used to work for family too, I know that life very well. I could give a fuk less about your job, your health however is important. What I care about is someone being irresponsible with these products, having their health suffer, and then come back to these boards with a thread entitled "What to do when OTC PCT fails?" or something the like. It happens, A LOT.

People used to run cycles without a PCT, we know this. When I see someone do an OTC only PCT regimen, I see the same uneducated methodology that took place before the discovery of SERMs and HCG for bodybuilding purposes. In my opinion, a method that recovery is nearly 99% guaranteed over a method that "may" work is simple science- use steroids, use a SERM. Is it honestly worth 5-7 lbs of mass to potentially shut you down, put you on TRT, make you infertile? If you take a steroid, just use a SERM. Do you think your employer would rather hear you are using a drug that reduces symptoms of gyno (Nolva, which a valid and probable case that can be claimed if busted), or that you are using steroids (which have an extremely negative stigma)?

Believe it or not, I am looking out for your health. Dont roll the dice. You arent stupid for wanting to use these products, but not following up and watching out for the end product is. What good are the gains going to be if you cant keep them? You made this thread, then discounted every answer that had the word SERM in it, even though you are asking what will happen if you dont use one. Why even bother to ask in the first place. I have a feeling im wasting my time, but enjoy your new tits.

If the OTC doesn't work, I would in fact go to the dr that day and get the SERM from him, i've already thought about talking to a doctor frankly about my intentions and getting it that way.

And to your comment about you being in my thread, wasting your time, your a fkin tool, please GTFO my thread you douche bag. You don't NEED to know about my personal life, but apparently I have to defend my choice, so I was explaining why. "You say you work hard for the money in one sentence, and in another say you sit on your ass all day. I used to work for family too, I know that life very well." You wanna hear about my life in the military or when I was building houses? You work in a building with old woman and an A'C being a trainer, don't you? STFU son. Why are you on a forum if you don't like seeing questions?

I notice you like to type, and type alot, but you can't read gud. You said you don't care about blah blah blah... You shouldn't really take on giving advice to people if you can't understand their circumstances. My specific question is due to personal choices. If there wasn't fgts like you in half the threads saying DON't USE OTC YOU'LL GET TEH TITTAYS" I wouldn't be confused. I've already talked to a few people about OTC who have done it with success. You haven't done it UNSUCCESSFULLY yourself, you are just being a fkin parrot.


I'm also not currently using these products, I'm doing my research before hand... Yet you are here to flame my choice to stay within the law. Do you think I don't KNOW a serm is better? That wasn't questioned. There isn't a question if hdrol or nolva shows up on a drug test, its if I get caught in possession of something thats illegal, no matter what it is. Its black and white.

[cobfab12]

If the OTC doesn't work, I would in fact go to the dr that day and get the SERM from him, i've already thought about talking to a doctor frankly about my intentions and getting it that way.

And to your comment about you being in my thread, wasting your time, your a fkin tool, please GTFO my thread you douche bag. You don't NEED to know about my personal life, but apparently I have to defend my choice, so I was explaining why. "You say you work hard for the money in one sentence, and in another say you sit on your ass all day. I used to work for family too, I know that life very well." You wanna hear about my life in the military or when I was building houses? You work in a building with old woman and an A'C being a trainer, don't you? STFU son. Why are you on a forum if you don't like seeing questions?

I notice you like to type, and type alot, but you can't read gud. You said you don't care about blah blah blah... You shouldn't really take on giving advice to people if you can't understand their circumstances. My specific question is due to personal choices. If there wasn't fgts like you in half the threads saying DON't USE OTC YOU'LL GET TEH TITTAYS" I wouldn't be confused. I've already talked to a few people about OTC who have done it with success. You haven't done it UNSUCCESSFULLY yourself, you are just being a fkin parrot.


I'm also not currently using these products, I'm doing my research before hand... Yet you are here to flame my choice to stay within the law. Do you think I don't KNOW a serm is better? That wasn't questioned. There isn't a question if hdrol or nolva shows up on a drug test, its if I get caught in possession of something thats illegal, no matter what it is. Its black and white.

I gave you an OTC suggestion. You want OTC, its in one of my posts.
I won't encourage your path, but do what you gotta do.

Oh, and I havent done an unsuccessful cycle because I really feel like keeping my nuts functioning. Why would you want take advice from someone who has failed at something as serious as this?

EDIT: Also, notice how everyone over at PHF is recommending the same thing in the thread you made. Go post this same thread at tnation/elitefit/sourcecheck/am you will get the same response I gave you. If someone says they recovered from and OTC PCT, demand bloodwork - dont just take their words on faith. This IS NOT AN ATTACK ON YOU, but you seem to be taking it that way. Dont do the PH/DS if you cant use a SERM - its the truth. Your health is at stake.

[rock_ten]

If someone says they recovered from and OTC PCT, demand bloodwork - dont just take their words on faith.

And the same for a SERM, right? I mean, either way we're going by how people "feel" they have recovered. Useful blood test results are few and far between, regardless of the PCT protocol employed.

Every kid parrots "LOL SERM" to look informed, but I'm pretty unconvinced.

[icanrace]

I've ran Reversitol and Formadrol on 2 different pct's and turned out fine. Ran Formadrol with the original Masterdrol and Reversitol with CEL H-Drol.
If you run something like either of these I'd suggest tapering......

[c0vjek]

I ran few H-Drol cycles back in the day and used OTC PCT and had no problems.

I did get my blood work done, before and after and in 2007/2008 time most people were using OTC PCT

I do not see a problem with OTC PCT for h-drol but at same time I do recommend having SERM prior to start of a cycle.

[rock_ten]

Repped you kids

I've ran Reversitol and Formadrol on 2 different pct's and turned out fine. Ran Formadrol with the original Masterdrol and Reversitol with CEL H-Drol.
If you run something like either of these I'd suggest tapering......

I ran few H-Drol cycles back in the day and used OTC PCT and had no problems.

I did get my blood work done, before and after and in 2007/2008 time most people were using OTC PCT

I do not see a problem with OTC PCT for h-drol but at same time I do recommend having SERM prior to start of a cycle.

So your blood shizzle returned to pre-cycle levels after PCT, yea? And what OTC products did you use?

[c0vjek]

Repped you kids





So your blood shizzle returned to pre-cycle levels after PCT, yea? And what OTC products did you use?

it was few years ago, blood test showed everything was normal after the PCT, it was better then pre-cycle because pre-cycle I had ****ty diet that was filled with fats and during pre-loading, cycle, and PCT my diet was clean.

Last cycle was Reversitol in end of 2008 with few other things which I cannot remember now since its been so long.

Again, if you run a OTC PCT have SERMS hand on before taking H-Drol. I still have left over clomid and nolva somewhere.

[Dymethazine]

incase anyone reads the above dont be retarded and take otc pct.

[~Hades~]

Again, if you run a OTC PCT have SERMS hand on before taking H-Drol. I still have left over clomid and nolva somewhere.

If you have the serm on hand, why not use it?

[Fitzwell]

If you have the serm on hand, why not use it?

^^This

Brb I have a condom on hand, but I'll just pull out instead.

[c0vjek]

If you have the serm on hand, why not use it?

^^This

Brb I have a condom on hand, but I'll just pull out instead.

because when I did the cycles in 2007 and 2008 it was different. Search threads from then and see how many people actually used serms and how many used OTC.

Different era, now new generation of ph users uses serms, while the older did not.

Is anyone wrong? Do not think so, because people who used in 2007 did not have any more negative side effects then people do now.

Also to note, back in 2007, 2008 when most the PHs were legal, and few were banned, there were companies who spend time making OTC PCT products for PHs they put out.

[Fitzwell]

because when I did the cycles in 2007 and 2008 it was different. Search threads from then and see how many people actually used serms and how many used OTC.

Different era, now new generation of ph users uses serms, while the older did not.

Is anyone wrong? Do not think so, because people who used in 2007 did not have any more negative side effects then people do now.

Also to note, back in 2007, 2008 when most the PHs were legal, and few were banned, there were companies who spend time making OTC PCT products for PHs they put out.

Well all that infers to me is that people were less intelligent in 2007 and 2008. And to answer your question, yes, some people were wrong. There is nothing OTC that is as good as a Serm plain and simple. And just because the same sides were reported does not mean anything in terms of length of recovery and internal functions.

[rock_ten]

There is nothing OTC that is as good as a Serm plain and simple.

I'm picking on you just because you're the most recent person to say it, but why do you think a serm is so much better than OTC? As far as I can see it's still simply a matter of tradition and brosicentific data like "99.9% of people recover fully on a serm and only 80% do with OTC".

Or, and this applies to whichever drug or product, they used it once or twice and it seemed to work for them, so again they promote it as the only/best option. I've dug through millions of posts lately and only a few dozen have any persuasive content about PCT, tbh :/

Confusing innit bruh

[CraigMatthew]

^^This

Brb I have a condom on hand, but I'll just pull out instead.

lol! Classic!

[c0vjek]

Well all that infers to me is that people were less intelligent in 2007 and 2008. And to answer your question, yes, some people were wrong. There is nothing OTC that is as good as a Serm plain and simple. And just because the same sides were reported does not mean anything in terms of length of recovery and internal functions.

Well shows how much you know. AI is just as good as serms on most cycles.

You want to talk about intelligence, why don't you form a sentence that makes sense since you are so smart?

Also I see all these cycles being done now, how many provide blood work? Hardly any. In 2007 most people who were really into did provide blood work.

CEL. AX, and other companies made their AIs for PCT and other PCT support supplements.

When it comes to this kind of stuff its bro-science. As time change so do trends. Does it make anyone wrong? no it does not.

Back when I did my cycles, every other log or thread was about PHs, most of them were doing with OTC PCTs, and not many people reported side effects, and a lot of people did provide blood work, including me.

Back in the day, we did actual research on it, now people just do it and use serms thinking they know what their doing. When I did my cycles, I knew the nomenclatures, how it works in the body, all the sides, everything about it.

[_Smitty_]

Well shows how much you know. AI is just as good as serms on most cycles.

what? maybe you can enlighten us by explaining the MoA of each and how they're so comparable in your opinion.

You want to talk about intelligence, why don't you form a sentence that makes sense since you are so smart?

Also I see all these cycles being done now, how many provide blood work? Hardly any. In 2007 most people who were really into did provide blood work.

the fact that no one gets blood drawn speaks to the maturity of the people using... that's all the more problematic when people recommend OTC PCT to these kids.

at the end of the day, you're going to recover even if you use nothing... but why put yourself through a longer recovery process by using nothing, or going OTC, when you could simply use a SERM?

CEL. AX, and other companies made their AIs for PCT and other PCT support supplements.

do you have a basic understanding of how marketing works? of course it would make sense to try and sell a plethora of products manufactured by your company...

maybe i should start recommending a slin-sane/protocol PCT and sway some consumers.

Back when I did my cycles, every other log or thread was about PHs, most of them were doing with OTC PCTs, and not many people reported side effects, and a lot of people did provide blood work, including me.

Back in the day, we did actual research on it, now people just do it and use serms thinking they know what their doing. When I did my cycles, I knew the nomenclatures, how it works in the body, all the sides, everything about it.

then that simply makes you a wealth of knowledge 4 years ago... it's not a matter of trends changing but updated evidence being presented to prove the efficacy of some things over others... if you can't respect that progress or evolution, then you should keep your mouth shut and not go around giving advice that was more acceptable 4 years ago.

[FlexManlet55]

idk why ppl keep bumping my old post to rep me or neg me. I'm gonna update it for the lurkers though.

I ended up buying a serm. Some of you clearly have reading problems. I found out its legal to order a serm because its a gray area in the US currently. its not "legal" but its not "illegal" yet either, aka gray area cuzz.


I don't get drug tested at work, im sure I said that. I was worried about actually getting pulled over and a cop seeing a tube of SERM and being able to get arrested for THAT... THAT is how I would get fired, not a drug test..

stupid mofos.


brb running pmag and sdrol together in a month for sick gainz.

[jurgenmeiehoff]

idk why ppl keep bumping my old post to rep me or neg me. I'm gonna update it for the lurkers though.

I ended up buying a serm. Some of you clearly have reading problems. I found out its legal to order a serm because its a gray area in the US currently. its not "legal" but its not "illegal" yet either, aka gray area cuzz.


I don't get drug tested at work, im sure I said that. I was worried about actually getting pulled over and a cop seeing a tube of SERM and being able to get arrested for THAT... THAT is how I would get fired, not a drug test..

stupid mofos.


brb running pmag and sdrol together in a month for sick gainz.

Possession of a non-controlled substance is perfectly legal. Supp reps and their following of retards just preach that they aren't. A case can be made that the seller of the RC is practicing medicine without a license, that's if they intend them to be used for human consumption. Again, there is absolutely no danger with buying and possessing an RC. A car is a stupid place to store them for other reasons though.

Think of pct as wiping your ass. Some people don't think that it's entirely necessary, but in reality it's definitely a good idea. OTC PCT is like using your hand. Let's be honest, there are WAY better options easily/legally available. Keep in mind PCT should never change, regardless of the compound used. The goal is always the same: speedy recovery and maintaining gains. It's pitiful to see people looking for excuses to use a weak overpriced pct. You're probably better off using nothing than using an OTC pct.

[FlexManlet55]

Possession of a non-controlled substance is perfectly legal. Supp reps and their following of retards just preach that they aren't. A case can be made that the seller of the RC is practicing medicine without a license, that's if they intend them to be used for human consumption. Again, there is absolutely no danger with buying and possessing an RC. A car is a stupid place to store them for other reasons though.

Think of pct as wiping your ass. Some people don't think that it's entirely necessary, but in reality it's definitely a good idea. OTC PCT is like using your hand. Let's be honest, there are WAY better options easily/legally available. Keep in mind PCT should never change, regardless of the compound used. The goal is always the same: speedy recovery and maintaining gains. It's pitiful to see people looking for excuses to use a weak overpriced pct. You're probably better off using nothing than using an OTC pct.

I agree and always knew OTC PCT was fail, but I wasn't going to risk losing my job until I knew for sure. Alot of ppl can giggle and just say "do it *******" to me on the net, but in reality, a misdemeanor drug charge would cause me to go from $40k$ a year to BROKE AS A JOKE... f that...

BUT now i know its legal, brb androgen time.