Jesus died for your sins... LOL

[associate]

Where's your proof that Jesus claims, wholeheartedly himself, that he is God?

John 10:30
"I and the Father are one."

John 8:58
"Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I am.""

Who is Jesus praying to? Himself?

Jesus is God, but he is also man. So he prayed to God.

You've taken that verse out of context. Here's the full verse.

"I (Jesus) and the Father are One." This verse is severely misunderstood and is taken out of context, because beginning at verse John 10:23 we read (in the context of 10:30) about Jesus talking to the Jews. In verse John 10:28-30, talking about his followers as his sheep, he states: "...Neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father who gave them me, is greater than all, and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. I and the Father are One." Here he clearly says my father is greater than me.

These verses prove only that Jesus and the Father are one in that no man can pluck the sheep out of either's hand. It does not at all state that Jesus is God's equal in everything. In fact the words of Jesus, " My Father, who gave them me is Greater than ALL...," in John 10:29 completely negates this claim, otherwise we are left with a contradiction just a sentence apart. All includes everyone even Jesus.


Also let us look at verse John 17:20-22 "That the ALL may be made ONE. Like thou Father art in me, I in thee, that they may be ONE in us. I in
them, they in me, that they may be perfect in ONE". In this verse, the same word ONE used, the Greek, HEN is used, not only to describe Jesus and the Father but to describe Jesus, the Father and eleven of the twelve disciples of Jesus. So here if that implies equality, we have a unique case of 13 Gods.

Of the verse in question, "I and the Father are One" in (John 10:30), we also need to take note of the verses following the 30th verse in the text. In those verses, the Jews accuse Jesus falsely of claiming to be God by these words. He however replies, proving their accusation wrong by their own text: "The Jews answered him saying,'For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy, and because that thou being a man, makest thyself a God '" (John 10:33).

[associate]

Taking verses out of context to fit your desires is wrong

Their are verses in the Qu'ran that talk about war and killing. These are always taken out of context to make Islam look back. But if you understand the context they are within. There''s nothing wrong. Islam is pro-human, if you are being attacked, attack them back.

[iRelentless]

For any Christians ITT who do not know how to scripturally defend the deity of Christ and the Holy Trinity, please watch these videos.

It's funny you post this when Yusuf Estes CONVERTED TO ISLAM.

[associate]

Question: In John 10:30 Jesus says, "I and the Father are one [hen]." Doesn't this show that they are one in essence?

This statement does not suggest either a dual or triune deity. What John's Jesus meant by the word hen ("one") becomes clear from his prayer concerning the apostles: "That they may be one [hen], just as we are one [hen]" (John 17:22), which means that they should be united in agreement with one another as he (Jesus) is always united in agreement with God, as stated: "I [Jesus] always do the things that are pleasing to Him [God]" (John 8:29).
There is thus no implication that Jesus and God, or the twelve apostles are to be considered as of one essence.

[lasher]

It's funny you post this when Yusuf Estes CONVERTED TO ISLAM.

Why is that funny? White is responding to his objections. Your post is pretty much irrelevant. That would be like me pointing out someone converting to christianity from Islam as evidence that Islam is false. Let's try to be reasonable here.

[associate]

Men pray to god. Jesus is man. Jesus is God.

Yes you could simplify it and say that he prays to himself, but the fact is that God is omnipotent. God is everywhere and nowhere, everything and nothing at the same time.

doesnt make sense man.


ALso

God is actually over his throne. As he mentions in the Qu 'ran:
“He it is Who created the heavens and the earth in six days and then rose over (istawa) the Throne (in a manner that suits His Majesty). He knows what goes into the earth and what comes forth from it, and what descends from the heaven and what ascends thereto. And He is with you (by His Knowledge) wheresoever you may be.” [57:4]
To Him ascend (all) the goodly words, and the righteous deeds exalt it (i.e. the goodly words are not accepted by Allah unless and until they are followed by good deeds).” [35:10]

“He is the First (nothing is before Him) and the Last (nothing is after Him), the Most High (nothing is above Him) and the Most Near (nothing is nearer than Him).” [57:3]

Meaning is his throne is above the heavens and the earth. Quite simple really. Makes sense to the common folk.

[TrickHenry]

Taking verses out of context to fit your desires is wrong

Their are verses in the Qu'ran that talk about war and killing. These are always taken out of context to make Islam look back. But if you understand the context they are within. There''s nothing wrong. Islam is pro-human, if you are being attacked, attack them back.

So I guess this has devolved into a discussion about Islam vs Christianity. I don't want to take throws at your religion, because so many Muslims receive that every day and that's why they've become so defensive about their religion.

Just understand that there's plurality in God and not multiple gods that's why you misunderstand so much. Also the reaction of the talmudist show that Jesus claimed deity and he never corrects his followers when they call him God.

[associate]

Men pray to god. Jesus is man. Jesus is God.

Yes you could simplify it and say that he prays to himself, but the fact is that God is omnipotent. God is everywhere and nowhere, everything and nothing at the same time.

Yes Allah is omnipotent. He is the king of the Kings and the lord of the worlds. Why would he pray to himself? He doesn't need to. What logic is in that? He was clearly praying to Allah

Mark (15:34): And at the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani? which is, being interpreted, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?

Explain that? is he talking to himself now aswell? doesn't make sense. plz enlighten me

[TrickHenry]

doesnt make sense man.


ALso

God is actually over his throne. As he mentions in the Qu 'ran:
“He it is Who created the heavens and the earth in six days and then rose over (istawa) the Throne (in a manner that suits His Majesty). He knows what goes into the earth and what comes forth from it, and what descends from the heaven and what ascends thereto. And He is with you (by His Knowledge) wheresoever you may be.” [57:4]
To Him ascend (all) the goodly words, and the righteous deeds exalt it (i.e. the goodly words are not accepted by Allah unless and until they are followed by good deeds).” [35:10]

“He is the First (nothing is before Him) and the Last (nothing is after Him), the Most High (nothing is above Him) and the Most Near (nothing is nearer than Him).” [57:3]

Meaning is his throne is above the heavens and the earth. Quite simple really. Makes sense to the common folk.

quoting the quran to prove the quran?

Yes Allah is omnipotent. He is the king of the Kings and the lord of the worlds. Why would he pray to himself? He doesn't need to. What logic is in that? He was clearly praying to Allah

Mark (15:34): And at the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani? which is, being interpreted, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?

Explain that? is he talking to himself now aswell? doesn't make sense. plz enlighten me

Why part of Omnipotent don't you understand?

[iRelentless]

So I guess this has devolved into a discussion about Islam vs Christianity. I don't want to take throws at your religion, because so many Muslims receive that every day and that's why they've become so defensive about their religion.

Just understand that there's plurality in God and not multiple gods that's why you misunderstand so much. Also the reaction of the talmudist show that Jesus claimed deity and he never corrects his followers when they call him God.

See but for me I feel like argument and debate is a must. Because I think we can all agree that ONLY ONE RELIGION IS RIGHT? Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Budaism, etc.. can't all be right... and I feel like at the end there should only be one Religion that comes out on top as the correct one that disproves all the others...

do you agree with that?

So I feel like debate is necessary to show which one is correct.

[associate]

So I guess this has devolved into a discussion about Islam vs Christianity. I don't want to take throws at your religion, because so many Muslims receive that every day and that's why they've become so defensive about their religion.

Just understand that there's plurality in God and not multiple gods that's why you misunderstand so much. Also the reaction of the talmudist show that Jesus claimed deity and he never corrects his followers when they call him God.

Well, there will be a day when Jesus himself will slam these false accusations himself.
The conversation between Allah and Jesus (alayhi's-salam) on the Day of Judgment (paraphrased):
Allah, The Most High, will ask, "O Isa, son of Mary, did you tell the people to worship you and your mother besides Me?"
Prophet Isa will respond, "All Praise be to You! How could I ever say something so evil? I could never utter something so unbefitting of Your majesty! You know what I say and do better than I know it myself. I only commanded them to worship You. And You are their Lord and my Lord. All Praise belongs to You alone."
(Surah Ma'idah, 116-120)

[associate]

quoting the quran to prove the quran?



Why part of Omnipotent don't you understand?

you... a person out all people... asking if i understand something... lol

2om·nip·o·tent noun \äm-ˈni-pə-tənt\
Definition of OMNIPOTENT

1
: one who has unlimited power or authority : one who is omnipotent

[TrickHenry]

you... a person out all people... asking if i understand something... lol

2om·nip·o·tent noun \äm-ˈni-pə-tənt\
Definition of OMNIPOTENT

1
: one who has unlimited power or authority : one who is omnipotent

Right now explain unlimited power.

[associate]

quoting the quran to prove the quran?


?

Quoting the Qu'ran because it is the only one that makes sense. I'm using it as a tool to combat your points

[associate]

Right now explain unlimited power.

unlimited
[uhn-lim-i-tid] Spell Syllables
Synonyms Examples Word Origin
adjective
1.
not limited; unrestricted; unconfined:

Ofcourse Allah has unrestricted power. he has power over all things.

[TrickHenry]

Quoting the Qu'ran because it is the only one that makes sense. I'm using it as a tool to combat your points

Yes let's let the fox guard the hen house.

[associate]

Yes let's let the fox guard the hen house.

Truth is, before Islam came, Christianity was the religion of the time. If I lived in that time I'd follow Jesus' message too because it was nothing else but the message from the lord. Jesus propogated nothing but oneness of Allah and to single him out in worship. Many biblical references in the Bible confirm this.
Today the teachings of that are distorted and changed.. no more are the people following what the people of Jesus and his companions followed. Utter corruption.

Islam has the same teachings of Jesus. Nothing new. Our messenger now is Muhammad PBUH. Allah promised in the Qu'ran that the Qu'ran will be protected and never be corrupted like earlier scriptures.
I use verses of the Qu'ran to enlighted you on certain areas where today's christianity beliefs fall short, I don't see whats wrong with that. It seems like it conflicts your interests but in reality its just the most valid response i can give u.

[lasher]

lol,I forgot to post the saint patrick trinity video




Forgot these too!

[whatisbro]

In Islam animals are not slaughtered for human sins

I thought it was. The Jews did it tho. Who gave muslims permission again to quit the practice?

[Harbinger]

jakes on them christians, jeebus ain't ded ...

[smokeater]

Does that even make any sense, you Christians crazy? Does it make any sense that someone would die for someone elses sins?

Any parent can easily explain why they would sacrifice their life to save somebody they love.

Would you send YOUR son to a certain death?

Me? Probably not. Based on everything I've read in the bible, Jesus was certainly a willing participant.

Also who is God Christians? God, Jesus, or the holy spirit? Who is actually GOD?

You should already know the answer before engaging in discussions of this nature.

[IbnKutub]

I thought it was.

It's not.

[Tekkendo]

unlimited
[uhn-lim-i-tid] Spell Syllables
Synonyms Examples Word Origin
adjective
1.
not limited; unrestricted; unconfined:

Ofcourse Allah has unrestricted power. he has power over all things.

Yet he can't stop his followers from raping and killing each other since Moh died?

[Tekkendo]

Taking verses out of context to fit your desires is wrong

Their are verses in the Qu'ran that talk about war and killing. These are always taken out of context to make Islam look back. But if you understand the context they are within. There''s nothing wrong. Islam is pro-human, if you are being attacked, attack them back.

Tell that to ISIS and Boko Haram and the rest to the killer/rapist crews.

[Lawliet94]

Yet he can't stop his followers from raping and killing each other since Moh died?

As far as I know, Adam n Eve's grandchildren fought and killed each other.
The wrong is within us, not with Islam.

[Harbinger]

Of course course Allah has unrestricted power. he has power over all things.

Not me. He's mah bitch!

[deadrats]

Why part of Omnipotent don't you understand?

which part of "you have the gayest avi in the joint" don't you understand?

i can't even respond to this "guys" posts because his avi is so flaming it's impossible to take anything he says as serious.

one has to marvel at a guy that claims to be all religious yet uses a pic with half his ass cheeks popping out as his avi.

i'm going to assume that if this guys in the closet then the closet is missing the doors.

[Ransom17]

Strong lack of understanding the dual nature of Christ in this thread:

The trinity also explains how God could both take on humanity with its limits and humility for himself as well as be ruling in heaven at the same time. Jesus who is God the son can be praying to the Father because God contains within himself the true picture of community and outward love.

This is a huge philosophical problem in the Muslim description of God - GK Chesterton refers to the Islamic god as the lonely god only capable of loving himself which is consistent with Islamic theology which teaches that god only loves the good people.

[cysns]

If god is all powerful, then why does he need to sacrifice his son to rid humanity of sin? Why can't the all powerful god say all sin is absolved, and it is?

[GreatOldOne]

If god is all powerful, then why does he need to sacrifice his son to rid humanity of sin? Why can't the all powerful god say all sin is absolved, and it is?

That's what you call a plot hole. And rather distasteful. But in the story Jesus isn't actually sacrificed...he comes back to life...saying, 'Just kidding'. If Jesus was going to be a real sacrifice he'd have to be sent to hell to burn forever in place of all the sinners.

Anyway in the story for maximum trolling of humanity Jesus comes back and only says goodbye to a few close friends before ascending to heaven...ensuring for all time their followers would be seen as irrational when weighing the evidence of their beliefs.



Another plot hole would be why Gods creations don't function exactly as expected in the first place, and how to marry God's expectations with free-will which Christians believe gets God off the hook for his poor design ability. You've got Satan to tempt people in their view, but he's not a true opponent of God as the Christian God is still all-powerful...the nature of being itself. Which means even Satan is made 'out of Gods love'.

Strong lack of understanding the dual nature of Christ

Don't forget about The Holy Ghost.