Client with no kinesthetic awareness. im losing my mind

[patstille390]

I recently started running small group sessions at my studio (5 clients at a time) and one of my clients has absolutely no motor skills. I feel that im running a one on one session and paying no attention to the other clients in the class which isnt fair to them. Ive tried regressing her to the most basic exercises possible and she either a) cant do those basic movements or b) complains about them constantly. her poor attitude about the exercises (and the fact that shes going through a divorce) really brings down the energy of the class. Shes too cheap to pay for one on ones, which ive tried suggesting. So right now im at a loss of what to do. ive never had a client that was this much of a headache. I feel like i remind her of her soon to be ex by attitude toward me but she keeps re-uping for more sessions. Any suggestions about how to approach/coach her would be appreciated.

Her main problems areas are deadlift, squating movements which ive regressed about as far as the can go.

[MrMcgaw]

Dont make her squat or deadlift? Make her body weight squat 50 times and jump as high as poasible at end. She will not be able to talk.
Deadlift on uncoordinated is asking to be sued. Perhaps do a more basic lift like straight leg dl or something

[schmedes2]

goblet split squats, goblet box squats, poor man leg curls, trx leg curls

Or just fire her as a client

[JoeCannonMSCSCS]

Start with basics. dont do deadlifts until he can get out of a chair correctly. it takes 2-3 months to get the neurological awareness sometimes. start with basics before doing weights. be proficient at moving body weight before you give him extra weight to lift.

joe

[jonmd123]

I recently started running small group sessions at my studio (5 clients at a time) and one of my clients has absolutely no motor skills. I feel that im running a one on one session and paying no attention to the other clients in the class which isnt fair to them. Ive tried regressing her to the most basic exercises possible and she either a) cant do those basic movements or b) complains about them constantly. her poor attitude about the exercises (and the fact that shes going through a divorce) really brings down the energy of the class. Shes too cheap to pay for one on ones, which ive tried suggesting. So right now im at a loss of what to do. ive never had a client that was this much of a headache. I feel like i remind her of her soon to be ex by attitude toward me but she keeps re-uping for more sessions. Any suggestions about how to approach/coach her would be appreciated.

Her main problems areas are deadlift, squating movements which ive regressed about as far as the can go.

Too cheap or just can't afford it?

Anyway, everyone of your clients can/should squat and deadlift. Does she sit on a toilet? Does she pick things up off her coffee table? She might not have perfect form, but the basic movement pattern is there. A lot of times, I see trainer thinking they are regression and in reality they are only making it harder for their clients. For example, a bodyweight squat is much harder to perform correctly compared to a goblet or med ball squat, even though the goblet squat is 'loaded'.

I wouldn't be so quick to blame her poor motor skills. Most likely, you aren't using the proper corrective exercises to fix the dysfunction.

Do some research on Gray Cook, or Brent Brookbush has a really good YouTube page, too.

[jonmd123]

Dont make her squat or deadlift? Make her body weight squat 50 times and jump as high as poasible at end. She will not be able to talk.
Deadlift on uncoordinated is asking to be sued. Perhaps do a more basic lift like straight leg dl or something

Take this advice, and do the opposite.

[patstille390]

Jonmn123- she is too cheap to pay. My studio is in Winnetka IL (top 10 riches cities in the US) and shes a psycologist who spends $3000 every three months for our group classes but doesn't want to spend the extra $1000 for one on one. I've actually put her though Grey Cooks FMS screens to see where her problem areas are. She has poor dorsiflexion tight hip flexors and a posterior pelvic tilt. Right now I have her doing a waiters bow and a body weight box squat (couldnt do single leg deadlifts or RDL's with kb' goblet squats ect). This is a group class with a set workout for everyone and a few regressions. If I regress her to much she complaines that she's not getting the same
workout as the rest of
the group. Having her in the class turns it into a one on one which the rest of the class complaines about.

[DPT31]

Jonmn123- she is too cheap to pay. My studio is in Winnetka IL (top 10 riches cities in the US) and shes a psycologist who spends $3000 every three months for our group classes but doesn't want to spend the extra $1000 for one on one. I've actually put her though Grey Cooks FMS screens to see where her problem areas are. She has poor dorsiflexion tight hip flexors and a posterior pelvic tilt. Right now I have her doing a waiters bow and a body weight box squat (couldnt do single leg deadlifts or RDL's with kb' goblet squats ect). This is a group class with a set workout for everyone and a few regressions. If I regress her to much she complaines that she's not getting the same
workout as the rest of
the group. Having her in the class turns it into a one on one which the rest of the class complaines about.

Have her get a script and go to a Physical Therapist for a month or so, let them address the issues, and have her come back ready to join the group. If she doesn't want to pay the extra 1000, that's her prerogative. Let her pay a $10 copay 10x, and then come back and not be behind. Winnetka has an Athletico right there, and i'm sure there are some ATIs. Also, tight hip flexors and Posterior pelvic tilt? I guess it's possible depending on just how messed up her body is, but that's a pretty uncommon pair.

[RT1957]

I would have a talk with her and explain, nicely, that the group class requires her to be at a different level and for her to get to that level she needs one on one attention until she can be with everyone else in the class. If you continue down the road your going it will just get worst. The class will always be waiting and the others in the class will not get what they pay for. Right now shes getting all that she paid for and then some.

[Simmo0508]

I had a recent thread about this on here re: a guy doing some of my MMA classes (a PT client) whom had no idea how to spar or grapple. No concept of basic technique and movement. I'll try dig it up for you and post it here.

In your case though to be honest, traditional deadlifting is a very technical movement even for the best of us, so it isn't really the best choice for group classes when things need to be fast paced and have flow. Deadlifting is something we coach usually in private sessions, with a lot of practice. Squatting is a lot easier for people to comprehend, since there's so many variations and modifications. Use prone hyperextensions if you wanna hit some posterior. Much simpler to execute in those instances. Depends on the theme of the class though. Up to you.

In terms of the class, likewise my guy was eating up most of the attention and time himself, leaving the rest of the class with very little coaching. More like a 1on1 PT, with some others nearby following along. That's what it feels like doesn't it?! It sucks dude. You're there to service the x many other people too, not just the beginner who really shouldn't be in a group environment and should be in 1on1's only.

I explained that to my guy after a while. It got mentally very draining for me. I suggested that MMA wasn't really needed at the time for him to continue towards his goal (put it like that) and that i'll find some extra ways for him to burn calories throughout the week. The reason why they keep attending (and in your case, re-signing up for new packs) is because of the social and motivation aspect. That's all well and good, but it must match the class type and the targeted demographic for that class. Not everyone is there necessarily for the social/motivation aspect, so it devalues other people's experience/workout in those cases. If the class is meant to be a serious/technical workout, then it's not primarily suited for her. Suggest to her one of the other classes on your gym's schedule.

I have a rule now that when in group settings, you must at least know some basic movements and some basic exercise terminology. It's not fair on the other attendees, and it's not fair on you. It's a group class, not a 1on1 PT. There's perks to 1on1 PT over groups for that exact reason.

It's also partially a reason why Crossfit gyms for example have "Fundamentals" classes for people before they're cleared and are seen as able to participate in the proper CF workouts competently.

[jonmd123]

Jonmn123- she is too cheap to pay. My studio is in Winnetka IL (top 10 riches cities in the US) and shes a psycologist who spends $3000 every three months for our group classes but doesn't want to spend the extra $1000 for one on one. I've actually put her though Grey Cooks FMS screens to see where her problem areas are. She has poor dorsiflexion tight hip flexors and a posterior pelvic tilt. Right now I have her doing a waiters bow and a body weight box squat (couldnt do single leg deadlifts or RDL's with kb' goblet squats ect). This is a group class with a set workout for everyone and a few regressions. If I regress her to much she complaines that she's not getting the same
workout as the rest of
the group. Having her in the class turns it into a one on one which the rest of the class complaines about.

Did you mean anterior tilted hips? What I would do is stretch her quads, hip flexors, IT/TFL, calves, and chest before every session. Then do posterior chain activation. Show her once, then make sure she does it on her own before every class.

I know you don't want to ruin the flow of your class, but doing 5-10 minutes of prehab/form stuff before you get rolling never hurt anyone.

Have you tried any of these things with her?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BbJrHzMXteY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZU_RfmeRyE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FNCsiHkyK5U

I would disagree with some on here about the deadlift. I feel the deadlift is much easier to teach than the squat. I also feel it's much safer than the squat in a group setting. The best teaching technique I have found with this is simply having them bend over and push their butt against a wall. As they progress, move them further away from the wall. It's amazing how you can take someone with the worst deadlift form, and correct them in under 2 minutes.

Give those techniques a try. If she's still giving you trouble you might have to be blunt with her, and tell her either get personal training, or get out (maybe not using that wording). Tell her for her safety and the flow of the class you need her to spend a few weeks doing 1-on-1 training. Give her a set start and end date, and what you're going to work on each session. That should make her feel more confident that you're looking out for her, and not just getting her to sign-up for extra training.

Best of luck to you, I've been in that situation before.

[RevolutionFF]

This is why I am not a fan of group training or even 2 on 1 PT. The whole point in personal training is to give each client your MAXIMUM attention. As soon as you train more than one person in each session your attention is cut in half. Group PT = maximising profit = less quality for each client.

Not so bad if each client is great and you can leave them for a minute or two and you know they will execute perfect technique.

In your case, not so good I'm afraid.

[RevolutionFF]

Or further to my last point, you should still be creating INDIVIDUAL programs for each person. The programs may be similar for each client, but tweaked for each client too.

In your case, you may get the client doing a posterior chain exercise that requires less motor control and single leg alternatives to quad dominant exercises.

[jnwfitness]

Group training really does take some of the attention away from each client which seems to be what this client is looking for. Of course their is more to this individual than you have stated, but it could be that here issues have nothing to do with exercise, but with getting attention. Try praising her more and celebrating small accomplishments more often. Try having her demonstrate exercises for the group and leading when ever possible. She may be reluctant to start, but the class will move smoother as her confidence builds and she works harder to be the image that you have created for her.

[jnwfitness]

Group training really does take some of the attention away from each client which seems to be what this client is looking for. Of course their is more to this individual than you have stated, but it could be that her issues have nothing to do with exercise, but with getting attention. Try praising her more and celebrating small accomplishments more often. Try having her demonstrate exercises for the group and leading when ever possible. She may be reluctant to start, but the class will move smoother as her confidence builds and she works harder to be the image that you have created for her.

on the same note, try not to correct her every single time her form is off, let her use lighter weights until form improves so that she can remain safe.