The New Christian Thread 2

[ppself]

general question for you guys, mainly small churches (300 and below i guess? lol), not mega churches:

have you seen a decline in your congregational numbers? either to other churches or just walking from the faith entirely?

Not really.

Of course some people end up leaving for their reasons, but there is always new people coming in.

[flexnation]

general question for you guys, mainly small churches (300 and below i guess? lol), not mega churches:

have you seen a decline in your congregational numbers? either to other churches or just walking from the faith entirely?

Yupp. My church has maybe 50-75 members that attend regularly. It has dwindled a lot in the last 5 years.

On that note, I'm in.

[mainsqueeze530]

If you had a motorcycle did you also have a dirt bike? That would be fun. There's a good spot I'm told by my brother outside of Wheatland. Its a lot of open area there so it makes sense.

haha my life revolved around football, motorcycles, dirt biking, and fishing. and God obviously, but that's a given.

I really wish I could just go dirt biking, but the landings from jumps are pretty brutal on my stomach and back.

mirin bike! i'm on a zx6r. started on a 636 then upgraded year and mileage to an 08 zx6r se, but by that point they'd stopped making the 636cc (though now that they're back again, i'm eyeing them) what was the litrebike like? dat power! hnnnng.

and what church did you attend when you went to ucb? and what years? i lived in mill valley for 3 years then moved to emeryville/berkeley until nov '12.

tilden is easy to get tired of quickly... but it's got some nice twisties out there for the bike stinson even more so, as i'm sure you well know.

srs??! I had the same se model. sold it towards a '12 gsxr 1000. the 2013 636cc models are so nice, but don't get rid of the zx6r though. it's an amazing bike! and I didn't go to a church in berkeley, rode an hour back and forth to a church near sac every sunday/wednesday.

[mainsqueeze530]

general question for you guys, mainly small churches (300 and below i guess? lol), not mega churches:

have you seen a decline in your congregational numbers? either to other churches or just walking from the faith entirely?

mine has no more than 40 haha. the attendance only goes up though, never declines

[Juicymango]

Interesting, that makes a lot of sense.


This is where I wish I had knowledge of greek/latin so that I would be able to translate literal meanings from original texts.

Just to reiterate, from what I understood of the passage is that the head covering applied more directly to the women of Corinth to differentiate themselves from the prostitutes and pagans. The culture of Corinth looked down upon women with no hair/short hair so in order to have more general acceptance they needed a covering or longer hair.

In cultures where there is not a negative stigma attached to women without hair or short hair then head covering is not needed.

I agree.

Also, Paul anticipated legalism regarding his opinion on this cultural issue so he bookends with:

"16 If anyone wants to be contentious about this, we have no other practice—nor do the churches of God."

For me he clearly states that Christians shouldn't make a big deal out of it at all.

[cross-trainer]

Welcome back, jf1!

The jf1 thing has been debunked long ago.
I dont understand why my fellow Christians are so unwilling to accept one of their own.

Why the trip to band camp?

"Religious trolling", in the RELIGION section.
Go figure.

[Harbinger]

The jf1 thing has been debunked long ago.
I dont understand why my fellow Christians are so unwilling to accept one of their own.

I can semi-affirm this.

"Religious trolling", in the RELIGION section.
Go figure.

Because you're a troll?

[Indivdude]

haha my life revolved around football, motorcycles, dirt biking, and fishing. and God obviously, but that's a given.

I really wish I could just go dirt biking, but the landings from jumps are pretty brutal on my stomach and back.

Aw man. That completely ruins a lot of stuff. Guess you have time to catch up on any reading you want/need to do.

What do you do then since you don't have a motorcycle anymore and can't do dirt bike/football? Lot more room for fishing? Fly fishing? I can't stand fishing. I don't get it. My father loves it but I can't stand it. Its so boring to me. Don't get me wrong, it can be fun if you have friends/family with you but fishing by itself is not fun for me. Course fishing is basically a way to get outside and talk with family/friends anyway.

mine has no more than 40 haha. the attendance only goes up though, never declines

If you're still running back and forth to sac for your church, you should head to the rock in roseville. Some very cool people there.

[1hardgainer]

Yupp. My church has maybe 50-75 members that attend regularly. It has dwindled a lot in the last 5 years.

On that note, I'm in.

In your sig you say you listen to Kanye West. You know he admitted to selling out to Satan for his fame and fortune, right?




This is a good sermon that warns people who claim to be Christian but yet act like the world, dress like the world, listen to wordly music, etc. You may need to examine yourself and see if you're really in the faith.

[flexnation]

In your sig you say you listen to Kanye West. You know he admitted to selling out to Satan for his fame and fortune, right?




This is a good sermon that warns people who claim to be Christian but yet act like the world, dress like the world, listen to wordly music, etc. You may need to examine yourself and see if you're really in the faith.

yes, i understand he admitted to that. Its sad really, because he grew up as a christian beleiving in God, yet turned his back b/c of money. Does that mean i make him a role model and follow what he does? Does that mean i go out and try to have sex w/ as many women as possible like him, Blaspheme(sp?) like him, put money over everything like him? No. I just enjoy listening to Hip Hop/Rap. Its the same thing as Believers watching horror movies/tv shows or movies with a lot of sexual content. I am very sure that i am in the faith. Thanks though brother.

Watching Video now, will respond when finished.

Edit:Just finished watching the video and all i can say is wow. That nearly described me to a T. Ive a had faith in Jesus for nearly my whole life but always fall off that path and jump back on for a bit over and over again. I needed that, thanks bro. I would also strongly recommend everyone else ITT to take some time out to watch that video as well. Its worth it.

[1hardgainer]

yes, i understand he admitted to that. Its sad really, because he grew up as a christian beleiving in God, yet turned his back b/c of money. Does that mean i make him a role model and follow what he does? Does that mean i go out and try to have sex w/ as many women as possible like him, Blaspheme(sp?) like him, put money over everything like him? No. I just enjoy listening to Hip Hop/Rap. Its the same thing as Believers watching horror movies/tv shows or movies with a lot of sexual content. I am very sure that i am in the faith. Thanks though brother.

Watching Video now, will respond when finished.

Edit:Just finished watching the video and all i can say is wow. That nearly described me to a T. Ive a had faith in Jesus for nearly my whole life but always fall off that path and jump back on for a bit over and over again. I needed that, thanks bro. I would also strongly recommend everyone else ITT to take some time out to watch that video as well. Its worth it.

I'm glad you were moved by that video! Yeah, that video shocked me when I first saw it and really made me realize there were still things in my life that I needed to repent of. It's important to remember that it is NOT about works salvation, but rather it's about the fact that true repentence and faith in Christ will eventually lead to a changed life/lifestyle. Over time we should be acting less and less like the world and more like Jesus, which I believe is what we are all called to do.

[BuccoBruce]

Washer is great. It's a shame that's the only sermon the majority of people know him for.

[flexnation]

I'm glad you were moved by that video! Yeah, that video shocked me when I first saw it and really made me realize there were still things in my life that I needed to repent of. It's important to remember that it is NOT about works salvation, but rather it's about the fact that true repentence and faith in Christ will eventually lead to a changed life/lifestyle. Over time we should be acting less and less like the world and more like Jesus, which I believe is what we are all called to do.

True that bro. If works got us saved then Jesus died in vain, He is the only way. I agree with everything in the video and everything you have said. We are to be IN the world Not OF the world.

Im assuming you're southern baptist as well?

[Harbinger]

I can semi-affirm this.




Because you're a troll?

Somebody is butthurt.

[justme7]

Somebody is butthurt.
[IMG]http://i37.tinypic.com/rvx5og.jpg[/IG]

bahahahaha.

after the avi debacle and influx of atheists during said debacle, i put 2 and 2 together as to what happened and began lurking the atheist thread. one of the people in there posted a comment about his pet snake. i had a field day with that in his CP (positive repped but left a comment worthy of landover). i was hoping he'd post it like you have with cross-trainer, but it did not come to pass. maybe he thought i was srs with the craziness i left in the comment.

anyway, i'll rep you when i'm off spread to make up for his negs.

[Harbinger]

bahahahaha.

after the avi debacle and influx of atheists during said debacle, i put 2 and 2 together as to what happened and began lurking the atheist thread. one of the people in there posted a comment about his pet snake. i had a field day with that in his CP (positive repped but left a comment worthy of landover). i was hoping he'd post it like you have with cross-trainer, but it did not come to pass. maybe he thought i was srs with the craziness i left in the comment.

anyway, i'll rep you when i'm off spread to make up for his negs.

he didn't even make my rep go down one.

[1hardgainer]

True that bro. If works got us saved then Jesus died in vain, He is the only way. I agree with everything in the video and everything you have said. We are to be IN the world Not OF the world.

Im assuming you're southern baptist as well?

I go to a non-denominational church, which believes what the Baptists believe but also believes in pursuing the gifts of the Spirit, which is what the Pentacostals believe.

[Swamp Dog]

I go to a non-denominational church, which believes what the Baptists believe but also believes in pursuing the gifts of the Spirit, which is what the Pentacostals believe.

Southern Baptists believe in gifts of the Spirit too, but I suppose you mean speaking in tongues. The problem lies in interpreting the tongue.
I have a theory: I believe that all the tongue speakers drift to the Pentacostal denomination and that all the interpreters end up in the SB. So what ends up happening is that they are unknowingly segregated.
Now if we can somehow combine the two denominations, voila! The problem will be solved. The people who speak in tongues, having never had them interpreted, all of a sudden are surrounded by interpreters and all can understand what's going on!
Pure genius I know.

not srs


well maybe kinda srs

[BuccoBruce]

My issue with with tongues is not with speaking in tongues itself but more with the overemphasis of it as if one isn't a Christian unless he/she does so. It seems to be made a mockery of and exalted as if it's some "super gift."

[Swamp Dog]

My issue with with tongues is not with speaking in tongues itself but more with the overemphasis of it as if one isn't a Christian unless he/she does so. It seems to be made a mockery of and exalted as if it's some "super gift."

True, true.

Jesus said we would be known by our love for each other, He didn't say anything about being multi-lingual.

[BuccoBruce]

True, true.

Jesus said we would be known by our love for each other, He didn't say anything about being multi-lingual.

Agreed. Which brings me to another question. Is "tongues" simply speaking in another language (such as me speaking Mandarin), or a language unknown to man? I suppose it could be both at different times. Acts 2 seems to lean that way.

[GreatOldOne]

My issue with with tongues is not with speaking in tongues itself but more with the overemphasis of it as if one isn't a Christian unless he/she does so. It seems to be made a mockery of and exalted as if it's some "super gift."

Do you have any experience with the handling of snakes? I won't go into my details about what I think about it other than I've seen it and don't think it's a great idea.

[BuccoBruce]

Do you have any experience with the handling of snakes? I won't go into my details about what I think about it other than I've seen it and don't think it's a great idea.

No. From what I know of it, I think it's a mockery of what faith is all about. In the same vein, I read a story about a group of people who walked in heavy traffic with the same mindset of "God will save us if we have enough faith" that seems to be the foundation behind the handling snakes deal. One of them ended up being hit by a car and died. I'm sure it happened to others too but I only remember reading about the one death.

[BuccoBruce]

Also, related to this discussion of "having enough faith" is the development of the New Thought movement. I strongly encourage anybody to check into it. While it started in the early 19th century, it's becoming more and more mainstream in a different packaging now known as Prosperity Theology. The idea is that if you have enough faith, anything and everything you want will come to pass. Therefore, there's no reason for you to be sick, because all you need to do is tell yourself you're not sick and have enough faith. Consequently, if you don't get better, it's your fault for not having faith.

[GreatOldOne]

No. From what I know of it, I think it's a mockery of what faith is all about. In the same vein, I read a story about a group of people who walked in heavy traffic with the same mindset of "God will save us if we have enough faith" that seems to be the foundation behind the handling snakes deal. One of them ended up being hit by a car and died. I'm sure it happened to others too but I only remember reading about the one death.

Oh man that's horrible. Yeah, anything in this vein of thought is a terrible idea.

[Swamp Dog]

Agreed. Which brings me to another question. Is "tongues" simply speaking in another language (such as me speaking Mandarin), or a language unknown to man? I suppose it could be both at different times. Acts 2 seems to lean that way.

In Acts they were speaking in known tongues, I'll have to look into it to see if Paul was talking about ecstatic utterances.

[Swamp Dog]

Also, related to this discussion of "having enough faith" is the development of the New Thought movement. I strongly encourage anybody to check into it. While it started in the early 19th century, it's becoming more and more mainstream in a different packaging now known as Prosperity Theology. The idea is that if you have enough faith, anything and everything you want will come to pass. Therefore, there's no reason for you to be sick, because all you need to do is tell yourself you're not sick and have enough faith. Consequently, if you don't get better, it's your fault for not having faith.

Jesus does day "If you abide in me and my words abide in you ask whatever you wish and it will be done for you." John 15:7
The key is not in the asking or getting done, but in abiding with Jesus. I would like to think that when one abides with him, there are more important matters than getting rich, never getting sick, and picking up deadly animals. Such as, oh, helping the widows, orphans, the sick, poor, and afflicted to His glory.

[BuccoBruce]

In Acts they were speaking in known tongues, I'll have to look into it to see if Paul was talking about ecstatic utterances.

I thought it was known tongues too, but why else would others think they were drunk?

[BuccoBruce]

Jesus does day "If you abide in me and my words abide in you ask whatever you wish and it will be done for you." John 15:7
The key is not in the asking or getting done, but in abiding with Jesus. I would like to think that when one abides with him, there are more important matters than getting rich, never getting sick, and picking up deadly animals. Such as, oh, helping the widows, orphans, the sick, poor, and afflicted to His glory.

Couldn't agree more. The issue with prosperity theology (one of the many) is that it makes God out to be some sort of celestial investment bank who exists to give you all of your selfish wants and desires.

[1hardgainer]

Southern Baptists believe in gifts of the Spirit too, but I suppose you mean speaking in tongues. The problem lies in interpreting the tongue.
I have a theory: I believe that all the tongue speakers drift to the Pentacostal denomination and that all the interpreters end up in the SB. So what ends up happening is that they are unknowingly segregated.
Now if we can somehow combine the two denominations, voila! The problem will be solved. The people who speak in tongues, having never had them interpreted, all of a sudden are surrounded by interpreters and all can understand what's going on!
Pure genius I know.

not srs


well maybe kinda srs

I would think that's what a non-denomination church would look like. Although the church I've been attending encourages believers to pursue the gifts of the Spirit, I personally haven't witnessed people speaking in tongues/translating during worship/service (I've only been going for a year, though).

No. From what I know of it, I think it's a mockery of what faith is all about. In the same vein, I read a story about a group of people who walked in heavy traffic with the same mindset of "God will save us if we have enough faith" that seems to be the foundation behind the handling snakes deal. One of them ended up being hit by a car and died. I'm sure it happened to others too but I only remember reading about the one death.

Wow, that's tragic. The handling of snakes can be found in Mark 16:15-18, though:

"And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover."


But does that mean to intentionally pick up snakes to prove your faith? I'm not really sure about that. Remember when Satan tried to tempt Jesus in the wilderness?

"And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone.
Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God." (Matthew 4:6-7)

Is it possible the folks who walked in the middle of traffic were unknowingly tempting God? Getting back to the handling of snakes, if you look at the book of Acts, Paul was bitten by a poisonous snake, but wasn't harmed by it:

"And when Paul had gathered a bundle of sticks, and laid them on the fire, there came a viper out of the heat, and fastened on his hand.
And when the barbarians saw the venomous beast hang on his hand, they said among themselves, No doubt this man is a murderer, whom, though he hath escaped the sea, yet vengeance suffereth not to live.
And he shook off the beast into the fire, and felt no harm." (Acts 28:3-5)

I'm wondering if what Jesus said in Mark 16:18 is making reference to what happened to Paul in the book of Acts. I'm assuming what Jesus was saying is that if you are doing the will of God/preaching the word of God, you are being supernaturally protected by God until He's finished with the purpose He has for your life.