core training

[Nlmrod]

i train my core every other day should you do core every day i have heard all kinds of different theories. what schedule will be most beneficial

[ntrllftr]

I honestly never give it any thought. I go to the gym and hit the body part I'm scheduled to do. I guess I'm trying to say... I try not to overthink things.

[ljimd]

I honestly never give it any thought. I go to the gym and hit the body part I'm scheduled to do. I guess I'm trying to say... I try not to overthink things.

^^^^^ I agree with Carl. After hvy pressing and pulling who has time or energy to worry about the "core". IMO it's overkill. To each his own.

[ironwill2008]

I honestly never give it any thought.

Nor do I.

Abs, along with everything else, get a tremendous indirect workout from just about all compound exercises. Some direct ab work, once or twice a week, is fine if you feel the need, but again, it's hard to imagine abs getting worked harder doing a set of Crunches than they do during a set of heavy Squats, Deadlifts, or OH Presses.

[John Prophet]

i train my core every other day should you do core every day i have heard all kinds of different theories. what schedule will be most beneficial

by "core" do u just mean abs? the core also incudes lower back etc

Here is my theory and what I am currently doing. There are things u can do to BUILD the core strength and there r things u do to MAINTAIN it.

So right now I am doing weighted abs and I am also doing heavy stiff leg deads and romanian deads, not to mention squats. So I am BUILDING the core strength using those exercises.

But also I am MAINTAINING the core strength by doing stuff like bodyweight hyperextensions and bw ab stuff for like 20 reps.

I am not trying to do the BUILDING stuff everyday. (though I may do weighted abs numerous times per week)

But the MAINTAINING stuff I feel I can do 7x per week and multiple times per day if I like. for instance I might do 10 bodyweight hyperextensions everytime I walk into the gym as part of my warmup. I dont really consider that as any type of "workout", its just a warmup to keep me limber etc though it will contribute to MAINTAINING the muscle tone.

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and some of what I say depends on the individuals strength and conditioning level. To an out of shape, never worked out before, middle aged office worker, doing 20 crunches would be very stressfull and he might only do them 1x-2x per week. Later, as he starts to do weighted abs etc he could drop and do 20 crunches every day multiple times per day to maintain muscle tone


even weighted abs or weighted hyperextensions can be done more or less frequently based on relative strength. If a guy does weighted hypers with 100lbs for around 15 reps max, he might just do that 1x per week to BUILD the core, but he might do 10 reps with 25lbs almost every single day to MAINTAIN


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as an aside, if everyone did, say, 3x20 crunches, and 3x15 hyperextensions 4-5x per week, how many chiropractors would be put out of business?

[Nlmrod]

Nor do I.

Abs, along with everything else, get a tremendous indirect workout from just about all compound exercises. Some direct ab work, once or twice a week, is fine if you feel the need, but again, it's hard to imagine abs getting worked harder doing a set of Crunches than they do during a set of heavy Squats, Deadlifts, or OH Presses.

ok thx for info guys

[Whiskeyjack]

Based on JP's def, and taking what the others said, I fit in as maintaining (by doing 3 sets of BW hypers supersetted with RC situps or leg raises every workout) and by doing compounds like squats. I don't do weighted stuff to build core (unless you count squats and T-bar effects on erectors). But overall I wouldn't over-think this stuff, these new age words and paradigms like 'core' and 'stack' etc.

[John Prophet]

to put my post in perspective, I am coming off of a long layoff and would like to get my powerlifting numbers back up to and beyond where they were before....Lord willing. So obviously my "core" strength and overall body conditioning was/is pretty pitiful when I stepped back into the gym.

My 3rd session squating, even though I was warmed up, I strained my back with a massive 225 on the bar. Couldnt put my own shoes on for a week etc. So I had to step back and think about my approach a little. So I decided to start building up my core some and keep it strong(er)

I dont think it was lack of strength per se that hurt my back, but flexibility also comes into play. Obviously my body wasnt ready to be hitting low squats plus I always struggle with "butt wink" to start with, lol.

I dont remember all of my exact numbers, but when I was squatting 425, deadlifting 445 I was doing hypers around 10 reps with 90-100lb dbell, sldl and romanian deads 315ish, "shrugs" 405ish which takes good core strength. I dont remember what I was doing as far as weighted abs...probably just crunches with a 45 and obviously weighted machine abs.

So obviously if I want to squat and dead, say, 550ish, then one can see that my hypers, sldl etc need to increase beyond where they were before. That sort of puts my post above in perspective. I am trying to "pre-build" those core areas so that they wont be the weak link and so i dont have to drive barefoot to my moms house to get my shoes put on, lol

[Whiskeyjack]

Yes, I too 'felt' my back squatting with 225 - hence the hypers. I don't think I'll get back to my own former poundages, but I am aiming for what I think's reasonable, so am going up slowly, well warmed, and doing BW core stuff.

I am also very seriously considering the deload idea, as you recommended, JP. This would be a first for me (aside from about a decade with no load), but I can feel the accumulated fatigue you mentioned from going it fairly heavily (relatively speaking), consistently, and progressively since April without a break. Not sure about how to go about it though - like 50% sets?

Sorry for thread hijack, OP.

[John Prophet]

Yes, I too 'felt' my back squatting with 225 - hence the hypers. I don't think I'll get back to my own former poundages, but I am aiming for what I think's reasonable, so am going up slowly, well warmed, and doing BW core stuff.

I am also very seriously considering the deload idea, as you recommended, JP. This would be a first for me (aside from about a decade with no load), but I can feel the accumulated fatigue you mentioned from going it fairly heavily (relatively speaking), consistently, and progressively since April without a break. Not sure about how to go about it though - like 50% sets?

Sorry for thread hijack, OP.

different people have different formulas etc. I almost always go by feel and just go about half speed, lol. obviously no sets close to failure, maybe cut out the top set, cut down the # of workout days, cut down the volume....there r a lot of ways to cut back

one way u might approach it (after u deload this time) is to look at an 8 week block:

3 hard weeks
1 week mild deload (cut back some volume, dont push sets too hard, stay really "fresh")
3 hard weeks
1 week more thorough deload (cut back more, give the body a real break)

then repeat

obviously in long term planning u look at your calender and preposition the thorough deload for vacation week etc.

[Whiskeyjack]

Excellent, tx Eom and JP.

I work out 2 on, 2 off, which works well. Perhaps my first go I'll cut back on volume from 12-8 sets/bodypart and no super heavy sets.

[John Prophet]

Excellent, tx Eom and JP.

I work out 2 on, 2 off, which works well. Perhaps my first go I'll cut back on volume from 12-8 sets/bodypart and no super heavy sets.

one possible benefit u may find will be increased focus during the 3 "hard" weeks (or whatever u choose) because u will have a short term framework in your mind as opposed to just sort of an open ended deal. Especially if u r the type who works a bodypart once per week, because in your mind you will think "wow, I only have 3 workouts for this bodypart before I deload." You can pretty much bet that those 3 workouts will be really focused.

a step further down the Russian plympic type theory is to "wave" the volume and intensity of those 3 "hard" weeks. Thats a fertile ground for imagination where u could make one of the weeks HIGHER volume and then a different week could be heavier weights with lower volume. There isnt really a wrong or right way to wave stuff, the idea being that u can REALLY push yourself hard on some weeks as long as u come back down on other weeks, plus u have the deload week as an overall pressure relief valve.


I will give u a few nice Russian quotes that u can ponder. Of course these were in books based on Olympic weightlifting but to me the ideas easily cross over into powerlifting and bodybuilding.


"Only a sequence of loading and rest can contribute to the continous increase in results."

"A week of high intensity training is followed by weeks of moderate or small intensity."

R.A. Roman. "The Training of the Weightlifter." 1986


"...only high loads are sufficiently effective for the exceeding of sporting results of trained lifters. But large loads give effect only when they alternate with small and medium ones, i.e. when conditions are created for the recovery of the organism after a heavy load."

"Correct contruction of the training process, above all, is related to a rational variation of large, medium, and small training loads."

A.N. Vorobyev. "A Textbook on Weightlifting." 1981



My thoughts on these quotes as far as bodybuilding are along the lines that everyone always searches for some exact STATIC number of sets and reps and weight etc, when in reality those variables should be changing all the time. You push hard, then u back off some. Tide comes in, tide goes out.