Help with huge discrepancy in treadmill vs outdoor running

[MojoNixon]

Hi Everyone -

I know that there are significant differences between free range running and treadmill running like lack of wind resistance on the treadmill, flat, even surface, the moving belt and so on. I have been running on a treadmill for over a year and try to compensate for the differences by changing my incline, varying the speed and keeping my stride similar to my outdoor running stride. Now that it's getting nice out, I would love to be able to run my regular walk from work, which is only about 4 miles.

Although I can jog for an hour on a treadmill at about 6/miles an hour without a problem, I cannot run/jog outside. And when I say "I can't run" I mean, I run for one minute and am totally incapable of catching my breath. I know that I am not that insanely out of shape.

Does anyone have any advice on how to efficiently switch from indoor to outdoor running? And is that much of a performance discrepancy between indoor and outdoor normal?

Thanks for any suggestions.

[matjusm]

Its entirely possible that you're running much faster outside since its hard to judge your speed. 6 mph which you run on the treadmill isn't too fast.

[iDrive]

Yeah you gotta learn how to pace yourself outside. Chances are you're running a lot faster than you should be out of the gate like matjusm said 6mph isn't that fast.

You also might have to get over any mental blocks of not being able to see your progress on a screen in front of you. Just relax and take it easy don't try to worry about times or speed just take in the nice weather and walk if you have to.

[BombDonald]

When I used to run, I always found treadmill running to be very difficult compared to running outside. 5-8 miles at 7:30 per mile left me fairly worn out on a treadmill, but I could usually bust out 5-8 milers outside at 6:30 mile pace with the same effort.

Keeping the treadmill at a slight incline is a good idea. It is also a great idea to run outside as much as you can. Serious runners are still hitting the roads in the middle of winter.

[MojoNixon]

Its entirely possible that you're running much faster outside since its hard to judge your speed. 6 mph which you run on the treadmill isn't too fast.

Thanks. I thought that was the case as well, but I started counting my strides per minute and seem to be running at the same pace. But I'll go out there again tonight and will try to go slower.

Also, I should mention that my body/legs do not get tired, well, after running a block or two, how could day. It's the breathing that's a pain, literally, especially if it's cooler outside.

[martial-man420]

Before I put on any muscle at all I used to be a pretty (not very) good runner and would train maybe 4 days a week. I could run a 10K easily in a sub 40min time but I have never in my life been able to run more than 5 minutes on a treadmill. I get (probably imaginary) injuries and pains in my knees and ankles. I think it's just too boring for me.

Just get used to running outside. As others said 6mph isn't very fast so chances are you're going much faster outside.

[tomsfish]

turn your brain off.start slow get warmed up and your legs will take over.your body will know when to slow down and speed up by itself.after a while you will actually be able to run faster outside as your body speeds up when its feeling good, and slows down when you start to get winded.

[Justin Buchana]

I always found treadmill running to be very difficult compared to running outside. 5-8 miles at 7:30 per mile left me fairly worn out on a treadmill, but I could usually bust out 5-8 milers outside at 6:30 mile pace with the same effort.

Keeping the treadmill at a slight incline is a good idea. It is also a great idea to run outside as much as you can. Serious runners are still hitting the roads in the middle of winter.

I'm like this as well, can run alot more effectively outside.

[chrsschb]

I'm like this as well, can run alot more effectively outside.

Same. I'm not sure what it is but on the treadmill I feel like I'm moving pretty quick but as soon as I step off the treadmill and do the same run I do it in a faster time but it feels like I'm running slower.

May be a mental thing

[Birddog6424]

Distance running is all about learning how to set and maintain pace. You can go the "Running for Dummies" route and simply start out super slow. Then slowly adjust up accordingly.

Or you can marker out some distances roughly and time yourself between your marks. A track is ideal for this.

Great runners are amazing at setting pace. Steve Prefontaine was famous for it. He knew down to the second how fast he wanted to complete each lap. And that is harder than you think, not all lap speeds are run at the same pace, and it's very easy when grouped up with other runners, to get thrown off pace.

When interval training to increase distance or speed, knowing your pace times is the key to making progress.

[mmorton]

i enjoy outside running better however where i live the pollen is horrible and it can be tough to breathe correctly outside.

when on a treadmill i usually set the incline to a 1 or 2 to simulate running outside.

[YoungMoolah69]

it may sound stupid but try running with headphones in with a semi fast beat song, try and keep your strides in sync with the beat and it'll take your mind off your running issues ?

[LoneWolf720]

Distance running is all about learning how to set and maintain pace.

Great runners are amazing at setting pace.

When interval training to increase distance or speed, knowing your pace times is the key to making progress.

This ^

I use to be purely a long distance runner and I was pretty good at it too, it's all about learning how to conserve your energy and use it optimally in the "long run", literally. I was going to add though, that running outdoors is significantly harder. When running on a treadmill, really the only muscles being used are the quads, while outdoor running activates the hams, calves, and glutes, more calories are being burnt when running outdoors as well. And then the differences in turf, such as running on asphalt vs grass, the grass is much more tiring. Just think about how much harder it is to walk in sand compared to a sidewalk.

[igsm1969]

Hi Everyone -

I know that there are significant differences between free range running and treadmill running like lack of wind resistance on the treadmill, flat, even surface, the moving belt and so on. I have been running on a treadmill for over a year and try to compensate for the differences by changing my incline, varying the speed and keeping my stride similar to my outdoor running stride. Now that it's getting nice out, I would love to be able to run my regular walk from work, which is only about 4 miles.

Although I can jog for an hour on a treadmill at about 6/miles an hour without a problem, I cannot run/jog outside. And when I say "I can't run" I mean, I run for one minute and am totally incapable of catching my breath. I know that I am not that insanely out of shape.

Does anyone have any advice on how to efficiently switch from indoor to outdoor running? And is that much of a performance discrepancy between indoor and outdoor normal?

Thanks for any suggestions.

I highly recommend doing high intensity interval training (HIIIT) on the treadmill a few times a week (non-consecutively). Sprint for 30 seconds/recover for 90 for about 20 minutes. I was in the same shape last year where I could not even jog for a minute without hitting the 170s and gasping for breath. This spring I have peaked at 170, and have been able to jog/run for over an hour with no problem.

[mobikwa]

What pulls your body forward when you run outside? Your muscles.
What pulls your body "forward" on the treadmill? The treadmill.

There is significantly more force and muscle needed to run outside.

[BombDonald]

Distance running is all about learning how to set and maintain pace. You can go the "Running for Dummies" route and simply start out super slow. Then slowly adjust up accordingly.

Or you can marker out some distances roughly and time yourself between your marks. A track is ideal for this.

Great runners are amazing at setting pace. Steve Prefontaine was famous for it. He knew down to the second how fast he wanted to complete each lap. And that is harder than you think, not all lap speeds are run at the same pace, and it's very easy when grouped up with other runners, to get thrown off pace.

When interval training to increase distance or speed, knowing your pace times is the key to making progress.

Slightly off topic, but I just watched the movie "Without Limits" again the other day after not watching it since high school. Awesome movie about Steve Prefontaine.


Pacing is HUGE with running with anything over 400m. You have to be able to feel how fast you are going and not let other runners dictate the pace.

The last competitive race I ever did was a half marathon where I let a bunch of guys that were running around a 1:10-1:12 pull me out in about a 5:30 mile. It completely destroyed me and caused me to run about 2:00 slower than what I was capable of for that distance. Had I just took my time for the first few miles while running my own race at my own speed I could have picked up at about the 5k mark and placed better with a better time. Pacing is what running is all about.

[TOS98SS]

OP when I could run for an hour on a treadmill , I couldn't run around the block . I really just think its cause the grounds not moving .

[PeterGibbons316]

Do you have a smartphone with GPS? There are a ton of running apps you can get that will track your time/distance/pace/etc. for you. If you have a good heart rate monitor that can help as well - try to keep the same heart rate on the road as you have on the treadmill. If you don't have those, you can try driving your course or mapping it out on google maps and taking note of 1,2,3, and 4 mile markers and checking your time as you pass those markers.

6 mph isn't all that fast - 10 min/mile. My experience is that guys who consider themselves to be in pretty good shape or are atheletic but don't run outside start out at what they think is a pretty slow pace, but is actually about 8 min/mile - 7.5 mph and are completely gassed within a mile.

[Tyciol]

OP just know that your outdoor speed will probably improve if you practice it, and if you're still including treadmill running, work on increasing the speed. Set the incline to whatever maximum is available for better intensity.

OP when I could run for an hour on a treadmill , I couldn't run around the block . I really just think its cause the grounds not moving .

No it's not, it's because the treadmill probably wasn't set to an intense enough level. It has to be either inclined or faster to simulate running at a given ground speed.

[Birddog6424]

Slightly off topic, but I just watched the movie "Without Limits" again the other day after not watching it since high school. Awesome movie about Steve Prefontaine.


Pacing is HUGE with running with anything over 400m. You have to be able to feel how fast you are going and not let other runners dictate the pace.

The last competitive race I ever did was a half marathon where I let a bunch of guys that were running around a 1:10-1:12 pull me out in about a 5:30 mile. It completely destroyed me and caused me to run about 2:00 slower than what I was capable of for that distance. Had I just took my time for the first few miles while running my own race at my own speed I could have picked up at about the 5k mark and placed better with a better time. Pacing is what running is all about.

That's a great show. I haven't seen it for years though. But do you remember right at the end when he is in his car? He was chanting to himself his lap times needed in order to beat the world record, and of course, each lap time was different. I guess he used to do that. It was cool that they put it in the show.

Pre would have won some gold medals had he lived.

Everyone has made the mistake of getting caught up in other people pace. I finished 13 marathons and countless halfs, 5k and 10k's, and you make plenty of mistakes learning the game. As I got more experienced, you realize there are tons of guys who pass you early on in a long race that you pass back later in the race because they are gassed from setting too fast of a pace for themselves.

[awod]

The whole "add 1-2% incline to equal outside" thing is false....kinda. At paces slower than about 5:30 mile pace, the effect of the lack of air resistance is not relevant. Considering most active people usually run 7:00-10:00 mile pace, most people do not need to add an incline to equal outside.

The only advantages of treadmills are lack of air, softer landing, and lack of turns. The "its doing some work for you" thing is quite a failure of understanding on physics. Try jumping onto a fast moving belt and you will appreciate the force you generate to stay in one place on the machine.

Treadmills can seem easier and harder to individuals. It could be hotter and stuffy inside compared to nice and cloudy outside, and then again, it could be nice and cool inside compared to sunny and windy day outside. Some people hate running on them out of boredom, but treadmill running goes fast to me because I enjoy watching tv and perving out on milfs at the gym.

[BombDonald]

That's a great show. I haven't seen it for years though. But do you remember right at the end when he is in his car? He was chanting to himself his lap times needed in order to beat the world record, and of course, each lap time was different. I guess he used to do that. It was cool that they put it in the show.

Pre would have won some gold medals had he lived.

Everyone has made the mistake of getting caught up in other people pace. I finished 13 marathons and countless halfs, 5k and 10k's, and you make plenty of mistakes learning the game. As I got more experienced, you realize there are tons of guys who pass you early on in a long race that you pass back later in the race because they are gassed from setting too fast of a pace for themselves.

Ha yeah I remember that part very well. Twelve 63 second quarters. Something like 1:03, boom, first quarter. 2:06, boom, second quarter. 3:19, boom, third quarter. Then the crash...

12:36 would have been an INCREDIBLE mark for that time period, and would still translate to around a 13:10 5k. Not world record breaking these days, but still world class. Twelve 63 second quarters is pacing at it's finest. Pre could have put up some blazing times at ANY distance if he would have tried. A marathon might have killed him with the effort he would have put forth lol.

Probably my favorite part of that movie is when he hurt his foot on the radiator and still won the race at nationals, and the guy that took second almost crapped himself after seeing Pre's foot.

[BombDonald]

Found that clip because I am bored.



That clip starts at about 8:40.

[TOS98SS]

maximum is available for better intensity.
No it's not, it's because the treadmill probably wasn't set to an intense enough level. It has to be either inclined or faster to simulate running at a given ground speed.

It was started in op post that he compensated that incline and still can't run far.

How can you not see that a belt with a motor is going to be easier to run on .

[Tyciol]

The whole "add 1-2% incline to equal outside" thing is false....kinda. At paces slower than about 5:30 mile pace, the effect of the lack of air resistance is not relevant. Considering most active people usually run 7:00-10:00 mile pace, most people do not need to add an incline to equal outside.

I just figure incline work is good regardless, much like running up hills and stuff. Better work for slower speeds and all that, more predominantly concentric to avoid eccentric dmg.

How can you not see that a belt with a motor is going to be easier to run on .

I don't think I said it wasn't easier. Just that the reason is more due to factors such as what awod has pointed out: softer landing, lack of turns, as well as stuff like smoother terrain, consistency.

Perhaps you could explain why you think it would be easier simply because it's a belt with a motor. That thing will throw you off if you're not running.

[TOS98SS]

I just figure incline work is good regardless, much like running up hills and stuff. Better work for slower speeds and all that, more predominantly concentric to avoid eccentric dmg.

I don't think I said it wasn't easier. Just that the reason is more due to factors such as what awod has pointed out: softer landing, lack of turns, as well as stuff like smoother terrain, consistency.

Perhaps you could explain why you think it would be easier simply because it's a belt with a motor. That thing will throw you off if you're not running.

Troll

[Tyciol]

Oh please, disagreeing with that silly "treadmilling is easy because the machine pulls your legs behind you!" type crowd isn't any indication of trolling.

People with a propensity to resort to such accusations might benefit from reading:
http://www.c2.com/cgi/wiki?Accusatio...nternalMotives
http://www.c2.com/cgi/wiki?FixContentNotMotivation

Fallacious ad hominem nonsense is wasteful to bicker about.

[awod]

I just figure incline work is good regardless, much like running up hills and stuff. Better work for slower speeds and all that, more predominantly concentric to avoid eccentric dmg.

I don't think I said it wasn't easier. Just that the reason is more due to factors such as what awod has pointed out: softer landing, lack of turns, as well as stuff like smoother terrain, consistency.

Perhaps you could explain why you think it would be easier simply because it's a belt with a motor. That thing will throw you off if you're not running.

It is givin that running on an inclined treadmill will result in more work than a flat surface. This is not always what the goal of the training run is. There are specific workouts for hill work. The incline could be detrimental to a interval, tempo, or distance run. Just depends what you are going for.

[Tyciol]

It is givin that running on an inclined treadmill will result in more work than a flat surface. This is not always what the goal of the training run is. There are specific workouts for hill work. The incline could be detrimental to a interval, tempo, or distance run. Just depends what you are going for.

Meh, most mills only go up to 15, is it even worth calling a hill? I could see how the incline could be of detriment to doing intervals since they're harder, though you can still use those methods. It just might be speed 3/5 using max incline instead of 5/7 on flat or whatever.