prework out foods

[h23delsol]

okay I work all day what are some good preworkout foods or supplments i can take prior to working out that wll give me a good boost... I read have a 20g protein shake and 40g of complex carbs like 45min before working out... Sorry if this question is dumb to some people I just know very little about the nutrition side


Also I was wondering out of the 400g of carbs I should eat a day how many of them should be simple and how many should be complex and what part of the day I should take each one in

[djansen]

i think 45min before you lift have whey and a piece of fruit like a banana or apple. maybe a little oats
almost all your carbs should be complex accept for post workout or maybe if you want right before lifting and a little at breakfast. i like fruit juice and whey 10 min before i lift but some people think thats a bad idea but i like it.

[AYung]

okay I work all day what are some good preworkout foods or supplments i can take prior to working out that wll give me a good boost... I read have a 20g protein shake and 40g of complex carbs like 45min before working out... Sorry if this question is dumb to some people I just know very little about the nutrition side


Also I was wondering out of the 400g of carbs I should eat a day how many of them should be simple and how many should be complex and what part of the day I should take each one in

Low GI sources combined with some High GI sources.
A good combo would be Oats and Honey.

Center your simple sugar intake around your workout. I would say limit your simple sugar intake to 25% of total carbs or less.

[sportyhp]

would something like a whole grain bagel and peanut butter and jelly be an okay preworkout food?

[djansen]

would something like a whole grain bagel and peanut butter and jelly be an okay preworkout food?

how soon pre workout? its not good to consume fat before a workout, so - the PB and it should be good.

[sportyhp]

ya it would havta be soon before the workout b/c i go right after school. thanks tho, jelly and bagel should b fine

[buffgrk]

mine

Carbs/Pro/Fat/Cals


Meal 6 ( Preworkout )

Rolled Oats ( 1/2 Cup Dry ) 35 | 8 | 5 | 230
Bannana 34 | 1.6 | 0 | 134
Water
On whey ( 1 scoop ) 3 | 24 | 1 | 120
Milk ( 150ml ) 7.7 | 4.8 | 1.7 | 66
-------------------------
79.7| 38.4| 7.7 | 550

[1quick1]

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=272067

[bOBeRt]

Timing is more crucial than anything. You really shouldn't be eating anything with 2 hours before your workout, ESPECIALLY simple carbs. Think about it... you eat 50g of carbs 40 min before you workout, you're blood glucose goes up, INSULIN goes up shoveling that glucose into your cells right when you need it the most. PLUS any muscle/liver glycogen that is be transported into the blood is being forced back into the cells by the insulin. The result... no energy for your CNS = tired, unmotivated and bloated.

2-2.5 hours before you workout eat something like JimJunkie posted for the best performance.

bOB

PS. Eating shouldn't be done to increase your energy levels at that moment, it should be planned hours or days ahead of time. That is unless you're doing a long term (60min+), high intensity (70%+ VO2 max) exercise that is depleting all your muscle and liver glycogen.

[livinonlava]

Timing is more crucial than anything. You really shouldn't be eating anything with 2 hours before your workout, ESPECIALLY simple carbs. Think about it... you eat 50g of carbs 40 min before you workout, you're blood glucose goes up, INSULIN goes up shoveling that glucose into your cells right when you need it the most. PLUS any muscle/liver glycogen that is be transported into the blood is being forced back into the cells by the insulin. The result... no energy for your CNS = tired, unmotivated and bloated.

2-2.5 hours before you workout eat something like JimJunkie posted for the best performance.

bOB

PS. Eating shouldn't be done to increase your energy levels at that moment, it should be planned hours or days ahead of time. That is unless you're doing a long term (60min+), high intensity (70%+ VO2 max) exercise that is depleting all your muscle and liver glycogen.

Though I agree about limiting the simple carbs pre-workout (sugar rush + crash), I disagree about pushing the meal 2 hours before your training. You aren't looking to eat to provide energy, but rather to make free amino acids available. Training releases cortisol and tells your body to begin breaking down its own protein. Ideally, you have provided your body a ready source of available amino acids (pre-workout meal) to minimize that catabolic response. This is also why folks stress the post-workout meal. These are both strategies for returning your body to an anabolic state -- not necessarily for providing energy.

[bOBeRt]

Training releases cortisol and tells your body to begin breaking down its own protein. Ideally, you have provided your body a ready source of available amino acids (pre-workout meal) to minimize that catabolic response. This is also why folks stress the post-workout meal. These are both strategies for returning your body to an anabolic state -- not necessarily for providing energy.

I have to disagree with you on the body's priorities. Less than 4% of your daily energy consumption is coming from proteins, proteins are VERY inefficient sources of energy.

I agree that the main purpose of pre-workout meal is to increase free floating amino acids, but to PROMOTE muscle growth, not to combat muscle breakdown (some cool new studies showing that protein before a workout may actually be more beneficial than after )

During a workout your body will be utilizing FIRST muscle glycogen... so if you've had a good breakfast AND gave your muscles enough simple sugars from your last post workout meal you will not be starving muscles for energy (assuming your keeping your workout to 45-60min max). SECONDLY the body will burn liver glycogen... and LASTILY you'll will feel very very tired (maybe even sick) and your body will start to use bodily proteins.

The main goal of your post-workout meal is to get those glycogen stores back up to 100%. They'll take in tonnes of simple sugars at this point, and we manipulate this period by also adding proteins, creatine, and other minerals to shove as much anabolic material into those cells while they're readily accepting it.

Hope that all makes sense,
bOB

[livinonlava]

I have to disagree with you on the body's priorities. Less than 4% of your daily energy consumption is coming from proteins, proteins are VERY inefficient sources of energy.

Not to belabor a point that I think we actually agree on, but I never stated protein or any other item from the meal is for energy purposes. And, unless my text books were lying, I'm afraid that intense training does in fact shift your body into protein-breakdown rather than synthesis. Again, this is why you want the free amino acids -- to minimize or halt this breakdown. You will not return to protein synthesis until you've left the gym, regardless of how much protein you've eaten. Again, none of this reflects on energy. Yes, your body is drawing on stored liver and muscle glycogen to power anaerobic exercise. The pre-workout meal is not intended to provide the "energy" for your workout, but rather to combat the catabolic effects of intense training. As I said, I think we are saying the same thing in the end, I just wanted to clarify my thoughts.

[bOBeRt]

I guess my discretion is stemming from using catabolic and anabolic. During high intensity short term exercise a person with a proper diet and fueled muscles should not be going into a catabolic state. The reason muscles go into a catabolic (atrophy) state is because there is a continued demand for energy and there's no where else to obtain it from (or the muscle isn't being used, N/A). The only other explanation for an increase in blood protein is from the actual tearing of sarcomeres, which is our goal during working out to promote hypertrophy (but this takes days to recover even to 80-85%).

We're at the same point of actual practice... just differing on the actual physiology.

bOB

PS. The blurb about pre-workout protein being more beneficial is part of a study I've been involved with UWO physiology department. Not conclusive as of yet, and not sure why, but groups that have been supplementing with protein 3-4 hours prior to workouts are showing quicker and more muscle hypertrophy than non supplementing groups. It's pretty exciting stuff.

[rugby06]

My pre work out meal is my breakfast which consists of:

1/2 cup of oatmeal
1/2 cup of natty apple sauce
3 eggs

This is usually an hour before i hit the weights....whether or not this is the best, i leave up to the experts to decide. But it does fit into my macros...so, yeah.

[livinonlava]

I'm always learning, so I take your considerations to heart, bOB. Hope the OP benefits from the discussion as I did.

[bOBeRt]

My pre work out meal is my breakfast which consists of:

1/2 cup of oatmeal
1/2 cup of natty apple sauce
3 eggs

This is usually an hour before i hit the weights....whether or not this is the best, i leave up to the experts to decide. But it does fit into my macros...so, yeah.

IMO, and to follow my own advice in this thread... haha... I'd bump your Oatmeal up because you're body is starving for energy earily in the morning, and not providing enough energy before your workout will have catabolic consequences (as well as a tired CNS).

[rugby06]

IMO, and to follow my own advice in this thread... haha... I'd bump your Oatmeal up because you're body is starving for energy earily in the morning, and not providing enough energy before your workout will have catabolic consequences (as well as a tired CNS).

Really? The oatmeal and apple sauce combined has 40g of carbs and when i break down my macros, i need 106g a day. should i add more pre workout and lose it somewhere else during the day. B/C right now, im pretty much done with carbs after lunch...except for some from veggies @ dinner.

[bOBeRt]

Whoa whoa whoa... 106g a day? Doing the low carb dealio? I'm not a believer in low carb, and if you're not either, you should be getting closer to 300-400g/day of carbos. How many calories total in your day and what's your C/P/F breakdown?

bOB

[rugby06]

Whoa whoa whoa... 106g a day? Doing the low carb dealio? I'm not a believer in low carb, and if you're not either, you should be getting closer to 300-400g/day of carbos. How many calories total in your day and what's your C/P/F breakdown?

bOB

I cant remember where i figured this out, but:

106g/300g/60g -c/p/f
2200 cals (low end of range...could be as high as 2400ish)

[bOBeRt]

I cant remember where i figured this out, but:

106g/300g/60g -c/p/f
2200 cals (low end of range...could be as high as 2400ish)

OK, if you're seeing good results with what you're doing, just continue. But if you need a change I follow a 55-30-15 breakdown, because I'm a big believer in carbohydrates are the **** (that's a good thing).

So, how much do you weigh 2200 cal seems kinda low?

If you're eating 2200 cal:
300g carbohydrates
165g protein
35g fat

So, post workout should be:
50g Simple Carbs
45g Protein
(Other than fish oil in the morning I treat fat as something i keep as low as possible, but it is necessary in some foods)

Breakfast/Pre-workout should be:
60g Complex Carbs + apple sauce
30g Protein

The remaining macro's should be split into 4 meals spaced throughout the day that are approx:

45g Complex Carbs
25g Protein

That's what I would do/recommend for someone eating 2200cal/day... I'll though I'm suspecting you should be raising that a smidge...

Good Luck,
bOB

[livinonlava]

I cant remember where i figured this out, but:

106g/300g/60g -c/p/f
2200 cals (low end of range...could be as high as 2400ish)

My opinion: too much protein, not enough carbs, especially if this is a bulking effort. 1-1.5gm per lb of bodyweight is adequate. The rest should be made up of healthy carbs. Are you getting all that protein from whole foods?

[livinonlava]

OK, if you're seeing good results with what you're doing, just continue.

...

I'm suspecting you should be raising that a smidge...

Good Luck,
bOB

x 2

[rugby06]

OK, if you're seeing good results with what you're doing, just continue. But if you need a change I follow a 55-30-15 breakdown, because I'm a big believer in carbohydrates are the **** (that's a good thing).

So, how much do you weigh 2200 cal seems kinda low?

If you're eating 2200 cal:
300g carbohydrates
165g protein
35g fat

So, post workout should be:
50g Simple Carbs
45g Protein
(Other than fish oil in the morning I treat fat as something i keep as low as possible, but it is necessary in some foods)

Breakfast/Pre-workout should be:
60g Complex Carbs + apple sauce
30g Protein

The remaining macro's should be split into 4 meals spaced throughout the day that are approx:

45g Complex Carbs
25g Protein

That's what I would do/recommend for someone eating 2200cal/day... I'll though I'm suspecting you should be raising that a smidge...

Good Luck,
bOB

I weigh 207lbs, and i've only been losing about 1-2 a week for the last few months(down from 248). Let me finish my pre bed meal, then i'll write down a usual day's menu.

[bOBeRt]

I weigh 207lbs, and i've only been losing about 1-2 a week for the last few months(down from 248). Let me finish my pre bed meal, then i'll write down a usual day's menu.

OK, that's a little more understandable if you dropping. What BF% are you at right now? (approx) I'll let you finish eating though of course, haha

bOB

[rugby06]

OK, that's a little more understandable if you dropping. What BF% are you at right now? (approx) I'll let you finish eating though of course, haha

bOB

No clue what my bf% is...so here's a picture. Left=Summer Right=Now
http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l2...summer_now.jpg

and a normal day's meals:

1/2 cup oatmeal
1/2 cup apple sauce(natty)
3 eggs

**workout**

2 scoops whey
1/2 cup oatmeal

1 chicken breast
Veggies or salad

Protein shake (at work, need something quick and easy)

tuna/chicken/or lean beef
Veggies (broccoli/cauliflower/or spinach usually)

Prebed meal
1 cup of F.F. Cottage Cheese
2 tablespoons of Natty peanut butter

[bOBeRt]

Well it looks like you're doing an awesome job eating clean, and some great progress in those pics, nice job!

Like I said, a lot people really advocate low carb diets for fat loss and it's obviously doing great for you. But if you need a change or you're seeing a plateau, change your meals around to what I suggested above (300g carb, 165g Pro, and 35g fat). If you continue to eat clean foods and complex carbos (except simple carbs for post workout to re-fuel muscle glycogen stores) then you'll continue to see fat loss and muscle gain.

Here's an excellent site for figuring out the macromolecules in foods (if you don't have a source already). http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/foodcomp/search/

Good luck, and keep the pics updated with you're progress!
bOB

[rugby06]

Well it looks like you're doing an awesome job eating clean, and some great progress in those pics, nice job!

Like I said, a lot people really advocate low carb diets for fat loss and it's obviously doing great for you. But if you need a change or you're seeing a plateau, change your meals around to what I suggested above (300g carb, 165g Pro, and 35g fat). If you continue to eat clean foods and complex carbos (except simple carbs for post workout to re-fuel muscle glycogen stores) then you'll continue to see fat loss and muscle gain.

Here's an excellent site for figuring out the macromolecules in foods (if you don't have a source already). http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/foodcomp/search/

Good luck, and keep the pics updated with you're progress!
bOB

Somedays i get more carbs then other...lunch might be turkey on wheat instead of chicken breast...but i make sure i have enough energy for workout and that i get carbs post. Diet is still being tweaked, im seeing what works best for me. I figure i should be in pretty good shape once i get down to around 180...but again, that all depends on BF%. Man, i can even begin to imagine myself 30lbs lighter....but come April i guarantee i will be there.

Thanks for the help

[djansen]

You aren't looking to eat to provide energy, These are both strategies for returning your body to an anabolic state -- not necessarily for providing energy.

do I have a solid meal of animal protein and copmplex carbs two hours before i train then right before i train i have some whey in 100% pure cherry juice or maybe pomagrannite juice and then right after i train i have a 50/50 mix of dextrose and maltodextrine and whey. should i drop the whey and fruit juice right before? i think it gives me energy though.

[bOBeRt]

Most people think it does too... a guy a played hockey with religiously had a snickers bar 15min before the game would begin... said it worked for him. But the physiology has proven time and time again that increasing sugars quickly will increase insulin and take all that glucose out of circulation (can't be used then).

So you might get a bit of a sugar rush, but within minutes, it will be hindering the rest of your workout. (drop the juice)

Good luck!
bOB

[djansen]

Most people think it does too... a guy a played hockey with religiously had a snickers bar 15min before the game would begin... said it worked for him. But the physiology has proven time and time again that increasing sugars quickly will increase insulin and take all that glucose out of circulation (can't be used then).

So you might get a bit of a sugar rush, but within minutes, it will be hindering the rest of your workout. (drop the juice)

Good luck!
bOB

so just have the whey? or what about the carbs from maltodextrin?