Newb in need of some nutrition guidance (have read the stickies)

[Dkr626]

I'm 5'10 and 17 years old and I have been on Rippetoe's Starting Strength program for a good 6 weeks. Prior to the program, I ran cross country and weighed in the 167-173 range. Immediately after the season, I began the program, and 6 weeks later, I weigh approximately 188 pounds. Although I have made fairly decent gains on my lifts, I feel like a significant portion of that weight gain is fat. When I ran XC, I would monitor what I ate to a degreee, but when I began lifting, I began eating a lot more. I made an effort to consume more protein, but I also found myself carelessly eating more food with very little nutritional value.

I've learned a lot by reading the forums, such as some good foods to eat, what does/doesn't matter in your diet, etc., but I still don't have a solid idea of what to do as far as my diet goes. I would really like to add some structure. At the moment, I want to focus on adding muscle to my frame and avoid adding fat (really I would like to lose some fat, but I know it probably isn't realistic to work towards both of these goals at once). How can I figure out how I should generally eat and what my macro goals should be?

[wnaskor]

I'm 5'10 and 17 years old and I have been on Rippetoe's Starting Strength program for a good 6 weeks. Prior to the program, I ran cross country and weighed in the 167-173 range. Immediately after the season, I began the program, and 6 weeks later, I weigh approximately 188 pounds. Although I have made fairly decent gains on my lifts, I feel like a significant portion of that weight gain is fat. When I ran XC, I would monitor what I ate to a degreee, but when I began lifting, I began eating a lot more. I made an effort to consume more protein, but I also found myself carelessly eating more food with very little nutritional value.

I've learned a lot by reading the forums, such as some good foods to eat, what does/doesn't matter in your diet, etc., but I still don't have a solid idea of what to do as far as my diet goes. I would really like to add some structure. At the moment, I want to focus on adding muscle to my frame and avoid adding fat (really I would like to lose some fat, but I know it probably isn't realistic to work towards both of these goals at once). How can I figure out how I should generally eat and what my macro goals should be?

tell ya what...ill make this easy for you- pm me what you eat, supps you take, and your current workout routine- and ill put something together for you.

[dukend]

tell ya what...ill make this easy for you- pm me what you eat, supps you take, and your current workout routine- and ill put something together for you.

No I want to see your reponse here.

[vitornoob]

OP, if you read the stickies, you should know that you can eat anything as long fit your macros and micronutrient goals, choosing micronutrient dense foods and you should probably know your macros and calories frm here: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hp?t=121703981

tell ya what...ill make this easy for you- pm me what you eat, supps you take, and your current workout routine- and ill put something together for you.

Please respond

[WonderPug]

tell ya what...ill make this easy for you- pm me what you eat, supps you take, and your current workout routine- and ill put something together for you.

Something isn't kosher about this post.

If the intent was to help the OP, that help would have been offered and provided in this thread.

[dukend]

Something isn't kosher about this post.

If the intent was to help the OP, that help would have been offered and provided in this thread.

Because of the creepy smile or the cheerful "tell ya what...?"

[WonderPug]

Because of the creepy smile or the cheerful "tell ya what...?"

It's the latter.

[Dkr626]

I'll post it here by request :P

Supplements:
Orange Triad Multivitamins (3 in morning, 3 at night as recommended)
OxiMega Fish Oil (2 in morning as recommended, recently starting taking 2 at night as well)
Currently White Flood PWO (2 scoops preworkout)
Optimum Nutrition Whey protein w/ 8oz of 1% milk per scoop (2 scoops post workout. starting about a week ago, I starting taking 1 scoop in the mornings and 1 in the evenings daily.)

Routine: As described in "Guide to Novice Barbell Training, aka the Official RIPPETOE-STARTING STRENGTH FAQ" along w/ recommended programming, I workout 3x a week


Workout A -
squats - 3x5
benches - 3x5
deadlifts - 1x5
dips - 3x12
weighted back extensions - 3x12
weighted incline situps - 3x10
weighted knee raises - 3x15

Workout B
squats - 3x5
standing press - 3x5
rows 3x5
pullups - 3x8
weighted incline situps - 3x10
weighted knee raises - 3x15

On my workout before the two day rest, I take out the ab work and add bicep curls and tricep extensions.

Diet: It is extremely irregular (particularly through on the weekends) and lacks structure . But I'll try to throw something together...

Breakfast:
1 Serving of oatmeal

Throughout school day:
1 PB&J with natural peanut butter, wheat bread, homemade jelly
Medium sized portion (vague,I know) of some type of protein rich food (usually left over from dinner the previous night - red beans & rice, chicken pot pie, etc.)
Apple
V8 vegetable juice
1-2 granola bars

When I get home:
1-2 granola bars (snack)
A large amount (again, vague, I know) of whatever my mom made for dinner (we eat healthy foods that almost always have good protein but the meals vary - salmon/tuna, chili, chicken pot pie, etc.)
Some type of snack before bed to go along with my protein shake (typically something not very healthy, like 1 or 2 poptarts or something)

By the way, almost all I drink is water and I drink at least 70oz on weekdays

^that is something like my diet through the week. My weekends are random. More often than not, I will eat more than I do during the week and a lot of the food I eat will just be carbohydrates with little nutritional value. Sometimes I will eat less than I do during the week. My problem is I really don't have any structure or dietary goals to shoot for and I'm just now taking the initiative to acquire them.




And vitornoob thanks for that link!!

[wnaskor]

TRUST ME WHEN I SAY...THERES IS NOTHING CREEPY ABOUT ME, OR ME OFFERING TO HELP ANYONE ON THIS SITE. I havent been on these threads nor offered up alot of advice, so I treated it just like I would if I was talking to someone in person. I have them email their stats, then I put together a program for them and send it back. I CAN see how that looks, so my appologies, only trying to help. I just made it to the top 20 in the BB.com spokesmodel contest, and have taken their advice and stepped up everything I do on this site. Again, my appologies-thought I was being nice without knowing proper ediquite.



This gives me something to work with. So you will continue to do 3 days a week in the gym? OR will you want something writen up for more ? Do you have a budget regarding supplementation? Can you take and consume whatever you want in class? Now most importantly, what are your goals? I know you said add muscle with little fat. I recomend you come up with 5 to 10 solid goals, and write them down. When I do a show, having that date for my long term goal DEF. helps me alot. I then set now goals, and mid term goals to go after- it makes that long term goal more attainable. In your case you may want to start to journalize your food consumption, that way if somethings not going the way you want it to you can always fall back on that.

[tominho7]

TRUST ME WHEN I SAY...THERES IS NOTHING CREEPY ABOUT ME, OR ME OFFERING TO HELP ANYONE ON THIS SITE. I havent been on these threads nor offered up alot of advice, so I treated it just like I would if I was talking to someone in person. I have them email their stats, then I put together a program for them and send it back. I CAN see how that looks, so my appologies, only trying to help. I just made it to the top 20 in the BB.com spokesmodel contest, and have taken their advice and stepped up everything I do on this site. Again, my appologies-thought I was being nice without knowing proper ediquite.

Then just answer his question in the thread. No need for PMs

This gives me something to work with. So you will continue to do 3 days a week in the gym? OR will you want something writen up for more ?

OP was asking about nutrition not workout advice

Do you have a budget regarding supplementation? Can you take and consume whatever you want in class?

There is no need for him to even consider adding anymore supplements

Now most importantly, what are your goals? I know you said add muscle with little fat. I recomend you come up with 5 to 10 solid goals, and write them down.

Good idea. But IMO 5-10 goals is just too much. Focusing on multiple goals at once can be very counterproductive

In your case you may want to start to journalize your food consumption, that way if somethings not going the way you want it to you can always fall back on that.

I agree with this. OP if you want more structure in your diet then you have to set it yourself. It just sounds like you want someone here to cook you up a meal plan. The stickies have more than enough information for you to create your own diet plan. Be self reliant

[wnaskor]

When someone wants to hit a goal etc. their workout, cardio, diet and supplementation comes into play together. You want to have everything working together, and not be counter productive. So as a trainer I ask about everything that could be hindering progress. I also recomend other supplements pertaining to his goal, so therefor I asked if there is a budget. But by no means does he have to take my recomendations. Regarding goals, when I say 5-10 thats vague, but if he sets short, midterm and longterm goals that can easily add up. I say to set these goals so he isnt overwhelmed by one specific goal or end goal. I know what works for me, and what works for my clients, and the advice I offer is just that, my opinion and my advice- what he or anyone else does with it is up to them. Just trying to help. What I have below is what I would recomend for what you said you currently are trying to achieve. You can change the weight range and rep range in the lifts to better suit you. If you want to do straight sets of heavy weight and lower reps, or do a pyramid, etc. The diet is also my recomendation and a format to follow, you can tweak it to better fit your lifestyle, budget etc. I also recomend doing cardio at the end of your workout. you can do HIT training if you want or can do longer durantion cardio at a slower pace. Ive also included "HIT" cardio example. If you need more assitance let me know.


WARMUP 3-5 minutes
LIFT
CARDIO -25-40 minutes
STRETCH

Workout 1

Dumbbell Squat
3 12
Bench Press
3 12
Lunges
3 20
Dumbbell Lateral Raise
3 12
Dumbbell Hammer Curl
3 12
Rope Tricep Extension
3 12
Machine crunch
2 30
Reverse Hyperextension
3 20
Ball crunch
2 50

Workout 2
One Arm Dumbbell Row
3 12
Flat Bench Dumbbell Flye
3 12
Dumbbell Shoulder Press
3 12
Dumbbell Bicep Curl
3 12
Tricep pushdown on machine
3 12
Adduction
3 20
Abduction
3 20
Seated Calf Raise
2 30
Abs Crunch on a mat
3 40

Workout 3

Squat with barbell
3 15
Seated Leg Curl
2 12
Standing Calf Raise
2 30
Push Ups
3 20
Dumbbell Reverse Flye
3 12
Bicep machine Curl
3 12
Lying Two Arm Dumbbell Tricep Extension
3 12
Abs- hanging leg lifts
4 15-20

*Times are subject to change- eat every 3 hours*
Meal 1: 7am
Protein: 4 egg whites (with 1 yolk) or 1 scoop of whey protein
Complex carb: ½ cup of oatmeal (you can use cinnamon/splenda) or two pieces of Ezekiel bread/ small bowl of cheerios or Kashi with skim milk

Meal 2: 9:30-10am *snack*
Protein: 1 scoop whey protein or 14 almonds or half cup of fat free cottage cheese or a cheese stick
Simple Carbs: Piece of fruit- banana, medium sized apple, etc. *may also add blueberries to oatmeal as fruit choice in meal one*


Meal 3: 12-12:30pm
Protein: 3-4 oz. chicken- white fish-ground turkey-lean steak- salmon etc.
Fibrous Carb: 1/2 cup any veggie “preferably green”: Broccoli, asparagus, green peppers, and zucchini “I try and keep them green” “Frozen better than canned”

Meal 4: 3-3:30pm *snack*
Protein: 1 scoop whey protein

Meal 5: 6- 6:30pm
Protein: 4 oz. chicken- white fish-ground turkey-lean steak -salmon etc.
Fibrous Carb: 1/2 cup Any veggie “preferably green”: Broccoli, asparagus, peppers, spinach, green salad
Complex Carbs: 3 oz. sweet potato or half cup of brown rice

Meal 6: 9-9:30pm *snack*
Protein: 1 scoop protein “preferably Casein”
Fats: 1 tablespoon of natural pb


Supplements- Multi vitamin, CLA, L-Carnitine, Protein powder/whey and casein, Fish oil, Glutamine, vit. C,

ACCEPTABLE SOURCES OF PROTEIN
chicken breast, turkey breast, 99% lean ground turkey, flank steak, sirloin, tilapia, cod, flounder, tuna, orange roughy, egg whites (1 yolk to every 6 whites, only use yolks with meals that have fat and count that towards your fat intake), whey protein ,salmon


ACCEPTABLE SOURCES OF CARBS
Oats, yams or sweet potatoes, cream of wheat, plain ezekiel bread or wraps, red potatoes, brown rice

ACCEPTABLE SOURCES OF FATS
all natural peanut butter, fish oil, mac nut oil, egg yolk if eating eggs, almonds, cashews

ACCEPTABLE SOURCES OF GREEN VEGGIES
green lettuce, broccoli, asparagus, spinach, green beans, really ANY veggies will do- try and stay green.




8-Week HIIT Program
You can do these workouts using tools, such as a jump rope, or simply doing jumping jacks, or sprinting, or working on a stationary cycle. Use your imagination. Just follow the work-to-rest intervals as indicated.
Phase 1 (1:4): Weeks 1-2

Time Activity
15 seconds High-Intensity Exercise
60 seconds Rest or Low-Intensity Exercise
Repeat another 10 times, followed by a final 15-second high-intensity blast.
Total time: 14 minutes

Phase 2 (1:2): Weeks 3-4

Time Activity
30 seconds High-Intensity Exercise
60 seconds Rest or Low-Intensity Exercise
Repeat another 10 times, followed by a final 30-second high-intensity blast.
Total time: 17 minutes






Phase 3 (1:1): Weeks 5-6

Time Activity
30 seconds High-Intensity Exercise
30 seconds Rest or Low-Intensity Exercise
Repeat another 11 times, followed by a final 30-second high-intensity blast.
Total time: 18.5 minutes

Phase 4 (2:1): Week 7-8

Time Activity
30 seconds High-Intensity Exercise
15 seconds Rest or Low-Intensity Exercise
Repeat another 25 times, followed by a final 30-second high-intensity blast.
Total time: 20 minutes

[AlwaysTryin]

Supplements- Multi vitamin, CLA, L-Carnitine, Protein powder/whey and casein, Fish oil, Glutamine, vit. C,

He doesn't need those, they are pointless

[ArchangelEST]

He doesn't need those, they are pointless

Technically "NONE" of the above supplements are needed. Though for comfort, some can be useful in constructing a more suitable diet.

[AlwaysTryin]

Technically "NONE" of the above supplements are needed. Though for comfort, some can be useful in constructing a more suitable diet.

I was giving credit to ones which actually work lol

[psychodiver9]

Nor is it necessary to eat every 3 hours. Now I see why he wanted to send this by pm

[ArchangelEST]

I was giving credit to ones which actually work lol

Yeah, I got your point. - Though things that "actually" work is a bit deceptive. As you know extra protein doesn't really do much for you if you are already eating tons of meat a day for example. Most supplements work under specific conditions and provide negligible benefits under others.

But fuk, that's just semantics. Your point is still valid in pointing out the uselessness of those specific sups in nearly all imaginable conditions.

[AlwaysTryin]

When someone wants to hit a goal etc. their workout, cardio, diet and supplementation comes into play together. You want to have everything working together, and not be counter productive. So as a trainer I ask about everything that could be hindering progress. I also recomend other supplements pertaining to his goal, so therefor I asked if there is a budget. But by no means does he have to take my recomendations. Regarding goals, when I say 5-10 thats vague, but if he sets short, midterm and longterm goals that can easily add up. I say to set these goals so he isnt overwhelmed by one specific goal or end goal. I know what works for me, and what works for my clients, and the advice I offer is just that, my opinion and my advice- what he or anyone else does with it is up to them. Just trying to help. What I have below is what I would recomend for what you said you currently are trying to achieve. You can change the weight range and rep range in the lifts to better suit you. If you want to do straight sets of heavy weight and lower reps, or do a pyramid, etc. The diet is also my recomendation and a format to follow, you can tweak it to better fit your lifestyle, budget etc. I also recomend doing cardio at the end of your workout. you can do HIT training if you want or can do longer durantion cardio at a slower pace. Ive also included "HIT" cardio example. If you need more assitance let me know.


WARMUP 3-5 minutes
LIFT
CARDIO -25-40 minutes
STRETCH

Workout 1

Dumbbell Squat
3 12
Bench Press
3 12
Lunges
3 20
Dumbbell Lateral Raise
3 12
Dumbbell Hammer Curl
3 12
Rope Tricep Extension
3 12
Machine crunch
2 30
Reverse Hyperextension
3 20
Ball crunch
2 50

Workout 2
One Arm Dumbbell Row
3 12
Flat Bench Dumbbell Flye
3 12
Dumbbell Shoulder Press
3 12
Dumbbell Bicep Curl
3 12
Tricep pushdown on machine
3 12
Adduction
3 20
Abduction
3 20
Seated Calf Raise
2 30
Abs Crunch on a mat
3 40

Workout 3

Squat with barbell
3 15
Seated Leg Curl
2 12
Standing Calf Raise
2 30
Push Ups
3 20
Dumbbell Reverse Flye
3 12
Bicep machine Curl
3 12
Lying Two Arm Dumbbell Tricep Extension
3 12
Abs- hanging leg lifts
4 15-20

*Times are subject to change- eat every 3 hours*
Meal 1: 7am
Protein: 4 egg whites (with 1 yolk) or 1 scoop of whey protein
Complex carb: ½ cup of oatmeal (you can use cinnamon/splenda) or two pieces of Ezekiel bread/ small bowl of cheerios or Kashi with skim milk

Meal 2: 9:30-10am *snack*
Protein: 1 scoop whey protein or 14 almonds or half cup of fat free cottage cheese or a cheese stick
Simple Carbs: Piece of fruit- banana, medium sized apple, etc. *may also add blueberries to oatmeal as fruit choice in meal one*


Meal 3: 12-12:30pm
Protein: 3-4 oz. chicken- white fish-ground turkey-lean steak- salmon etc.
Fibrous Carb: 1/2 cup any veggie “preferably green”: Broccoli, asparagus, green peppers, and zucchini “I try and keep them green” “Frozen better than canned”

Meal 4: 3-3:30pm *snack*
Protein: 1 scoop whey protein

Meal 5: 6- 6:30pm
Protein: 4 oz. chicken- white fish-ground turkey-lean steak -salmon etc.
Fibrous Carb: 1/2 cup Any veggie “preferably green”: Broccoli, asparagus, peppers, spinach, green salad
Complex Carbs: 3 oz. sweet potato or half cup of brown rice

Meal 6: 9-9:30pm *snack*
Protein: 1 scoop protein “preferably Casein”
Fats: 1 tablespoon of natural pb


Supplements- Multi vitamin, CLA, L-Carnitine, Protein powder/whey and casein, Fish oil, Glutamine, vit. C,

ACCEPTABLE SOURCES OF PROTEIN
chicken breast, turkey breast, 99% lean ground turkey, flank steak, sirloin, tilapia, cod, flounder, tuna, orange roughy, egg whites (1 yolk to every 6 whites, only use yolks with meals that have fat and count that towards your fat intake), whey protein ,salmon


ACCEPTABLE SOURCES OF CARBS
Oats, yams or sweet potatoes, cream of wheat, plain ezekiel bread or wraps, red potatoes, brown rice

ACCEPTABLE SOURCES OF FATS
all natural peanut butter, fish oil, mac nut oil, egg yolk if eating eggs, almonds, cashews

ACCEPTABLE SOURCES OF GREEN VEGGIES
green lettuce, broccoli, asparagus, spinach, green beans, really ANY veggies will do- try and stay green.




8-Week HIIT Program
You can do these workouts using tools, such as a jump rope, or simply doing jumping jacks, or sprinting, or working on a stationary cycle. Use your imagination. Just follow the work-to-rest intervals as indicated.
Phase 1 (1:4): Weeks 1-2

Time Activity
15 seconds High-Intensity Exercise
60 seconds Rest or Low-Intensity Exercise
Repeat another 10 times, followed by a final 15-second high-intensity blast.
Total time: 14 minutes

Phase 2 (1:2): Weeks 3-4

Time Activity
30 seconds High-Intensity Exercise
60 seconds Rest or Low-Intensity Exercise
Repeat another 10 times, followed by a final 30-second high-intensity blast.
Total time: 17 minutes






Phase 3 (1:1): Weeks 5-6

Time Activity
30 seconds High-Intensity Exercise
30 seconds Rest or Low-Intensity Exercise
Repeat another 11 times, followed by a final 30-second high-intensity blast.
Total time: 18.5 minutes

Phase 4 (2:1): Week 7-8

Time Activity
30 seconds High-Intensity Exercise
15 seconds Rest or Low-Intensity Exercise
Repeat another 25 times, followed by a final 30-second high-intensity blast.
Total time: 20 minutes

So what's the macro breakdown of your diet? Is it specific to his requirements?
Why 15 rep squats?
Why only brown rice and not white?

[harebearva]

*Times are subject to change- eat every 3 hours*
Meal 1: 7am
Protein: 4 egg whites (with 1 yolk) or 1 scoop of whey protein
Complex carb: ½ cup of oatmeal (you can use cinnamon/splenda) or two pieces of Ezekiel bread/ small bowl of cheerios or Kashi with skim milk

Meal 2: 9:30-10am *snack*
Protein: 1 scoop whey protein or 14 almonds or half cup of fat free cottage cheese or a cheese stick
Simple Carbs: Piece of fruit- banana, medium sized apple, etc. *may also add blueberries to oatmeal as fruit choice in meal one*


Meal 3: 12-12:30pm
Protein: 3-4 oz. chicken- white fish-ground turkey-lean steak- salmon etc.
Fibrous Carb: 1/2 cup any veggie “preferably green”: Broccoli, asparagus, green peppers, and zucchini “I try and keep them green” “Frozen better than canned”

Meal 4: 3-3:30pm *snack*
Protein: 1 scoop whey protein

Meal 5: 6- 6:30pm
Protein: 4 oz. chicken- white fish-ground turkey-lean steak -salmon etc.
Fibrous Carb: 1/2 cup Any veggie “preferably green”: Broccoli, asparagus, peppers, spinach, green salad
Complex Carbs: 3 oz. sweet potato or half cup of brown rice

Meal 6: 9-9:30pm *snack*
Protein: 1 scoop protein “preferably Casein”
Fats: 1 tablespoon of natural pb

Seems like too many protein shakes IMO. Possibly around 1/2 protein for the day in powder form would be something like a 2 pound tub every week. I think whey is fine but I see it as convenience protein calories. Just my 2cents

[Vanduynomite]

Why the hell is everybody bashing WNASKOR when he's just trying to help...? seriously? Look at him, and then look at yourself. He's obviously doing something right. If OP doesnt want his advice, he'll tell him.

[Dkr626]

Hey guys I greatly appreciate all of your advice, especially from you wnaskor (+rep)! I have learned a lot from your info, and that link you provided me vitornoob really helped me out. Thanks!

[Vanduynomite]

Hey guys I greatly appreciate all of your advice, especially from you wnaskor (+rep)! I have learned a lot from your info, and that link you provided me vitornoob really helped me out. Thanks!

point proven

[AlwaysTryin]

Why the hell is everybody bashing WNASKOR when he's just trying to help...? seriously? Look at him, and then look at yourself. He's obviously doing something right. If OP doesnt want his advice, he'll tell him.

Because people were asking questions as to why he was advising people certain things

Also I looked at him, and at myself

[ThatWei]

Obviously if you lift weights for 10 years+ and get ripped, you don't have to justify anything to anyone.





(notsrs)

Edit. Strong math skills...

[AlwaysTryin]

Hey guys I greatly appreciate all of your advice, especially from you wnaskor (+rep)! I have learned a lot from your info, and that link you provided me vitornoob really helped me out. Thanks!

Sure the advice was fine in most parts but lots is unnecessary and a waste of $