The 2022 Barbell Enthusiasts Collaborative Training Log & Hall of Fame

[Filmbuff81]

Coach I don’t care for or need anyone to worship me.

How did I twist anything?

Your statements clearly make it seem like you think enhanced bodybuilders consuming 500g of protein is some sort of secret sauce for their success.

You’ve been debating this with more than just me.

I’m telling you’re wrong on that ONE thing. Their protein consumption could be the minimum intake and they’d still be giant mass monsters and elite Champions. Because the DRUGS will build muscle no matter what and their genetics are best of the best.

[Filmbuff81]

Floor Press: 145 pounds x 5/5/4 reps
Cable Row: 4 chain - 3 sets x 12 reps
Larsen Press: 130 pounds - 4 sets x 5 reps

Added 1 rep to Floor Press and 1 set to Larsen press compared to last week. Been changing up what attachments I'm using on the Cable Rows - used a rope this time around and it felt good. Solid session - feels like I'm making consistent progress right now.

You’ve been really going strong these days.

[Filmbuff81]

90s rest periods today.

Low Incline Dumbbell Press
Set 1: 50 lb × 10 [Warm-up]
Set 2: 70 lb × 6 [Warm-up]
Set 3: 100 lb × 6 @ 6
Set 4: 100 lb × 6 @ 6
Set 5: 100 lb × 6 @ 7
Set 6: 100 lb × 5 @ 7
Set 7: 100 lb × 4 @ 6.5

Might need to up reps since the Y doesn’t have heavier dumbbells or I’ll head to the other gym.

Paused Deadlift
Set 1: 135 lb × 3 [Warm-up]
Set 2: 225 lb × 3 [Warm-up]
Set 3: 315 lb × 3 @ 6
Set 4: 315 lb × 3 @ 6
Set 5: 315 lb × 3 @ 6
Set 6: 315 lb × 3 @ 6.5
Set 7: 315 lb × 3 @ 6.5
Set 8: 315 lb × 3 @ 7
Set 9: 315 lb × 3 @ 7

Seated Row (Cable)
Set 1: 70 lb × 8 [Warm-up]
Set 2: 100 lb × 5 [Warm-up]
Set 3: 140 lb × 3 [Warm-up]
Set 4: 180 lb × 14 @ 7.5
Set 5: 180 lb × 13 @ 8
Set 6: 160 lb × 12 @ 7.5
Set 7: 140 lb × 12 @ 7

Leg Extension (Machine)
Set 1: 70 lb × 10 [Warm-up]
Set 2: 115 lb × 15 @ 7
Set 3: 115 lb × 15 @ 7.5
Set 4: 115 lb × 14 @ 8
Set 5: 115 lb × 13 @ 8

Lateral Raise (Machine)
Set 1: 25 lb × 10 [Warm-up]
Set 2: 50 lb × 20 @ 7
Set 3: 50 lb × 17 @ 7.5
Set 4: 50 lb × 15 @ 8

Preacher Curl (Dumbbell)
Set 1: 20 lb × 20 @ 8
Set 2: 20 lb × 20 @ 9
Set 3: 20 lb × 17 @ 9.5

Standing Russian Twist
Set 1: 25 lb × 36 @ 7.5
Set 2: 25 lb × 30 @ 7.5

Dumbbell Farmers Carry
Set 1: 80 lb × 30
Set 2: 80 lb × 30
Set 3: 80 lb × 30
Set 4: 80 lb × 30
Set 5: 80 lb × 30
Set 6: 80 lb × 30

Notes:

Single arm - 30 yards EMOM

1 set = 30 yards for each arm

[coachcalande]

Coach I don’t care for or need anyone to worship me.

How did I twist anything?

Your statements clearly make it seem like you think enhanced bodybuilders consuming 500g of protein is some sort of secret sauce for their success.

You’ve been debating this with more than just me.

I’m telling you’re wrong on that ONE thing. Their protein consumption could be the minimum intake and they’d still be giant mass monsters and elite Champions. Because the DRUGS will build muscle no matter what and their genetics are best of the best.

You’ll have to show me where I said these things because Clearly you’re confused. In fact, my very last post had this comment “ Protein alone is not the reason someone is a champ. I’m not sure where you got that idea. The massive protein consumed however is the NORM among champions. It’s the norm among all massive bodybuilders. ”

As far as drug users…
I’m fully aware of the advantages they have. This thread , from my perspective, was never about drugs, it was about protein. What is funny is how you wanted to argue about protein intake but have now come full 180 to agree with me. Nobody is taking in .8 g per lb or lean lb and going anywhere in bodybuilding. They ALL consume massive amounts. If that statement right there sounds like “protein is some sort of secret sauce” instead of being an absolutely necessary staple for bodybuilding, so be it. Interpret it however you want. No serious bodybuilder is going to short change themselves of protein.

I’d bet every lifter on this thread would enjoy some of the best training and recovery of their lives by taking protein up another 100 grams a day. It’s worth the bet.

[coachcalande]

6 sets bench/pulldowns supersetted
5 sets incline/narrow pulldowns supersetted
5/sets of these NASTY fly presses supersetted with rows

https://youtu.be/uJb_uPz7Rh4

The Arnold presses for 3 sets, managed the 30s today.


This is how I ended todays chest, back, shoulders workout.
Shoulder complex https://youtu.be/rEjgZfyM4ZI
Four giant sets like that.

[Filmbuff81]

As far as steroids go, many are on steroids and will never eat enough or work hard enough to accomplish what many of the biggest and best have done. On an even playing field, something pushed those guys ahead of the others. It’s more than just drugs, there’s MASSIVE protein consumed.

This is just one of the spots where you make it very obvious you’re saying ultra high protein is clearly the advantage they had over others.

I haven’t done a 180. I’ve told you the highest ANYONE suggested is maybe 1.3G/lb and that’s in a very unique situation and only if it doesn’t displace fats and carbs a ton.

Renaissance periodization says .7-1 is sufficient.

They coach numerous bodybuilders and athletes.

I said I eat moderate protein. Which puts me around .87-.9 right now.

You now just claimed that if everyone upped their protein 100 grams they’d enjoy the best training of their careers.

How are you not seeing that you’re making hyperbolic claims?

You brought up Ronnie, Jay, and Dorian as examples of how much protein people should be eating.

I’m saying that calling them the norm is absurd.

Because you won’t acknowledge that they have to eat 3-5x more calories than the average person just to maintain weight.

The moment you involved the “mass monsters” drugs became inseparable from the conversation, because that changes the entire context.

So you might as well tell everyone they should up their carb intake to 600+ as well.

So if I did your method of eating 300-400g of protein while trying to drop weight from 220 right now and I’m trying to lose .5ish% a week.

That’s around 2400 calories.

400 protein - 1600 calories
Min fat 66grams -594 calories

Calories left for carbs 200 = 50 grams of carbs.

Explain to me how that’s beneficial for me performance and physique goals?

Let’s say even just 300g protein. Upping my total 100 grams as you just suggested.

That now gives me 150 grams of carbs.

That’s pretty low for someone who trains as much as I do.

I’d have to start taking from fats to up carbs a bit to survive my training.

If I scaled this down for someone who is 180lbs or smaller it gets even trickier.

[coachcalande]

This is just one of the spots where you make it very obvious you’re saying ultra high protein is clearly the advantage they had over others.

I haven’t done a 180. I’ve told you the highest ANYONE suggested is maybe 1.3G/lb and that’s in a very unique situation and only if it doesn’t displace fats and carbs a ton.

Renaissance periodization says .7-1 is sufficient.

They coach numerous bodybuilders and athletes.

I said I eat moderate protein. Which puts me around .87-.9 right now.

You now just claimed that if everyone upped their protein 100 grams they’d enjoy the best training of their careers.

How are you not seeing that you’re making hyperbolic claims?

You brought up Ronnie, Jay, and Dorian as examples of how much protein people would be eating.

I’m saying that calling them the norm is absurd.

Because you won’t acknowledge that they have to eat 3-5x more calories than the average person just to maintain weight.

The moment you involved the “mass monsters” drugs became inseparable from the conversation, because that changes the entire context.

So you might as well tell everyone they should up their carb intake to 600+ as well.

Read that quote slowly so you understand this part “on an even playing field”….that is, all the dudes on the same drugs. Now from there, what do you think might separate them? Luck?

[Filmbuff81]

Read that quote slowly so you understand this part “on an even playing field”….that is, all the dudes on the same drugs. Now from there, what do you think might separate them? Luck?

Lol you say I’m condescending and you tell me to “read that slowly”?

Better genetics, Better drug protocol, better peaking strategies is why they won.

We’ve already established all bodybuilders eat insane amounts of food.

The food isn’t the difference.

[coachcalande]

Lol you say I’m condescending and you tell me to “read that slowly”?

Better genetics, Better drug protocol, better peaking strategies is why they won.

We’ve already established all bodybuilders eat insane amounts of food.

The food isn’t the difference.

So you don’t believe in better nutrition? Just better drug protocol? Put them on the same training, same RPE, same drug protocols…put them on (as I have said now THREE times) “on an even playing field…feed your guy .08 g/ protein per lb, my guy gets 1.5-2 g per lb.

Now what’s the difference? Don’t say “calories”. You can add carbs, fats, don’t care….WHY ARE THEY EATING ALL THAT PROTEIN WHEN YOU SAY REPEATEDLY NOW THAT ITs NOT A DIFFERENCE MAKER?

You are being ridiculous for the sake of an argument. You cannot win.

[coachcalande]

This is your ridiculous debate technique in a nutshell.



“ You now just claimed that if everyone upped their protein 100 grams they’d enjoy the best training of their careers.

How are you not seeing that you’re making hyperbolic claims?”

And here’s what I actually said. …

“ I’d bet every lifter on this thread would enjoy some of the best training and recovery of their lives by taking protein up another 100 grams a day. It’s worth the bet.”

Now tell me again that you aren’t making stuff up.

[Filmbuff81]

This is your ridiculous debate technique in a nutshell.



“ You now just claimed that if everyone upped their protein 100 grams they’d enjoy the best training of their careers.

How are you not seeing that you’re making hyperbolic claims?”

And here’s what I actually said. …

“ I’d bet every lifter on this thread would enjoy some of the best training and recovery of their lives by taking protein up another 100 grams a day. It’s worth the bet.”

Now tell me again that you aren’t making stuff up.

How did I make anything up? You LITERALLY said “the best training” lives/careers is an interchangeable word.

The fact you claimed I lied about what you actually said, just shows you’re being intellectually dishonest.

Your claim is if we all upped our protein intake 100grams my training and recovery would improve and be “the best”.

That’s the definition of hyperbole.

I used your previous claims of protein and your current 100 gram claim to show you what increasing my protein intake would do to my macros.

Explain me to me how I made something up?

you can’t explain it, because I didn’t.


I gotta say this again.

All enhanced bodybuilders eat absurd amounts of food.

Any of the guys placing in the top callouts all eat the same stuff with variance in preference.

The top 5 all were able to diet harder than the rest and peaked their drugs, carbs, electrolytes, properly to achieve their looks.

These dudes are the top 5 because of genetics, drugs, work ethic.

The drugs they take literally build muscle, take fat off their bodies, and reduce hunger.

[coachcalande]

How did I make anything up? You LITERALLY said “the best training” lives/careers is an interchangeable word.

The fact you claimed I lied about what you actually said, just shows you’re being intellectually dishonest.

Your claim is if we all upped our protein intake 100grams my training and recovery would improve.

I used your previous claims of protein and your current 100 gram claim to show you what increasing my protein intake would do to my macros.

Explain me to me how I made something up?

you can’t explain it, because I didn’t.


I gotta say this again.

All enhanced bodybuilders eat absurd amounts of food.

Any of the guys placing in the top callouts all eat the same stuff with variance in preference.

The top 5 all were able to diet harder than the rest and peaked their drugs, carbs, electrolytes, properly to achieve their looks.

These dudes are the top 5 because of genetics, drugs, work ethic.

The drugs they take literally build muscle, take fat off their bodies, and reduce hunger.

Is there some part of the words “I’d bet…” that you don’t understand? That’s not a claim, it’s more like an assumption. It’s intellectually dishonest for you to state something that I never said. Now, assuming you understand what I’m actually typing now, had I said “withouT a doubt, I guarantee every single one of you…”

Drugs, work ethic, genetics but not diet? Lol.

[Filmbuff81]

Is there some part of the words “I’d bet…” that you don’t understand? That’s not a claim, it’s more like an assumption. It’s intellectually dishonest for you to state something that I never said. Now, assuming you understand what I’m actually typing now, had I said “withouT a doubt, I guarantee every single one of you…”

Drugs, work ethic, genetics but not diet? Lol.

I bet if you played the lottery every day in every country you’d be a millionaire in less than a year.

Does that not sound hyperbolic? Of course it does.

Same with your 100 gram protein statement to a bunch of guys already eating sufficient protein.

And I don’t know how many times I need repeat this.

Every top bodybuilder already eats pretty much the same as the other guy.

Peak weak drug protocols and carb/sodium manipulation is what makes or breaks things, provided they gave themselves enough time to diet down.

And because they are on so much gear, some guys will just up the fat burners if they really need to get rid of the last bit of fat to nail The look.

Nutrition matters to the extent of making sure you have the willpower to not binge and set yourself back a week or two.

You’re trying to say

Ronnie Coleman was Ronnie Coleman because he ate 500+ grams of protein.

The dude was Ronnie Coleman because he had insane genetics combined with insane work ethic combined with massive drugs.

bodybuilding is a genetics game.

If his insertions had sucked, or his torso to limb ratios were wonky, no amount of protein is fixing that and making him a champion.

Also Please explain how me upping my protein 100 grams would improve my training and recovery? Still waiting for that nugget.

[BeginnerGainz]

Came back to see if people are still yelling at walls.

Leaving satisfied yet very disappointed.

[coachcalande]

I bet if you played the lottery every day in every country you’d be a millionaire in less than a year.

Does that not sound hyperbolic? Of course it does.

Same with your 100 gram protein statement to a bunch of guys already eating sufficient protein.

And I don’t know how many times I need repeat this.

Every top bodybuilder already eats pretty much the same as the other guy.

Peak weak drug protocols and carb/sodium manipulation is what makes or breaks things, provided they gave themselves enough time to diet down.

And because they are on so much gear, some guys will just up the fat burners if they really need to get rid of the last bit of fat to nail The look.

Nutrition matters to the extent of making sure you have the willpower to not binge and set yourself back a week or two.

You’re trying to say

Ronnie Coleman was Ronnie Coleman because he ate 500+ grams of protein.

The dude was Ronnie Coleman because he had insane genetics combined with insane work ethic combined with massive drugs.

bodybuilding is a genetics game.

If his insertions had sucked, or his torso to limb ratios were wonky, no amount of protein is fixing that and making him a champion.

Also Please explain how me upping my protein 100 grams would improve my training and recovery? Still waiting for that nugget.

“ Every top bodybuilder already eats pretty much the same as the other guy.”

Yes MASSIVE amounts of protein. I rest my case.

[coachcalande]

Came back to see if people are still yelling at walls.

Leaving satisfied yet very disappointed.

You enjoyed every bit of it and couldn’t stay away. Admit it.

[EliKoehn]

Coach, could you please answer the question of how increasing protein significantly above the conventionally recommended levels will not either result in a caloric surplus and fat gain, or compromised training from having to reduce carbs and fats excessively? That's been asked numerous times from multiple posters and it doesn't look like you've ever addressed it.

[BeginnerGainz]

You enjoyed every bit of it and couldn’t stay away. Admit it.

I REALLY wish you would of learned something, and I kept coming back to see if you had a “come to Jesus” moment, but…

NOPE

You kinda made yourself look like an ass this whole time. Even after people tried to explain while you’re wrong, you just kept doubling down and being willfully obtuse.

Coach, could wyou please answer the question of how increasing protein significantly above the conventionally recommended levels will not either result in a caloric surplus and fat gain, or compromised training from having to reduce carbs and fats excessively? That's been asked numerous times from multiple posters and it doesn't look like you've ever addressed it.

“Ronnie did it”

[coachcalande]

Coach, could you please answer the question of how increasing protein significantly above the conventionally recommended levels will not either result in a caloric surplus and fat gain, or compromised training from having to reduce carbs and fats excessively? That's been asked numerous times from multiple posters and it doesn't look like you've ever addressed it.

If you add 100 grams of protein and wish to stay at the same total calories, you need to adjust carbs and or fats by a sum total of 400 calories. This is the very essence of setting your macros.

For example Arnold popularized a 40-40-20 diet. That’s 40% protein, 40% carbs and 20% fat.
Consider someone else may choose to set their macros at 30%-40%-30%
And someone else may set theirs at 25%-50%-25%

As stated several times, Ronnie’s diet was as high as 65% protein and under 10% fat.
Jay Cutler at closer to 40% protein.

[coachcalande]

I REALLY wish you would of learned something, and I kept coming back to see if you had a “come to Jesus” moment, but…

NOPE

You kinda made yourself look like an ass this whole time. Even after people tried to explain while you’re wrong, you just kept doubling down and being willfully obtuse.



“Ronnie did it”

Nope, you own it now that you couldn’t rise above and stay out of the fray. It’s hypocrisy to point a finger at me now. Own it.

You didn’t really think I was going to cower and be bullied out of my position on higher % protein diets did you?

[EiFit91]

Guys, look:

https://forum.bodybuilding.com/showt...post1657441753

The Nutrition forum has been quiet for too long

:P

[coachcalande]

Guys, look:

https://forum.bodybuilding.com/showt...post1657441753

:P

Legend

[coachcalande]

Just stumbled across this as I’m heating up a pound of chicken breast and a cup of broccoli


https://www.drworkout.fitness/ct-fletcher-diet-plan/

50% protein for CT Fletcher.

[Filmbuff81]

What are you resting your case on?

I have never once said enhanced bodybuilders don’t eat giant sums of protein.

I’m saying your claim that Ronnie, Jay, Dorian were better than the rest of the bodybuilders BECAUSE THEY are tons of protein is completely and utterly false.

If every bodybuilder eats the same amount of protein, you realize that isn’t the deciding difference?

You continually skip over my statements of pure fact, that they’re protein is astronomical because they need to eat so much food.

The reason CT fletcher and other bodybuilders eat so little fat, is because testosterone and other gear have the ability to completely fuk your lipid profile up.

So yeah they need to eat less fat.

Also if you have ever looked at the blood panels of natty bodybuilders at the end of a contest diet, their hormones are completely tanned because they’re reducing fat and carbs so much they are hypogonadal.

Enhanced guys don’t need to worry about that at all.

So for someone who is natty trying to diet from 18% to 8-12% BF not a single person in their right mind would tell them to sacrifice proper fat and carb intake for the sake of going way over on protein intake.

10% fat intake will completely **** up a natural lifter. That type of thing can only be sustained for a very short amount of time.

You’re being willfully obtuse, so there’s no point in engaging any longer.

I never bullied you, I called you out on pure speculative BS that you pass off as gospel.

[Filmbuff81]

Guys, look:

https://forum.bodybuilding.com/showt...post1657441753

The Nutrition forum has been quiet for too long

:P

Just copy/paste the last few pages over haha.

[CW47]

Stiff Legged Deadlift: 270 pounds x 5/5/4 reps
Situp: 3 sets x 20 reps
Reverse Yoke Bar Squat: 170 pounds - 4 sets x 5 reps

Added 1 rep to SLDL. On the squats I reduced the weight by 5 pounds and added a set. Don't think I would have been able to complete this at 175 pounds. It doesn't help that this is my most difficult day and it's also the day where I'm most fatigued. I may change around my rest days to help with this. Speaking of rest days...tomorrow will be one for me - much needed.

[Filmbuff81]

Stiff Legged Deadlift: 270 pounds x 5/5/4 reps
Situp: 3 sets x 20 reps
Reverse Yoke Bar Squat: 170 pounds - 4 sets x 5 reps

Added 1 rep to SLDL. On the squats I reduced the weight by 5 pounds and added a set. Don't think I would have been able to complete this at 175 pounds. It doesn't help that this is my most difficult day and it's also the day where I'm most fatigued. I may change around my rest days to help with this. Speaking of rest days...tomorrow will be one for me - much needed.

Your squat form has really got dialed in.

Looking crispy.

[EliKoehn]

Good looking squats CW. How much of a difference would you say the SSB makes? I've got to say I was initially hostile towards them, but if the day comes that I buy my own setup, I'll most likely get one.

[CW47]

Good looking squats CW. How much of a difference would you say the SSB makes? I've got to say I was initially hostile towards them, but if the day comes that I buy my own setup, I'll most likely get one.

I'll start out by saying that it's NOT a replacement for a Low Bar Squat. The movement pattern is somewhere between a high bar squat and a front squat - definitely using more quads than a back squat. Can potentially be quite good for hypertrophy. The most obvious benefit for most people is that it can be easier on the shoulders than a standard barbell, though as others have mentioned it's important to have good padding. Even with the brand new bar and padding that I have I get some minor bruising/irritation on the top of my shoulders using pretty light weights. But even then it's easier on the shoulder joint, which is a positive.

Having said that, I've never had issues with my shoulders when squatting, so that isn't a huge benefit for me. Where I get the benefit is in the versatility, using it for good mornings (it's far better than a standard barbell for that), and hoping to try out some other exercises with it in the future as well. Probably the main benefit for me is that it forces me to fight against the weight pulling me forward. This has always been an issue for me on back squats, and I believe the SSB is helping improve that.

So there are benefits, but I wouldn't say it's worth the investment for everyone. It just depends upon what you're hoping to get out of it. If at all possible, I'd recommend trying one out before you make a decision.

[EliKoehn]

I would certainly place the premium on the regular bar, especially since I intend to compete in the not-too-distant future, so the strength-specific adaptations to the straight bar are most likely going to be more important. As an auxiliary it seems like it would be therapeutic against my weak points.

--

This week, I've decided that I'm going to do a legitimate deload at low volume and well-below challenging levels of intensity, primarily to keep a mild stimulus on every movement pattern while enabling rest and recovery. My last workout was kind of crappy despite good rest and being well-fed.

I keep bouncing off of 230 and so am also hesitant to train heavy this week, because my appetite seems to fight back pretty hard at that point on its own and intense training is not going to help break that barrier.

Incidentally, I actually haven't done a "deload" like this - where frequency and variety remain high but volume and intensity are reduced so much that it almost seems unserious - in probably well over a year, as opposed to simply taking days off entirely. Very strong and accomplished people program them for a reason though, so we'll see how it affects more challenging work in the upcoming weeks.