Building Curves

[ilovethe80s]

I'm almost certain you're defying physics with that squat. Good work.

thanks! I used to have a lot of knee travel (probably did not help my knee issues) so I'm pretty happy about the way the squats are going now

[ilovethe80s]

Smolov Jr Bench Session 11
Bench 8 x 4 (125)
Pull Ups 4 x 6

Everything went up, no danger of failing any lifts, however note to self - do NOT take creatine right before training. This has happened a few times, today worse than ever, I was holding down barf the whole time I was lifting.

I am lucky everything went up because I forgot to pull the bar apart, every single set. Just when you think everything is under control. I was really concentrating on setting up my shoulders, however pulling the bar is part of that and I missed it.

Tomorrow will be interesting - 10 x 3 at 135. I have not missed a lift all program, so we'll see Better not be forgetting my damn cues. Bands on the wrists tomorrow for sure. Getting all the post-its set up tonight, haha.

After that, I am thinking about where I want to go with this. Not sure when I want to test my 1rm. Also not sure if I want to just bench for that, or do a paused bench. I'm thinking I might want to pause so I can have a better idea for an opener. Who knows, maybe now that I can use leg drive, the paused bench won't be so pathetic in comparison to non-paused.

Also thinking about programming up to the meet. The original plan was (if smolov jr was successful), was to take a week off after the first run, then run it a second time, which would have me peak right for the meet. Shoulder issues made me think twice, but in all fairness I was using a lot of shoulder in the benches initially. I also love the idea of continuing with all the frequency and practice on bench.

I could just run a 5/3/1 scheme for bench and peak for the meet that way too, hitting 5/3/1 on the heavy day and dynamic benching the other day. I might be ready for dynamic bench (the right way) now. Not ready for following westside methods full-on though as I still need practice on my competition bench.

Ok trying not to ralph from this creatine crap, this shiz better have some redeeming qualities pretty soon here haha

[newbeginning828]

That squat is beautiful!!
I'm glad your bench is progressing beautifully! You're going to rock your next meet
What's the meet date? Interested to see what program you'll choose.

[ilovethe80s]

That squat is beautiful!!
I'm glad your bench is progressing beautifully! You're going to rock your next meet
What's the meet date? Interested to see what program you'll choose.

lol thanks! My meet is on October 20th, just about 1 month away. I'm really excited for this meet. I did this exact meet, same place same federation, same exact time last year. I've put nearly 100 pounds on my dead since then so it will be really nice to have that progress down on paper

[ilovethe80s]

Smolove Bench 12 FINAL SESSION!!
10 x 3 (135)

Only one miss, which I retook, but some were a little shaky.

Sets 1-4 ok.
Set 5, I started losing it on the 3rd rep.
Set 6, the same. Butt might have left the bench.
Set 7 - Buried on the first rep. However, I had realized that I was shuffling my feet outward just AFTER unracking the bar, which made me think that I was wanting a wider foot position. So I tried to set up wider initially, leg drive was compromised, and I failed the lift. I waited just 30 seconds and gave it another go and had a successful set. Just goes to show that bench is technique, not brawn.

I took a brief (3 minute) break to look at JT's vid again, and my own vid from last week when my benches were successful (so now I have 2 vids going, plus post-its). I realize that before arching on the bench, I need to be sure that I can reach back and touch the bar with both arms from where I am standing - that ensures feet are in the right place for best leg drive. That foot shifting thing - it was actually wanting to turn the toes out, not the whole foot out farther. So get feet almost completely out to the side while still standing.

And the most important thing I have to remember - PUSH HEAD TOWARD TOP OF BENCH!! When the lift started to fail, the moment I remembered or put more effort into this, the bar literally flew up. It's like a different lift altogether.

Sometimes, I reverted to my old ways and drove my traps INTO the bench instead of push head up. This resulted in butt coming off bench, bar feels heavier, and it happened a few times on the 3rd rep.

Sets 9 and 10, everything came together and it was awesome.

I have a raging headcold, stayed up till after 1am and got up at 5 and am sore from yesterday. Everyone still asleep including husband who should be at work, so I think everyone else is sick now, too. So if this day went ok under these conditions, I KNOW improvements have been made.

1rm test soon, whenever the mood strikes

[tina722]

congrats on the awesome progress for the dead and bench. squat looks like it's coming along nicely too.

when you say "drive your head up" do you mean up in the air - towards the bar or up - back towards the top of the bench?

[ilovethe80s]

congrats on the awesome progress for the dead and bench. squat looks like it's coming along nicely too.

when you say "drive your head up" do you mean up in the air - towards the bar or up - back towards the top of the bench?

thanks! drive the head up = pushing through your heels to slide the body right off the bench, there is a vid by Jennifer Thompson on the previous page that shows it perfectly. This is the single most important thing I find I need to remember. I thought I was doing it right before but was pushing myself down into the bench, world of difference.

In the Book of Methods (westside), they suggest actually raising head off the bench on the eccentric, and slamming back down on the bench on the concentric - I had trouble getting that to work for me. Maybe once my benches get better I'll give that one another shot

[Euqinom]

In the Book of Methods (westside), they suggest actually raising head off the bench on the eccentric, and slamming back down on the bench on the concentric - I had trouble getting that to work for me. Maybe once my benches get better I'll give that one another shot

Be aware that this might get you red lights in other organizations!!

Also, for the feet position: I tend to sit up on the bench, move my feet back as far as I can, but not excessively on toes, lie down, 'swoosh' spring-loading. Then again, my feet are WAY closer to the bench,.

[Euqinom]

[ Bands on the wrists tomorrow for sure. Getting all the post-its set up tonight, haha.

How did you do?

[ilovethe80s]

Be aware that this might get you red lights in other organizations!!

Also, for the feet position: I tend to sit up on the bench, move my feet back as far as I can, but not excessively on toes, lie down, 'swoosh' spring-loading. Then again, my feet are WAY closer to the bench,.

I know, I have seen in a few rule books that the head must stay in contact with the bench. I wouldn't want to get in the habit of doing something that isn't going to fly at meets, but sometimes like to try things 'illegal', I find that certain unconventional methods wake something up in me or bring awareness into something I was not fully tapping into before. So even if I don't stick with it, hopefully I can still experience whatever power or drive that slamming the head into the bench offers, and be able to somehow implement it in a subtle way. This bench stuff is like the ballet with all the technicalities lol.

The feet position, something was up there today. I just jotted what you stated here on another post-it, I am really thinking that another round of smolov jr would be great to offer more practice on the bench.

How did you do?

Overall, pretty well!! Detailed log of the day up at post 515, but I did find myself forgetting some things and reverting back to old habits once the weight got heavy. I can see for sure now, it is all technique - at one point I got stuck on stupid and was buried on the first rep. I just picked the bar back off the safeties, thought for about 20 seconds, and knocked out another set of 3 with the same weight. No way I could have 'recovered' in 30 seconds or so, so it is all mental. Up to now, that fail would have meant the end of the bench session, I feel like I really have a place to tap into now to get the weight up, just need to get to where I am doing it 100% of the time. Sometimes I would barely get the 3rd rep, and then other times it was all easy as pie. When it all came together, the weight was light. I'm pretty excited now that I look back at my log, looks like I have never repped anything over 125 - I've only done singles over that

[Euqinom]

I know, I have seen in a few rule books that the head must stay in contact with the bench. I wouldn't want to get in the habit of doing something that isn't going to fly at meets, but sometimes like to try things 'illegal', I find that certain unconventional methods wake something up in me or bring awareness into something I was not fully tapping into before. So even if I don't stick with it, hopefully I can still experience whatever power or drive that slamming the head into the bench offers, and be able to somehow implement it in a subtle way. This bench stuff is like the ballet with all the technicalities lol.

Try to find out if you tuck the chin on 'slamming'. That could be the cue you want for somewhat getting that same effect legally.

Overall, pretty well!!

No, no, I specifically meant the bands around wrists. I can't wait to hear how you'll like it. Once it clicks, it's wonderful. And if it doesn't: more pull ups. ;-/

[ilovethe80s]

No, no, I specifically meant the bands around wrists. I can't wait to hear how you'll like it. Once it clicks, it's wonderful. And if it doesn't: more pull ups. ;-/

The bands - I had no business removing them (again) lol. Don't know how many times I need to make the same mistake of thinking I graduated from something (prematurely) - they did the trick today - when I was using them religiously and then took one day of of them, my bench was still pretty good. Then a few more sessions and.. I need the bands again. I'll be using them every session up to the meet

[Euqinom]

The bands - I had no business removing them (again) lol. Don't know how many times I need to make the same mistake of thinking I graduated from something (prematurely) - they did the trick today - when I was using them religiously and then took one day of of them, my bench was still pretty good. Then a few more sessions and.. I need the bands again. I'll be using them every session up to the meet

Don't make them a crutch. Use them as a reminder. If you can't keep form, something else 's wrong. If you have tot lower weights without them, it means THE cue to work on is grip/pull. Think of it as a brush up + diagnostic tool: insane benching with bands also gives you clues as to what you should do/prioritize/build. If you can keep the weight, but not the reps,.. etc.

[ilovethe80s]

Don't make them a crutch. Use them as a reminder. If you can't keep form, something else 's wrong.

oh there is PLENTY still wrong in my bench haha. I just wish I could remember all my cues, every time. I miss one, focus on it for the next time, and then end up forgetting something else. I do have a lot to think about on bench, priorities and such. The bands force me to pull the bar apart, so that unless I really go out of my way to be dense, I don't miss that cue. Then I take off the bands and everything is going swimmingly, till I refocus on leg drive or something, then boom, now we are no longer tucking the shoulders and the bar is not being pulled apart. Some day I know all the pieces will come together but it would be really great if it could just happen now, before my next meet

[Euqinom]

r but it would be really great if it could just happen now, before my next meet

Definitely. Just work on automatizing, even at lower weights. I've done lift offs with just the bar for an hour with my previous coach, years ago, just to get it right. Also, wearing the loops around your feet will help you focus on pulling apart while using leg drive. And I wasn't dissing you about form (just to be clear on this) but it's just the way I think about benching. Master the first stumbling block, and move on once you've improved and made it automatic (sorta), when's the next meet?

[ilovethe80s]

Definitely. Just work on automatizing, even at lower weights. I've done lift offs with just the bar for an hour with my previous coach, years ago, just to get it right. Also, wearing the loops around your feet will help you focus on pulling apart while using leg drive. When's the next meet?

Only one month away now That is a good idea - the lighter work for technique purposes isn't as taxing at all of course but I am feeling like that might be the missing link right now - need more of it. Just lying on the bench, pushing with heels while spreading a band apart, things like that that aren't really weight bearing and requiring recovery.. will definitely incorporate more drills, and can't wait to try the bands around the feet. thank you, you are a wealth of info on bench!!

[Euqinom]

Only one month away now That is a good idea - the lighter work for technique purposes isn't as taxing at all of course but I am feeling like that might be the missing link right now - need more of it. Just lying on the bench, pushing with heels while spreading a band apart, things like that that aren't really weight bearing and requiring recovery.. will definitely incorporate more drills, and can't wait to try the bands around the feet. thank you, you are a wealth of info on bench!!

Dunno, it's just a VERY hard lift for me, so I try, try, try, and try. The bar only drills helped me focus on set up and really tucking shoulders right from the start, bringing out properly, etc.
I'd actually probably go for t he loops around feet for the coming cycle/weeks. That way you'll have to stomp down, and you can press 'raw' while drilling yourself to really drive with the legs. Also, it will be helpful to have a clean (bandless) set up down. Benching without bench around wrists takes a bit of getting used to again, you know?

[ilovethe80s]

Dunno, it's just a VERY hard lift for me, so I try, try, try, and try. The bar only drills helped me focus on set up and really tucking shoulders right from the start, bringing out properly, etc.
I'd actually probably go for t he loops around feet for the coming cycle/weeks. That way you'll have to stomp down, and you can press 'raw' while drilling yourself to really drive with the legs. Also, it will be helpful to have a clean (bandless) set up down. Benching without bench around wrists takes a bit of getting used to again, you know?

agree on the lift being hard, this is by far my worst lift. Before starting Smolov Jr, I was thinking 'hmm just bench? no triceps? I might sneak in some more triceps somewhere.' Um, NO. lol. My tris are so fried. The light bar work is very appealing at this point, I'll probably just stick to some drills this week, try out what you have outlined with the bands and just be experimental and stay light. One of my issues is not using the proper cues until the weight gets so heavy where I need them, I think it will be great practice to get the technique right even with light weight. When I see JT's vid, even though that is very light weight for her on the bar, she is still forcefully pushing up on the bench and using proper technique with each rep. This month will continue to be bench boot camp

[ilovethe80s]

I am lying low this week, a few drills and a very slight possibilty of some speed work. But I have two tests that need to happen at some point over this week.

1. Bench
2. Deadlift

I'll do whichever I feel psyched up for, whenever the stars align. I'm thinking I might even wait till early next week to test bench.

I am having my typical month-before-the-meet panic attack that my deadlift has suffered (I go through this every meet - fear that the dead has dropped drastically because I haven't trained it). But this time I might have legitimate concern since I've been focusing so much on bench.

I was set on opening with 325 this time, but scared now. I've only lifted up to 315 at home (but PR's at the meet with 341), and that was several months ago... If I can get my 325 opener at home, that will give me some peace of mind - I'd like to take a stab at 360 for this meet, and to do that I think I need to open with 325.

Because I have a habit of doing singles in 5 pound increments from like 280-315 (so by the time I am at the upper end of that I am wiped), I am making my outline for my test here (to refer to when the crazies hit):
135/5 185/3 225/2 275/1 295/1 315/1 325/1

Well that was a lot of writing for doing NOTHING in the gym today, yesterday and probably tomorrow and even the next day, too. All talk no action here right now

[geek23ka]

i hope your body says deadlift bc i am excited to see it happen. i like the way you increase in small weight and do singled. do you're still doing enough to wipe yourself out but few enough to get to the big numbers. you have an amazing deadlift. did you come up with the singles work by yourself or get it from an outline somewhere?

[ilovethe80s]

i hope your body says deadlift bc i am excited to see it happen. i like the way you increase in small weight and do singled. do you're still doing enough to wipe yourself out but few enough to get to the big numbers. you have an amazing deadlift. did you come up with the singles work by yourself or get it from an outline somewhere?

Aside from the recovery, I have an actual medical reason for doing the singles, haha

I got up to doing straight sets for 5 sets of 5, every week and I really never felt so awful for such an extended period of time. Ny hams were always tingling and numb, I would fall asleep reading to my kids, daylight hurt, had ringing in the ears and hearing what sounded like radio frequencies, my vision was shifty too, I felt drunk. lol!

In Starting Strength, I read to work up to a top set of 5 deads. That felt a bit better, but still had a heck of a time with recovery.

Westside Methods prescribe not doing the deadlift at all really, and when you do your Max Effort move, just work up to a few heavy singles. After starting that, I never felt better, and my deadlift started really doing well.

Unfortunately, after pregnacies, deadlifts are not as great for me right now as they were at one time. In addition to recovery with the posterior chain, I have some internal issues as well (physical internal issues -hernias and displaced organs, not emotional conflicts with deads haha).

It is impossible for me to lift more than one heavy rep and keep everything in check, the deadlift drags things down, pulls things to where they are not supposed to be and shifts them around. After each lift, I can feel everything pulling in really abnormal directions, during the rests, it settles back . If I do more than one at a time, nothing has had a chance to shift yet back to its normal position and just keeps pushing again from its already shifted spot.

I already had one of my hernias become incarcerated but I have more that need to be fixed, plus other internal surgeries that I am having all together as soon as my youngest doesn't need to be picked up so much.

I know, most would say 'don't lift at all' but there is only so much of your life you are willing to give up, especially when the dr is confident that everything will be 100% post surgery I just tighten my belt, brace, and pay attention to what is going on.

[Euqinom]

Aside from the recovery, I have an actual medical reason for doing the singles, haha

I know, most would say 'don't lift at all' but there is only so much of your life you are willing to give up, especially when the dr is confident that everything will be 100% post surgery I just tighten my belt, brace, and pay attention to what is going on.

Whoa!

I only pull singles as well. Those longer rep stuff just don't seem to work in my mind. I want to pull a great deadlift, and to do that, I need to have an AWESOME first pull. It's so much different from pulling touch & go that I didn't feel like I got much carryover. Even making a full stop but holding tension between reps feels really different. 2nd rep is always easier that way. And I wanted to avoid that.


When do you get your surgery?

[geek23ka]

i've had, what i think is my liver slip in and out between my diaphragm and abdominal wall. not during deads, thankfully. it hurts like a little b*tch, too. it'll slip out pretty quickly, and go back to normal if i arch my back. started happening during my last pregnancy.

the things we destroy just to have some rugrats.

i like the approach of singles and if i ever decide to try a max, i'm gonna do that. i just feel weird thinking baout not doing warm up deads. maybe i need to let go of that.

equinom, i pause between deads on the heavy ones. just to reset in my mind and get a better grip if i need one. there isn't much actual time between? i think 5-15 seconds max. in my head, i am still doing sets, but i guess they are inbetween sets and singles.

[rdferguson]

i've had, what i think is my liver slip in and out between my diaphragm and abdominal wall. not during deads, thankfully. it hurts like a little b*tch, too. it'll slip out pretty quickly, and go back to normal if i arch my back. started happening during my last pregnancy.

the things we destroy just to have some rugrats.

i like the approach of singles and if i ever decide to try a max, i'm gonna do that. i just feel weird thinking baout not doing warm up deads. maybe i need to let go of that.

equinom, i pause between deads on the heavy ones. just to reset in my mind and get a better grip if i need one. there isn't much actual time between? i think 5-15 seconds max. in my head, i am still doing sets, but i guess they are inbetween sets and singles.

You don't need to forego warming up your deadlift to pull singles. If I'm going to train singles on my deadlift, the session will look something like this: 1x60kg, 1x80kg, 1x100kg, 1x120kg etc, either up to a daily max, or up to a reasonably heavy weight and then just keep repeating that same single every few minutes. I've usually been squatting and/or doing olympic lifts before deadlifting, so I don't normally bother with a more general warm up for them, but 5min cardio, dynamic stretching and/or some light squats first might also help with preparing for it.

[ilovethe80s]

Whoa!
Even making a full stop but holding tension between reps feels really different. 2nd rep is always easier that way. And I wanted to avoid that.


When do you get your surgery?

ITA. On the surgery, my husband is thinking of taking a sabbatical in Spring, so will do it then. I had to have one surgery (with no help at home) when my kids were 3 and 2 and I NEVER want to go through anything like that again. I was basically on my back on the floor, crying 'no, please god have mercy, stop them!' as I could not pick them up or be upright for more than a few minutes at a time, they could totally run and escape me (and not old enough yet to listen) and I could not even scream because of the hernia pain, could not take in enough air. They would be 6 and a half, almost 5 and 2 years old by then so I am hoping with 2 being older, things will be a lot different. I hope! lol.

i've had, what i think is my liver slip in and out between my diaphragm and abdominal wall. not during deads, thankfully. it hurts like a little b*tch, too. it'll slip out pretty quickly, and go back to normal if i arch my back. started happening during my last pregnancy.

the things we destroy just to have some rugrats.

oh my. yes, I used to hear that organs shift around with pregnancies but thought it was an urban legend. Didn't want to think these horrors were real, but indeed they are.

You don't need to forego warming up your deadlift to pull singles. If I'm going to train singles on my deadlift, the session will look something like this: 1x60kg, 1x80kg, 1x100kg, 1x120kg etc, either up to a daily max, or up to a reasonably heavy weight and then just keep repeating that same single every few minutes. I've usually been squatting and/or doing olympic lifts before deadlifting, so I don't normally bother with a more general warm up for them, but 5min cardio, dynamic stretching and/or some light squats first might also help with preparing for it.

Hmm, I might go more this approach then even have some 5 and triple sets working up. Seems like it would be even easier on the body that what I've been doing. thanks for posting that!

[ilovethe80s]

Bench 1RM Test
(Unplanned)

My fixed knee has been burning more each session from torquing foot so far out of line in bench setup. So I headed down for some light drills to see where I could compromise as far as foot positioning. And it turned into a 1RM test.

Instead of worrying about all these post-its and choreography and not knowing if it would work till the actual bench attempt, I focused on the actual outcome of what I was doing, and checking for leg drive every step of the way. Today, I ended up lying on the bench first, then walking feet up to where my heels could touch hands, planting feet and experimenting with leg drive from that position by forcefully pushing up. Then grab bar, swing foward, spring load feet and actively check drive again, arch onto bench and check drive, set shoulders, check drive again.. just basically quickly re-check for leg drive after each small adjustment I make elsewhere. THINK, don't just go through the motions and trust things will just work out just because I am superficially duplicating something I did before.

I went through several tests with empty barbell first, but I realized even with my sticky pad, I was having a hard time feeling how well I was pushing off floor. So kept adding weight. Several sets with an empty bar, then:

95/5
115/1
135/1 - Did this with a pause, things are feeling great, so going for it now

140/1 - No pause now, I just want to see how much I can actually bench

145/1 - would have been 4lb PR but butt left bench. That was my mistake though, I pushed down through floor instead of head toward upper bench. still going for 150 next

150/1 !!! (9lb PR)

155/sort of?? (very near miss on 14lb PR!!!)

It went up, however I think butt did legitimately leave the bench. Bar path went up to shoulder level instead of out away from me over sternum (which almost always spells a miss for me). Also, my previous attempts had a very slow, controlled eccentric. Not a conscious effort at being slow, but when I actually started feeling out what I was doing as opposed to going over checklists, the eccentric just naturally slowed, it served as a chance to feel everything coil like a spring, getting ready to blast through on the concentric. Here, bar velocity changed as I approached the chest. Again, I knew where I went wrong, I thought I could fix, so again:
155/ and......



OK so based on that, I would guestimate my 1RM with butt on bench to be maybe 153?

I'm pretty darned happy!

Where to go from here, not sure yet, will know more after the deadlift test. If I fail my DL test miserably than I'll reserve my energy to focus on bringing that up to speed for the meet. But if it goes ok, I am thinking of another round of Smolov to peak for the meet.
Honestly, I don't feel burned out on it. Had some shoulder tenderness (probably from bad benching) for a while but it is gone. My only issue, is I feel I need to test my paused bench. I'd be ending this round exactly 1 week before the meet, so I if I wanted to test my paused bench, it would need to be the week of the meet...

We'll see after the dead test

I read Smolov JR promised a 10-15 pound gain, but I did NOT think that meant me, since I was starting off with so little anyway. Plus, the last smolov session was a triple at 135, which by the calculators put my 1rm a little over 140, so I was thinking that would be it. I'm a VERY satisfied customer. Well, happy customer. Never 'satisfied' haha, but happy!

[newbeginning828]

Yeeee that's great so happy for you!
The lift looked good..couldn't tell about the butt though. It'll be yours very very soon!!

Can't wait to see your DL!

Happy Thursday!

[Euqinom]

Congratulations on another step forward with benching!

Next attempt, try the bands/belt/feet set up. Will help you to focus on set up, but stomp down automatically!

[newbeginning828]

Congratulations on another step forward with benching!

Next attempt, try the bands/belt/feet set up. Will help you to focus on set up, but stomp down automatically!

'Nom speaking of belts.. I noticed that pro PLers actually bench with their belts on. How does that help? I've never tried it but I would think it would be difficult to arch properly?

[Euqinom]

Mainly helps to keep the shirt in place. In addition, it helps to put a little extra pressure on the upperbody.