Moving forward in Reverse: Devils post-show recovery thread

[Williurms]

Just began reverse dieting, in on log for motivation. Looking good man!

[The Solution]

Staying very lean and continual strength gains
Burgers and ice cream are anabolic

[PhilAUS]

You look insanely familiar man, i swear i have seen you IRL

[jaredmus]

Been following along in here, sick stuff man, your reverse is going insane I wish I could mimic half of this when I am done competing , a lot of the food looks great too, I am a popcorn man my self I see you are too, kettle corn is my pop corn of choice haha

[Devils]

Just began reverse dieting, in on log for motivation. Looking good man!

Thanks mate, good luck with yours.

Staying very lean and continual strength gains
Burgers and ice cream are anabolic

The strength gains I'm enjoying the most.

You look insanely familiar man, i swear i have seen you IRL

Maybe, depends where you train

Been following along in here, sick stuff man, your reverse is going insane I wish I could mimic half of this when I am done competing , a lot of the food looks great too, I am a popcorn man my self I see you are too, kettle corn is my pop corn of choice haha

I'm sure you'll be able too. Yeah I've been loving the food lately, eating is just as much fun as training. One of the simple pleasures.

[Devils]

Day 70, Week 9 / Lower Body / Morning Weight = 78.8kg

Training

in BOLD are PR's

Keiser Spin Bike 4 x 30 seconds @ Level 21, 90 Seconds rest

Leg Extension 55kg x 20, 100kg x 20-20-20, Single Leg 50kg x 10-12
Leg Curl 55kg x 15, 70kg x 8-8-8, Single Leg 25kg x 8-6
Seated Calf Raise 60kg x 20-20-15
Backward Lunge 16kg x 10-10-10
Seated Calf Extension 55kg x 20, 90kg x 15-15-18


Nutrition

Approx ____ calories, ___p, ___c, ___f / Meal Breakdown's

Thoughts

Comments

--------------------------------------------
Day 71, Week 9 / Rest/ Morning Weight = 78.6kg

Training

in BOLD are PR's

Spin Bike 6 x 30 second sprints, 100 seconds rest.

--------------------------------------------
Day 72, Week 9 / Upper / Morning Weight = 78.9kg

Training

in BOLD are PR's

Bench Press 20kg x 30, 30kg x 20, 40kg x 10, 60kg x 4-4, 92.5kg x 12-12, 112.5kg x 7-7
Incline DB Press 32.5kg x 12-12, 38kg x 7-6
Pullups 30kg x 10-10, 40kg x 6-6
High Machine Row 40kg x 12-12
Seated Row 1 arm Row 32kg x 15, 52kg x 12-12
Tricep Pushdown 2 sets of 15, mod heavy weight.

Nutrition

Approx ____ calories, ___p, ___c, ___f / Meal Breakdown's

Thoughts

Went to a different gym for a workout. Another PR on the bench, I had to check if the bar was really 20kg, should be correct so I guess it just felt lighter because of strength gains. Did not have a good time on my way back home, now I'm pretty stressed out. I'm a bit up and down on my luck at the moment

I've tracked my weight for the last few months, here's an interesting breakdown of my daily fluctuations. Calories have been between 3500 and 4500 a day.

76.0kg 17-6-13
76.4kg 19-6-13
75.9kg 20-6-13
76.7kg 21-6-13
76.3kg 22-6-13
76.2kg 23-6-13
76.5kg 24-6-13
76.3kg 25-6-13
76.3kg 26-6-13
76.4kg 27-6-13
77.7kg 28-6-13
76.7kg 29-6-13
77.7kg 30-6-13
76.4kg 01-7-13
77.4kg 02-7-13
77.4kg 03-7-13
77.1kg 04-7-13
77.4kg 05-7-13
78.4kg 06-7-13
77.4kg 07-7-13
77.2kg 08-7-13
77.2kg 09-7-13
77.3kg 10-7-13
77.9kg 11-7-13
78.4kg 12-7-13
77.5kg 13-7-13
77.9kg 14-7-13
78.4kg 15-7-13
77.9kg 16-7-13
77.9kg 17-7-13
78.4kg 18-7-13
77.7kg 19-7-13
78.7kg 20-7-13
78.9kg 21-7-13
79.2kg 22-7-13
78.1kg 23-7-13
78.1kg 24-7-13
78.8kg 25-7-13
78.6kg 26-7-13
78.9kg 27-7-13
78.5kg 28-7-13

Comments

[The Solution]

up only 2kg in about 1.5 months, thats not bad at all for eating 3.5-4.5 metabolism is crazy fast.

[Bonkies]

up only 2kg in about 1.5 months, thats not bad at all for eating 3.5-4.5 metabolism is crazy fast.

^this

Strong benching and pullups there Devils. That high row's a tough one.

[jpfaherty]

Metabolism is on point! Those fluctuations aren't too crazy. Nice work man.

What happened on the way home?

[Balddude]

Bench PRs coming in steadily, weight and cals going up slowly but surely.

110% successful reverse diet

[Devils]

up only 2kg in about 1.5 months, thats not bad at all for eating 3.5-4.5 metabolism is crazy fast.

Maintenance should be a bit lower, I'm gaining more rapidly in the last month. I will lower my junk intake.

^this

Strong benching and pullups there Devils. That high row's a tough one.

Thanks, it's a Hammer strength High Row machine.

Metabolism is on point! Those fluctuations aren't too crazy. Nice work man.

What happened on the way home?

Car trouble, not serious, just $$$ and stressful

Bench PRs coming in steadily, weight and cals going up slowly but surely.

110% successful reverse diet

Cheers, It's pretty much a bulk now. I'll keep logging my workouts, I can write down my food or macro's for the day if anyone's interested but I think general bodyweight progression is more interesting, besides my macro's fluctuate a lot.

-----

Anyway I'm thinking of a deload this week or taking some time off, I feel I need it. Keep following and I'll be back in a few days.

[Ccm644]

Enjoy the Deload or time off

Hope the car is sorted

Weight was writing interesting to see, thanks

[chickeneater]

Four.....

Thousand.....

Calories......














A day.....

And you are still a shredded kunt....











Holy crap!

[chickeneater]

So, again I don't want to request your mac's. But I am wondering what has been your average protein intake?

If you splurge, which you self admittedly seem to do often lately, and miss what you feel is an ideal protein amount, do you try to go heavier on protein the next couple days to make up?

Do macro percentages even matter while you're bulking? Do you just try to incorporate a balance of foods or try to get in x amount of macros still?

To take that further, if your protein intake was only 50-75 grams a day, would you still look the way you do with the calories being the same, or do you feel you would look worse?

To take that further, and further, when you cut again, will you raise your protien up compared to now, and to what?

[bunnybuilder]

It would be an interesting experiment to see if your muscles would just disintegrate if you dropped to 75 grams of Protein a day for an extended period. My guess is that it would have minimal affect or much less affect than we tend to think.

I know a few friends of mine think they absolutely won't grow or even maintain their muscle unless they are taking in that magical 2 x their body weight in grams of protein. Some even take in close to 3x. Seems like a big waste of protein powder in my opinion.

[kobebryant8to24]

It would be an interesting experiment to see see what would happen if he dropped his protein intake to around 70 to 100 grams or so a day. Personally, I would think it wouldn't have a negative effect on his physique to maintaining or bulking on that amount (as that's what I've been doing for the past 2 years). It would be an even more interesting experiment to seeing him cut after his little bulk (let's say from a low BF starting point of 9-10% to a shredded 5-6%) on a low protein range of 70-100grams, with caloric intake taking priority. It would very intriguing to see if you would be able to reach the same conditioning and size..albeit a vastly lower protein intake.

[lukamura]

The protein in diet in not only there to maintain muscles guys. Try going on a low-protein diet during contest prep and you'll notice the differences in being satisfied with your food intake. Protein makes you feel fuller, as for me. I dropped protein to 150 grams and noticed that I'm not getting satisfied with the amount of protein in the diet, made me hungrier for carbs and fats which is bad being on restricted calories. Upped then to 225 and felt a difference.

[Devils]

Four.....
Thousand.....
Calories......
A day.....
And you are still a shredded kunt....

Holy crap!

Shredded is a subjective term I think 6-8% is shredded, I'm about 10% now. Thanks mate.

So, again I don't want to request your mac's. But I am wondering what has been your average protein intake?
If you splurge, which you self admittedly seem to do often lately, and miss what you feel is an ideal protein amount, do you try to go heavier on protein the next couple days to make up?
Do macro percentages even matter while you're bulking? Do you just try to incorporate a balance of foods or try to get in x amount of macros still?
To take that further, if your protein intake was only 50-75 grams a day, would you still look the way you do with the calories being the same, or do you feel you would look worse?
To take that further, and further, when you cut again, will you raise your protien up compared to now, and to what?

For me, I have already built a good amount of mass. I don't feel It takes a big amount of protein to maintain that mass so I'm not too worried about it dropping low for a day or two. For the most part my protein is high simply because I enjoy eating meat and large filling meals, which just happens to contain a good amount of protein. I find once protein synthesis is achieved at a good rate, adding more protein is just about meal satisfaction rather than more gains.

I would say it's good to have balance, but not to the fine point of counting everything, if you can get away with it or estimate accurately. I'm not sure about how having protein that low would make a difference as I haven't tried it. Anecdotally I wouldn't feel satisfied on such low protein as I find it more filling that just pure carbs. Regarding my macro's I would say I'm having between 170 and 250 grams per day. I do not notice a difference between body composition between the two, but I may feel less hungry.

It would be an interesting experiment to see if your muscles would just disintegrate if you dropped to 75 grams of Protein a day for an extended period. My guess is that it would have minimal affect or much less affect than we tend to think.

I know a few friends of mine think they absolutely won't grow or even maintain their muscle unless they are taking in that magical 2 x their body weight in grams of protein. Some even take in close to 3x. Seems like a big waste of protein powder in my opinion.

Yeah but is this because they're having more protein or more calories? Not maintaining your bodyweight I would believe cause you to not grow.

It would be an interesting experiment to see see what would happen if he dropped his protein intake to around 70 to 100 grams or so a day. Personally, I would think it wouldn't have a negative effect on his physique to maintaining or bulking on that amount (as that's what I've been doing for the past 2 years). It would be an even more interesting experiment to seeing him cut after his little bulk (let's say from a low BF starting point of 9-10% to a shredded 5-6%) on a low protein range of 70-100grams, with caloric intake taking priority. It would very intriguing to see if you would be able to reach the same conditioning and size..albeit a vastly lower protein intake.

I would love to experiment with this but I don't know what effect it may have on my physique. I'm not willing to take the chance just yet considering I want to win a bigger title in a few years. Maybe in the future I can experiment more on this.

The protein in diet in not only there to maintain muscles guys. Try going on a low-protein diet during contest prep and you'll notice the differences in being satisfied with your food intake. Protein makes you feel fuller, as for me. I dropped protein to 150 grams and noticed that I'm not getting satisfied with the amount of protein in the diet, made me hungrier for carbs and fats which is bad being on restricted calories. Upped then to 225 and felt a difference.

Correct, I feel fuller on protein than I do on carbs.

[kobebryant8to24]

I would love to experiment with this but I don't know what effect it may have on my physique. I'm not willing to take the chance just yet considering I want to win a bigger title in a few years. Maybe in the future I can experiment more on this.

Understandable. From June2012-August 2012 I was able to cut from about 220-198 on 70-120grams of protein..with strength increases and no visible muscle loss. I'm currently fluctuating from 202-204lbs and probably at about 18% if I were to guess (current avi) but don't really care. I'm looking to get down to low 180s and about 9-10%bf the same way I did 2.5 years ago but on a much lower protein intake. I was logging it in the nutr log sec, but it didn't garner enough attention so I opted out. But I'm still slowly but surely cutting down to the low 180s (and beyond).

[jpfaherty]

This thread is fun! Lots of interesting things/ideas being tossed around

I'm still here lurking bro!

[bunnybuilder]

I'm with you Devils...totally agree on the satiety of protein and that dipping it THAT low would not be optimal. I'm the same way in that I love meat and typically end up eating a lot of protein each day regardless.

However I do think a lot of people are too worried about that 1.5- 2 grams per lb of body weight rule. Like if you weight 170 and take in 175-200 grams of protein you are in danger of not getting enough. I know guys at my gym that drink four 50 gram protein shakes a day on top of meals that comprise an additional 200 plus grams of protein a day. To me that is just excessive....unless they have stock in the whey company.

[Devils]

I'm with you Devils...totally agree on the satiety of protein and that dipping it THAT low would not be optimal. I'm the same way in that I love meat and typically end up eating a lot of protein each day regardless.

However I do think a lot of people are too worried about that 1.5- 2 grams per lb of body weight rule. Like if you weight 170 and take in 175-200 grams of protein you are in danger of not getting enough. I know guys at my gym that drink four 50 gram protein shakes a day on top of meals that comprise an additional 200 plus grams of protein a day. To me that is just excessive....unless they have stock in the whey company.

Yes, I actually think 0.8x would be just fine for most people, because even at 170 lbs your lean body mass would be much lower so again you don't need the increased protein for that.

I usually get my protein cheap per kilo, cheaper than meat sometimes, so I supplement my intake with it in order to save some money there. But I guess cutting it out wouldn't do much harm.

[bunnybuilder]

Yes, I actually think 0.8x would be just fine for most people, because even at 170 lbs your lean body mass would be much lower so again you don't need the increased protein for that.

I usually get my protein cheap per kilo, cheaper than meat sometimes, so I supplement my intake with it in order to save some money there. But I guess cutting it out wouldn't do much harm.

agreed.

and I do the same...I'm not saying shakes are a bad thing. I drink a couple most days....I just don't see the need to drink 3 or 4 double serving shakes a day so you can hit 2 x bodyweight in protein.

[lukamura]

agreed.

and I do the same...I'm not saying shakes are a bad thing. I drink a couple most days....I just don't see the need to drink 3 or 4 double serving shakes a day so you can hit 2 x bodyweight in protein.

2 x body-weight in pounds is excessive as hell, 2 x body-weight in kilos is what I'd use for most folks on a slow bulk.

[Devils]

Just benched 112.5 x 7 and 115 x 6, no spotter. New PR!!

[nvs180]

Just benched 112.5 x 7 and 115 x 6, no spotter. New PR!!

Awesome work man, less then a month to add 5kg to your bench. Your routine and diet are definitely working for you!

[The Solution]

Just benched 112.5 x 7 and 115 x 6, no spotter. New PR!!

Huge congrats Matey, clear your PM's. Tried to PM you and you were full.

[Devils]

Awesome work man, less then a month to add 5kg to your bench. Your routine and diet are definitely working for you!

Thanks, yeah I feel I'm in new territory now moving forward, next stop 120 for 6

Huge congrats Matey, clear your PM's. Tried to PM you and you were full.

Sorry, cleared it now!

[jpfaherty]

Just benched 112.5 x 7 and 115 x 6, no spotter. New PR!!

Simply demolishing PR's on this reverse. Very impressive. Well done.

[chickeneater]

So that's 250 something for 6? That's beastly! For comparison that's exactly what I did 5 years ago, but my waist was 40 inches and I weighed about 235. So you have a lot to be proud of!

I had to neg you for using kg, sorry, Americans don't realize there's other countries and ways of doing things and I have to be lockstep


I'm continuing to learn with your thread, thanks for keeping it going.