Kai is wider, Phil is thicker. This isn't new.

[golfpunk1985]

Why? Did the grapefruit incident influence judges and influence others' careers?

Good point.

[Jeddore]

Why? Did the grapefruit incident influence judges and influence others' careers?

uh.. yeah?

[Safin]

uh.. yeah?

Well you sound intelligent!

Care to explain...uh..how?

[Rocky-Balboa]

1. Phil is thicker
2. Phil wins the side shots...Ripped obliques and no protruding belly whatsoever
3. Phil has a thinner waist and bigger quads hence I prefer his ab and thigh

1. He is thicker because he is more narrow. People with short clavicles have less room for their chest to spread out, so instead it thickens quicker. Same thing for back. All the narrower bodybuilders i know are significantly thicker then the wider one's. This isn't something that should be praised. When you have both (Such as Coleman or Cutler), then it is impressive. Kai is wider, Phil is thicker..therefore neither has an advantage in these 2 criteria. Phil's thickness shines from the side whereas Kai's width from the back and front. It somewhat evens itself out. Though not having the thickness of Phil isn't really a flaw and can be fixed with time and contest prep, though a structure can't be changed.


2. Phil wins probably the side tricep. In no way imaginable does he win the side chest. This is probably Kai's best pose and even the Olympia judges gave this pose to Kai.


3. Phil doesn't have bigger quads when flex. He has big inner thighs which give the illusion of big quads. If he hit poses like Kai and everyone else, instead of bending his legs, you will see his quads aren't bigger. They have great shape and sweep from the side, but not the front. Phil has little or no visible quad striations and narrow lats in this pose. Apart from a tighter waist, everything else goes to Kai.

Just my un-biased opinion.

[featureless]

Now that we have seen them at 100% (so I am not talking about any direct comparsion from the olympia or the sheru, rather, when I thought kai was 100% vs when I thought Phil was 100%) this is how I see the comparison stacking up:

Front Relaxed: Kai - could go either way. Both hit the pose completely different so it is just a matter of opinion. I'm not one for sitting on the fence so I must pick one. Phil hunches up more, kai spreads right out. The end result, phil looks more detailed, defined, muscular. Kai displays more taper, width, overall size. Both are equal on conditioning and symmetry. Because this is a symmetry round, not muscularity, I give Kai the nod placing more emphasis on taper and size than musclarity and definition.

Side Relaxed: Phil - Phil looks sharper, tighter in the right areas, and more polished. His delt, bi, tri, chest separation is too good. He gives up very little, if anything, in the lower body.

Rear Relaxed: Kai - Kai is wider, his lats thicker. Phil has better upper body separation and trap thickness. Phil wins glutes, but Kai takes hammies and calves. Very close and could go either way but my eyes are drawn more to the lat width and thickness of kai (phil looks a tad narrow by comparison) as opposed to Phil's separation and trap thickness.

FLS: Kai - imo this is the closest comparsion shot. Absolutely nothing in it. Just a matter of opinion. Phils arms and delts clearly trump kais but at the same time leave his chest looking a touch lacking. His quad flare is incredible but this throws off his calves a tad and a little more shoulder width would balance his quads out a little better. His detail is unsurpassed and small joints make his muscle bellies pop. Kai's lat flare is perfect for his quad sweep which inturn matches his calves. Kai is wider but less detailed and less separated. Overall, i just think kai is a little better balanced top to bottom in this shot. Trap size is not really a issue in this shot.

FDB - Kai: Phil just looks awkward in this shot. Almost like he struggles to spread out his upper body (cramped up if you like). He needs more lat flare to balance everything out. Kai on the other hand looks so natural when hitting this shot. With his improved waist, wide shoulders, beautiful biceps peaks, thicker lats, thicker, wider, low hanging chest he looks amazing in this shot. Phil almost takes the shot due to his tight waist and joints but my eyes are just drawn to kai in this pose and how effortlessly he hits it.

A&T - Kai: Phil needs more shoulder and lat width. If he could do this, there is no way kai could beat him in this shot due to phil's superior detail, tight waist and excellent quad sweep. Kai's low inserting, wide and thick lats balance out his quad sweep perfectly and his waist is tight enough to give him the edge. Kai looks more balanced period.

Side Tri - Phil: An easy win for Phil. Phil's structural flaws are not evident in the side shots. His muscle separation and detail is too good for kai. He gives up very little ground (if any) in the lower body. His waist is tighter and quite honestly, this is just a beautiful shot for phil.

Side Chest - Kai: I think this shot is closer than most give it credit. Phil very nearly matches kai in this shot, top to bottom, but when all is said and done, Kai's lower body can't be beat and his upper body very nealry matches his lower, which is a feat in itself.

Rear Lat Spread - Kai: How do you separate the two in this shot? Kai's lat thickness and width versus Phil's trap thickness, detail and balance. Kai's hammies and calves versus Phil's glutes. I honestly can't decide so I let my personal opinion make the decision and therefore give kai the edge because I want to see wings that could fly away.

RDB - Kai: This was the most surprising matchup for me. On paper I would have thought phil had this shot, but in reality I saw it as all Kai. Kai's lats looked thicker when both pulled their elbows back and squeezed their shoulder blades together in preparation for the shot. And I could not take my eyes off Kai's feathered lower lats. When they hit the shot, phil looked thicker but then kai squeezed further, and further, and suddenly phil was left in his wake. Somehow kai found more detail than phil and his width was superior. Phil's appeared a little more balanced head to toe but imo was beat on muscularity in this pose.

MM - Phil: Not even close, Phil's hands clasped most muscular is the most captivating shot in bodybuilding today. After witnessing it, I can honestly say that I am a Phil fan now, just breath-taking. The small joints and full, round muscle bellies and excellent proportions elevate phil into a league of his own in this shot.

Overall, Phil is the best bodybuilder on the planet for a reason. He is able to put it all together better than kai when it matters. When it came to most of the comparison rounds phil was closer to 100% than Kai imo. He also gained a slight edge by being more agressive and standing in front of kai. Overall, phil looks like he is more genetically gifted. He just presents as the better bodybuilder to me but the comparsons don't lie and I think Kai's best is good enough to take a majority of the poses. Well, that is just how I see it all.

[TTimmerman]

^^ both on recharge

[Hardbody316]

kais lack of trap thickness is so distracting from his back relaxed and lat spread shot..

[x-trainer ben]

Until this year i never really understood Hany's comment about Phils *3D* muscles, and i see it now in the comparisons to Kai. Kai looks great but that 3D wins it for Phil every time.

[Bobby1291]

Kai....Mother of....

[socalifas805]

Idk Kai's back looked a bit better than Phil in some of those pics, Phil is taller and thicker tho

[rocco421]

phil looked amazing but he really does need to keep an eye out on that left/right imbalance, esp this early in his career

[notKuRdiSH]

man phil's left side is WAAAY bigger than his right. It's everything too not just his arm.

[AnarkyLost]

Also why do Phil fanboys keep saying his back is thicker? Traps sure but the whole back no....and last I checked your whole back wasn't just traps. Kai's lats are clearly thicker.

[alan aragon]

Seriously, the Kai bandwagonists are some of the funniest I've seen for a while. Yes he looks great, but come on bros.

I've never been a Kai bandwagonist. Sure, I've wanted to see Kai win because I like his humble personality, but I've always thought that Heath was the better bodybuilder -- until this year's Olympia, & even more so from the Sheru shots. Kai's waist reduction & better conditioning allowed his other freaky bodyparts to overpower Phil's insane triceps, shoulders, & traps. Kai has Phil on lats, quads, hams, calves, biceps, & abs. I wouldn't say that Phil's chest is more impressive than Kai's because structurally it comes off as very vertical/narrow. This isn't to say that Kai is way better than Phil by any means. It's super-close between them, but comparing bodyparts top to bottom (& mandatories), Kai edges Phil out.

[flangmasterj]

Also why do Phil fanboys keep saying his back is thicker? Traps sure but the whole back no....and last I checked your whole back wasn't just traps. Kai's lats are clearly thicker.

You could just say fans.

[ZBlacktt]

Kai....Mother of....

Along with Roelly's rear delts.

[tsiparlanaeht]

I've never been a Kai bandwagonist. Sure, I've wanted to see Kai win because I like his humble personality, but I've always thought that Heath was the better bodybuilder -- until this year's Olympia, & even more so from the Sheru shots. Kai's waist reduction & better conditioning allowed his other freaky bodyparts to overpower Phil's insane triceps, shoulders, & traps. Kai has Phil on lats, quads, hams, calves, biceps, & abs. I wouldn't say that Phil's chest is more impressive than Kai's because structurally it comes off as very vertical/narrow. This isn't to say that Kai is way better than Phil by any means. It's super-close between them, but comparing bodyparts top to bottom (& mandatories), Kai edges Phil out.

You've never heard of golfpunk then, he is the original kai bandwagonist king. Might want to look at his history, Kai beating Ronnie and all lol.

[Gorky88]

You've never heard of golfpunk then, he is the original kai bandwagonist king. Might want to look at his history, Kai beating Ronnie and all lol.

Kai is the goat according to him as of like 2010

[boyoboyo]

Also why do Phil fanboys keep saying his back is thicker? Traps sure but the whole back no....and last I checked your whole back wasn't just traps. Kai's lats are clearly thicker.

agreed.

But man they both look sick there...and some of you think jay can come back and hang with these two? lol

[FAN0FdaSport]

agreed.

But man they both look sick there...and some of you think jay can come back and hang with these two? lol

yeah i dont get that

[purdey]

Kai looks better in all the OPs pics, And kais waist is accually smaller in relation to his lat with than phils in the ab thigh.

[Kiwi_]

Yeah, never thought i'd see the day where Kai's waist is styling on Phil's.

[SquinkysGhost]

Until this year i never really understood Hany's comment about Phils *3D* muscles, and i see it now in the comparisons to Kai. Kai looks great but that 3D wins it for Phil every time.

So you listened to some schmoe who pulled a term out of his ass and you let it affect your judgement.

[flangmasterj]

So you listened to some schmoe who pulled a term out of his ass and you let it affect your judgement.

Why are you so upset?

[guatoncabron]

Prime jay would smoke both of those guys, let alone prime ronnie.

Phil and Kai have obviously great phisiques but also alot of flaws overall... muscle maturity, negative body size compared to arms (more the case of phil) and kai has obviously a big disproportion with undersized traps compared his delts and overall shoulder width. Ronnie and Jay on their primes had it all, insane muscle size, proportions, big definition, only ronnie had the little adventage because he looked more proportioned than jay because of his height( a couple if inches above jay) and it made him a better flow between his upper and lower body (waist in proportion) compared to jay who always appeared a bit more blocky.

[JM3K]

Prime jay would smoke both of those guys, let alone prime ronnie.

Phil and Kai have obviously great phisiques but also alot of flaws overall... muscle maturity, negative body size compared to arms (more the case of phil) and kai has obviously a big disproportion with undersized traps compared his delts and overall shoulder width. Ronnie and Jay on their primes had it all, insane muscle size, proportions, big definition, only ronnie had the little adventage because he looked more proportioned than jay because of his height( a couple if inches above jay) and it made him a better flow between his upper and lower body (waist in proportion) compared to jay who always appeared a bit more blocky.

Ronnie only had little advantage over jay because he was taller ? Ok and the pounds of muscle and better conditioning ?

[d16daily]

Yeah, never thought i'd see the day where Kai's waist is styling on Phil's.

[Kiwi_]

A failed gif..

What it is with you and failure d16daily?

[SquinkysGhost]

Why are you so upset?

Keep on topic or I will report you.

[Achillesthetics]

Phil is just more aesthetic. Yep I went there.

aesthetic

Just said it again.

:P


In all seriousness though, Kai is freakin good, but Phil just has better genetics. 100% Phil will always beat 100% Kai imo. Totally agree with Coal.