So the goal is to accumulate 50 reps total. I did it in two ways and I got some strange perresults.
The first way:
Start a timer and just chip away at the pull-ups til you reach 50. My max reps is 7 so I started w/4 reps, rested 10 is seconds, did two more, rested a min, did 3 more, etc etc.
The second way (two days later):
Do sets and timed rest breaks of 2-3 min. I started of with 7, then 6, 5, 4, 4, etc for a total of 11 sets.
So the first way, I finished in about 20 min but the second method took me 32 minutes.
Which way is better for hypertrophy?
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Thread: Arnold’s 50 Pull-up program
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05-09-2024, 06:15 PM #1
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Arnold’s 50 Pull-up program
Sept of Baelor was an inside job. Wildfire can't melt stone masonry.
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05-09-2024, 06:56 PM #2
They are both the same for hypertrophy, but if you continue to just do 50reps your body will adapt and stop growing.
Now, you need to do 55reps for hypertrophy and continue on.
Read my science thread, science is not important here, just aim to do more reps or sets or add weight.Autenic Kights Sing Hevy Stel and Hav Hands and Wriss of Steel!
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05-09-2024, 08:09 PM #3
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Actually you’ll like the program when I tell you more about it. The goal is do the 50 in fewer sets (or less time) as you progress. And once you can do a set of 12, you start the process over again but with weight!
These 50 pull-ups and heavy snatch pulls from the floor will be my only 2 back movements but I’ll be doing it 2 to 3x a week. I’m excited to see how this will turn out after I drop 10 more pounds of fat and then start upping my calories for teh gainzzzSept of Baelor was an inside job. Wildfire can't melt stone masonry.
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05-10-2024, 12:32 AM #4
I was just thinking about working on my pull-ups numbers when I came here, so interesting reading..
Like lww mentions, both approaches are pretty similar and slow progression will drive hypertrophy, but to answer your question the method that causes the more stress (7-6-5-4-4 etc) is going to give more stimulation. The initial inflation and stress is one (of many) stimulae for hypertrophy so the shorter time method will stimulate more. BUT .. you might find that it's harder to keep progressing over time. If the method is too hard, playing the long game might be more difficult to achieve so it might be better to go for the one that is slightly easier despite the inflammation theory. Basically it's a big compromise.
Consistency trumps (mine or anyone's) bro theory. Since Arnold has more experience biceps training than all of us put together, why not just follow his method to the letter, and do that consistently for 12 months. By that point you'll be the expert on how to train your arms and you tell us!
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05-10-2024, 06:51 AM #5
Yeah, and if you continue to add reps, or add sets, or add weight to that in any fashion combo etc, you should see faster pace on your 50rep set when tested. And yes doing the 50 reps faster will net hypertrophy, faster and that can include TUT partial reps, as you know those are advanced bbing growth techniques.Autenic Kights Sing Hevy Stel and Hav Hands and Wriss of Steel!
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05-10-2024, 07:38 AM #6
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Look up Charles Staley's Escalated Density Training where basically if you progress to where you're doing the same amount of work in less time, then that's progress. As such, my thoughts are doing these in less time are better for hypertrophy. This is not too unlike Rest Pause either where if you consider only the final few reps in a regular set get maximal fiber recruitment, doing them rest pause means that you get MORE REPS with maximal fiber recruitment which means more hypertrophy.
Pull-Up PR: https://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=177233951
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05-10-2024, 05:35 PM #7
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This is similar to a Gironda routine, increasing intensity by increasing density (more work, less time).
The only thing I will say on this is a lot of people run into MAPS (middle age pull up syndrome). Especially as you start trying to get those times down and your form starts going a bit. I'm 34 and ran a similar program and my elbow started to get a little wonky until I started mixing grips. One set I would do pull ups, the next chin ups, and the next hammer grip. I also never did high reps, I just did sets of 5 but less rest which helped me reset and not get to the point of form breakdown. Also, I found this to be great AFTER my OH press work... starting my workout with this protocol also seems to be a problem for my elbow.
Hope that helps!https://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=180003183&p=1635918623#post1635918623
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"225, 315, 405 whatever. Yeah these benchmark digits come to mean a lot to us, the few warriors in this arena. They are, however, just numbers. I'm guilty of that sh*t too, waiting for somebody to powder my nuts cuz I did 20 reps of whatever the **** on the bench. Big f*king deal. It is all relative." G Diesel
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05-11-2024, 08:01 AM #8
Since these are pull-ups, as you gain hypertrophy eg muscle growth you are going to get bigger, this may also affect your pull-up performance, but will still be hypertrophy.
Are you training your lower body?
I can’t imagine Arnold at 250 when he was the Oak doing more pull-ups faster than when he was smaller as a muscled teen.
If you have chicken legs, then sure. There is a guy on YouTube who has an amazing back from nothing but pull-ups 10sets of 10 doing every combo. Zero leg work, sticks, hugely disproportionated.Autenic Kights Sing Hevy Stel and Hav Hands and Wriss of Steel!
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05-18-2024, 01:58 PM #9
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You know, I never thought to think that tendon/ligament/etc inflammation might be a trigger for muscle growth but it totally makes sense now that you mention it!
But yeah, you’re right. I decided to just do it in sets as Rx’d (for the same reason you pointed out.. Arnold aint wrong about this stuff). And that was to do fewer and fewer sets until you get to 12 on your first set. At which point you add weight and start over again.
So it’s going really well. I’ve done this 4 times so far (2-3x/week). Here are screen shots of the first and last. I started at 11 sets and I’m at 9 now. 2-3 min rest between sets.
[image]https://imgur.com/H6fuh2S[/image]
Maybe I should post beginning back pics and make this a log of sorts. The only other thing I do for back is heavy snatch pulls (imagine an explosive snatch grip deadlift into navel to chest height upright row) but I have back/pull days 2 to 3 times a week. But I’ve been doing those consistently for at least a few years and have only just now started doing pull-ups again due to tendinitis getting better. So w/just one other back exercise in the mix, I think back progress would be a good indicator of this program’s effectiveness (or rather my execution of it since, as stated before, Arnold aint wrong about this stuff)Sept of Baelor was an inside job. Wildfire can't melt stone masonry.
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05-18-2024, 05:51 PM #10
Negatives are a tool most often overlooked when trying to increase the pull up game.
Good luck Keltron.𝓐𝓲𝓻 𝓕𝓸𝓻𝓬𝓮 𝓥𝓮𝓽𝓮𝓻𝓪𝓷 1976 - 1999 - 𝓒𝓪𝓷𝓷𝓪𝓫𝓲𝓼 𝓔𝓷𝓽𝓱𝓾𝓼𝓲𝓪𝓼𝓽 𝓼𝓲𝓷𝓬𝓮 𝓽𝓱𝓮 1960'𝓼
ᖇᗴ丅Ꭵᖇᗴᗪ ᗩ丅 40 ᑕᖇᗴᗯ - ᔕᗝᑕᎥᗩᒪ ᗪᎥᔕ丅ᗩᑎᑕᎥᑎǤ ᗴ᙭ᑭᗴᖇ丅 - ᒪᎥᐯᎥᑎǤ 丅ᕼᗴ ᗪᖇᗴᗩᗰ
ƚo| ɒ ꙅɿɘʞʞuꟻ bᴎɒ ɿɘʞʞuꟻ ꙅᴎuoᴎoɿq ɿɘbᴎɘǫ ɘʜƚ ɘꙅu I
𝕀 𝕕𝕠𝕟'𝕥 𝕒𝕝𝕨𝕒𝕪𝕤 𝕒𝕘𝕣𝕖𝕖 𝕨𝕚𝕥𝕙 𝕥𝕙𝕖 𝕞𝕖𝕞𝕖𝕤 𝕀 𝕡𝕠𝕤𝕥
🄸 🅃🄴🄻🄻 🄸🅃 🄻🄸🄺🄴 🄸🅃 🄸🅂, 🄸🄵 🅈🄾🅄 🅆🄰🄽🅃 🅂🄼🄾🄺🄴 🄱🄻🄾🅆🄽 🅄🄿 🅈🄾🅄🅁 🄰🅂🅂 🄾🅁 🅂🄾🄼🄴🅃🄷🄸🄽🄶 🅂🅄🄶🄰🅁 🄲🄾🄰🅃🄴🄳. 🄸 🅂🅄🄶🄶🄴🅂🅃 🅈🄾🅄 🄶🄴🅃 🄰 🄷🄾🄾🄺🄴🅁 🄰🄽🄳 🄰 🄿🄾🅆🄳🄴🅁🄴🄳 🄳🄾🄽🅄🅃
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05-19-2024, 05:07 PM #11
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I don't understand pullup programs. They are highly influenced by variations of body weight. Drop couple pounds, and you will get massive increase in performance, while there will be not much tied to actual muscle growth. OP are you in jail or ocean-going ship? Seated cable pull is essentially same move, where you can control the weight, and have it in most desirable rep range.
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05-19-2024, 05:10 PM #12
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05-20-2024, 06:30 AM #13
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05-20-2024, 11:19 AM #14
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05-21-2024, 10:01 PM #15
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great input so far from everyone.
So my screen shot didn’t work so I’ll just manually type it out my progress. The first workout was done by chipping away at 50 total reps and time myself. I did it in 19:52 on 5/6 and w/an underhand/chinup grip.
Thurs 5/9 (underhand grip)
11 sets (7,6,5,4,4,4,5,5,4,2)
Sat 5/11 -underhand
10 sets (7-7-6-6-6-6-5-4-3)
5/14 - underhand
9 sets (7-7-5-5-6-5-5-5-5)
5/16 - neutral grip
9 sets (5-5-5-5-5-3-5-5-4)
5/18 - underhand
9 sets (7-7-6-6-6-65-4-3)
i should also mention that I’ve been at 1600-1700 calories on most days.
My cut is going well and I want to drop another 10ish lbs before I start adding calories to build muscle which should be around end of june. I’m kind of wondering if I should save all this frequency and hard work grinding reps for when I’m in a surplus…Sept of Baelor was an inside job. Wildfire can't melt stone masonry.
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05-22-2024, 02:32 PM #16
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5/22 - underhand
10 sets, 7-6-5-5-5-5-5-5-5-2
Diet has been dialed in lately w/almost everything home cooked. However this past weekend I did have some processed stuff and had pho noodles twice which is packed w/sodium and it’s really true what they say. Pull-ups are VERY sensitive small daily shifts in weight.
I like that it was tougher though. It makes me less likely to have processed/high sodium food if I can directly correlate bad performance/slowed progress towards a goal with those foods.
But as far as hypertrophy, I’m not expecting much until the end of june when I end my cut.Sept of Baelor was an inside job. Wildfire can't melt stone masonry.
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05-24-2024, 08:00 AM #17
Wouldn’t all the volume help your 10# weight loss goal ? I would think it could get you there a bit quicker?
I’m against your mindset here, but you gotta do you.
If you stopped all the volume, would you still do like some weighted pull-ups and negatives while cutting? I personally would go that route if me.Autenic Kights Sing Hevy Stel and Hav Hands and Wriss of Steel!
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05-25-2024, 04:17 PM #18
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Well i’d love to continue what I’m doing w/the high volume, so im looking for a good reason keep it up. I was just wondering if all this effort im putting in (whether it’s w/high volume programs like this, OHPing 5x3-7 three times a week, high volume lateral and rear raises) is being “wasted” because there are no calories to build any muscle.
Im pretty sure all the volume/intensity/etc is helping KEEP the muscle (1650 calories/day) but Im wondering if i could retain the same kind of muscle w/o all the volume.
(and as far as how i’d scale things back, w/the pull-ups I’d probably just do it once/week instead of two to three… or keep the frequency and just do 25 or 30 total reps instead of 50.
Or even do weighted 10x3, 10x2 or weighted singles on the top of every minute for like 20 minSept of Baelor was an inside job. Wildfire can't melt stone masonry.
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