The Unforgiving Minute [Middle Distance Log]

[shesprints]

Whoa. Okay, so it's been a million years.

Has it been a million years? A lot's happened--I got a new job (very good, but very busy). Two of my grandparents died. (I have only one left now). My brother moved back to NYC so I'm insanely workout-competitive with him. The Tough Mudder was great fun, but training for it rather put me off distance running (and I hate distance running in winter. Because cold-induced asthma and bronchitis always happens.)

SO.

OKAY!

GUYS.

So I've done some thinking, and I'm really f*cking tired of cardio. My brother just moved back to the city and he's getting very swole doing a P/P/L routine. Being the competitive person I am, I've also begun doing a P/P/L routine. I quite like it so far. (I'm also running before I lift, but a moderate amount--like 2 miles--we'll see where that takes me, I may increase. I just had the flu, so my aerobic's shot).

Basically I just really need to shake things up. I want to actually train for some upper body strength. Actually be able to do a decent number of pushups.

Tips are appreciated. Anyone else doing P/P/L? I just felt like I was stagnating on full-body days--getting too wiped out after each individual session.

[HARRYBEAST]

What is ppl?

[VO2Maxima]

Whoa, she lives!

I did a PPL for a while. Then moved to U/L. Now about to try a super high-frequency but lower volume squat/bench/deadlift every day thing, see how that goes. What's the program look like?

Sorry to hear about your grandparents. Fun stuff with your brother though, always nice to have someone to push you.

[muruku]

Welcome back!

What is ppl?

PUSH PULL LEGS

[HARRYBEAST]

Welcome back!


PUSH PULL LEGS

Thanks for making me aware

In that case I approve. I do Squat,Press,Deadlift,Press

[shesprints]

Thanks, guys!

So, here is the program my little brother's following, as written:

Legs & Abs:
1 mile run @ medium pace

Leg Press
Squats
Deadlift
Calf raises
Lower back raises
Ab ripper (all exercises, 20 reps)

Chest, Shoulders, & Triceps
2 mile run @ medium pace

Flat bench
Military Press
Incline/decline bench (switch off, sometimes do before military)
Pull downs
Skull Crushers or close grip bench
Front Raises (actually do before skull crushers)

Back and Biceps
1 mile run @ fast pace

Pull ups
T-bar rows
Rows
Curls
Shrugs
Isolation curls



I am not doing exactly the same thing... partly because I can't do pullups in any meaningful amount. So here's what I did this week. Note that Monday and Tuesday I had the flu and thus no cardio--also the weight I'm using is light because sick.


Mon

Improved push day

bench press: 45lb x 15, 65lb x 10, 75lb x 8 x 3, 65lb x 10
tricep cable pushdown 20lb x 10 x 5
OHP 17.5lb x 8 x 4, 15lb x 10
cable flyes 20lb x 10 x 4
lateral raise 5lb x 10 x 4
front raise 5lb x 10 x 4
plank x :30?ish

Tues

pull day

Underhand rows bar x bunch, 65lb x 10 x 5
lat pulldowns wide grip 70lb x 10 x 5
lat pushdowns 40lb x 20, 50lb x 10, 60lb x 10 x 3
seated row 55lb x 10 x 5
single-arm bent over row 26lb x 10 x 5 each side
bicep curls 12lb x 10 x 5

Wed

still-sick-and-tired leg day

2 mile run on treadmill including some accelerations up to 12.3 mph and 2 incline (about 100m each time, just to sprint a little bit on leg day, was coughing a lot though); also a random 40 seconds at 6:40 pace idk why

Squats 65lb x 8 x 5
Deadlifts 90lb x 8 x 5
Leg press 90lb x 15 x 4

Thurs

Ran 2 miles easy

bench press: 45lb x 20, 65lb x 8 x 5
tricep cable pushdown 20lb x 8 x 5
OHP 17.5lb x 8 x 4, 15lb x 12, 6
cable flyes 20lb x 10 x 5
lateral raise 5lb x 8 x 5
front raise 5lb x 8 x 5

Fri

Ran 2 miles easy warmup (slow, coughing, 9:25 pace)

Underhand rows bar x 15, 65lb x 8 x 5
lat pulldowns med grip 70lb x 8 x 5
Renegade Row 12lb each hand
seated row 45lb x 10 x 2, 50lb x 10, 55lb x 10, 60lb x 10
band pullaparts x 12 x 4


Note: left calf/ankle/foot are on FIRE asdfkjkljklkj






Soooo I am kinda improvising? I'm doing sprints on my leg day--that's always worked well. I should add calf raises to leg day and abs SOMEWHERE. Bah abs. I hate abs.

I'm also having trouble finding triceps exercises. I have tennis elbow in my left arm and skullcrushers really hurt. I was thinking close-grip bench for tris? IDK. My darn elbow just gives out.

[VO2Maxima]

Looks solid. I like that you moved squats and DL before leg press...seems weird to put that before the compounds in the original program.

Triceps...hmm. Honestly, I just bench and military press and that hits triceps pretty freaking hard as far as I'm concerned lol. If you wanted other stuff, CGBP, JM press, Tate press...those are all good. Just make sure you balance them with pull since they're all pressing exercises that will still use anterior delts, rotator cuff, pecs, etc as accessory.

[shesprints]

Thanks, V02! That's pretty helpful--I trust you about this stuff more than I trust my brother. :P

Note about last two workouts--sadly I still feel under the weather (flu is awful) and still kind of achy/coughing, so workouts are kind of laaame. I get out of breath running so easily! My cough just won't fade away entirely. Nonetheless, slogging through. Also super busy w/ work so workouts have sometimes had to be short. Blah.

Saturday

(rest day, tons of work)

Sunday

3 miles treadmill run w/ 2 x 200m @ 6:40 pace, 4 x 100m @ 5:00 pace/2.0 incline just to get some speed in my legs

Leg day

Hip thrusts x 15 x 3, hip thrusts one-legged x 10 x 3 each side
band clamshells seated x 15 x 3
squats bar x 15, 65lb x 8, 75lb x 8 x 4
deadlifts bar x 15, 90lb x 10, 110lb x 10, 140lb x 8 x 3
single leg calf raise x 10 x 4 each side


Monday (today)

2 miles run easy

CGBP bar x 15, 65lb x 8 x 5
single arm tricep pushdown 10lb x 12 each side, 20lb x 10 each side x 2, 25lb x 10 each side x 3
OHP 15lb x 15, 17.5lb x 8 x 4, 20lb x 5 x 2
shrugs 25lb x 12 x 4
bent over DB flye 7.5lb x 12 x 4


Tomorrow's 'pull' day. We'll see. I may do that and then try a swim. Just to stretch out. My calves are tight and I'm having awful plantar issues on the left side plus stiffness/soreness in left hip. I blame the flu, this appeared then, not even from working out.

[bbowsh54]

Thanks, V02! That's pretty helpful--I trust you about this stuff more than I trust my brother. :P

Note about last two workouts--sadly I still feel under the weather (flu is awful) and still kind of achy/coughing, so workouts are kind of laaame. I get out of breath running so easily! My cough just won't fade away entirely. Nonetheless, slogging through. Also super busy w/ work so workouts have sometimes had to be short. Blah.

Saturday

(rest day, tons of work)

Sunday

3 miles treadmill run w/ 2 x 200m @ 6:40 pace, 4 x 100m @ 5:00 pace/2.0 incline just to get some speed in my legs

Leg day

Hip thrusts x 15 x 3, hip thrusts one-legged x 10 x 3 each side
band clamshells seated x 15 x 3
squats bar x 15, 65lb x 8, 75lb x 8 x 4
deadlifts bar x 15, 90lb x 10, 110lb x 10, 140lb x 8 x 3
single leg calf raise x 10 x 4 each side


Monday (today)

2 miles run easy

CGBP bar x 15, 65lb x 8 x 5
single arm tricep pushdown 10lb x 12 each side, 20lb x 10 each side x 2, 25lb x 10 each side x 3
OHP 15lb x 15, 17.5lb x 8 x 4, 20lb x 5 x 2
shrugs 25lb x 12 x 4
bent over DB flye 7.5lb x 12 x 4


Tomorrow's 'pull' day. We'll see. I may do that and then try a swim. Just to stretch out. My calves are tight and I'm having awful plantar issues on the left side plus stiffness/soreness in left hip. I blame the flu, this appeared then, not even from working out.

Awesome work!!

I hope you completely kick the flu symptoms soon...

I wish I had a competitive brother or sister living in the same town to add an extra push every day... That's nice! Great work in here!

[VO2Maxima]

"I'm sick and can't catch my breath and can only slog today so I will only run 5:00 pace on an incline" <--lol seriously?

I also see that you're planning on swimming. So after all that, where you couldn't wait to be able to run and not just swim again, you decide to shelve running, get swole, and go swimming for fun. No judgement here, of course, considering I did the same with running.

What are you doing with the bar on deads when you don't have plates? Just since it's a lot more flexibility to start in a good position with the bar sitting on the ground. Are you sitting it in a rack/on boxes? And for the 90 and 110 are you using bumper plates? Just curious.

[shesprints]

@bbshow thank you bro. I will check out your log, too, when I get a chance.

@V02 don't laugh at me, 100m at a time run at 5:00 pace is not that bad! I used to do that x 20 for a workout, so really doing just 4 of them is nothing don't hurt me COME ON you crazy person you used to run 10 mile repeats. That would legit kill me.

Do I seem like a terminal program-hopper here? I guess the thing about running is that it's just... I missed it when I didn't have it because I missed how it USED to be, before all the injuries--or maybe what I imagined it had been. Obviously, I never had a healthy relationship with the sport (first starving myself, then getting injury upon injury). I'm still thinking about it. It's also what my body can take, at this point--running just beats the heck out of me and I don't know a way around that.

Re: the (ridiculously embarrassingly light) deadlifts: yep. Bumper plates. When it's just the bar I basically just go a little deeper than I wound normally and don't let go of it, so it's like a warmup deficit deadlift? IDK.

I'm SO WEAK HELP. Like, I'm legit embarrassed to be lifting so little weight. But I haven't been consistent, plus I'm doing hypertrophy not strength now so I'm not in my upper % ranges for weight... still, I feel like a doofus.

[shesprints]

ANYWAY


Tuesday

Pull day + swim

T-bar row 35lb x 15, 45lb x 10, 55lb x 8 x 3, 45lb x 6
Underhand row bar x 15, 65lb x 10 x 2, 75lb x 10 x 3
Lat pulldown 55lb x 15, 70lb x 10 x 4
bicep curl 12lb x 10 x 4

Swim--1800 yards
500 w/u
6 x 50 on the 1:05
4 x 100 (50 stroke, 50 swim)
6 x 50 on 1:05 as 25 fast/25 EZ
2 x 100 on the 1:50 in 1:30, 1:32
2 x 50 c/d (with some double/triple arm drill)



Still NOT feeling 100%. Nauseated, kinda dizzy and coughing. BLAH LAME. But I felt better swimming. Cleared me out some. I didn't stay for the whole Master's practice, just did a mile-ish.

Ooh also my gym doesn't have a t-bar setup so I just turned a barbell sideways in the squat rack and balanced a plate on the back to hold it down; then loaded it up and put a pulley holder on it so I could pull using that.

[VO2Maxima]

10x10 miles at HALF MARATHON PACE! So a pace that you could sustain for 13 miles tapered, and you get 60 second breaks between repeats. It's nasty, but does not burn like 5:00 pace, which I don't know if I've run in my life. Like I think my mile PR was around 5:20, and I seriously thought I was sprinting the entire time.

Nah, don't think anyone is accusing you of being a terminal program-hopper. There are lots of people way, way worse with program hopping than you, and everyone has to do what keeps them motivated anyway. And surprise, training gets you results regardless of whether you stay on the same program or switch around. It's not like I stay on a program for forever either.

I'm honestly starting to wonder if there's less of a difference between "hypertrophy training" and "strength training" than people make it out to be, especially with so many people doing powerbuilding now.

[shesprints]

Vo2Maxima hahaha differences between sprinters and runners, so vast, so continually amusing. I mean I've been both, but clearly I'm not really cut out for distance running. I can just stand in awe and stare at the 10 x 1 mile at basically any speed. Re: program-hopping, I have at least committed to regular P/P/L for the winter--both strength-building and hypertrophy. I've never really focused on pure strength! I've always mostly just done lifting to complement other stuff, but for this winter I'm going to be an actual proper bb.com brolady. And lift. Even though I'm a bit ashamed to be so weak relative to Real Lifters.

Happy Thanksgiving!

(Turkey) Leg Day


Run--3 miles
with 4 x 1/4 mile at 6:40 pace thrown in to get legs moving but not intense sprints (ha)

Squats bar x 10, 65lb x 8, 75lb x 8, 85lb x 8, 95lb x 8, 6
Deadlift 90lb x 10, 110lb x 8, 140lb x 5 x 4
Back extensions 10lb x 10 x 3, 25lb x 8 x 2
Leg press 110lb x 15 x 4
side plank, side plank, plank 1:00 each


*probably both squats and deads were really speed squats/speed deads--focused on fast pull or fast out of the hole for squats, though slow lower down.

Throat FINALLY feels better, but still not 100%. I'm never 100% in winter. Hoping less cardio means less bronchitis. Also gonna alternate running and swimming days prob.

[shesprints]

Friday

bench was taken, so...

DB bench press 25lb x 12, 30lb x 8 x 5
pushups x 5 x 4
OHP 15lb x 10, 17.5lb x 8 x 3, 15lb x 10
lateral raise 6lb x 10, 10, 10, 8
front raise 6lb x 10, 10, 10, 8
single arm tricep pushdown 20lb x 12 x 4


+ incline walk at 3.8-4.0 mph, 10-12 incline, 30 minutes


My back hurts like a mofo. :/

[VO2Maxima]

Lol brolady. You're going to have to fight me and my chicken legs and unproportional top-heavy physique for that title though.

What did you do to your back? Hopefully it feels better soon.

[shesprints]

I don't know what I did to my back! Something always hurts. I think deadlift form may not be 100%. Better now, though, whew.

I'm not even going to try to contest you for brolady status. YOU CLEARLY WIN.
At least I still have my sprinter quads oh well. I'll work on... basically all other muscles. I'm thinking of hitting tris more often than planned. Mine are lame.

Saturday

Pull day
T-bar rows 35lb x 10 x 4, 45lb x 8 x 2
Underhand Rows bar x 15, 65lb x 10, 75lb x 10, 85lb x 8 x 3
reverse grip lat pulldowns 70lb x 10 x 4
bicep curls 12lb x 10 x 4
lat pushdown 30lb x 10 x 4 <---I like how that fries my core

+ 3 miles run easy


Sunday (today)

spin class--48:00, 15.7 'miles'
bunch of standing climbs, sprints, etc.

This is my cardio-only day. Was gonna swim but too lazy to get in bathing suit. Prob. swim tomorrow after I lift--there's Master's practice, which is motivating.


Did karaoke last night with a huge group of friends... I've had more of a 'life' lately, but it means less time for working out and less-than-ideal sleep. Hm.

[shesprints]

Monday


I... I just needed cardio and I needed to stretch out my aches and pains in the pool. My stupid left calf is still screwed up down through the foot--I think it's all related, like I have sciatica on that side translating down. Lame-o. So I swam today and hope to do leg day + sprints tomorrow if I feel better. Sometimes working the muscles actually helps.

Masters' Swim--2500 yards
550 w/u
12 x 25 on the :30 (18ish each)
3 x 250 as 100 fast/med, 50 ez, 100 fast/med
(100s in 1:34-1:37)
6 x 50 as 20 fast/30 EZ
3 x 200 pull

[VO2Maxima]

Working the muscle actually helps often. Feeling any better lately?

[dailob]

hi sam

new job so i lurk a lot and no time to really mess around the forums like i used to haha - but it was good to see this pop up in my CP, despite you having updated this a few weeks ago

only things i caught were that you hate cardio, got a new job yourself and now you're gonna become a brosephina for the winter lol

program hopping? yup, sounds like a lot of lifters out there

see you around and good to see you back again

[shesprints]

Hi V02 and dailob!

Dailob, I think program-hopping is my new exercise of choice. My calves are going to show mad gains from all this hopping.

SO:

1. I think my sudden hatred for cardio stemmed from a really slow-recovering episode of the flu. This made cardio difficult and sucky. I'm recovered now and kind of into cardio again.

2. PPL didn't wind up feeling like the right fit for me. The workouts felt too long and just too complicated. Maybe it's that I'm busier in general, but I think I prefer a simpler full-body program. I'm still pondering. In the meantime, here's what I'm doing now:

3 x per week lifting (full body--squats or front squats, deadlifts or rack pulls, assisted chinups/rows/pushups/something for upper body, some form of core move)
plus 30 min elliptical on the days I lift

and 3 x per week swimming, about 2200-2400 yards (40ish minutes)

This is going pretty well for me. The swimming lets me recover from the lifting and I'm getting in some good volume. Right now I'm working in the 6-12 rep range and trying to get my squat and deadlift numbers up to something respectable. I've ripped some calluses off my hands doing so many deadlifts--I aim for 40-50 total reps of each exercise split into sets--but other than worrying about that changing my grip, I'm not concerned.

Notice the lack of running? Yeah. Running... strongly correlated with intense back pain for me right now, and I'm just not feeling it. It's amazingly easier to hit a high heart rate on the elliptical and still have the energy and wherewithal to lift. I don't intend to quit running forever, but... maybe I'll recommence in the spring or summer when my body is stronger, better-balanced, and leaner--those should all equip me better to run.

For me, running is not something to take for granted. It's an activity I have to earn by getting my body into pretty good shape--partly because when I run, I intend to run fast and with proper form. I have to upgrade the engine before I can manage that. I hope what I'm doing now can lead to some running in the future.

Further note: part of the reason for my absence and general issues sticking to a program is that I was slipping back into a pretty serious depression. I'm back on some meds for that. I was worried about weight gain, which is why I stopped taking the meds before. I'm still a little worried, so I took the step of eliminating added sugar from my diet, so that I can trust my appetite more and worry less about unintentional overeating. I may do that Mark Bittman thing where I eat some dessert on weekends, but I actually feel amazing not eating sugar. I'm not avoiding fruit or whole grains or anything, carbs are still >200g/day, but my energy levels are much more stable and hunger cues are more reliable, and I'm not 'crashing' postworkout (probably also because I'm not doing tons of cardio). So that's nice.

[Fang2]

You're doing good so far, and good luck in your future goals.

[y2zipper]

Hi V02 and dailob!

Dailob, I think program-hopping is my new exercise of choice. My calves are going to show mad gains from all this hopping.

SO:

1. I think my sudden hatred for cardio stemmed from a really slow-recovering episode of the flu. This made cardio difficult and sucky. I'm recovered now and kind of into cardio again.

2. PPL didn't wind up feeling like the right fit for me. The workouts felt too long and just too complicated. Maybe it's that I'm busier in general, but I think I prefer a simpler full-body program. I'm still pondering. In the meantime, here's what I'm doing now:

3 x per week lifting (full body--squats or front squats, deadlifts or rack pulls, assisted chinups/rows/pushups/something for upper body, some form of core move)
plus 30 min elliptical on the days I lift

and 3 x per week swimming, about 2200-2400 yards (40ish minutes)

This is going pretty well for me. The swimming lets me recover from the lifting and I'm getting in some good volume. Right now I'm working in the 6-12 rep range and trying to get my squat and deadlift numbers up to something respectable. I've ripped some calluses off my hands doing so many deadlifts--I aim for 40-50 total reps of each exercise split into sets--but other than worrying about that changing my grip, I'm not concerned.

Notice the lack of running? Yeah. Running... strongly correlated with intense back pain for me right now, and I'm just not feeling it. It's amazingly easier to hit a high heart rate on the elliptical and still have the energy and wherewithal to lift. I don't intend to quit running forever, but... maybe I'll recommence in the spring or summer when my body is stronger, better-balanced, and leaner--those should all equip me better to run.

For me, running is not something to take for granted. It's an activity I have to earn by getting my body into pretty good shape--partly because when I run, I intend to run fast and with proper form. I have to upgrade the engine before I can manage that. I hope what I'm doing now can lead to some running in the future.

Sorry to hear about all the running stuff but it's good to see you back. I can relate to the new job thing (because I have 2 of them now) and I'm probably going to start a log up in a little bit here again to track myself. But you keep showing up and you figure it out.

[shesprints]

NEW TRAINING LOG

I promise to be consistent in this one. Hope to see you brahs there <3