1-Methyl-1,2,3,4-tetrahydroisoquinoline

[Unpossible]

New ingredient in Stimulant X.

Discuss.

[itzDodge]

New ingredient in Stimulant X.

Discuss.

Is it chemically related to anything?

What sort of effect would feel from it. Energy? Focus?

[BringnIt]

I really only see anti-Parkinson's research on it and overall neuro-protective studies.

[-=BigSmith=-]

Its something they were working on the last year I was with AX. Its really good. Before applying for a patent it went through a rigorous DSHEA compliance review.

Basically its medium on energy, but great on focus and mood. From my understanding this compound is what PEA converts into in the brain. It's also a pretty powerful neuro-protectant. They were trying to research what they could use in replacement of 1,3 Dymethl (geranium), and this was the one ingredient across the board testers loved over 1,3, as it is super clean, no crash and puts you in the zone.

[itzDodge]

Its something they were working on the last year I was with AX. Its really good. Before applying for a patent it went through a rigorous DSHEA compliance review.

Basically its medium on energy, but great on focus and mood. From my understanding this compound is what PEA converts into in the brain. It's also a pretty powerful neuro-protectant. They were trying to research what they could use in replacement of 1,3 Dymethl (geranium), and this was the one ingredient across the board testers loved over 1,3, as it is super clean, no crash and puts you in the zone.

Very interesting!

Would love to see some articles on it if anyone has any. If it's as awesome as you claim it to be then this would most certainly replace many 1,3 D products as it's a highly debated ingredient right now. Banned by the NCAA I believe. It specifically is not but it's chemically related and would cause a false positive, however, still a positive and something you don't want to go through to get fixed.

[JoelMcClain]

Its something they were working on the last year I was with AX. Its really good. Before applying for a patent it went through a rigorous DSHEA compliance review.

Basically its medium on energy, but great on focus and mood. From my understanding this compound is what PEA converts into in the brain. It's also a pretty powerful neuro-protectant. They were trying to research what they could use in replacement of 1,3 Dymethl (geranium), and this was the one ingredient across the board testers loved over 1,3, as it is super clean, no crash and puts you in the zone.

oh look another former AX tard spouting off about 1,3,DMAA

leave the science to Neuron kthxby

[-=BigSmith=-]

oh look another former AX tard spouting off about 1,3,DMAA

leave the science to Neuron kthxby

What are you talking about? I don't think I mentioned anymore than they are looking for a replacement to 1,3Dymethl. Reading is fundamental. What I said about 1-MeTIQ is accurate.

[Synapsin]

From my understanding this compound is what PEA converts into in the brain.

What I said about 1-MeTIQ is accurate.

PEA doesn't "turn into" tetrahydroisoquinolines in the brain. Is "Dr.D" still your formulator? I'm surprised people can just take things without even reading up on them...1-Methyl-1,2,3,4-tetrahydroisoquinoline crosses the blood brain barrier and easily increases the brain's concentration of it's endogenous form by 4x. 1,2,3,4-tetrahydroisoqulnolin is the "bad" thing that people consider when discussing parkinson's, and there is the possibility that isoquinoline can be reduced back into 1,2,3,4-tetrahydroisoqulnoline. Not only that, but 1-Methyl-1,2,3,4-tetrahydroisoquinoline isn't easily metabolized either...the funny thing is, a metabolite of it is methyl-3,4-dihydroisoquinoline, a precursor to isoquinoline...the metabolite of the "bad" thing.

[-=BigSmith=-]

Is "Dr.D" still your formulator?

I don't have a formulator.

PEA doesn't "turn into" tetrahydroisoquinolines in the brain.

Maybe I used the wrong word, "convert." 1-Methyl-1,2,3,4-tetrahydroisoquinoline (1MeTIQ), an endogenous parkinsonism-preventing substance, is enzymatically synthesized from 2-phenylethylamine (PEA) in the brain. "Institute of Pharmaceutical Sciences"

[PinchTheBear]

This is not even remotely comparable to MHA.

[-=BigSmith=-]

This is not even remotely comparable to MHA.

Yes its different, which I think is a good thing. As I said, the energy was just medium, but mood and focus were a 10/10.

[JoelMcClain]

Its something they were working on the last year I was with AX. Its really good. Before applying for a patent it went through a rigorous DSHEA compliance review.

Basically its medium on energy, but great on focus and mood. From my understanding this compound is what PEA converts into in the brain. It's also a pretty powerful neuro-protectant. They were trying to research what they could use in replacement of 1,3 Dymethl (geranium), and this was the one ingredient across the board testers loved over 1,3, as it is super clean, no crash and puts you in the zone.

What are you talking about? I don't think I mentioned anymore than they are looking for a replacement to 1,3Dymethl. Reading is fundamental. What I said about 1-MeTIQ is accurate.

irony?

its clear you have an agenda

whats cool though is no one listens to you because you, Anabolic Xtreme, and the entire Slim Xtreme debacle got you raped son

you mad?

[-=BigSmith=-]

blah

USP should be proud to have you as a rep. Your destined for greatness in life I can tell.

[JoelMcClain]

USP should be proud to have you as a rep. Your destined for greatness in life I can tell.

member since 2006

991 postive rep points

it seems you've been very helpful in your stint here

heres another former AX tard doing the samething:

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showpo...3&postcount=34

people here arent stupid

no ones forgotten about you or that crap company

or shall we bump all of Dr P's threads?

[-=BigSmith=-]

member since 2006


heres another former AX tard doing the same thing:

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showpo...3&postcount=34

Guy, it no secret that 1,3 Dymethyl is in the hot seat. Nutritional orgs are talking about it, WADA is talking about it (banned it), FDA is talking about it. Its been in the news. So...there has been plenty of talk of it being banned. I am pretty sure that is Aaron asking about it. I don't see him bashing the ingredient. I like 1,3Dymethl, but I don't think its going to be around for that long. The only thing I don't like about it is the crash. I think its safe and effective and should be able to be sold, however I know the government and other organizations do not feel that way.

Maybe its around for another two years, or maybe OCI comes in three months and shuts it for being adulterated (eg they believe it is not DSHEA)...

[PinchTheBear]

No drama in the science section?

[Synapsin]

Guys, there is no reason to be attacking Big Smith right now, try to stay relevant please.

[Adawg4929]

heres another former AX tard doing the samething:

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showpo...3&postcount=34

people here arent stupid

i was simply asking for peoples opinion on when its going to be banned, i think its a great ingredient and have nothing bad to say about it, i just wanted to know how much longer it will be around, i even pmed jacob, dan and matt asking them the same thing(you can ask them if u want to verify) edit- ooo your a USPlabs rep huh, well ask jacob we had a good convo on it

No drama in the science section?

If any section deserves to be void of any drama its the sceince section.

im looking forward to Nuerons opinion on the ingredient, but while were here, what do yyou think PTB, your usually pretty insightful.

[PinchTheBear]

im looking forward to Nuerons opinion on the ingredient, but while were here, what do yyou think PTB, your usually pretty insightful.

edit: ignore what was here. I was thinking of salsolinol lulz. I'll look at some research tomorrow.

[Adawg4929]

edit: ignore what was here. I was thinking of salsolinol lulz. I'll look at some research tomorrow.

haha for sure, looking forward to your input!

[De__eB]

Someone brought it up over on MFF a couple months ago, It seemed interesting to me, though the same fruits this compound was found in were also linked to *elevated* parkinson's occurrence in several populations

[PinchTheBear]

There are a few purported mechanisms here and they're mostly indirect through enzyme interaction and direct through receptor occupation. These effects are tissue specific as shown by its co-administrative synergistic effect with MK-801, a direct central dopamine releasing agent, on dopamine release in the rat prefrontal cortex. [1, 2] However, it has also been shown to inhibit agonist-induced excitation in the frontal lobe. [3] In vivo, it would be mildly dopaminergic through its direct mechanisms and broadly sympathomimetic through its facilitated exchange activity and through its COMT and MOAB inhibitory action. (Fig. 1) It also has been shown to be a potentially mild analgesic on its own in rats.

1-MeTIQ and N-MeTIQ given at doses of 50 mg=kg, in the first phase of their
action, produced a slight and not significant decrease of nociceptive threshold
but 90 min after the injection both compounds produced an analgesic effect,
which lasted for at least 150 min. However, the significance of the effect of
N-MeTIQ was borderline (P < 0.1)

This data is also suggestive of adrenergic activity, specifically with alpha-2, as its analgesic effects have been shown to be synergistic with morphine, a potent opioid receptor agonist. [4] Structural limitations affect its ability to act on beta adrenergic receptors, however, 1-substituted analogs have been shown to acquire structure-dependent interaction (agonism and antagonism) with beta receptors 1, 2 and 3. [7] These compounds are all phenyl-hydroxylated, while 1Me-TIQ is not.

The neuroprotective effects are direct through NMDA receptor antagonism and this is demonstrated through its ability to attenuate agonist-induced locomotion. [1] The direct central effects would be significant due to its ability to cross the blood-brain barrier, while the peripheral effects would be potentiated by psychoactive/peripherally active MAOB substrates (e.g. phenethylamine, tyramine).

Its structural limitations also affect its ability to interact with 5-HT receptors. Specific group and location substitutions facilitate all effective binding potentials of TIQ derivatives. [5] Substitutions are necessary to change the ligand's orientation in the binding pocket and unsubstituted 1Me-TIQ's action in vivo indicates that it either has antagonistic activity at 5-HT2a, alpha-1 (adrenergic), or both. [1]


Fig. 1. 1MeTIQ, at a 50mg/kg dose, significantly affects dopamine to HVA metabolism in vivo (in rats). This is suggestive of both MAOB and COMT inhibition.


Homovanillic acid (HVA)

1. http://www.springerlink.com/content/...3/fulltext.pdf
2. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16897599
3. http://lib.bioinfo.pl/pmid:16515537
4. http://www.springerlink.com/content/...l/fulltext.pdf
5. http://dissertations.ub.rug.nl/FILES...rmeulen/c3.pdf
7. http://www.freepatentsonline.com/6596734.html

[Adawg4929]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to PinchTheBear again.

[PinchTheBear]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to PinchTheBear again.

Lol thanks. I just added some stuff to the second paragraph. I probably missed a bunch of important stuff, but I think I got most of it. Neuron should be back any day now to comment...

[NO HYPE]

subscribed

[Synapsin]

Huperzine is a much better alternative to this in a neuroprotective sense. Cool work on 1MeTIQ though.


Also:

Someone brought it up over on MFF a couple months ago, It seemed interesting to me, though the same fruits this compound was found in were also linked to *elevated* parkinson's occurrence in several populations

See below:

PEA doesn't "turn into" tetrahydroisoquinolines in the brain. Is "Dr.D" still your formulator? I'm surprised people can just take things without even reading up on them...1-Methyl-1,2,3,4-tetrahydroisoquinoline crosses the blood brain barrier and easily increases the brain's concentration of it's endogenous form by 4x. 1,2,3,4-tetrahydroisoqulnolin is the "bad" thing that people consider when discussing parkinson's, and there is the possibility that isoquinoline can be reduced back into 1,2,3,4-tetrahydroisoqulnoline. Not only that, but 1-Methyl-1,2,3,4-tetrahydroisoquinoline isn't easily metabolized either...the funny thing is, a metabolite of it is methyl-3,4-dihydroisoquinoline, a precursor to isoquinoline...the metabolite of the "bad" thing.

[Peter LeDrew]

Huperzine is a much better alternative to this in a neuroprotective sense. Cool work on 1MeTIQ though.


Also:


See below:

I like me some Hup-A!

[Chimpinzo]

Strong post PinchTheBear~

Drug abuse disorder is induced by a variety of substances and results from their interaction with the brain reward system. It is characterized by a high frequency of relapse, usually associated with to craving. In this study we investigated the effects of 1-methyl-1,2,3,4-tetrahydroisoquinoline, an endogenous compound with antidopaminergic and neuroprotective activity, on *******-induced reinstatement in *******-dependent, self-administering rats. 1-methyl-1,2,3,4-tetrahydroisoquinoline (50 mg/kg i.p.) completely inhibited the expression of reinstatement of ******* self-administration and accompanying neurochemical changes induced by a single priming ******* dose (10 mg/kg i.p.). The priming ******* dose inhibited dopamine metabolism in the structures containing nerve endings (frontal cortex, nucleus accumbens, and striatum) but not in the substantia nigra and ventral tegmental area. A behaviorally active dose of 1-methyl-1,2,3,4-tetrahydroisoquinoline administered 30 min before a priming dose of ******* significantly increased the dopamine concentration in the limbic structures, and strongly inhibited dopamine metabolism in the substantia nigra and ventral tegmental area. ******* also inhibited noradrenaline and serotonin metabolism, and 1-methyl-1,2,3,4-tetrahydroisoquinoline abolished the inhibition in noradrenaline metabolism, while it intensified the inhibition of serotonin metabolism. Our results strongly support the view that 1-methyl-1,2,3,4-tetrahydroisoquinoline, an endogenous compound, has considerable potential as a drug for combating substance abuse disease through the attenuation of craving.

1MeTIQ shows promise for reducing the symptoms of ******* withdraw via interruption of *******'s effects on inhibiting noradrenaline and increasing the inhibition of serotonin...


Would this be the cause of the 10/10 focus that BigSmith was speaking of?

[PinchTheBear]

Strong post PinchTheBear~

Thanks, man.

1MeTIQ shows promise for reducing the symptoms of ******* withdraw via interruption of *******'s effects on inhibiting noradrenaline and increasing the inhibition of serotonin...

The inhibition is likely due to extra-neuronal 5-HT and NE respectively, not selective enzyme inhibition. So, in other words, the inhibition of NE metabolism is due to *******'s effect on re-uptake and the possibility that 1Me-TIQ occupies the transporter without causing an inhibitory conformational change. The changes in 5-HT metabolism are indicative of 1Me-TIQ's direct effects on 5-HT2a. That's source 2 in my post (forgive my ignorance if that's where you got it anyway).

Would this be the cause of the 10/10 focus that BigSmith was speaking of?

The effects on NE are likely only relevant with *******, but the 5-HT2a effects would be independent.

[Chimpinzo]

Great clarification, thanks Pinch