How Many Believe "The Economy is Good"

[7Seconds]

NorwichGrad,

Lets say we lived in your perspective "free" society, much of what you are describing here is unfairness and corruption, which can also happen in your "free" society, meaning people are "free" to do you injustice. If you want to look at "strongest survive" fine, I don't need protection from anyone, I'll protect myself.

The idea isn’t all these things go away and life becomes some sort of utopia. No it’s about how a government is not the only way to achieve the outcome you want.

Protecting life and liberty can be done by competitive market services too, and if this is true then you don't need a monopoly on those services, aka: government.

That's essentially ancap, the idea that government isn't doing anything special that others can't do, government is just monopolizing these things and propagandizing people to think only government can do them.

In actual fact we have private law already in the form of contracts, private police in the form of security guards, and private courts in the form of arbitration, and all are extremely popular.

What the government does is use it's monopoly on these things to rent-seek, to extract wealth from you in taxes and fees.

It’s completely unnecessary. Many societies did not have a government monopolize these services and it worked just fine. See David Friedman's book "Legal systems very different from ours."

[NorwichGrad]

LWW

No offense taken. LOL

For the record, I DO NOT drink, smoke, do drugs, or smoke pot.

Individuals have the right to do these things. That is what I stand for. Individual Rights and Freedom.

A Black gay atheist has the same right to Life, Liberty and Pursuit of Happiness as a White Hetero Christian.

The problem, again, is gubmint and its many, many fake manmade laws that are illegal and immoral.

Most laws are arbitrary.

In order for a law to be effective, IT MUST PROTECT ALL AND NOT JUST GROUPS OF PEOPLE.

The only laws that are moral and ethical are the LAWS OF PRIVATE PROPERTY. Do not kill. Do not steal.

And guess what. Gubmints are experts at killing and stealing.

[NorwichGrad]

the idea isn’t all these things go away and life becomes some sort of utopia. No it’s about how a government is not the only way to achieve the outcome you want.

Protecting life and liberty can be done by competitive market services too, and if this is true then you don't need a monopoly on those services, aka: Government.

That's essentially ancap, the idea that government isn't doing anything special that others can't do, government is just monopolizing these things and propagandizing people to think only government can do them.

In actual fact we have private law already in the form of contracts, private police in the form of security guards, and private courts in the form of arbitration, and all are extremely popular.

What the government does is use it's monopoly on these things to rent-seek, to extract wealth from you in taxes and fees.

It’s completely unnecessary. Many societies did not have a government monopolize these services and it worked just fine. See david friedman's book "legal systems very different from ours."

preach!!!!!!!!!!

[LWW]

Guys,

Good points, makes sense.

I often think of that poor fella who died (killed) by police for selling black market cigarettes, or actually resisting, all because of a "law" and the DEM who don't even support policing.

If someone is looking for trouble, they will find it, but what is real "trouble", selling cigs. not forking up to the hierarchy or like you say, what I would call laws of GOD, killing, stealing.

So I decided not to try to be a police officer because I don't even agree with laws they arrest (or people end up killed) for breaking. Whats gonna happen if hunting rifles are banned, "oh just following orders, your going to jail now, phuck that"

[LWW]

Guys,

Good points, makes sense.

I often think of that poor fella who died (killed) by police for selling black market cigarettes, or actually resisting, all because of a "law" and the DEM who don't even support policing.

If someone is looking for trouble, they will find it, but what is real "trouble", selling cigs. not forking up to the hierarchy or like you say, what I would call laws of GOD, killing, stealing.

So I decided not to try to be a police officer because I don't even agree with laws they arrest (or people end up killed) for breaking. Whats gonna happen if hunting rifles are banned, "oh just following orders, your going to jail now, phuck that"

...If you think I'm drawing a conclusion, think again.

if my man is selling black market stuff, he should have money to "play the game" and he could be paying protection to mafia who are scum of the earth, killers, thieves, human traffickers, people who will do anything to make a dollar. Black market stuff is usually stolen goods, but those cigs may of been purchased out of state by the guy? Of course death by police was WRONG, but regarding "law" it's a pretty grey...........

If people don't want to contribute to society they should just be in poverty then, keep them there, don't move them to my neighborhood.

.......and then there is the issue of what if......what if hunting rifles are banned, or red flag goes into effect, anyone can say anything about someone who owns a rifle...... not good stuff that could be on the horizon?

[Plateauplower]

Guys,

Good points, makes sense.

I often think of that poor fella who died (killed) by police for selling black market cigarettes, or actually resisting, all because of a "law" and the DEM who don't even support policing.

If someone is looking for trouble, they will find it, but what is real "trouble", selling cigs. not forking up to the hierarchy or like you say, what I would call laws of GOD, killing, stealing.

So I decided not to try to be a police officer because I don't even agree with laws they arrest (or people end up killed) for breaking. Whats gonna happen if hunting rifles are banned, "oh just following orders, your going to jail now, phuck that"

So what you are saying is that you would blindly follow orders in direct opposition to the Constitution and attempt to disarm law abiding citizens of their hunting rifles if that somehow became a new “law”. Wow a real patriot you are lol. It’s really a good thing that you lack the mental capacity to engage in anything other than the most menial jobs. At least the rest of us only need worry about you chasing us down with a wet mop, you know if a law is enacted that all janitors are now part of the secret police. It’s truly scary when people can’t or don’t think for themselves, masters degree aside of course lol.


NG
People want to control people. It’s been that way since the beginning of people. Think about it. Even back before there were “governments”. In fact that’s how governments were probably established. Say you have the tribal medicine man who has some knowledge of roots and herbs that have healing properties. They would have some power over people because those services are needed. Now those people learn some astronomy by observing the sky. At some point they can predict events like a solar eclipse. They make their prediction that the sun will become dark and it happens. Then they tell the tribe etc, to make them their king or the sun will disappear and not return, crops will fail and everyone will die. Soon thereafter they have their subjects sacrificing their first borne to them, they have absolute control over a population.

As far as the monitory policy which was the original topic of this thread, I think that the economy is doing just fine right now. I maintain a position in hard assets like physical metals but I have made nothing in them. They are nothing more than an inflationary hedge to me, at one time I had about 10-15% in hard assets. However due to the growth in the stock market, and the power of compounding interest, I’m nowhere near that now. In fact, this year my market earnings could exceed my salary. If you believe that there is a world power super secret government, or that the world is controlled by the rich oligarchs, what makes you think they are going to abandon the stock market? That’s where the wealthy put their money....Investing in a low cost market based mutual fund such as an S&P 500 fund will build wealth faster and more reliably than anything else you can do. After 20-30 years of that you could afford a much more elaborate bunker, more guns, more ammo or whatever you choose to spend your large pile of fiat currency on. You would even be able to buy more metals than if slowly accumulated them, because typically metals only match inflation (which is why it’s an inflationary hedge) whereas a sound investing strategy will exceed inflation, many times over.

[7Seconds]

NG
People want to control people. It’s been that way since the beginning of people. Think about it. Even back before there were “governments”. In fact that’s how governments were probably established. Say you have the tribal medicine man who has some knowledge of roots and herbs that have healing properties. They would have some power over people because those services are needed. Now those people learn some astronomy by observing the sky. At some point they can predict events like a solar eclipse. They make their prediction that the sun will become dark and it happens. Then they tell the tribe etc, to make them their king or the sun will disappear and not return, crops will fail and everyone will die. Soon thereafter they have their subjects sacrificing their first borne to them, they have absolute control over a population.

The cycle theory of government is very old, dating back to Ancient Greece, Plato I think.

In short, the cycle goes like this:

Autocracy/Monarchy --> Tyranny

UNREST --> Aristocracy

Aristocracy --> Oligarchy

UNREST --> Republic

Republic --> Democracy

Democracy --> Anarchy

Anarchy --> Autocracy/Monarchy

And so it repeats, on and on and on.

The idea is that there are three "good" systems (Autocracy, Aristocracy, Republic) that eventually devolve into their "bad" counterparts (Tyranny, Oligarchy, Democracy), followed by periods of unrest that cycle into the next "good" system.

There is a phrase “breaking the wheel”. Well the Platonic cycle is the wheel, and Libertarians are generally the ones trying to break it.

[NorwichGrad]

So what you are saying is that you would blindly follow orders in direct opposition to the Constitution and attempt to disarm law abiding citizens of their hunting rifles if that somehow became a new “law”. Wow a real patriot you are lol. It’s really a good thing that you lack the mental capacity to engage in anything other than the most menial jobs. At least the rest of us only need worry about you chasing us down with a wet mop, you know if a law is enacted that all janitors are now part of the secret police. It’s truly scary when people can’t or don’t think for themselves, masters degree aside of course lol.


NG
People want to control people. It’s been that way since the beginning of people. Think about it. Even back before there were “governments”. In fact that’s how governments were probably established. Say you have the tribal medicine man who has some knowledge of roots and herbs that have healing properties. They would have some power over people because those services are needed. Now those people learn some astronomy by observing the sky. At some point they can predict events like a solar eclipse. They make their prediction that the sun will become dark and it happens. Then they tell the tribe etc, to make them their king or the sun will disappear and not return, crops will fail and everyone will die. Soon thereafter they have their subjects sacrificing their first borne to them, they have absolute control over a population.

As far as the monitory policy which was the original topic of this thread, I think that the economy is doing just fine right now. I maintain a position in hard assets like physical metals but I have made nothing in them. They are nothing more than an inflationary hedge to me, at one time I had about 10-15% in hard assets. However due to the growth in the stock market, and the power of compounding interest, I’m nowhere near that now. In fact, this year my market earnings could exceed my salary. If you believe that there is a world power super secret government, or that the world is controlled by the rich oligarchs, what makes you think they are going to abandon the stock market? That’s where the wealthy put their money....Investing in a low cost market based mutual fund such as an S&P 500 fund will build wealth faster and more reliably than anything else you can do. After 20-30 years of that you could afford a much more elaborate bunker, more guns, more ammo or whatever you choose to spend your large pile of fiat currency on. You would even be able to buy more metals than if slowly accumulated them, because typically metals only match inflation (which is why it’s an inflationary hedge) whereas a sound investing strategy will exceed inflation, many times over.

Have you read the book "Creature from Jekyll Island"? It outlines the playbook.

The wealthy oligarchs uses the stock market indeed, but NOT to place their wealth, but to trap the outsider masses into its systems.

If you read Robert Kiyosaki's book "FAKE" it outlines everything.

You were too young to remember the 2008 market crash. 12 trillion dollars of digital illusions of wealth disappeared from the common man. But it didn't really disappear because the middle class bailed out the top 0.01% via bail outs. In reality, it was the greatest transfer of wealth.

The wealthy owns the federal reserve printing press. They can print fake fiat to oblivion. It looks good on paper to the unsuspecting victims when they prop up the stock market. But when you go deeper beyond the NYSE and look at the bond market and derivatives, they should scare you. In fact, the yield curve inverted. Whenever the yield curve inverts, 100% of the time recession follows. But the thing is the 2008 crash never recovered. It was only papered over by a decade long ZIRP.

Nevertheless, the fact that you have PMs makes you ahead of the 99% of the population. Well done.

Truth is the economy is on FREE FALL. Of course the media will not discuss this.

Just look at the statistics. Off the top of my head:

a) Manufacturing PMI lowest in 10 years.

b) Store closures in first quarter of 2019 exceeds that of the year 2018.

c) Trucking industry slowing down.

d) All time debt record in personal, student loan, etc..

e) People who filed for bankruptcy increased by 5% just recently.

f) People who are delinquent in auto loan all time high.

Then to top it off, all kinds of geopolitical events around the world.

Just remember "when all else fails, they take us to war." currency war -> trade war -> world war.

We are seeing this now.

And since you are a PM holder, you are well aware that they are the proverbial "canary in the financial coal mine". I am sure you have seen recently how they have been behaving. Considering they are heavily suppressed by banks via ETF, the fact that they are rising should tell you that more and more in-the-know investors are hoarding them as hedge.

The cycle theory of government is very old, dating back to Ancient Greece, Plato I think.

In short, the cycle goes like this:

Autocracy/Monarchy --> Tyranny

UNREST --> Aristocracy

Aristocracy --> Oligarchy

UNREST --> Republic

Republic --> Democracy

Democracy --> Anarchy

Anarchy --> Autocracy/Monarchy

And so it repeats, on and on and on.

The idea is that there are three "good" systems (Autocracy, Aristocracy, Republic) that eventually devolve into their "bad" counterparts (Tyranny, Oligarchy, Democracy), followed by periods of unrest that cycle into the next "good" system.

There is a phrase “breaking the wheel”. Well the Platonic cycle is the wheel, and Libertarians are generally the ones trying to break it.

I have seen many versions of this cycle. THIS IS PERHAPS THE BEST SUMMARY I HAVE SEEN. Thanks for sharing.

[Plateauplower]

NG, I remember the dot com crash in 02, I graduated college in 02 and was already employed and investing for the future. I was a big buyer in the 08 crash. I diverted a LOT of my income into investments. I’m pretty sure I sent you a PM when you were first considering metals, I was already holding a good amount then...The fact is if the stock market goes goes to ****, metals are going to be good to have, but in my opinion we would be looking at a “Madmax” world by then and lead, brass, power and primers would be more valuable than silver or gold (diversification in metals right). While I can appreciate what you are saying as there is some truth to it, I tend to believe the reality is somewhere in the middle. Like I said the market is the only game in town for long term financial gains, I only gamble with what I can afford to lose (about 30% of my gross income) the rest I spend on other things. I’m happy with the current economy. If you are not in the market now, I’m not saying it’s a good time to jump in, the market is overvalued right now IMO. Otherwise I try to buy all the time and even more on the dips. It’s been working well for me so far.

[Cantplankwell]

NG
People want to control people. It’s been that way since the beginning of people. Think about it. Even back before there were “governments”. In fact that’s how governments were probably established. Say you have the tribal medicine man who has some knowledge of roots and herbs that have healing properties. They would have some power over people because those services are needed. Now those people learn some astronomy by observing the sky. At some point they can predict events like a solar eclipse. They make their prediction that the sun will become dark and it happens. Then they tell the tribe etc, to make them their king or the sun will disappear and not return, crops will fail and everyone will die. Soon thereafter they have their subjects sacrificing their first borne to them, they have absolute control over a population.

Listening the Audiobook for "Guns Germs and Steel" Basically a book about how some societies developed to dominate others.

This is the exact path that civilization took from hunter gatherer groups to tribal chiefs.then monarchies and then finally modern governments.

The issue for most governments regardless of political system is to what degree do they redistribute wealth, benefits and protection from other states etc... so as to maintain order and control over their subjects...or citizens as the case may be to..... to prevent collapse, anarchy, and possibly falling victim to a "Reign of Terror". Most of the ones that concentrate too much wealth near the top and neglect the bottom eventually fail.

[Plateauplower]

Listening the Audiobook for "Guns Germs and Steel" Basically a book about how some societies developed to dominate others.

This is the exact path that civilization took from hunter gatherer groups to tribal chiefs.then monarchies and then finally modern governments.

The issue for most governments regardless of political system is to what degree do they redistribute wealth, benefits and protection from other states etc... so as to maintain order and control over their subjects...or citizens as the case may be to..... to prevent collapse, anarchy, and possibly falling victim to a "Reign of Terror". Most of the ones that concentrate too much wealth near the top and neglect the bottom eventually fail.

Yea there is a saying that I can’t recall about happy people being pacified making them weaker, and people struggling becoming stronger. I’m sure someone can remember it verbatim but it pretty much reflects what you wrote/ listened to in the audio book.

[steffo99]

I do believe we're in for some rough times (eventually), but honestly too lazy to write an explanation of all the reasons why and it would take a long time, then finding the sources to back statements up, argue points, etc. That's not very miscer-like.

However, regarding the S&P Vs Gold and silver, the chart at 4:20 minutes may surprise some. Good video here, I may "gamble" with a little just in case silver takes off. Institutions traditionally pushing price down are now long as well.



Keep in mind that this performance is despite heavy manipulation to prevent the dollar being sold off (not everyone will believe that ofc). And now China and others are buying a lot, and with growing tensions in trade etc, some have even expressed desire to tie their currency to gold. It is just my belief that the downward manipulation won't work much longer with the increased demand and separate independant systems being built.

Interesting times for sure, hope you all stay safe and look into a few different sources and not just what mainstream news tells you. DYOR. Today there is so much available to listen to from old fund managers and wall street people with decades of experience sharing everything and their insights. I listened to about 200 interviews even before starting to trade a bit and have to say it's amazing that this is even possible today. Not sure I would even bother going to college if I was young today.

[LWW]

So what you are saying is that you would blindly follow orders in direct opposition to the Constitution and attempt to disarm law abiding citizens of their hunting rifles if that somehow became a new “law”. Wow a real patriot you are lol. It’s really a good thing that you lack the mental capacity to engage in anything other than the most menial jobs. At least the rest of us only need worry about you chasing us down with a wet mop, you know if a law is enacted that all janitors are now part of the secret police. It’s truly scary when people can’t or don’t think for themselves, masters degree aside of course lol.

Don't underestimate that, who knows what diseases lurks in the mops, could've mopped up urine and chit, or blood.

...and do you even know what is going on today? I'm watching right now, that idiot Warren who is running for President walking with a farmer and the farmer is saying "the green new deal says I need to get rid of cows" and she (that idiot Warren) is shaking her head, yes. WTF is happening? It looks she and many others will puck everyone, just to be well liked by.......

[superiorlogic]

Maybe the fed realized they increased rates prematurely

[LWW]

happy people being pacified making them weaker, and people struggling becoming stronger.

After some of your posts, I don't believe you to be the struggling becoming stronger.

Are you one of those guys who eats several high protein meals on the clock, by the clock, everyday? Like a baby needing feedings?

[steffo99]

I find this channel amazing, so just sharing. Many great talks and interviews here. The first video is a year old and went viral with over a million views, and the second may offer some perspective on an asset not well understood.

[Mark1T]

Maybe the fed realized they increased rates prematurely

It was mind-boggling that the Fed raised rates only because the economy was warming up.

[steffo99]

[Brackneyc]

I think it sucks.

[steffo99]

Brand new vid on the topic from my favorite channel, haven't even watched it yet.

[NorwichGrad]

Dang Steff,

You and I follow the same channels, bruh!! LOL.

No wonder we get called conspiracy theorists.

Here is another FACT that many deny: The 2-10 yield curve inverted here in the US. Historically, every single time 2-10 curve inverts, they are 100% followed by recession / depression / correction / reset.

But no.. We don't know economics.. SHEEEESH.

[NorwichGrad]

And speaking of being a real economist, where is CONGORE? Hiding under a rock?

Keynesians are dangerous, cuz they poison the minds of the sheeple.

Which is more dangerous, a bottle that says POISON? Or a delicious looking cheesecake laced in cyanide?

I submit that the bottle of POISON is far safer, because anybody with a functioning brain cell knows NOT to drink it. The cheesecake is the one that will kill.

And this is what wannabe economists like CONGORE are like. They are the cheesecake that will poison the sheep. SAD. People like him are criminally negligent. They are accomplices.

[OldFartTom]

Avoiding passing comments on almost all issues in this thread... Just wanted to ask if anyone else thinks the 10 year gov bond yields have gone very weird? (US and UK, not looked at others yet). The doom-predictors are having a field day... sky is about to fall in etc etc

[NorwichGrad]

Avoiding passing comments on almost all issues in this thread... Just wanted to ask if anyone else thinks the 10 year gov bond yields have gone very weird? (US and UK, not looked at others yet). The doom-predictors are having a field day... sky is about to fall in etc etc

That's the thing. Very few people, if any, understand the bond market. You obviously do.

Very few people understand the derivatives time bomb.

Everybody has been conditioned to look at the manipulated DOW and get fooled into thinking the economy is good.

Full inversion of the entire yield curve from 3 months to 30 years is an "oh crap" moment.

But inversion of the 2-10 is the big "HO LEE SHEEEEEET" moment.

The wannabe economists do not understand this.

[Plateauplower]

Dang Steff,

You and I follow the same channels, bruh!! LOL.

No wonder we get called conspiracy theorists.

Here is another FACT that many deny: The 2-10 yield curve inverted here in the US. Historically, every single time 2-10 curve inverts, they are 100% followed by recession / depression / correction / reset.

But no.. We don't know economics.. SHEEEESH.

We are overdue for a correction for sure. I'm long in the market and don't expect start drawing for another 10-15 years. At this point if the market has a big pull-back I just see it as a buying opportunity. Similarly when markets are on the way up and metals are cheap that's the time to buy those, not when there is a correction and everyone drives up the prices of metals. There's no loss unless you sell, you maintain the same number of shares.

[Mark1T]

We are overdue for a correction for sure. I'm long in the market and don't expect start drawing for another 10-15 years. At this point if the market has a big pull-back I just see it as a buying opportunity. Similarly when markets are on the way up and metals are cheap that's the time to buy those, not when there is a correction and everyone drives up the prices of metals. There's no loss unless you sell, you maintain the same number of shares.

I fully agree.

[NorwichGrad]

PP and Mark.

Yup. I also agree.

Buy low and sell high. This is the way to make a profit.

You two obviously know how it works.

I plan to buy stocks after the reset for sure.

But here’s the thing.

So many sheeple are NOT savvy investors. They keep jumping into the bandwagon not knowing the big players in the know have already exited.

[ElrondHubbard]

Listening the Audiobook for "Guns Germs and Steel" Basically a book about how some societies developed to dominate others.

This is the exact path that civilization took from hunter gatherer groups to tribal chiefs.then monarchies and then finally modern governments.

The issue for most governments regardless of political system is to what degree do they redistribute wealth, benefits and protection from other states etc... so as to maintain order and control over their subjects...or citizens as the case may be to..... to prevent collapse, anarchy, and possibly falling victim to a "Reign of Terror". Most of the ones that concentrate too much wealth near the top and neglect the bottom eventually fail.

The whole point of "Guns, Germs, and Steel" has nothing to do with any particular system of government, it's all about the role of geography in determining which societies developed the ability to dominate others.

[Cantplankwell]

The whole point of "Guns, Germs, and Steel" has nothing to do with any particular system of government, it's all about the role of geography in determining which societies developed the ability to dominate others.

Read Chapter 14, at least in the audio book version explains the rise and role of complex government in a society and its contribution towards one state or region in dominating others.

[Plateauplower]

PP and Mark.

Yup. I also agree.

Buy low and sell high. This is the way to make a profit.

You two obviously know how it works.

I plan to buy stocks after the reset for sure.

But here’s the thing.

So many sheeple are NOT savvy investors. They keep jumping into the bandwagon not knowing the big players in the know have already exited.

Most people do the opposite of what they should when it comes to investing. They see the big drops, get shaken and sell. Then they sit on cash watching the market (whatever the investment vehicle is) and think "Oh no I'm missing out on this" and end up re-investing when the market is at or near the next high. That is how money is made in any investment. The people who make gains are basically taking the money away from those who lose...There is a very simple and effective strategy to avoid this. Simply dollar cost averaging into and eventually out of the investment vehicle. This allows you to spread your investments or withdrawals out and smooth out the curve. I don't sell any stocks, but since about a year ago I have reduced my allocations putting just a little more into a stable money market fund (cash) so when the dips come I simply move some of that cash into investments. I will sell physical assets if the prices are right. I would unload silver at $24/oz making a good profit and knowing that when the recovery comes I will be a buyer again around $16/oz...