Developing upper traps without hurting posture? (aka no shrugs)

[jumboliah]

I've always heard and been told that shrugs are horrible for upper body posture as they promote rounded shoulders/hunchback. I'm trying to improve my upper body posture and the only thing my PT told me not to do is shrugs. But I want big upper traps. What other exercise would you recommend? The only one I can really think of is deadlift.

[birdlegs]

Face pulls and upright rows

[magician27]

key is balanced development ,not avoiding to develop a particular muscle . in your routine balance horizontal push vs horizontal pull, press vs vertical pull, lower trap exercises vs upper trap etc. basically just follow a proven routine , you wont have major problem

[jumboliah]

key is balanced development ,not avoiding to develop a particular muscle . in your routine balance horizontal push vs horizontal pull, press vs vertical pull, lower trap exercises vs upper trap etc. basically just follow a proven routine , you wont have major problem

I have to train unbalanced right now to fix my posture. When I started lifting half a decade ago I did a bit more pushing volume than pulling volume. Which probably added up over time. And I don't think I started out doing rows correctly for proper mid/lower trap engagement.

[magician27]

I have to train unbalanced right now to fix my posture. When I started lifting half a decade ago I did a bit more pushing volume than pulling volume. Which probably added up over time. And I don't think I started out doing rows correctly for proper mid/lower trap engagement.

if you are doing a routine for correcting posture now , definitely follow what your trainer says ,forget about developing a particular muscle now, just fix your posture , you will be better off for your future lifting

[jumboliah]

if you are doing a routine for correcting posture now , definitely follow what your trainer says ,forget about developing a particular muscle now, just fix your posture , you will be better off for your future lifting

Thanks. My PT said I could actually lift normally as my posture (slight winged scapula) isn't that bad but they just don't want me training upper traps via shrugs. They just have me doing stretches/corrective work outside of the gym.

[jumboliah]

Face pulls and upright rows

Thanks for the reply. I do a lot of face pulls so that'll definitely help. I've debated adding wide grip upright rows for mostly side delts and some upper traps but I feel like these may have a similar effect that shrugs have. Postural wise.

[boathead]

a variant of a shrug will actually tighten up your posture: snatch grip shrug.

[lancegoyke]

I'd be curious to hear the rationale behind their prescription of not doing shrugs. That might shed some more light on the topic.

[TBoneBrah]

I know, I know. I am trapless in my avi, but hear me out.

Military presses are great as long as you fully lock out the weight.

Deadlifts are also good for building the traps

Armpit rows are good too.



Lance, I expect its due to the tendency to stick the head forward when shrugging, plus the tendancy to allow the thoracic spine to round.

[jenachi]

I feel like having good posture is just training yourself to always sit and stand up right.

[mjf100215]

I feel like having good posture is just training yourself to always sit and stand up right.

It's not always that easy. OP spent years overtraining his chest. The result is a tight chest and weak back pulling his shoulders forward.

OP, help me understand how a shrug which focuses on muscles in your upper back and neck would then pull your arms forward and round your back? That makes no sense to me.

[PBnJay]

a variant of a shrug will actually tighten up your posture: snatch grip shrug.

i think trap work in general should pull your shoulders back. Overdeveloped chest and delts is what rolls um forward, no?

[jumboliah]

I'd be curious to hear the rationale behind their prescription of not doing shrugs. That might shed some more light on the topic.

I think it's because one, shrugs are typically done with bad posture. The heavier you go on them, the worse it gets. I guess you could go really light (with dumbbells) but then would it even benefit your traps that much? Two, upper traps (along with pecs, anterior delts, and lats) are the muscles that promote internally rotated shoulders and a rounded upper back. They pull everything forward in a sense. Shrugs work the problem area (upper traps) and don't work the important area (mid and lower traps).

Also isn't bad posture from weak upward scapular rotators? The typical 'hunched' shrug posture when using decent weight also heavily stimulates the downward rotators of the scapula. The exact location where my problem lies.

Summing it up, a shrug is a sub-optimal (shoulder health wise) movement pattern which also strengthens a muscle that promotes upper crossed syndrome. Is this correct?

This is mostly based off of things I've read online. The PT didn't go into great detail on it.

It's not always that easy. OP spent years overtraining his chest. The result is a tight chest and weak back pulling his shoulders forward.

OP, help me understand how a shrug which focuses on muscles in your upper back and neck would then pull your arms forward and round your back? That makes no sense to me.

I believe it has to do with where muscles insert and basic anatomy. I can't tell you exactly why but I know that the muscles which promote upper crossed syndrome (hunch back, internally rotated shoulders, kyphosis, w/e you wanna call it) are the pecs, lats, upper traps, and anterior delts.

i think trap work in general should pull your shoulders back. Overdeveloped chest and delts is what rolls um forward, no?

Chest, lats, upper traps, and anterior delts all do that.

The mid traps, lower traps, and rear delts would pull your shoulders back

[cornman99]

I think it's because one, shrugs are typically done with bad posture. The heavier you go on them, the worse it gets. I guess you could go really light (with dumbbells) but then would it even benefit your traps that much? Two, upper traps (along with pecs, anterior delts, and lats) are the muscles that promote internally rotated shoulders and a rounded upper back. They pull everything forward in a sense. Shrugs work the problem area (upper traps) and don't work the important area (mid and lower traps).

Also isn't bad posture from weak upward scapular rotators? The typical 'hunched' shrug posture when using decent weight also heavily stimulates the downward rotators of the scapula. The exact location where my problem lies.

Summing it up, a shrug is a sub-optimal (shoulder health wise) movement pattern which also strengthens a muscle that promotes upper crossed syndrome. Is this correct?

This is mostly based off of things I've read online. The PT didn't go into great detail on it.



I believe it has to do with where muscles insert and basic anatomy. I can't tell you exactly why but I know that the muscles which promote upper crossed syndrome (hunch back, internally rotated shoulders, kyphosis, w/e you wanna call it) are the pecs, lats, upper traps, and anterior delts.



Chest, lats, upper traps, and anterior delts all do that.

The mid traps, lower traps, and rear delts would pull your shoulders back

how do lats pull the shoulder forward?

[Jackal005]

Deadlifts and farmers walks are all you need. I haven't done a shrug in over a year and they're probably the area where I've seen the most improvement in that year.

[jumboliah]

how do lats pull the shoulder forward?

It's because they insert on the front of the humerus

[TJP33]

first Ive heard of shrugs being bad for posture, maybe those with horrible form or pre-existing injury... otherwise really question the source of statement.

[cornman99]

It's because they insert on the front of the humerus

So all the people that do chins and other lat exercises to help posture have been wrong all these years is what youre saying? Flex your lats and then tell me how it pulls your shoulder forward lol.

[davik]

Get your deadlift to 180 kilos, screw shrugs until then

[italianplaya30]

Get your deadlift to 180 kilos, screw shrugs until then

ditto....i use sumo deadlifts and have seen more growth from that then I ever will with shrugs

[BJP2k14]

I have a decent pair of traps from when I used to oly lift.
Since then all I've done is shrugs and dumbbell/plates shrugs.

[Athl3te]

Underhand puul ups are good for posture

[CaseyofDoom]

Winged scapula is caused by a weak serratus. The serratus pulls the shoulder blades forward. Any exercise that pulls them forward strengthens them. Best example would be a standing overhead press. As you bring the barbell or dumbells to the top, your shoulder blades usually will move forward and vuola, scapula is called for duty.

[CaseyofDoom]

As for as your traps go, at the end of a good back routine light to medium weight shrugs do just fine.

[Yobra33]

Handstand push ups could help

[aresman1221]

Deadlifts

/thread