Dumb Question, but here it goes...

[MisterT]

I have always been skinny most of my life. Now that I am nearing my 40s, my metabolism is slowing, any weight gain goes straight to the midsection instead of being evenly distributed (go figure). I want to gain lean muscle mass without the added fat. Should I stick to what I am taking or take a weight gainer to replace the 100% Whey? This is what I am currently taking:

Currently doing a cycle of Halotest 25 for 8 weeks (week 2/8)
ON 100% Whey 2x a day
ON Optimen
ON L Glutamine
Vitamin D3
COQ10
ON After Max (only on days I workout as a post work out)
Gaspari Super Pump 250 Preworkout (only days I work out too)

I eat 5-6 small meals a day. I eat clean every day of the week, I may cheat once in a while, but I don't go all out and engorge myself, and if I do cheat, it is only for 1 of the meals. I don't count my calories either, I know that is probably not that great of me because I need to figure how many I need to take in for my goals. I am 6'4 and weigh in at around 205 lbs. I have been lifting for several years, just not serious about dieting until this year, where I have been pretty strict on what goes in. I did 4 months of the Mens Fitness Yearlong Workout 2010 Routine, but have switched to allpro's workout in the workout section (beginner's workout program) so I can focus more on compound mvts to add more bulk. I have always had a hard time making gains. Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.

[ironwill2008]

I have always been skinny most of my life.


any weight gain goes straight to the midsection instead of being evenly distributed

I don't count my calories either,

I need to figure how many I need to take in for my goals.

I have always had a hard time making gains.

All of these statements are inter-related. Start tracking what/how much you eat. You have to know where you're at right now before you can figure out where you need to go. This is a good resource to get you started with this: http://fitday.com

[MisterT]

But by taking in good calories from a weight gainer be the key to lean muscle mass or would the extra calories being stored as fat?

[ironwill2008]

But by taking in good calories from a weight gainer be the key to lean muscle mass or would the extra calories being stored as fat?

Any 'extra' calories you eat will be stored as bodyfat. Their source is immaterial to that fact.

[BazzaW]

without getting in to the 'all calories are created equal' debate my first thought is that you are relying too much on product and perhaps not enough on a good old fashion food plan.

X2 on what ironwill said, the bottom line is that you just have to know your macros. If you are looking to use the standard 40/40/20 (Pro/carb/fat) macro its difficult to get a clear picture of it (unless you are very experienced) without using something like fitday.

Most people here will tell you that to get rid of the midriff you have to follow the equation of reducing your daily calorie count by 500 from your basal metabolic rate to lose 1 lb per week. Unfortunately like the rest of us, its impossible to 'spot' reduce your (although there are some miracle creams that proport to do this....)

First, get a handle on what your macro splits are, eat good fresh food, and the rest will happen...

[Old-Time-Lifter]

But by taking in good calories from a weight gainer be the key to lean muscle mass or would the extra calories being stored as fat?

If you're trying to lean out why in the world are you using weight gainer?

Any 'extra' calories you eat will be stored as bodyfat. Their source is immaterial to that fact.

^^^ This, many times we try to make it all too complicated.

I don't use fitday myself (I did for a while though) but if you don't have a good handle on your diet and you don't want to eat the same thing day after day (which is what I personally am doing) then it's a very very good tool.

[MisterT]

If you're trying to lean out why in the world are you using weight gainer?

I am not using a weight gainer. I am talking about wanting to gain more lean mass and was wondering if I should continue taking what I am taking in addition to my program or add a weight gainer on top. I am on the lean side, but when I do gain any weight, it goes straight to the love handles.

[BazzaW]

I am not using a weight gainer. I am talking about wanting to gain more lean mass and was wondering if I should continue taking what I am taking in addition to my program or add a weight gainer on top. I am on the lean side, but when I do gain any weight, it goes straight to the love handles.

Let's have a look at a typical days food plan. That should tell us how your macros are. Sounds to me as if perhaps your macros are a little out of whack - your splits may be high in carbs and fat - and light on the protein.

If what you are doing is not working " any weight gain goes straight to the midsection instead of being evenly distributed " then the amount of additional calories you are ingesting is surplus to your bodies needs. My guess is that if you plug in what you are eating to fitday or something similar your macros will come back something like 50/30/20 (an example) its not until you break it down that you realise what you are putting in isn't giving you the building blocks to make the most of your efforts....as I say, could be wrong, but until you provide an example of what you are eating, or use fitday....you won't know.

[MisterT]

Great advice guys, thanks! I never sat down and plugged in all of the food I eat, but I eat almost the same thing daily, so it shouldn't be too hard to do on the suggested website.

[kdogg3270]

Great advice guys, thanks! I never sat down and plugged in all of the food I eat, but I eat almost the same thing daily, so it shouldn't be too hard to do on the suggested website.

far as your original question, push heavy weights, up your protein intake (track your macros first as others have suggested), mix in some cardio, and give it time to work

[Rdez]

I am not using a weight gainer. I am talking about wanting to gain more lean mass and was wondering if I should continue taking what I am taking in addition to my program or add a weight gainer on top. I am on the lean side, but when I do gain any weight, it goes straight to the love handles.

Man, I have the same exact problem. If you solve it, let me know!

I find it's a very fine balance. If I eat even a little 'too much' it goes right to my love handles. But if I'm not eating enough, I don't gain any muscle mass at all.

At this point I've resigned myself to getting a little fat around the middle in exchange for bulking up. I know when the time comes, cutting calories out of my diet is NOT going to be difficult at all for me.

[Headshrink]

Lots of us have this problem. It takes a lot of effort to find out what will work for you. As stated in the above opinions, the job of figuring it out will be much easier (but not easy) when you know your calories and macros. You will have to play around a bit with your diet. Also, unless I missed it we know nothing about how your are training.

[LyingSac]

Sounds like you're on top of your game, might be just time for a lifestyle and diet change while you're not so far gone...i'm not a big fan of superpump, all the rest looks fine..don't get crazy, just adjust and give it time...

[MisterT]

I started using the site fitday and did not realize how easy it is. The cool thing is that if you eat close to the same things week to week (nachos, Yoohoos, Dunkin Donuts, etc.), you can click on the use recent food instead of having to research it every time. BTW, I am kidding about the nachos, yoohoo, and DD. I am doing pretty good from a diet standpoint. The only thing that I do "bad" is eat dry cereals, but it is Koshi, so it is not that bad I guess. It is high in protein/fiber and low in fat. This week, I lost 1.5 lbs after having had gained 3 the week prior. Thanks for the info. everyone. Lastly, I after the Super Pump 250, I am going to switch to a different preworkout drink.

I read up on the nutrition section about how many grams of protein/carbs/fats you should take. If anything, I am a little below on the fat intake. I am right on with the protein and as for carbs, I believe I am right on or at least close to where I should be each day. I am not strict about my diet I don't think, but those I work with think I am from the foods I eat. I just feel better eating good foods. If I cheat and have chinese for dinner, I feel really lethargic and bloated afterwards. I always like to be firing on all cylinders, so I stick to eating what is healthy. And as for my sweet tooth, 2 small Dove dark chocolates after dinner seems to be enough to take the edge off the sweet cravings.

[JOHN GARGANI]

All of these statements are inter-related. Start tracking what/how much you eat. You have to know where you're at right now before you can figure out where you need to go. This is a good resource to get you started with this: http://fitday.com

Any 'extra' calories you eat will be stored as bodyfat. Their source is immaterial to that fact.

LISTEN TO THIS MAN!!!!!! ^^^^^^^^^^^^^


and:

without getting in to the 'all calories are created equal' debate my first thought is that you are relying too much on product and perhaps not enough on a good old fashion food plan.

X2 on what ironwill said, the bottom line is that you just have to know your macros. If you are looking to use the standard 40/40/20 (Pro/carb/fat) macro its difficult to get a clear picture of it (unless you are very experienced) without using something like fitday.

Most people here will tell you that to get rid of the midriff you have to follow the equation of reducing your daily calorie count by 500 from your basal metabolic rate to lose 1 lb per week. Unfortunately like the rest of us, its impossible to 'spot' reduce your (although there are some miracle creams that purport to do this....)

First, get a handle on what your macro splits are, eat good fresh food, and the rest will happen...

another EXCELLENT response!

[J.Ho]

Hey fellow Charlestonian!

If you are trying to lose the midsection then as stated above track you macros like a madman. Pretty soon you'll know what is what and you will be more on auto pilot. But you will gain some of that midsection if you are eating over maintenance and trying to pack on muscle, it just comes with the turf... Unless we are talking newbie gains then you cant have your cake and eat it too ( you cant lose the love handles AND add a bunch of muscle).

I also wouldn't recommend any supplements that turn into a steroid in your body. It's not going to help you get you where u want to go IMO. You just dont need it to accomplish your goals.

Also do you haven an iPhone? There is a free app called lose it! That I have been using since last fall and its great for tracking your macros wherever you may be.

[DeathtoToasters]

Currently doing a cycle of Halotest 25 for 8 weeks (week 2/8)

For those wondering ( like I was)

halotest = Halotest-25, 25mg/60 Caps (PowerLab) Best Prohormones - Legal Steroids Alternatives

Seriously ...........hmmmmmmm sounds weird to me!

Either do it or don't....IMHO....oh well

Let the flaming begin!

When you stop the above stuff....

Even with LEGAL stuff you need to EAT CORRECTLY.....which you seem not to be doing correctly.

Listen to Ironwill.....he knows the stuff....

[JOHN GARGANI]

Death: I was thinking the same thing, but didn't want to divert the thread that way....

but now that you did....LOL...

[tonester]

A lot of times fat placement has a basis in hormonal balance. Fat stored around the midsection and chest. Chronically elevated cortisol from constant exposure to stress is one example of this. You can't make appreciable gains in it's presence.

Using all manner of supplements "may" disrupt an already challenged hormonal profile.

My advice would be to stick to natural food for your calorie needs and work hard at your programme followed by working hard at recovery. Recovery and stress management being very, very important.

I have found this combination to be the best at optimizing my own hormonal balance. Genetics willing, the human body can do miracles with this set up.

[fireman43CLC]

Ok so a little about me,
Im 5'11", 210 lbs., 11.5% Body Fat, 19 yrs. old
I play college football and I work out pretty regularly. Prior to this I took just HemoRage and lost about 7 lbs of fat and about 2 lbs of muscle starting at 210 lbs and 12.5% getting down to 205 lbs. at about 9.5% after I finished the 2.0 lb tub, and I wasn't taking any in extra protein in terms of a post-workout so I can put on muscle and lose fat pretty well sticking to my guns and eating fairly decent, but I'm going to start going hard again here pretty soon and this is what I was thinking about taking...

Current Stats:

Height: 5 Feet 11 Inches
Weight : 210 Pounds
Bodyfat : 11.5%
Chest : 45 Inches
Arms : 16 Inches
Hips : 39 Inches
Waist: 37 Inches
Thighs : 24.5 Inches
Calves : 16 Inches
Forearms : 12 Inches
Shoulders : 24 Inches
Neck : 17 Inches

Beginning May 17 and ending August 23, 4 days before our first game, going in in peak condition
Schedule: 6 days/wk. Mon-Sat,

Lift: M-W-F

Speed and Agility/Cardio: T-Th-Sat



6-week supplement regimen:

Pre-workout: Sucker Punch HemoRage Black by Nutrex, 2.0 lbs tub

Protein: Strawberry Syntha-6 by BSN, 5.0 lb. tub

Test Booster: Formadrol by LG Science 90 Caps (I'll buy more when necessary)

Supplements: Liver Support by GNC, Glucosamine/Chondroitin by GNC, Tribulus by Ultimate Nutrition, Super Cissus Rx by USP Labs, and a Performance & Vitality VitaPak by GNC.


Post Cycle 8-wk (Maintaining Same Schedule As Stated Above):

Mitotropin/Cytolean V2 Fat Loss Cycle by Gaspari

Supplements: Gluco./Chon., Trib, Cissus Rx, and VitaPak

Continue to take Syntha and Hemo as well.

(I already bought Syntha-6 along with the Hemo, Formadrol, Cissus Rx, and Trib, just fyi, what do you think about substituting MyoFusion by Gaspari in place of Syntha?)



Please give me your thoughts and reactions regarding this stack, and how you think I will fair in the end. If I follow the dosing instructions recommendations and eat 6-7 meals a day 3 consisting of protein as a meal replacement and maintaining a balanced diet, where do you think I will end up? Weight, Body Fat, Strength Gains? OH! And recommendations and alterations are VERY MUCH SO WELCOMED and GREATLY APPRECIATED!!

[fireman43CLC]

I didn't see that this was an Over 35 forum, sorry for imposing. But critiques would still be greatly appreciated!

[lanolar]

Ugh.... People get so "supplement insane".

Dude just eat right, take some extra protein via shakes, take a post workout drink.

Workout hard, lift HEAVY and with good form.

Its that simple, really.

[DeathtoToasters]

Ok so a little about me,
Im 5'11", 210 lbs., 11.5% Body Fat, 19 yrs. old
I play college football and I work out pretty regularly. Prior to this I took just HemoRage and lost about 7 lbs of fat and about 2 lbs of muscle starting at 210 lbs and 12.5% getting down to 205 lbs. at about 9.5% after I finished the 2.0 lb tub, and I wasn't taking any in extra protein in terms of a post-workout so I can put on muscle and lose fat pretty well sticking to my guns and eating fairly decent, but I'm going to start going hard again here pretty soon and this is what I was thinking about taking...

Current Stats:

Height: 5 Feet 11 Inches
Weight : 210 Pounds
Bodyfat : 11.5%
Chest : 45 Inches
Arms : 16 Inches
Hips : 39 Inches
Waist: 37 Inches
Thighs : 24.5 Inches
Calves : 16 Inches
Forearms : 12 Inches
Shoulders : 24 Inches
Neck : 17 Inches

Beginning May 17 and ending August 23, 4 days before our first game, going in in peak condition
Schedule: 6 days/wk. Mon-Sat,

Lift: M-W-F

Speed and Agility/Cardio: T-Th-Sat



6-week supplement regimen:

Pre-workout: Sucker Punch HemoRage Black by Nutrex, 2.0 lbs tub

Protein: Strawberry Syntha-6 by BSN, 5.0 lb. tub

Test Booster: Formadrol by LG Science 90 Caps (I'll buy more when necessary)

Supplements: Liver Support by GNC, Glucosamine/Chondroitin by GNC, Tribulus by Ultimate Nutrition, Super Cissus Rx by USP Labs, and a Performance & Vitality VitaPak by GNC.


Post Cycle 8-wk (Maintaining Same Schedule As Stated Above):

Mitotropin/Cytolean V2 Fat Loss Cycle by Gaspari

Supplements: Gluco./Chon., Trib, Cissus Rx, and VitaPak

Continue to take Syntha and Hemo as well.

(I already bought Syntha-6 along with the Hemo, Formadrol, Cissus Rx, and Trib, just fyi, what do you think about substituting MyoFusion by Gaspari in place of Syntha?)



Please give me your thoughts and reactions regarding this stack, and how you think I will fair in the end. If I follow the dosing instructions recommendations and eat 6-7 meals a day 3 consisting of protein as a meal replacement and maintaining a balanced diet, where do you think I will end up? Weight, Body Fat, Strength Gains? OH! And recommendations and alterations are VERY MUCH SO WELCOMED and GREATLY APPRECIATED!!

Ugh.... People get so "supplement insane".

Dude just eat right, take some extra protein via shakes, take a post workout drink.

Workout hard, lift HEAVY and with good form.

Its that simple, really.

Dude, IMHO taking a test booster or anything that messes with your hormomnes when you are as young as you is just ASKING for trouble. If you think you have hormone issues (which can happen at your age) , then see your doctor, but truth be told...look in the mirror. From the way you are describing your self and from your pic, you look like you are in great shape.

Lanolar is correct.

[fireman43CLC]

Dude, IMHO taking a test booster or anything that messes with yoru hormomnes when you are as young as you is just ASKING for trouble. If you think you have hormone issues (which can happen at your age) , then see your doctor, but truth be told...look in the mirror. From the way you are describing your self and from your pic, you look like you are in great shape.

Lanolar is correct.

I know I don't have testosterone problems, and like you said that looks pretty evident. But all I was really looking for was just that little extra boost I could get from the Formadrol, being that it promotes free testosterone in the body. And what the effects might be compounding the supplements. Not necessarily saying I am actually going to do everything this say, I just wanted some food for thought on it.

If that's at all understandable?

[rob440]

No supplement not even the illegal kind is a substitute for hard work and 24 hour a day discipline. I have seen so many guys over the years think if they went on this or that that they would achieve greatness. I never saw it happen once. The guys who did achieve something turned out to be the hardest working guys in the gym. Coincidence? I think not. I also think some of these legal substitutes even though they are made from uncontrolled ingredients are not healthy. Your liver and endocrine system still has to deal with them so there can be a price for using them that you dont want to pay. Think before you take any product please. If it claims to do all this great stuff, then why isnt everyone in the IFBB already? Marketing people marketing.

Rant off!

IMO do not add a weight gainer if you are at all concerned about your bodyfat. 99% of them either are really high in carbs or contain MCT's ( medium chain triglycerides a fat). All those calories have to come from somewhere. High fat or super high carb concentrations will likely be beneficial for you trying to reach your bodyfat goal and they dont necessarily guarantee muscle mass increases either. Calories are involved in the muscle building equation but it is more complex than that. A cake with just one ingredient is not a cake is it?

[LanePianoMan]

Great advice guys, thanks! I never sat down and plugged in all of the food I eat, but I eat almost the same thing daily, so it shouldn't be too hard to do on the suggested website.

I can ** almost ** guarantee that if you start using fitday you will begin to see results because you will learn how to make permanent changes in your diet.

I had the same exact problem - "skinny fat" - and once I started understanding nutrition, my workouts have turned into results. I was eating way too few grams of protein and often starving myself, which dumped muscle mostly along with some fat.

After a four month mini bulk, I am leaning out for the summer by once again adjusting using fitday. In a little over a month I've lost 7 lbs. and according to the tape measure and my clothing, it's mostly fat. As a matter of fact, I would swear I've kept all my muscle gains or have even made some progress in that area.

Bottom line: once you know what you are really consuming, you will start to see results if you adjust properly. And by the way, I agree that you need to rely mostly on real foods, other than a couple of good whey protein shakes in-between.

Good luck!

LPM

[MisterT]

So far, I am good as far as caloric intake and protein intake. If anything, my fat intake is lower than it should be. I do take fish oils for Omega 3 fats, but as far as whole foods, my fat intake is lower than perhaps it should be. My protein intake is about 1gram/pound of bodyweight. I guess I could bump it up to 1.5gs.
It has always taken me a long time to make the little gains that I have. I am definitely not as skinny as I was in high school. I think I was around 150lbs. Now I am right around 200, but I am also 20 years older. I guess a lot of it has to do with genetics. I have been working out for several years, not so much to bulk up, but for fitness. The past 2-3 years I have been doing more to bulk up.

[J.Ho]

So far, I am good as far as caloric intake and protein intake. If anything, my fat intake is lower than it should be. I do take fish oils for Omega 3 fats, but as far as whole foods, my fat intake is lower than perhaps it should be. My protein intake is about 1gram/pound of bodyweight. I guess I could bump it up to 1.5gs.
It has always taken me a long time to make the little gains that I have. I am definitely not as skinny as I was in high school. I think I was around 150lbs. Now I am right around 200, but I am also 20 years older. I guess a lot of it has to do with genetics. I have been working out for several years, not so much to bulk up, but for fitness. The past 2-3 years I have been doing more to bulk up.

You need those fats or your body Will hold on to what you already have, slowing your progress. If you have been doing everything right for 2-3 years then you'd be ripped. I am guessing that a combination of diet and training is still not quite in order. Folks here are ready and willing to help but you must be willing to receive it. Trust me I was at almost 30% BF a year ago and i am now in single digits. I listened to and followed thru on great advice I got on this very forum. I'm very grateful for this site!!!

[MisterT]

You need those fats or your body Will hold on to what you already have, slowing your progress. If you have been doing everything right for 2-3 years then you'd be ripped. I am guessing that a combination of diet and training is still not quite in order. Folks here are ready and willing to help but you must be willing to receive it. Trust me I was at almost 30% BF a year ago and i am now in single digits. I listened to and followed thru on great advice I got on this very forum. I'm very grateful for this site!!!

I agree with you totally. I have never been strict on dieting as I have this year. I usually just ate what I wanted, but within moderation. I also would buy processed food because it was fast and easy to make. Now that I am married, I have a wonderful wife who also shares the same goals. We have been eating clean, mostly from the very start of January.
I used to also be the person who would try and eat everything on his plate. I could not stand for food to go to waste.

[J.Ho]

I used to also be the person who would try and eat everything on his plate. I could not stand for food to go to waste.

That was me too...thanks to dad and two other brothers growing up it was always a race to clean your plate first so you'd be able to get seconds!