Vascularity on Keto

[Mackenna]

I've only been on keto for 4 days, i don't even know if I'm in ketosis or not, but I have noticed my vascularity has been greatly reduced. Is this common or temporary or did this only happen to me?

[jaim91]

It's probably due to the immediate loss of water one experiences when going no/low carb.

However, I'm wondering what your goals are because judging by your avatar/measurements on bodyspace, you don't loook like you have any fat to lose.

[concentrated1]

I've only been on keto for 4 days, i don't even know if I'm in ketosis noticed my vascularity has been greatly reduced. Is this common or temor not, but I have porary or did this only happen to me?

definitely common this was happening to me as well,IMO get off keto focus more on carbohydrate/protein protein/fat meals,water/sodium/potassium loss occurs commonly onketo diet not to mention glycogen is depleted, andthe body is 70 percent hydrogen, the muscles particularly contain water/sodium/potassium/nitric oxide these are responsible mainly for giving you that pumped filled look inyour muscles, when you are on keto these are all depleted.my advice is forget keto eat protein fat carbs/protein meals never all 3 combined or at least have almost all 3 identical as its impossible, for example in the protein/fat meals keep carbs the lowest, for carbs/protein keep fat the lowest,consume carbohydrates the highest glycemic as soon as possible during the day then consume your lower gis in the middle of the day until the point that you are consuming no carbohydrates by the evening/night, this is just what I found that its the best way to get lean/build muscle and maintain optimal energy ive TRIED ALL DIETS and this is what generally works for me and most people. but like I said and you will find the best way to know what works for you is through the process of trial and error.

[Mackenna]

I was gaining fat at a rapid pace on a higher carbs ratio. I am not cutting with keto, I am just eating maintanance, if not slightly above, which for me right now which is about 1700cal. I've never eaten this much calories a day before, I usuallyy ate about 1500 tops. I am sub 100 lbs. That pic is about 2 yrs old, although I don't believe I've changed much at all. I enjoy the foods on keto more..just trying it out.

[concentrated1]

It's probably due to the immediate loss of water one experiences when going no/low carb.

However, I'm wondering what your goals are because judging by your avatar/measurements on bodyspace, you don't loook like you have any fat to lose.

not to get off topic but you look very attractive in your tri pic number 16

[Mackenna]

definitely common this was happening to me as well,IMO get off keto focus more on carbohydrate/protein protein/fat meals,water/sodium/potassium loss occurs commonly onketo diet not to mention glycogen is depleted, andthe body is 70 percent hydrogen, the muscles particularly contain water/sodium/potassium/nitric oxide these are responsible mainly for giving you that pumped filled look inyour muscles, when you are on keto these are all depleted.my advice is forget keto eat protein fat carbs/protein meals never all 3 combined or at least have almost all 3 identical as its impossible, for example in the protein/fat meals keep carbs the lowest, for carbs/protein keep fat the lowest,consume carbohydrates the highest glycemic as soon as possible during the day then consume your lower gis in the middle of the day until the point that you are consuming no carbohydrates by the evening/night, this is just what I found that its the best way to get lean/build muscle and maintain optimal energy ive TRIED ALL DIETS and this is what generally works for me and most people. but like I said and you will find the best way to know what works for you is through the process of trial and error.

thank you! I'm going to give keto a shot for a month or 2 and then see what I want to do next. I appreciate your info, thanks!

[concentrated1]

I was gaining fat at a rapid pace on a higher carbs ratio. I am not cutting with keto, I am just eating maintanance, if not slightly above, which for me right now which is about 1700cal. I've never eaten this much calories a day before, I usuallyy ate about 1500 tops. I am sub 100 lbs. That pic is about 2 yrs old, although I don't believe I've changed much at all. I enjoy the foods on keto more..just trying it out.

im not suggesting a high carb diet but I suggest if you worry about having pumps and your vasculary to maximize that YOU MUST consume an adequate amount of water/carbs/potassium theres just no way around it/keto diets are low carbs and i think you should try 1 gram of carbs per pound or at least 100 a day if your worried about vascularity/

[concentrated1]

thank you! I'm going to give keto a shot for a month or 2 and then see what I want to do next. I appreciate your info, thanks!

sure im no expert but ive been on and off on these things and I know these things are proven facts,if your on keto DO NOT expect muscle gain or increased vascularity if you have unless you have a high body fat.

[concentrated1]

thank you! I'm going to give keto a shot for a month or 2 and then see what I want to do next. I appreciate your info, thanks!

sure im no expert but ive been on and off dieting/training and I know these things are proven facts,if your on keto DO NOT expect muscle gain or increased vascularity unless you have a high body fat to begin with,vascularity is mostly about genetics if you just focus on losing the fat you will improve your vascularity as vascularity improves with lower body fat, BUTyou must be losing fat while maintaining complete hydration and full glycogen stores, to maximize vascularity. complete hydration meaning full glycogen stores/lots of potassium/lots of sodium. if you drink a lot of water and your on keto taht doesnt help as every time there is water loss there is sodium/potassium lost especially in the urine.

[jaim91]

I know these things are proven facts,if your on keto DO NOT expect muscle gain

Do you have scientific research? "Proven"? Says who?

I think there are a lot of members on this board who have successfully cut with keto and gained LBM while losing fat, and also many members who bulked on keto and gained LBM while gaining minimal fat.

[concentrated1]

Do you have scientific research? "Proven"? Says who?

I think there are a lot of members on this board who have successfully cut with keto and gained LBM while losing fat, and also many members who bulked on keto and gained LBM while gaining minimal fat.

boy I said you looked cute in one pic and this is the thanks i get lol, anyway I SAID DO NOT EXPECT MUSCLE GAIN, I didnt say it wouldnt happen its mostly about calories in vs. calories out but If your on a restricted caloric diet which he said he was on do not expect muscle gain am I wrong?how can you go in a restricted calorie diet while especially on a keto diet and expect muscle gain?you need an insulin spike throughout the day to ensure amino acids get shuttled into muscle glycogen on a bulk. many of these people who gained LBMwhile losing fat ARE NOOBS who get noob gains, Im talking about experienced serious minded individuals who take this seriously. How can you expect to gain muscle when your glycogen stores are depleted seriously??????your body adapts and decreases its glycogen stores and usesfat fore energy but the body uses mostly glycogen for weight lifting, NOOBS can gain muscle while losing fat because their body can tap into fat reserves because its readily availablebut those who are lean will just lose a large amount of muscle as the body relies on stored glycogen for energy in weight lifting.

[Muscle Mania Malky]

I get HYOOOOOOGE vascularity on my carb-up days on ckd. Its awsome. I love it.

[jaim91]

boy I said you looked cute in one pic and this is the thanks i get lol, anyway I SAID DO NOT EXPECT MUSCLE GAIN, I didnt say it wouldnt happen its mostly about calories in vs. calories out but If your on a restricted caloric diet which he said he was on do not expect muscle gain am I wrong?how can you go in a restricted calorie diet while especially on a keto diet and expect muscle gain?you need an insulin spike throughout the day to ensure amino acids get shuttled into muscle glycogen on a bulk. many of these people who gained LBMwhile losing fat ARE NOOBS who get noob gains, Im talking about experienced serious minded individuals who take this seriously. How can you expect to gain muscle when your glycogen stores are depleted seriously??????your body adapts and decreases its glycogen stores and usesfat fore energy but the body uses mostly glycogen for weight lifting, NOOBS can gain muscle while losing fat because their body can tap into fat reserves because its readily availablebut those who are lean will just lose a large amount of muscle as the body relies on stored glycogen for energy in weight lifting.

If you (hypothetically) weigh 200 lbs, and your bf% is 20 then your LBM = 160 lbs.

If you go on keto, lose 20 lbs, and now have 8% bf, your LBM = 166.

Even though that's a small difference, it's still a gain in muscle.

[concentrated1]

If you (hypothetically) weigh 200 lbs, and your bf% is 20 then your LBM = 160 lbs.

If you go on keto, lose 20 lbs, and now have 8% bf, your LBM = 166.

Even though that's a small difference, it's still a gain in muscle.

yeah but you reinforced my statement 20 percent body fat is high. and usually people with that high body fat are noobs and I said that with that high body fat its easy for your body to tap into body fat for energy.GENETICS also plays a large role as well.but all I was saying DO NOT EXPECT MUSCLE GAIN wwho the heck expects muscle gain on keto when your glycogen stores are depleted.

[Mourning Tide]

yeah but you reinforced my statement 20 percent body fat is high. and usually people with that high body fat are noobs and I said that with that high body fat its easy for your body to tap into body fat for energy.GENETICS also plays a large role as well.but all I was saying DO NOT EXPECT MUSCLE GAIN wwho the heck expects muscle gain on keto when your glycogen stores are depleted.

Thats a pretty ignorant statement, as you become adapted to using fat as a fuel source your workouts will soon reach and commonly exceed your strength levels and intensity in the gym from a carbohydrate-fueled workout.

[muruku]

isnt 20-25% bf actually considered normal for adult males ?

[jaim91]

isnt 20-25% bf actually considered normal for adult males ?

It's REALLY good for an adult female

P.S. Mourningtide - Great point!

[Druluv75]

Concentrate makes a couple good points,
that when body fat levels start to drop to very low more muscle may be burned for energy, but to stop the body from using or burning muscle you have to increase your dietary fat. Its not the protein in the diet that is protein sparring its the dietary or body fat that keep protein from being burned. Your genetics will say how lean you can get, after that you have to work harder to obtain the lower bodyfat ideals.

If Mackenna already notices that she accumulates fats while eating carbs, so the right course is to eliminate as much carbs as necessary to start losing bodyfat. Carbs offer no benefits to humans, I'm not saying to eliminate all carbs, however, I'm saying that you need to eat carbs is a totally false statement. I will never recommend carbs to any one, the more you do without the better. If you see you are starting to accumulate bodyfat, before you start reducing calories, start reducing carbs. Gaining bodyfat while eating carbs is a sign that you are starting to have problems using carbohydrates. Anyone ever notice that good carbs are the carbs where only some of the total carbohydrates is absorb (fiber).

As far as gaining lean mass, its all about the hormones. If you keep insulin levels low, your body will produce more Growth Hormone (GH). How do you think children grow. When GH is high, you will gain lean mass without lifting weights, even though weight lifting will make this process happen faster. The only problem is that excessive exercise and cardio limits the production of GH.

[Mackenna]

Concentrate makes a couple good points,
that when body fat levels start to drop to very low more muscle may be burned for energy, but to stop the body from using or burning muscle you have to increase your dietary fat. Its not the protein in the diet that is protein sparring its the dietary or body fat that keep protein from being burned. Your genetics will say how lean you can get, after that you have to work harder to obtain the lower bodyfat ideals.

If Mackenna already notices that she accumulates fats while eating carbs, so the right course is to eliminate as much carbs as necessary to start losing bodyfat. Carbs offer no benefits to humans, I'm not saying to eliminate all carbs, however, I'm saying that you need to eat carbs is a totally false statement. I will never recommend carbs to any one, the more you do without the better. If you see you are starting to accumulate bodyfat, before you start reducing calories, start reducing carbs. Gaining bodyfat while eating carbs is a sign that you are starting to have problems using carbohydrates. Anyone ever notice that good carbs are the carbs where only some of the total carbohydrates is absorb (fiber).

As far as gaining lean mass, its all about the hormones. If you keep insulin levels low, your body will produce more Growth Hormone (GH). How do you think children grow. When GH is high, you will gain lean mass without lifting weights, even though weight lifting will make this process happen faster. The only problem is that excessive exercise and cardio limits the production of GH.

wow, thank you for that, it explained a lot to me.

[concentrated1]

Concentrate makes a couple good points,
that when body fat levels start to drop to very low more muscle may be burned for energy, but to stop the body from using or burning muscle you have to increase your dietary fat. Its not the protein in the diet that is protein sparring its the dietary or body fat that keep protein from being burned. Your genetics will say how lean you can get, after that you have to work harder to obtain the lower bodyfat ideals.

If Mackenna already notices that she accumulates fats while eating carbs, so the right course is to eliminate as much carbs as necessary to start losing bodyfat. Carbs offer no benefits to humans, I'm not saying to eliminate all carbs, however, I'm saying that you need to eat carbs is a totally false statement. I will never recommend carbs to any one, the more you do without the better. If you see you are starting to accumulate bodyfat, before you start reducing calories, start reducing carbs. Gaining bodyfat while eating carbs is a sign that you are starting to have problems using carbohydrates. Anyone ever notice that good carbs are the carbs where only some of the total carbohydrates is absorb (fiber).

As far as gaining lean mass, its all about the hormones. If you keep insulin levels low, your body will produce more Growth Hormone (GH). How do you think children grow. When GH is high, you will gain lean mass without lifting weights, even though weight lifting will make this process happen faster. The only problem is that excessive exercise and cardio limits the production of GH.

lol man the noobs ugh and i expected better from jaim as well who has weight lifting experience, you pretty much repeated what I said HOWEVER testosterone is the main hormone responsible for growth in muscles and testosterone is maximally secreted under the presence of carbs as the insulin released when carbs are released into the bloodstream signals the protein being consumed to enter the bloodstream, however I dont see how carbs are useless their very important within the diet to consume necessary vitamins and minerals.also mackenna there are many posts and articles from scientists within this site so feel freeto use the SEARCH function.

[concentrated1]

[QUOTE=Druluv75;84954623]

by the way dude im in Queens, gotta show the NY power.

[concentrated1]

Thats a pretty ignorant statement, as you become adapted to using fat as a fuel source your workouts will soon reach and commonly exceed your strength levels and intensity in the gym from a carbohydrate-fueled workout.

that is b/s as more time you spend on a low carb diet your performance which may have decreased from the initial drop in carbs which deplenished your glycogen stores your performance will increase from the decreased glycogen stores causing the body to relie less on carbs and reduce its glycogen size,HOWEVER your weight lifting relies primarily on stored glycogen it may dip into very little fat for energy and use A LOT of muscle protein for energy during the excercise. basically no matter how much your body all adapts it will ALWAYS primarily need CARBOHYDRATES stored within the muscles to fuel its excercise, and as bodyfat diminishes itwill rely more on stored muscle protein and thats when the body becomes catabolic, not good if you ask me.

[Rugger7]

this is just a thought.. but shouldn't you be more vascular on keto because of the water loss? Don't bodybuilders take diuretics to increase their vascularity for shows?

[Druluv75]

There are a couple of things we need to understand. Lean people metabolize carbohydrates more efficiently than obese people. Naturally lean people store and burn fat from their fat cells much easier than naturally obese people. Lean people can be so efficient at using up stored fat that they need carbs in their diets or else they feel drained. The body cares nothing for a six-pack; and would rather burn up muscle in order to save fat on the frame. This may be the reason some lean people find it hard to drop carbohydrate levels low. Lean people are much better adapted in the world that we live in today than people who are obese. I would even bet through natural selection, than lean people will soon dominate over obese people because of their ability to use carbohydrates. I should add after time that some lean people can lose their ability to metabolize carbohydrates, and will become obese if their pancreatic systems start to downgrade from overuse.

Being obese has more to do with how your fat cells operate. Fat cells are not just static devices used to store extra fuel. Fat cells have a rich supply of blood vessels and are constantly being used through out the day for energy needs. The problem with obese people is that fat comes in but little comes out. This could be the reason why obese people are constantly hungry. The fat is coming in, but little is coming out for energy needs. So even though you are eating a bunch of food, the cells within the body is starving for energy but the fat cells are not releasing it. Now this can be that obese people push out too much insulin, so the body is in constant storage mode, and this hormone can stunt the fat cells release of fat for energy. Obese people have lots to worry about with this phenomenon, because if obese people still insist on using low calories/ high carb/ low fat means of losing weight, this diet structure will ultimately put the body in starvation mode. The high carbs will still keep insulin levels high, making it difficult for fat to leave the fat cells. Thus causing the body to eat away at lean mass. So the end result is a skinny fat person. They look skinny but they still have the same body fat % as when they were obese, and the weight that was lost was mostly lean mass. This is why most dieters fail or only the most dedicated can actually survive this set-up.

So when obese people control their insulin by lessen the storage mode of the powerful hormone, their fat cells can start releasing more fat for energy. This may be the reason why most keto dieters are less hungry during the keto phase of the diet; more energy coming from their fat cells. Now this doesn't necessarily mean that the body will give up more body fat to get to get ultra lean. However, a controlled insulin environment makes it possible. We are still governed by our genetics , your DNA will dictate how lean you can naturally get when eating fats & protein, ultra lean or to achieve unnatural leanness is where the individual has to takes over.

[concentrated1]

this is just a thought.. but shouldn't you be more vascular on keto because of the water loss? Don't bodybuilders take diuretics to increase their vascularity for shows?

NO not neccessarly the diuretic is to shed EXCESS sodium and water and may even dehydrate you but not all body builders restrict water, in fact when using diuretics you should maintain your water amount to about the same to prevent cramps and other health issues,HOWEVER bbers supplement with a banana or a fruit or potassium caps as potassium is responsible for cramps and a lot of potassium is lost with diuretics. and the water and potassium can compensate for the sodium loss to prevent cramps and health issues for some time and degree.

[Druluv75]

Thighs Looking Good Rugger! no homo

[concentrated1]

. I would even bet through natural selection, than lean people will soon dominate over obese people because of their ability to use carbohydrates. I should add after time that some lean people can lose their ability to metabolize carbohydrates, and will become obese if their pancreatic systems start to downgrade from overuse.
.

really? you really think so?