Instead of bragging about what we have, should we be talking about how we help others

[eddiehaskell]

If he is living off his woman's income, that is pretty messed up, and completely un-Biblical (OP claims to be a Christian)...I understand if your woman makes more, but as a man, especially a Christian man, you should still be providing and working, not sitting around while she does the work.

McD's is just straight poison, maybe once a moth or once every couple weeks as a treat, but never as a meal replacement on the regular


edit-did not see your post Anachron, good he isn't living off his woman

Brother -- I have acquired quite the following online. If there is anything you want to know about me personally I suggest you privately message me.

[Paul Kreul]

Sure -- if you're BOASTING -- as in give ME the credit for what I have done. As a Christian your acts should be done with a pure heart and in honor the mercy/love/kindness that God bestowed upon through Jesus Christ...extolling the joys those acts give you is not boasting.

It is boasting because God commanded you to do your good deeds in secret and not display them in public...our "public" today is/are "public forums". You may be anonymous to others here but you aren't anonymous to God.

Do what you want, I'm just telling you what is Biblically true.

Even the non-believers ITT grasp this

[eddiehaskell]

Great thread OP

Thank you.

[Anachron]

Brother -- I have acquired quite the following online. If there is anything you want to know about me personally I suggest you privately message me.

Translation : You've been exposed for the fraud you are, on multiple forums.

Hopefully your daughter finds a father figure in her life before she ends up having daddy issues.

[Godfrd824]

The thing about lies is that you have to keep track of them, and eventually you forget and let out the truth. This has happened to the OP multiple times. My thing is, why lie at all?

[georgeenoob]

Translation : You've been exposed for the fraud you are, on multiple forums.

Hopefully your daughter finds a father figure in her life before she ends up having daddy issues.

Why you gotta be such a Debbie downer?

[Anachron]

Why you gotta be such a Debbie downer?

OP is a known fraud.

¯\_ (ツ)_/¯

[eddiehaskell]

It is boasting because God commanded you to do your good deeds in secret and not display them in public...our "public" today is/are "public forums". You may be anonymous to others here but you aren't anonymous to God.

Do what you want, I'm just telling you what is Biblically true.

Even the non-believers ITT grasp this

https://www.epm.org/resources/2010/M...e-kept-secret/

When one man received an automated tax receipt from his church indicating he’d given no money the previous year, he was outraged. He said he was obeying Scripture by not letting his left hand know what his right hand had given. Giving was to be so secret, he thought, that even he shouldn’t know how much he was giving. (Apparently he didn’t know he hadn’t given anything.)

A closer look at this passage, and the rest of Scripture, demonstrates this is not a valid interpretation.

In Matthew 6, Jesus deals with motives, something the religious elite often failed to examine. He starts with the broad category of “acts of righteousness,” then moves to three such acts—giving, prayer, and fasting. This is not an exhaustive list. In their teaching, rabbis often spoke in groups of threes. Jesus could have added Bible reading, feeding the poor, or raising children. Today, we might include going on mission trips or attending a particular college or church. The idea is that any “act of righteousness” (or badge of spirituality) can accord us spiritual status in the eyes of others.

The most important verse, the one that sets up the entire passage, is the first: “Be careful not to do your ‘acts of righteousness’ before men, to be seen by them” (Matthew 6:1). The operative phrase is “to be seen by them.” This is not a prohibition against others becoming aware of our giving, prayers, fasting, Bible study, feeding the poor, missions work, or church attendance. Rather, it’s a command not to do these things in order to receive the recognition of men. Jesus continues, “If you do [that is, if you do good things to win human approval], you will have no reward from your Father in heaven.” The problem isn’t doing good things with reward in mind—it’s looking for the reward from men rather than from God.

Then Jesus says, “When you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored by men” (Matthew 6:2). Trumpet blowing may seem silly. There’s no record that this was actually done. It seems to be satirical or humorous, a caricature of less obvious (to us anyway) things we do to get attention. But Christ’s focus is the reason for which hypocrites draw attention to what they’ve done: “to be honored by men.” Again, Christ’s argument is not that our giving should never be seen, but only that we should never divulge it in order to get human recognition. When that happens, “I tell you the truth, they have received their reward in full” (Matthew 6:5).

If we give in order to get men’s praises, we’ll get what we seek—college wings named after us, dinner invitations from heads of ministries, our names inscribed on pews or bricks, appointment to boards, or seeing our names on a plaque and in the newspaper. But in getting what we seek, we will lose what we should have sought—God’s approval.

Let’s look at the verses we started with: “So when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, so that your giving may be in secret” (Matthew 6:3-4).

This is a figure of speech. It’s hyperbole, a deliberate overstatement, which would have been immediately clear to the hearers. That Christ’s command cannot be literal is self-evident, because a hand lacks the ability to know anything, and besides the person’s brain would know what both the right hand and the left hand were doing. There is no center of intelligence in one hand as opposed to the other, nor is there an ability for the brain to withhold information from one hand while disclosing it to the other. We aren’t able to throw a switch so that we don’t know we’re giving or that we have given.

So what’s Christ’s point? Do your giving quietly, unobtrusively. Don’t cough loudly just as you’re giving. Don’t slam-dunk your offering in the plate. Drop your check in the offering or send it in the mail without drawing attention to yourself. Fold the check. Keep the envelope sealed. Give in a spirit of humility and simplicity, as an act of worship. Don’t give in order to get your name on a list. Don’t give in a spirit of self-congratulation. Don’t dwell on your gift, fixating on it, building a mental shrine to yourself. In other words, don’t make a big production out of it, either in view of others or in the privacy of your own heart.

This verse cannot mean that we should—or even that we can—be unaware of our own giving, any more than we could be unaware of our praying, fasting, Bible reading, or evangelism. To suggest that it does would remove the discerning, thoughtful elements of giving, praying, fasting, and all other spiritual disciplines.

But can this verse mean it’s always wrong for others to know that we’ve given? No. Acts 2:45 tells of Christians selling possessions and giving to the needy. Did other people know who had done this? In many cases, the answer would be obvious. These people knew each other. If you no longer had your prize camels, coat, or oxcart, and Caleb ben Judah did, people would figure it out. Acts 4:32-35 tells us about more people liquidating assets. Most names, which would mean nothing to us, aren’t recorded, but they were surely known at the time.

But some givers were named even for our benefit. Acts 4:36-37 tells us that Barnabas sold a field and brought the money to the feet of the apostles. If Barnabas was looking for status and prestige, his motive was wrong. But it’s certainly false to say that it was wrong for others to be made aware of his gift, because Scripture itself reveals it! Barnabas’s act of generosity was commonly known among the believers and was publicly and permanently recorded in Acts. This was good and right, and did not violate Matthew 6’s warning about bad motives.

You may want to read the entire article. I don't say this to nessecarily win the argument, but as exercise in us both deepening our understanding.

[Paul Kreul]

https://www.epm.org/resources/2010/M...e-kept-secret/

You may want to read the entire article. I don't say this to nessecarily win the argument, but as exercise in us both deepening our understanding.

Don't agree with all of this person's take, and never even heard of this website...but re-read it..it affirms what I have been saying, it isn't supporting your argument.

"This is not a prohibition against others becoming aware of our giving, prayers, fasting, Bible study, feeding the poor, missions work, or church attendance. Rather, it’s a command not to do these things in order to receive the recognition of men."


Nobody here would be aware of your good deeds unless you posted them for all to see on display and be recognized by the men and women here..

[r32gojirra]

Cliffs on why OP has such hatred in his heart?

[eddiehaskell]

Don't agree with all of this person's take, and never even heard of this website...but re-read it..it affirms what I have been saying, it isn't supporting your argument.

"This is not a prohibition against others becoming aware of our giving, prayers, fasting, Bible study, feeding the poor, missions work, or church attendance. Rather, it’s a command not to do these things in order to receive the recognition of men."


Nobody here would be aware of your good deeds unless you posted them for all to see on display and be recognized by the men and women here..

And therein lies the crux of the issue. Is one speaking about giving to receive praise from man or is it done as testimony to honor God?

The article (for those interested) goes on to say:

In Matthew 6, it’s clear that whatever’s true of giving is also true of praying and fasting. Jesus says in verse 6, “When you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen.” He’s swinging the pendulum away from the self-conscious, self-serving, image-enhancing prayers for which the Pharisees were notorious. But did he mean that all prayer must be private? No. Scripture has many examples of public and corporate prayer. Every time a pastor or worship leader prays in church, every time parents pray with their children, or husbands pray with wives, or families pray before dinner, or someone prays with the person being led to Christ, it demonstrates the falseness of the notion that it’s always wrong to be seen or heard by others when you pray.

Jesus tells us to pray in secret, and God will reward us (Matthew 6:6). Yet gathering for group prayer is certainly important (Matthew 18:19-20). God wants us to pray secretly sometimes but not others. And so it follows that he wants us to give secretly sometimes but not others. It all comes down to the motives of our hearts and the purpose of disclosure.

Just as Matthew 6:6 doesn’t mean it’s always wrong to let others hear you pray, Matthew 6:3-4 doesn’t mean it’s always wrong to let others be aware of your giving. Because Jesus groups giving, praying, and fasting as the three acts of righteousness in this passage, whatever applies to one applies to the others.

Treasure PrincipleWhen the poor widow gave, she gave publicly—Jesus could actually see the two coins. He used her as a public illustration (Luke 21:1-4). So, it was right that she gave in public, and it was right that people were told the exact amount of her gift. Her motives were right. The public disclosure did nothing to nullify her good heart.

....

We shouldn’t brag about our Bible study, prayer, evangelism, parenting, or giving, but neither should we cover it up. It’s easier for people to follow footprints (what we do) than commands (what we say). If we aren’t willing to openly and humbly discuss our giving, how can we expect to raise up givers? The church has plenty of examples of consumers—we need to see examples of givers. Hebrews 10:24 tells us to “spur one another on toward love and good deeds.” We can only be spurred on by what we can see.

[Godfrd824]

Cliffs on why OP has such hatred in his heart?

It's hard out here when one refuses to get a job and has kids out of wedlock.

[Paul Kreul]

And therein lies the crux of the issue. Is one speaking about giving to receive praise from man or is it done as testimony to honor God?

The article (for those interested) goes on to say:

"We can only be spurred on by what others see".

This is not true, nor Biblical and again, what others see you doing (not for show boating) is much different than telling others of the deeds you have done..so again, supporting my argument..not yours.

If you want to honor God than you do what He commanded and preach His Word, give your testimony, not boast about works

[eddiehaskell]

I will also add that my church is all about the "the next step" being to get involved. And getting involved often means very public acts of giving and volunteering. My pastor will often have sermons about those very public acts being a way to engage in the body of Christ as Christians. Now could there be people engaging publicly without a pure heart only to receive praise and recognition from man? Sure. But there can also be people not acting in secret because God has put it on their heart to do so.

[Akd123]

Whats with all these self righteous POS ph@ggot holy rollers acting like they are better than everyone lately? You maybe a Christian but your all going to hell for being ph@ggots according to your "God" so all your brownie points mean nothing. Suck on them apples ph@ggot

[Tanerian]

Honest question.

At no point in your title or post did you ask a question tho.

[eddiehaskell]

"We can only be spurred on by what others see".

This is not true, nor Biblical and again, what others see you doing (not for show boating) is much different than telling others of the deeds you have done..so again, supporting my argument..not yours.

If you want to honor God than you do what He commanded and preach His Word, give your testimony, not boast about works

Did you read the article fully?

The body of Christ needs to let its light shine before men, and we need models of every spiritual discipline. We dare not let the risk of our pride keep us from faithfully disclosing God’s work in this area of our lives. And if we must be silent to avoid our own pride, we should support others who can humbly testify to Christ’s faithfulness in their giving.

Our motive for not talking about our giving is not always humility. Sometimes it’s fear, doubt and, yes, even pride. To vulnerably express to others where we are on our pilgrimage to generous giving can be an act of humility. We must always check our motives, but it certainly doesn’t have to be an act of pride.

We shouldn’t brag about our Bible study, prayer, evangelism, parenting, or giving, but neither should we cover it up. It’s easier for people to follow footprints (what we do) than commands (what we say). If we aren’t willing to openly and humbly discuss our giving, how can we expect to raise up givers? The church has plenty of examples of consumers—we need to see examples of givers. Hebrews 10:24 tells us to “spur one another on toward love and good deeds.” We can only be spurred on by what we can see.

R. G. LeTourneau was a great inspiration to me. He gave away 90% of his income, motivating me to raise the bar of my giving. I’m eternally grateful that he told his giving story.

Let me also ask you this: do you only support prayer done in private?

In Matthew 6, it’s clear that whatever’s true of giving is also true of praying and fasting. Jesus says in verse 6, “When you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen.”

[eddiehaskell]

Whats with all these self righteous POS ph@ggot holy rollers acting like they are better than everyone lately? You maybe a Christian but you're all going to hell for being ph@ggots according to your "God" so all your brownie points mean nothing. Suck on them apples ph@ggot

I'm not sure where I said I was better than anyone...perhaps that's just an internal bias you project to anyone speaking of God in your presence?

[Paul Kreul]

Did you read the article fully?



Let me also ask you this: do you only support prayer done in private?

I do not agree with that article whatsoever, it is not Biblical. If you want a good commentary read Spurgen, Henry, or even Chuck Smith. What you are reading is not Biblical.

[eddiehaskell]

I do not agree with that article whatsoever, it is not Biblical. If you want a good commentary read Spurgen, Henry, or even Chuck Smith. What you are reading is not Biblical.

I'm open to reading any source you can quote or link to that backs that any mention of giving (or public prayer) is not Biblical.

[Akd123]

I'm not sure where I said I was better than anyone...perhaps that's just an internal bias you project to anyone speaking of God in your presence?

Dont play coy with me. you know exactly what your doing. im not a Christian but i hope there is a hell for you ph@ggots

[Paul Kreul]

I'm open to reading any source you can quote or link to that backs that any mention of giving (or public prayer) is not Biblical.

You are changing my argument in an attempt to save face. I stated Scripture that goes in line with not publicly touting your good deeds before man..what is exactly what this thread would be doing. You then claimed it would be anonymous so it is not known, I reminded you that it is not anonymous before God..which is the entire point.

[eddiehaskell]

You are changing my argument in an attempt to save face. I stated Scripture that goes in line with not publicly touting your good deeds before man..what is exactly what this thread would be doing. You then claimed it would be anonymous so it is not known, I reminded you that it is not anonymous before God..which is the entire point.

Your argument based on that ONE word has been shown to not hold water and is a mischaracterization of what I've said. To speak of giving is NOT inherently "touting your good deeds before man" if the glory is given to God.

BTW -- just read nearly an entire sermon by Spergeon on giving -- full of stories of people that had indeed given. Stories that by not being private are a testimony to God and in the end serve one of our greatest callings on Earth -- to make disciples.

[Paul Kreul]

Your argument based on that ONE word has been shown to not hold water and is a mischaracterization of what I've said. To speak of giving is NOT inherently "touting your good deeds before man" if the glory is given to God.

BTW -- just read nearly an entire sermon by Spergeon on giving -- full of stories of people that had indeed given.

But this thread would BE touting of your good deeds.

I'll tell you what, go ahead and tell us what you wanted to initially by making this thread, and see if it gets the reaction you were looking for and leads people to Christ

[eddiehaskell]

But this thread would BE touting of your good deeds.

I'll tell you what, go ahead and tell us what you wanted to initially by making this thread, and see if it gets the reaction you were looking for and leads people to Christ

You mean the thread where I haven't mentioned any good deeds -- only that on a conceptual level we should look more favorably on giving instead wealth? To stir up such a question I'm simply asking people to search their hearts on what's more important in life -- what you've done for others or what what material wealth you've accumulated.

[Godfrd824]

OP has yet to post a single instance in which he has helped anyone in any way. I'm still waiting.

You mean the thread where I haven't mentioned any good deeds -- only that on a conceptual level we should look more favorably on giving instead wealth? To stir up such a question I'm simply asking people to search their hearts on what's more important in life -- what you've done for others or what what material wealth you've accumulated.

You made a thread about how we should be talking about how we help others. That's nothing conceptual about that. And yet you haven't provided even one example.

[Ironmanlet]

No need to talk about being good. Just do it.


Marcus Aurelius sponsored by Nike.

[eddiehaskell]

No need to talk about being good. Just do it.


Marcus Aurelius sponsored by Nike.

I like it!

[Paul Kreul]

You mean the thread where I haven't mentioned any good deeds -- only that on a conceptual level we should look more favorably on giving instead wealth? To stir up such a question I'm simply asking people to search their hearts on what's more important in life -- what you've done for others or what what material wealth you've accumulated.

You keep saying what you have done for others...I'm not seeing you post an example and how it glorifies God. God has put me in more situations than I can count where He has given me the opportunity to bless others, but i do not speak of them because I do not tout my good deeds. If I want to glorify God, I minister to someone, I try to relate to them, I speak of the miracles in my life that He has done, I don't brag about my good deeds..I brag about HIS good deeds. One brings glory to you..the other brings glory to God, you may think it brings glory to God..but you are the one speaking of your deeds.

I'm tired of arguing with you, wanna talk about your deeds..go for it. I'm out.

[eddiehaskell]

OP has yet to post a single instance in which he has helped anyone in any way. I'm still waiting.

And this WOULD support what Paul is saying. Would by telling you something I've done be self serving to win a debate? To prove *I* am righteous? More righteous than another man who will accept my good deed as good? Would it come from a place of seeking to win disciples for the Lord?