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03-18-2019, 08:50 AM #91
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03-18-2019, 09:24 AM #92
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03-18-2019, 12:35 PM #93
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How can that be a "fact?"
Let's use your wonky logic for shiz and giggles.
1) Assume protein takes "hours upon hours to digest" - More accurately some proteins depending upon what you ate them with can take upwards for 50 hours to digest
2) Assume that you are not fasting >24 hours nor using IF (lol)
Those assumptions made, you're eating every 4-6 hours except while sleeping meaning your body is constantly digesting food and protein. Since that will be the case, you will always have amino acids feeding the pool. If you are meeting your macro and not fasting >24 hours you will always have amino acids feeding the pool thus supplementing free form amino acids is pointless.
^^^^Facts"I'm pretty sure your wrong, but care to elaborate..."
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TheFugitive, Manwittaplan, and ILPump are all the same guy...socktastic
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03-18-2019, 12:51 PM #94
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03-18-2019, 12:53 PM #95
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03-18-2019, 01:03 PM #96
You are on the right track in that assumptions have to be made unfortunately... which always does f up these discussions. That is why I always phrase it that "WRAATH is worth a try"... these supplements aren't magic, but certainly worth it (compared with other stuff typically already in the shopping cart).
I formulated Purple WRAATH many years ago and it is still going strong. XTEND also deserves mentioning ! There are not a TON of products that stand the test of time in the industry. We went with EAA's for WRAATH because = a superior choice... NOT the ONLY choice ! Our Leucine product was also OUTSTANDING but it directly competed against WRAATH so that's where we went wrong.Last edited by pu12en12g; 03-18-2019 at 01:12 PM.
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03-18-2019, 01:18 PM #97
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03-18-2019, 01:22 PM #98
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03-18-2019, 01:31 PM #99
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03-18-2019, 02:26 PM #100
Physiques never lie and supplementation becomes a factor if you’re serious. Weighing 200lbs and consuming 200 grams of protein isn’t enough, if you believe so step in front of the mirror.
As for the studies, all are flawed and all are funded no matter what they say. If you search hard enough you’ll find the answer to just about anything. The continuous BCAA argument leads me to believe that everyone is still unsure. I personally feel they’re worth using especially if you’re training with intensity.ǝɟıl ɹnoʎ ɟo spuoɔǝs ǝǝɹɥʇ ǝʇsɐʍ llıʍ sıɥʇ ƃuıpɐǝɹ
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03-18-2019, 03:03 PM #101
I can respect where you're coming from, but that first part is highly questionable, and you're grossly simplifying the muscle building process...and for anyone tackling this game with that level of commitment, let's be honest about what type of supplements they're taking that are really making the difference, as well as how one's physiology completely changes under those circumstances, making the muscle building process a completely different game for both camps.
I've pushed well past the 200lb mark without any BCAA supplementation, and I am relatively lean with respectable lifts. I've never noticed any difference between supplementing w BCAA vs getting all my BCAA's through diet. You're arguing based on conjecture and anecdotal experience, and I can do the same. But if that's all we're gonna do, this thread and argument is already tired and played out. Let's just agree to disagree in that case.
As for studies being flawed and funded, no argument there.Last edited by BenBlue; 03-18-2019 at 03:19 PM.
Squat and Deadlift
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03-18-2019, 04:40 PM #102Controlled Labs Warder
Email: Powercage [at] ControlledLabs.com
Free Controlled Labs supps for your CL labels: goo.gl/kylDte
I'm pretty sure your wrong, but care to elaborate...
Disclaimer: The above post is my personal opinion and does not represent the official position of any company or entity. It does not constitute medical advice.
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03-18-2019, 04:52 PM #103
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03-18-2019, 05:00 PM #104
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Yes, you're right that most stuff in the shopping cart is typically wood, but then so are free-form amino acids. Sure, the science behind EAAs is stronger, but in the end, any free-form amino acids deliver little to no value, especially when macros are being met. It makes no sense to supplement 1, 3 or 9 aminos when protein covers it all.
I bought plenty of Wraath and In-train back in the day. The reality? I was misinformed based on what we thought we knew at the time and, as PC's point continues to drive, is that the science of the time was not controlling diet nor total protein intake very well, thus giving skewed results.
There is plenty of leucine, isoleucine, valine, histidine, lysine, methionine, phenylalanine, threonine and tryptophan in the protein we ingest and to imply that free-form aminos including BCAAs are magically more usable because of some theory about pools of aminos being depleted due to non-eating constantly is ridiculous. In the end, why supplement the free-form aminos when protein suffices, has fewer calories per gram and a full spectrum of amino acids?
The key here is that people aren't fasting >24 hours. Since anyone training for body comp goals is not doing that, this argument about pools needing replenishment is seriously flawed. To claim that something is beneficial based on that flawed logic is specious at best."I'm pretty sure your wrong, but care to elaborate..."
Retired account
TheFugitive, Manwittaplan, and ILPump are all the same guy...socktastic
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03-18-2019, 05:26 PM #105Controlled Labs Warder
Email: Powercage [at] ControlledLabs.com
Free Controlled Labs supps for your CL labels: goo.gl/kylDte
I'm pretty sure your wrong, but care to elaborate...
Disclaimer: The above post is my personal opinion and does not represent the official position of any company or entity. It does not constitute medical advice.
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03-18-2019, 05:32 PM #106
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03-18-2019, 05:33 PM #107Controlled Labs Warder
Email: Powercage [at] ControlledLabs.com
Free Controlled Labs supps for your CL labels: goo.gl/kylDte
I'm pretty sure your wrong, but care to elaborate...
Disclaimer: The above post is my personal opinion and does not represent the official position of any company or entity. It does not constitute medical advice.
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03-18-2019, 05:53 PM #108
- Join Date: Sep 2007
- Location: Chicago, Illinois, United States
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alienshave.com - Shave Smarter
steve@alienshave.com
BMBC - Master Level - Worldwide
Original 999,999k Crew
BCAAs Bring all the Boys to the Yard
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03-18-2019, 05:59 PM #109
You never make any relevant points or ask relevant questions. You generally attempt to change the subject, therefore it is very hard to discuss anything with you.
Being the subject of a trial, for instance, does not make you an expert on research methodology.
That’s like suggesting a prisoner understands the wardens job.Controlled Labs Warder
Email: Powercage [at] ControlledLabs.com
Free Controlled Labs supps for your CL labels: goo.gl/kylDte
I'm pretty sure your wrong, but care to elaborate...
Disclaimer: The above post is my personal opinion and does not represent the official position of any company or entity. It does not constitute medical advice.
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03-18-2019, 07:16 PM #110
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03-18-2019, 07:28 PM #111
- Join Date: Sep 2007
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Let's just say I think I have your attention or you wouldn't continue to respond, and I do talk in riddles at times, but thats just to keep you on your toes and focused Seriously, I enjoy your company and efforts, you're one of the few who I know is really passionate about this industry and give the forum your full attention. Whether we agree on BCAAs isn't the point, helping members and keeping this place fun is. Look at the views Keep doing what you do, and I'll see you in the next one
alienshave.com - Shave Smarter
steve@alienshave.com
BMBC - Master Level - Worldwide
Original 999,999k Crew
BCAAs Bring all the Boys to the Yard
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03-18-2019, 07:34 PM #112
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03-19-2019, 06:02 AM #113
Was gonna mention that as well...
Nope. Granted, I've only ever run a trial for maybe a month at a time or so (have received free BCAA products in the past where I ran the bottle straight). Never noticed anything but something nice to sip on while training.Squat and Deadlift
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03-19-2019, 06:27 AM #114
The old BCAA Forum, ay? Not gonna fall for that ****
---Get those Negs ready---
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03-19-2019, 08:27 AM #115
Short answer: your money is better spent on other things. Bcaas are good if your fasting and thats about it.
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03-19-2019, 08:37 AM #116
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03-19-2019, 08:40 AM #117
Personal experience is they did nothing for me, except make me dehydrated (the ones i took contained sodium). I was drinking a whole gallon jug of bcaa's because they don't ****ing mix with any small volume of water on top of a bunch of actual water and protein shakes and milk and coffee and orange juice. It was just too much to drink throughout the day. Try Beta Alanine instead for recovery.
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03-19-2019, 08:47 AM #118
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03-19-2019, 10:38 AM #119
I would like proof that the recent “anti-BCAA” studies are biased and who funded the said biased studies
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03-19-2019, 10:41 AM #120
The problem is the "pro" BCAA studies all have the same glaring holes. Once those holes are accounted for, they do not provide benefit. There is no pro BCAA study that has accounted for protein that shows a practical benefit. At some point, over dozens to hundreds of studies, you realize that's because it doesn't work.
If you can't get it to work over dozens of studies, it 1) is almost certainly placebo and on the very rare off chance it isn't placebo is 2) likely so insignificant as to not matter
That's the problem. Some people try so hard to make it a thing. It's the flat earth of supplements.Controlled Labs Warder
Email: Powercage [at] ControlledLabs.com
Free Controlled Labs supps for your CL labels: goo.gl/kylDte
I'm pretty sure your wrong, but care to elaborate...
Disclaimer: The above post is my personal opinion and does not represent the official position of any company or entity. It does not constitute medical advice.
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