Icarian Super Squat machine

[davemata]

Quick question regarding this piece of equipment, is it a good replacement for squats with free weights?

I'm recovering from an LCL and MCL sprain in both knees and have been ordered off the squat rack for a while. Could super squat be a good long term replacement, or should I invest time getting back on free weights knowing that I'll probably not be able to safely go too far over 150# for a while?

To give an idea of the situation, when I do squat with just the bar I get intense knee pain, on the flip side, I had a leg day and topped out on the Super Squat today at 400# for two sets of five after some high rep work for stamina.

The super squat seems to have a great ROM, even though I lose the workout for the assisting muscles. I'd just like some thoughts on the pros/cons of using a machine over free weights.

[ironwill2008]

Based on your post, you don't seem to have any choice; any difference in the effectiveness of one over the other is a moot point for you.

Do what you can do, and don't worry about what you can't do.

[Kodokan]

I'm wondering if the machine is guiding you down a path where you may be sitting back more, with your knees going not as far out over your toes.

Do you normally squat high-bar, low-bar, front squat?

I found personally the stress on my knees was drastically reduced when switching from front squats to low bar, box squats. There might be something you can do with free squats by changing your stance, style, etc...but certainly you should stay away from pain.

And if the machine is the only thing letting you go pain free right now, then obviously that's the way to go. But you could consider some other form changes using just the bar and experiment to see if you can do it with no pain.

I think you could ask in the exercise section, and post a video of your form there, and get some solid advice regarding how to reduce strain on your knees with your squat form if you were so inclined.

[davemata]

Based on your post, you don't seem to have any choice; any difference in the effectiveness of one over the other is a moot point for you.

Do what you can do, and don't worry about what you can't do.

Totally true. I just have this belief that if I were to work the free weights often at low weights, I might eventually be able to get over these problems.

I was also concerned last night that this particular machine isn't much of a workout, or assists too much. The deep seated soreness in my hams today has me less concerned.

[davemata]

Do you normally squat high-bar, low-bar, front squat?

I found personally the stress on my knees was drastically reduced when switching from front squats to low bar, box squats. There might be something you can do with free squats by changing your stance, style, etc...but certainly you should stay away from pain.

I think you could ask in the exercise section, and post a video of your form there, and get some solid advice regarding how to reduce strain on your knees with your squat form if you were so inclined.

I'll do fronts and high-bar since I lack the flexibility to do low-bar. Now, front squats are killer for me, the more upright position seems to stress my knees badly and hurt almost from the start of the movement.

The high-bar is a little more comfortable, and if I'm going to have pain that rep it will be during the lift upward to standing.

If I can get someone to tape it I think I'll post a vid in the exercise section, that's a great idea - thanks. I'm sure it's a form issue, I've used the leg sleds for years, but wanted to learn squats back in January, and just lack a solid example for proper form.

Just curious, but did the form changes adjust the centerline of the movement taking it off your knees as much? Also, just for a point of reference, how close to the plane of your toes do your knees move?

[ironwill2008]

Totally true. I just have this belief that if I were to work the free weights often at low weights, I might eventually be able to get over these problems.

If your issue is form-related, rather than medical-related, then this could be true.

I was also concerned last night that this particular machine isn't much of a workout, or assists too much. The deep seated soreness in my hams today has me less concerned.

Any exercise done correctly, and with progression, will result in gains. Your muscles neither know nor care what the source of the resistance might be.

[STR8OUT]

I just sold a York Super Squat (basically the same machine just cheaper) for like $300 or something. I got it out of a gym and it was pretty commercially built with bearings and all. Would save you a few bucks

[davemata]

If your issue is form-related, rather than medical-related, then this could be true.

Right, I don't really gain anything by pushing before it's safe.

I'm not going to sweat it much then if I can still progress, and I'm sore the next day. Keeping pushing as hard as possible on it, then readjust later.

Thanks.

[Kodokan]

Regarding form, I believe the further out over your toes your knees go the more stress is going to be on them. So, it would be most in fronts, and then less in high bar, and then even less in low bar.

For me, doing the low bar squats, and sitting back more to the box...my shins are more vertical and knees don't go out over the toes. It felt much better than front squats on my knees.

[davemata]

For me, doing the low bar squats, and sitting back more to the box...my shins are more vertical and knees don't go out over the toes. It felt much better than front squats on my knees.

I'll keep that in mind, I'll give some low bar squats a try - sitting back further, keeping the lower leg more vertical and not going past 90 degrees.

Thanks.

[thindoctor]

Why can I do 8 reps of 810 lbs on this super squat machine and I can hardly do 1 rep of 315 on a regular freestyle squat?

[daniel327]

Why can I do 8 reps of 810 lbs on this super squat machine and I can hardly do 1 rep of 315 on a regular freestyle squat?

The machine is helping you overcome your weakness.

[SomeIronBoy]

Why can I do 8 reps of 810 lbs on this super squat machine and I can hardly do 1 rep of 315 on a regular freestyle squat?

It's a machine, your body really doesn't need to balance itself. With a bar it does.