How/when can deep squats damage the posterior menisci?

[F1eld]

Have any of you ever developed pain AT THE BACK of your knee(s) from doing alot of atg squatting ?

I know all the hoopla about deep squatting and how it is perfectly healthy for you, and for the most part i would agree , and i myself have made sure to go for 95-100 degrees of hip flexion when squatting.

A while ago i read one of Mike Boyle's books "Advances in Functional Training" and in one section he briefly talks about how deep squatting (going way past parallel) can potentially cause damage to the posterior horn of the meniscus (meniscus at the back of the knee)

I have personally started to develop a nagging pain in the back of my right knee over the past few months which will pretty much only occur during knee flexion past 90 degrees (be it either sitting on my calves, grabbing my foot and doing some kind of quadricep stretch or of course, squatting below parallel.)

I am seriously wondering if this is due to doing deep squatting, technique problems during squatting or some other mechanical issue that i havent thought of.


So have you or anyone you know developed posterior knee pain from doing deep squats ?

[hammerfelt]

No.

Post video of squat.

[PAINBRAH]

"When the medial is damaged or torn, pain at the back of the knee is the result, especially when squatting.

Read more: http://www.livestrong.com/article/21...e-pain-causes/"


Just go get it checked out by a specialist. If you have noticeable knee pains, you probably have knee problems.

[F1eld]

I went to see a PT a little while ago and they said i just had a small bakers cyst if anything. But then a baker cyst only occurs when there is some kind of damage to the meniscus.

Since then its really only gotten worse and now its doing some clicking when coming out of flexion. Srs buzzkill for doing any knee extension exercises . F this S. Not really sure what i should be doing right now.

[feces99]

how hard did you drop into the bottom?

[F1eld]

This is how i would typically be squatting :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJfHrHlFnq4

Ive spent a number of months doing alot of stuff in the 3-5 rep range.


The whole thing is kind of sad because im not even moving big weight or anything .

My best back squat has been 275x3
I have done 245x1 on the Front squat (thats it)

My deadlift is up around 450lbs

Now the back of my knee is bugging me and im going to have to back off. A cinderblock of pointlessness just fell on me.

[feces99]

This is how i would typically be squatting :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJfHrHlFnq4

Ive spent a number of months doing alot of stuff in the 3-5 rep range.


The whole thing is kind of sad because im not even moving big weight or anything .

My best back squat has been 275x3
I have done 245x1 on the Front squat (thats it)

My deadlift is up around 450lbs

Now the back of my knee is bugging me and im going to have to back off. A cinderblock of pointlessness just fell on me.

the vid is marked as private. whats with the deadlift/squat ratio? long legs and longer arms?

[F1eld]

the vid is marked as private. ?

Sorry about that. It is fixed.

Eh, im not really sure about my anthropomorphy, maybe my legs are just neurologically weak, like they arent supposed to be strong or something.

[feces99]

I'm no doctor, but I think trying to ATG squat without shoes is why you messed up your knee. You need arch support when squatting (especially if you are a flatfoot). I can also see the weight moving toward the toes, which puts a bunch of pressure on your knees, even more so when barefoot.

OR

You just have bad luck and are one in a million with this problem.


PS: Your form needs work

[F1eld]

I'm no doctor, but I think trying to ATG squat without shoes is why you messed up your knee. You need arch support when squatting (especially if you are a flatfoot). I can also see the weight moving toward the toes, which puts a bunch of pressure on your knees, even more so when barefoot.

OR

You just have bad luck and are one in a million with this problem.


PS: Your form needs work

My feet underpronate a bit, i have medium arches. When standing in a neutral position with feet forward my knees point outwards a bit.

Yes i agree that i have some form problems , i typically had trouble getting my right leg to NOT shift underneath the center of gravity during squats.

Ive read a billion times about "shoving the knees out" but honestly i just cant wrap my head around the concept. Squatting feels very much like an Up-Down activity to me, and ive done quite a bit of squatting.


The whole thing just kind of pisses me off. srsly just F it.

[nikob00m]

common errors
1. descending too rapidly. This occurs when the descent causes the squatting muscles to relax and tightness at the bottom is lost as a result. increasing chance of injury.
2. is when the knee is not aligned with the direction of the toes. If the knee is not tracking over the toes during the movement this results in twisting/shearing of the joint and unwanted torque affecting the ligaments which can soon result in injury. The knee should always follow the toe. Have your toes slightly pointed out in order to track the knee properly.
3. squat firing order... most ppl lift with there quads increasing knee problems... order muscles should be engaged in 1. core/erector, 2. ARSE!!! if you are at the bottom and you arn't thinking about cracken a walnut between your cheeks your using wrong muscle, 3. Hamstrings, then last but not least, 4. you finally get to use your quads

vid was fixed while I posted this... you drop really fast.... rule number 1 is why your knees moves so much you not tight at all
followed by 3. you lifting with your quads not your glutes you can see the weight shift to your toes

[PAINBRAH]

The whole thing is kind of sad because im not even moving big weight or anything .

My best back squat has been 275x3
I have done 245x1 on the Front squat (thats it)

My deadlift is up around 450lbs

Now the back of my knee is bugging me and im going to have to back off. A cinderblock of pointlessness just fell on me.

My advice is to go see a doctor as soon as you can and get the MRI/surgery. I've torn the meniscus in both of my knees, the first one went without getting fixed for around 7-8 months and I have horrible issues with it to this day (terrible range, clicking, pain when held in flexion since day 1 after surgery). The one I just got fixed within a week after tearing it feels fine (for now). A buddy of mine tore his squatting 60 kgs. It sucks and I feel your pain, but it's really not something you should just leave as is.

Good luck, my friend...

[F1eld]

I started back squatting again recently, as well as adding some regular calf work into my routine .

The main things i have changed with squatting is :

-using some footwear with an elevated heel do to my medium/narrow type stance i generally use,
-cutting my depth short a little bit, to me the squatting i am doing now feels/is shallow.
-Deliberatly pausing for a moment between reps . Every rep is its own rep , if you understand where im coming from.

I've kind of keyed in a little more to the whole thing about 'squatting with your hips.'
You can definitely feel the difference between using alot of glute when you squat, and using alot of quadricep. You just feel yourself rise differently.

I did a bit of squatting today and was just doing alot of 225x5 and then a couple reps with 265.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FLI7BkUjNNA

[ChrisJones999]

I started back squatting again recently, as well as adding some regular calf work into my routine .

The main things i have changed with squatting is :

-using some footwear with an elevated heel do to my medium/narrow type stance i generally use,
-cutting my depth short a little bit, to me the squatting i am doing now feels/is shallow.
-Deliberatly pausing for a moment between reps . Every rep is its own rep , if you understand where im coming from.

I've kind of keyed in a little more to the whole thing about 'squatting with your hips.'
You can definitely feel the difference between using alot of glute when you squat, and using alot of quadricep. You just feel yourself rise differently.

I did a bit of squatting today and was just doing alot of 225x5 and then a couple reps with 265.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FLI7BkUjNNA

Do your self a huge favor and get some lifting shoes. That air bubble is working agianst you squatting. You better off squaring in a pair of dress shoes with a hard heal that those sneakers.

[F1eld]

Do your self a huge favor and get some lifting shoes. That air bubble is working agianst you squatting. You better off squaring in a pair of dress shoes with a hard heal that those sneakers.

Yeah i agree but im going to have to wait a little bit for that.

These shoes (Nike Reax) are actually harder soled than those Nike Free 2.0 shoes i tried out. Im not really sure WHAT those nikes are good for , other than maybe sprinting or doing bodyweight light stuff, or just casual walking shoes.

[olyw8lifter]

Biggest thing I've been working on is controlling the descent more by thinking of "pulling" myself into the bottom of the squat.