Walking out on a car salesman

[bullybreed]

Dealers have come to accept that not every process works for every customer. It's inevitable that some will be unhappy. We don't cater to you. We cater to the 80-90% of car shoppers out there. We're happy to sell you a car but not upset when you dont. No offense but its the way it is.

So you cater to 80-90% but I'm within the 10% you don't cater to? Please explain your logic behind this one?

Maybe because I am an educated buyer and that pisses you off?

[tng83]

So you cater to 80-90% but I'm within the 10% you don't cater to? Please explain your logic behind this one?

We have a sales process and a training method that teaches people how to sell cars and handle cusromers and their objections. Your personality makes it difficult for a salesman to follow the process outlined for him. We'll allow you to control the process to an extent but eventually the salesperson is going to no longer wish to help you or sell you a car. Unless of course youre not really the ass you sound like. But I guess that goes for both of us.

[bullybreed]

We have a sales process and a training method that teaches people how to sell cars and handle cusromers and their objections. Your personality makes it difficult for a salesman to follow the process outlined for him. We'll allow you to control the process to an extent but eventually the salesperson is going to no longer wish to help you or sell you a car. Unless of course youre not really the ass you sound like. But I guess that goes for both of us.

Ahhh...well unfortunately I don't give salesmen enough time to figure out how to control the process. When I am there I am in control. I'm the one spending the money, you're not going to lead me around your lot by a leash trying to get me to try out different cars when I know what I want. I'm not going to sit down with you and discuss anything until I'm ready. I may just come in kick a couple tires and leave. It is my choice. Sure I'll gladly take your card, but you aren't getting my number until I'm ready to buy. I never have done that and I never will. Yes sometimes it can take me a couple weeks to buy a car doing it this way, but I always get the lowest price I can and one that I am happy with. Not one a dealer forces me to take just because I am tired of shopping or he thinks he is in control of the situation.

And I know most likely that pisses salesmen off like yourself but it is what it is. I'm the one dropping 20k plus on a new car. Things are going to go my way or I move on to the next dealer. Anyone who thinks differently is just an idiot. BRB I'll just go in an pay whatever the dealer wants me to pay just because he presented it that way. Um no thanks.

[tng83]

Ahhh...well unfortunately I don't give salesmen enough time to figure out how to control the process. When I am there I am in control. I'm the one spending the money, you're not going to lead me around your lot by a leash trying to get me to try out different cars when I know what I want. I'm not going to sit down with you and discuss anything until I'm ready. I may just come in kick a couple tires and leave. It is my choice. Sure I'll gladly take your card, but you aren't getting my number until I'm ready to buy. I never have done that and I never will. Yes sometimes it can take me a couple weeks to buy a car doing it this way, but I always get the lowest price I can and one that I am happy with. Not one a dealer forces me to take just because I am tired of shopping or he thinks he is in control of the situation.

And I know most likely that pisses salesmen off like yourself but it is what it is. I'm the one dropping 20k plus on a new car. Things are going to go my way or I move on to the next dealer. Anyone who thinks differently is just an idiot. BRB I'll just go in an pay whatever the dealer wants me to pay just because he presented it that way. Um no thanks.

Nah I dont mind your process at all. The biggest issue is that I have almost no chance of earning your business. We look at cars, I shoot you a great price like 500 over invoice, you then go to the dealer down the road and show him my email so he beats me by 300. Then another dealer beats it by 200. Then another by 100. You end up paying close to invoice. Youre free to buy cars this way. We're all trying to do right by you and offer you a great deal to do business with us.

[bullybreed]

Nah I dont mind your process at all. The biggest issue is that I have almost no chance of earning your business. We look at cars, I shoot you a great price like 500 over invoice, you then go to the dealer down the road and show him my email so he beats me by 300. Then another dealer beats it by 200. Then another by 100. You end up paying close to invoice. Youre free to buy cars this way. We're all trying to do right by you and offer you a great deal to do business with us.

Do you ever show a customer what the invoice price is of the vehicle if they ask?

[Mr Beer]

What you'd like me to do is basically talk people out of buying a car all together or make zero money doing it.

Two way street bro. Customers lie exponentially more than salespeople.

Nope, just drop shady practices, like bait advertising. BTW 'but they lie too!' is not an excuse to be a conman.

[tng83]

Do you ever show a customer what the invoice price is of the vehicle if they ask?

Mmmmmm... it depends really. Ive worked a sales process that explicitly used the invoice to quote a price. Where Im at now Id probably show an invoice. The problem is that invoice isnt necessarily my cost. On my F150s we install wheel well liners, all weather floor mats, and drop in bed liners. Its totals about 300 bucks and we sell it for 399. Thats plus pack puts my cost on an F150 at about 600 over invoice. So although Id likely show an invoice that doesnt mean I wont continue to justify a price well over invoice. Its not too hard if I know my product well and have good rapport with the customer. IMO on a vehicle like an F150 which likely costs 40+ thousand dollars, 2 grand over invoice is a fair price. Thats a very modest 5%. And probably 1000 to 1500 below msrp. On a Focus or Fiesta ther is only about 600 dollars from invoice to msrp. So with pack taking 500 dollarsnoff puts me behind cost.

[bullybreed]

Mmmmmm... it depends really. Ive worked a sales process that explicitly used the invoice to quote a price. Where Im at now Id probably show an invoice. The problem is that invoice isnt necessarily my cost. On my F150s we install wheel well liners, all weather floor mats, and drop in bed liners. Its totals about 300 bucks and we sell it for 399. Thats plus pack puts my cost on an F150 at about 600 over invoice. So although Id likely show an invoice that doesnt mean I wont continue to justify a price well over invoice. Its not too hard if I know my product well and have good rapport with the customer. IMO on a vehicle like an F150 which likely costs 40+ thousand dollars, 2 grand over invoice is a fair price. Thats a very modest 5%. And probably 1000 to 1500 below msrp. On a Focus or Fiesta ther is only about 600 dollars from invoice to msrp. So with pack taking 500 dollarsnoff puts me behind cost.

I see I see. Well I'll have to say even though I don't agree with really anything that you are doing this has been a good debate. This could go on forever, but we are both just beating a dead horse anymore. I'm not budging off of what I feel, and you won't off of what you have been taught. Good luck with your sales in the future. I hope you make some money, just not too much if ya know what I mean...

[KRANE]

Been reading all of your responses and you are so out of touch and delusional it is funny. You greatly overvalue the "relationship" factor. Nobody gives a fuk about the dealership and having a relationship. Nobody gives a fuk about a relationship with a salesman and being his buddy. Nobody gives a fuk about you. They care about the car they want and their budget. You think people should buy from your lot despite competitors because of the relationship you offer? Lmao oldest sales garbage in the book. Newsflash: thousands of other salesmen all across the country are all telling their clients they should buy from THEM because of the personal touch. Your sales manager will tell you the product isn't the car but the relationship with you they are buying. Your managers are so far gone from all the koolaid they've consumed that they actually believe it. You are everything that is wrong with the car buying process.

Despite what you may feel emotionally or personally that particular relationship actually is true. The best way to maintain customer loyalty is through that personal touch.

Fact is, YOU many not care -- and I might feel the same way -- but in general, people have and will continue to pay extra for what they believe to be personal preference or that personal touch. Its true in a lot of markets. Not the least of which is the automobile dealership.

[HumptyBrah]

Do you ever show a customer what the invoice price is of the vehicle if they ask?

This wasn't directed at me but I'll take it. I had lots of people ask, I showed very few. Mainly because the salesperson generally doesn't have access to the invoice, so it has to come from the manager. And it takes a lot for the manager to give up the invoice. At least it did 10 years ago. Nowadays, most don't really care.

But also because the customer who asks to see the invoice - as opposed to finding it with a 2-second Google search before they walk into the showroom - isn't buying the car at invoice. It's just a negotiating tactic someone told them to try, much like mentioning the word "holdback." It's just something that's supposed to make them sound like they know what they're doing.

[tng83]

This wasn't directed at me but I'll take it. I had lots of people ask, I showed very few. Mainly because the salesperson generally doesn't have access to the invoice, so it has to come from the manager. And it takes a lot for the manager to give up the invoice. At least it did 10 years ago. Nowadays, most don't really care.

But also because the customer who asks to see the invoice - as opposed to finding it with a 2-second Google search before they walk into the showroom - isn't buying the car at invoice. It's just a negotiating tactic someone told them to try, much like mentioning the word "holdback." It's just something that's supposed to make them sound like they know what they're doing.

Yea I should probably point out that many salespeople will not be given an invoice even if they beg for it. My sales desk knows Im experienced in working off of an invoice so they dont have a problem with it.

[tng83]

I see I see. Well I'll have to say even though I don't agree with really anything that you are doing this has been a good debate. This could go on forever, but we are both just beating a dead horse anymore. I'm not budging off of what I feel, and you won't off of what you have been taught. Good luck with your sales in the future. I hope you make some money, just not too much if ya know what I mean...

I suppose youre right. We could go on for days. Its a unique business but not unlike any other commission sales job. But I get to talk to people and work with cars so its a win win for me.

[1quick1]

About 4 months ago I was considering a 2014 Ram truck. I found one at the dealer right by my house that had exactly every option I wanted and color. It was a 2014 and they were making room for 2015's so it also had around $7k in savings. I email the dealership, ask if they have it and set up an appointment.

I show up and the salesman is this dude that couldn't have been more than 20. After chatting a minute I tell him that I was there specifically to see one vehicle and that I've done all the research. He then tells me that vehicle has sold but he has two optioned nearly the same. So fine I say. He walks me back to two trucks. Both with completely hail damaged hoods. The rest of the hail damaged vehicle was repaired. These were not optioned any where close to how I wanted or the color. Then to top it off I sit in both and each has between 150-200 miles.

I just turn around and walk out. I was so pissed this dude wasted my time like that. I call back and ask the manager when the vehicle I wanted sold and he told me it was about 6 days prior.

So basically the little chit stain knew the vehicle I was looking for wasn't there but basically just did everything he could to bait and switch me basically.

[bullybreed]

About 4 months ago I was considering a 2014 Ram truck. I found one at the dealer right by my house that had exactly every option I wanted and color. It was a 2014 and they were making room for 2015's so it also had around $7k in savings. I email the dealership, ask if they have it and set up an appointment.

I show up and the salesman is this dude that couldn't have been more than 20. After chatting a minute I tell him that I was there specifically to see one vehicle and that I've done all the research. He then tells me that vehicle has sold but he has two optioned nearly the same. So fine I say. He walks me back to two trucks. Both with completely hail damaged hoods. The rest of the hail damaged vehicle was repaired. These were not optioned any where close to how I wanted or the color. Then to top it off I sit in both and each has between 150-200 miles.

I just turn around and walk out. I was so pissed this dude wasted my time like that. I call back and ask the manager when the vehicle I wanted sold and he told me it was about 6 days prior.

So basically the little chit stain knew the vehicle I was looking for wasn't there but basically just did everything he could to bait and switch me basically.

Salesmen gonna salesmen

[tng83]

About 4 months ago I was considering a 2014 Ram truck. I found one at the dealer right by my house that had exactly every option I wanted and color. It was a 2014 and they were making room for 2015's so it also had around $7k in savings. I email the dealership, ask if they have it and set up an appointment.

I show up and the salesman is this dude that couldn't have been more than 20. After chatting a minute I tell him that I was there specifically to see one vehicle and that I've done all the research. He then tells me that vehicle has sold but he has two optioned nearly the same. So fine I say. He walks me back to two trucks. Both with completely hail damaged hoods. The rest of the hail damaged vehicle was repaired. These were not optioned any where close to how I wanted or the color. Then to top it off I sit in both and each has between 150-200 miles.

I just turn around and walk out. I was so pissed this dude wasted my time like that. I call back and ask the manager when the vehicle I wanted sold and he told me it was about 6 days prior.

So basically the little chit stain knew the vehicle I was looking for wasn't there but basically just did everything he could to bait and switch me basically.

This happens a lot but its less and less. Many dealers embrace the use of a BDC to handle all incoming calls so when you do call it's not a salesman on the other end. I always go put my hands on the car. It gives me a valid reason to get the customers name and phone number. I walk to th car and call them back minutes later from my cell. I often text em a picture so they know I have the car.

[gswarrior510]

used car dealerships are a massive joke. If you are buying a cheap car, buy it private (from old people preferably or enthusiasts).

[1quick1]

This happens a lot but its less and less. Many dealers embrace the use of a BDC to handle all incoming calls so when you do call it's not a salesman on the other end. I always go put my hands on the car. It gives me a valid reason to get the customers name and phone number. I walk to th car and call them back minutes later from my cell. I often text em a picture so they know I have the car.

This would have went a long way had he done this. It annoyed me that he knew the specific vehicle I wanted wasn't there but he acted as if it was then when I arrived he bait and switched me with some B.S. hail damaged vehicle. Trust went out the window at that point.

[WSG1]

Its sad how many people walk into a dealership and get ****ed over. The industry thrives on lying,stealing and manipulating. That is what happens when you build a job based on commission.

Private party sales are 100x easier.

[Xinroth]

This happens a lot but its less and less. Many dealers embrace the use of a BDC to handle all incoming calls so when you do call it's not a salesman on the other end. I always go put my hands on the car. It gives me a valid reason to get the customers name and phone number. I walk to th car and call them back minutes later from my cell. I often text em a picture so they know I have the car.

This is what I did- called 20-30 min before going there, and supposedly they had somebody go in the lot to ask for the car.

I go in about 20 min later and they used the "it was sold" excuse. Legit or not, they should've called when it was sold. Waste of time. Craiglist is sadly a better option for buying used cars, especially if the person can get his hands on carfax records.

[tng83]

Had a guy come in on a 14 Tundra today. He came via the internet dept and had unrealistic expectations but he came on the last day of the month 2 hours before close. Internet prices was 34,999 and behind retail. His trade was a 200k mile 07 Avalanche. We drove the truck and also looked at a Sierra as well. He liked the Tundra and the Internet dept had already offered this guy 33999 sale price. His truck was worth 4 grand. I hit him with the numbers and after 3 or 4 pencils we finally agreed to do his number. We bumped the trade to 6 and sold the truck for 32. We lost 600 dollars and are buried in his trade but ye financed with us and bought an extended warranty. I made 95 dollars.

[HumptyBrah]

Its sad how many people walk into a dealership and get ****ed over. The industry thrives on lying,stealing and manipulating. That is what happens when you build a job based on commission.

Private party sales are 100x easier.

Literally the only reason to buy private party is price. If you can get a comparable price from a reputable dealer then go that route every time.

You criticize dealers for "lying" and "manipulating" but then recommend people go private party. ayy lmao I don't even

[jakie201]

Would much rather go private party for car sales. Such a simpler way of buying a car.

1. Run the carfax before you go look at vehicle.
2. Look it over and test drive.
3. Negotiate the price based off carfax, appearance, mechanical issues.
4. Agree on a price and sign title or disagree and leave.

Takes like 30 minutes vs 2 or 3 hours at the dealer. 9 times out of 10 you will get a better deal private.

[tng83]

Would much rather go private party for car sales. Such a simpler way of buying a car.

1. Run the carfax before you go look at vehicle.
2. Look it over and test drive.
3. Negotiate the price based off carfax, appearance, mechanical issues.
4. Agree on a price and sign title or disagree and leave.

Takes like 30 minutes vs 2 or 3 hours at the dealer. 9 times out of 10 you will get a better deal private.

Youll also get a vehicle with no gurantee of service or reconditioning work done to it and no help if something does go wrong. And not everyone can go to their bank and get financing. They require an experienced finance manager to structure a deal and get certain stipulations waived. Bank with chase as a 1099 independent contractor and have less than a 650 credit score? You have no choice but to go to a dealership. And what about new cars?

I personally would never consider a private party purchase unless it was from a friend or relative. And I would never buy a used car from a dealer that didnt have a new car franchise attached to it.

[ChaoticReignPbt]

I personally would never consider a private party purchase unless it was from a friend or relative. And I would never buy a used car from a dealer that didnt have a new car franchise attached to it.

See, this to me is weird as hell. For those of us mechanically inclined that do our research why in the world would we spend substantially more?

I hate going through dealers and have very very rarely done it. Always trying to sell crap I don't need, always paying several thousand over what I could do private party. No thanks.

I've done both for motorcycles and cars and have had better experiences private party every single time.

[TTViper]

I've bought 4 vehicles off of private party (craigslist). I've had really good luck on 3 of them and have had zero issues with those purchases. The 4th vehicle I bought had a lot of unforeseen issues , some stuff that I missed that I shouldn't have when inspecting the truck, and was a real pain in the ass. Had I bought that truck from a used car dealer every issue that I had with the truck would have been taken care of in the 30 day warranty. They would have either bought the truck back from be or fixed several catastrophic issues it had.

I've purchased one vehicle from a used car dealer back in January. Now it had some issues that would have been impossible to detect by even the best mechanic pre-purchase, but fortunately I had a 30 day warranty through the dealer. It took them 3 attempts to fix the issue and eventually it was sent to a Toyota dealer for better diagnosis, but they spent at least $3,500 replacing parts on the truck. That's just an example of a good reason to buy from a dealer and not craigslist.


I will still buy private party, but only "safer" vehicles.

[Murph0408]

for what it's worth. for me easiest thing is to say no and go home. that's my only chip to play in these things. i don't have time for BS nor do i have interest in playing mental chess with salesmen. set yourself a budget and stick to it and if it doesn't work go home. they'll call you back and you'll likely get what you wanted as long as you're being fairly realistic.

i did this with my '11 ram which was bought in '11 but late summer. they were fine by me and kept everything short and simple because i just said no thanks to the first round of pricing and went home. got an email a couple days later with better pricing and ended up going back by the end of that week. buying something fairly standard like an american pickup you should keep in mind there are dozens of dealerships in your area. this isn't some extra special vehicle that only one place will have. if you don't like the vibe in the dealership just walk away no need to get upset or turn it into some big thing.

[jakie201]

Youll also get a vehicle with no gurantee of service or reconditioning work done to it and no help if something does go wrong. And not everyone can go to their bank and get financing. They require an experienced finance manager to structure a deal and get certain stipulations waived. Bank with chase as a 1099 independent contractor and have less than a 650 credit score? You have no choice but to go to a dealership. And what about new cars?

I personally would never consider a private party purchase unless it was from a friend or relative. And I would never buy a used car from a dealer that didnt have a new car franchise attached to it.

I happen to know the things to look out for when buying a used car. Obviously I can't guarantee that nothing will go wrong once I buy the car.

Let's put it this way:
I could buy x car for $10,000 from a dealer and get some kind of purchase warranty which would cover a repair if something were to go wrong right away. Or I could buy that same car for $8000-8500 from private party and worst case scenario if something happens, I'll still have that saved money that I got when I chose a private sale to cover the repair.

And let's be honest, you can usually tell if the car is running like it should when you drive/inspect it.

I understand why you pay more at a dealer; I just simply prefer saving money. And the new car thing doesn't apply to me. I don't believe in pissing away thousands of dollars on a new car.

[HumptyBrah]

And the new car thing doesn't apply to me. I don't believe in pissing away thousands of dollars on a new car.

He's saying new car dealers are a better place to buy a used car than a dedicated used car lot. A used car from Local Toyota is more than likely going to be a much better car than one from Slick Willie's Used Cars - especially if it's a certified Toyota (or Honda, Ford, etc).

[bullybreed]

He's saying new car dealers are a better place to buy a used car than a dedicated used car lot. A used car from Local Toyota is more than likely going to be a much better car than one from Slick Willie's Used Cars - especially if it's a certified Toyota (or Honda, Ford, etc).

If people don't already know this kind of thing then they deserve to buy a POS from Willie's. There are probably 25-30 of these lots in the area I live in. Buy-here-pay-here type of places that sell garbage.

They do like to deal though...I have heard they like to deal though.......unlike you guys.....hahahahaha