when to cut the sodium

[apinian]

hello all. i am currently two weeks out and feel a bit of soduim retention. i was wondering if i should start cutting it now? or start next week? would cutting the sodium matter 14 days out?

[Bnizzle163]

Don't cut sodium... not only will you look flat and less vascular, you'll probably cramp up.

[AustrianOakJr]

^^^ Yes. I tried tapering (not even cutting) sodium once and i was flat as a board and couldnt hold a pump. Cutting sodium/water is a bad idea.

[Milone79]

I never cut..I use salt on everything, salsa and hot sauce too...about one day out all I do is cut the salsa and hot sauce so sodium is reduced slightly....but never eliminated totally...

[fitcopforlife]

Don't cut sodium... not only will you look flat and less vascular, you'll probably cramp up.

This, ^^^^

[Justin-27]

^^^ Yes. I tried tapering (not even cutting) sodium once and i was flat as a board and couldnt hold a pump. Cutting sodium/water is a bad idea.

This.

Isn't it amazing how you can pretty much disregard anything a professional IFBB BB'er or one of their "gurus" has to say about training and nutrition?

Train with short, quick reps to pump the muscle.
Cut water.
Cut sodium.
Carb deplete someone who's never done it before for Days 1-4 in the final week (oh hai, I did that in my first show and lost 10 lbs and looked like a twig).
Diet for 12 weeks, 2 hours of cardio everyday, cut carbs a ton, cut calories a ton. (the dieting world is a much prettier place when you have a special drug for every occasion).

[CaseySmithBB]

hello all. i am currently two weeks out and feel a bit of soduim retention. i was wondering if i should start cutting it now? or start next week? would cutting the sodium matter 14 days out?

I would suggest you do everything in moderation. My first contest was a disaster because I tried to do too many drastic things all at once.

Just remember that extreme changes to your diet might give you extreme results. More often than not, those results are not the ones you want.

[simpleguy4]

One day out reduce to what is in the foods naturally...plenty in chicken, eggs, etc.... DO NOT eliminate it completely....sure way to flatten out, lose fullness, and not maintain a pump. At two weeks out, you should be liberally salting everything!!!

[JohnBrowne]

One day out reduce to what is in the foods naturally...plenty in chicken, eggs, etc.... DO NOT eliminate it completely....sure way to flatten out, lose fullness, and not maintain a pump.

What's the point of ANY sodium manipulation?

[DanTheManB]

What's the point of ANY sodium manipulation?

it can work if you're extremely drastic with it...if you load like mad first. doesnt make sense to use though

[db2012]

For one variation of my peaks I will sodium load 7 days out, and depending on a previous trial run I will tapper sodium down 2 days out, and cut it at some point 1 day out along with water. Typically 3pm works well. This is also a junk loaded peak, so the reintroduction of sodium comes fairly early before stage time with the junk.

Basically their is a proper way to manipulate sodium for peak week. It's just for many peak styles it may conflict, or be extremely tricky to get down without practicing.

[AustrianOakJr]

Even if you could argue that it MIGHT work, you really just shouldnt need it if you are shredded. There are lots of guys at the top of the top that come in ripped to ribbons and win at the pro level but they dont do anything with their sodium and water. It just seems like an unnecessary risk to me.

[DanTheManB]

Even if you could argue that it MIGHT work, you really just shouldnt need it if you are shredded. There are lots of guys at the top of the top that come in ripped to ribbons and win at the pro level but they dont do anything with their sodium and water. It just seems like an unnecessary risk to me.

lol yea. was thinking that. if you're shredded but load up EXTREMELY hard on sodium than drastically cut it you'd be back at square one anyway hahah

prob f's with your body way too hard too

[AustrianOakJr]

lol yea. was thinking that. if you're shredded but load up EXTREMELY hard on sodium than drastically cut it you'd be back at square one anyway hahah

prob f's with your body way too hard too

At the first show this past season I had instructions from Tommy to taper sodium slightly the day before the show. Well, i figured if a little taper is good, maybe a bigger taper is better......so I didnt purposefully set out to eliminate sodium but I just didnt add ANY salt to anything the day before and morning of. I still did my normal pb/honey/rice cake carb up prior to the stage but I couldnt get a good pump to save my life......very little vascularity and I was just flat (despite loading on 1500g of carbs). Not to mention when I went out to eat chinese at the post show pig out, I ended up on the floor of the restaurant not able to move because I was cramping head to toe. For my second show, the very next week, I didnt do anything to my sodium at all.....just kept it high.....and I was a lot more full (my avatar pic is from that show). Perhaps I was a touch softer (than my best). The last show I did I kept my sodium high right through to show day, salting everything and all I did was taper my water just a hair (like dropped it from 2 gals all week to 1.5 gals show day) and I came in full and a maybe a touch drier than the show before....but arguably that was due to the fact that I was a half pound leaner. All that to say......save yourself the trouble of experimentation.....sodium manipulation just isnt worth it.

[Barn01]

I reduce it for 3 days during my carb deplete phase but only down to what's in the foods I eat. Since I do a gradual carb up then final crap load I sodium up pretty hard morning of and all show day. I don't salt anything per say but just the crap that I eat tends to be full of it carbs and fats. I only suggest something like this if you've tried it out and know the amounts and timing of it all. Screw up something like this by 4-5hours and it could end up a disaster. With no experimenting under your belt just keep sodium constant and play it safe.

[DanTheManB]

At the first show this past season I had instructions from Tommy to taper sodium slightly the day before the show. Well, i figured if a little taper is good, maybe a bigger taper is better......so I didnt purposefully set out to eliminate sodium but I just didnt add ANY salt to anything the day before and morning of. I still did my normal pb/honey/rice cake carb up prior to the stage but I couldnt get a good pump to save my life......very little vascularity and I was just flat (despite loading on 1500g of carbs). Not to mention when I went out to eat chinese at the post show pig out, I ended up on the floor of the restaurant not able to move because I was cramping head to toe. For my second show, the very next week, I didnt do anything to my sodium at all.....just kept it high.....and I was a lot more full (my avatar pic is from that show). Perhaps I was a touch softer (than my best). The last show I did I kept my sodium high right through to show day, salting everything and all I did was taper my water just a hair (like dropped it from 2 gals all week to 1.5 gals show day) and I came in full and a maybe a touch drier than the show before....but arguably that was due to the fact that I was a half pound leaner. All that to say......save yourself the trouble of experimentation.....sodium manipulation just isnt worth it.

jesus@ the cramping.

im guessing post show next time around youll keep the cheat much more moderate? arent u a big beer guy too ( i know i am)

[str8flexed]

cutting sodium is a sure fight way to end up flat and softer

[apinian]

cutting sodium is a sure fight way to end up flat and softer

interesting suggestions. Thanks all. I guess I am looking for the icing on the cake to look more shredded

[AustrianOakJr]

jesus@ the cramping.

im guessing post show next time around youll keep the cheat much more moderate? arent u a big beer guy too ( i know i am)

No, the cramping was really due to the fact that I had depleted the sodium and then all of the sudden introduced it in the form of a chinese sodium bomb. Ive had two shows since then, both with a post contest meal with enough calories to feed a horse and I was fine. BUt that was a good, hard lesson in NOT cutting sodium.

No, im not a beer guy. I like hard cider but if I have alcohol (on occasion in my off season) I drink liquor.

[DanTheManB]

No, the cramping was really due to the fact that I had depleted the sodium and then all of the sudden introduced it in the form of a chinese sodium bomb. Ive had two shows since then, both with a post contest meal with enough calories to feed a horse and I was fine. BUt that was a good, hard lesson in NOT cutting sodium.

No, im not a beer guy. I like hard cider but if I have alcohol (on occasion in my off season) I drink liquor.

man im way off today

[simpleguy4]

interesting suggestions. Thanks all. I guess I am looking for the icing on the cake to look more shredded

Everyone wants to look better....but, you are either shredded or you're not--and nothing you can do in the last week can accomplish that. If you look good 1-2 weeks out, keep doing what you are doing and cruise into the contest--do not try anything drastic!

[OnTheRoad]

Everyone wants to look better....but, you are either shredded or you're not--and nothing you can do in the last week can accomplish that. If you look good 1-2 weeks out, keep doing what you are doing and cruise into the contest--do not try anything drastic!

This ^

Getting more shredded is getting leaner.....get leaner to look more shredded!, it is not done with sodium/water

[mactom9]

I see many competitors on here seem to pull water out constantly during their preparation. I see pics two to 3 weeks out and they look better than the day of the contest. I do whatever I can to hold water, especially before training. I want to assess myself when I look the the smoothest. Maybe I've been away from the sport for too long, is this the trend now to stay drier during the 12 weeks?

[AustrianOakJr]

I see many competitors on here seem to pull water out constantly during their preparation. I see pics two to 3 weeks out and they look better than the day of the contest. I do whatever I can to hold water, especially before training. I want to assess myself when I look the the smoothest. Maybe I've been away from the sport for too long, is this the trend now to stay drier during the 12 weeks?

The only way I know how to "hold water" is if I spike the heck out of my sodium or go too long without drinking water......then i might look watery the next day. But my sodium is pretty darn high throughout my prep.....I salt everything, franks red hot, etc, etc. So I have noticed a couple times if I make stir fry and add a ton of soy sauce, I hold a bit of water the next day. If your sodium is relatively constant and water intake is pretty high, you arent going to hold water under the skin.

[MarkVI]

The only way I know how to "hold water" is if I spike the heck out of my sodium or go too long without drinking water......then i might look watery the next day. But my sodium is pretty darn high throughout my prep.....I salt everything, franks red hot, etc, etc. So I have noticed a couple times if I make stir fry and add a ton of soy sauce, I hold a bit of water the next day. If your sodium is relatively constant and water intake is pretty high, you arent going to hold water under the skin.

This ^, my sodium intake is a lot higher than it was about a month ago but it's been consistent since I raised it (wanted some more flavor in food) and my body has adapted and not holding any excess water apart from typical bulking bloat.

[mactom9]

The only way I know how to "hold water" is if I spike the heck out of my sodium or go too long without drinking water......then i might look watery the next day. But my sodium is pretty darn high throughout my prep.....I salt everything, franks red hot, etc, etc. So I have noticed a couple times if I make stir fry and add a ton of soy sauce, I hold a bit of water the next day. If your sodium is relatively constant and water intake is pretty high, you arent going to hold water under the skin.

I keep my sodium very high. Franks Red Hot is my best friend!

[simpleguy4]

I see many competitors on here seem to pull water out constantly during their preparation. I see pics two to 3 weeks out and they look better than the day of the contest. I do whatever I can to hold water, especially before training. I want to assess myself when I look the the smoothest. Maybe I've been away from the sport for too long, is this the trend now to stay drier during the 12 weeks?

You are spot on....the ONLY time you want to be dry is the day of the contest. Staying dry any other time is a sure way to injury....water and sodium should be a priority throughout prep.

[AustrianOakJr]

I keep my sodium very high. Franks Red Hot is my best friend!

You are spot on....the ONLY time you want to be dry is the day of the contest. Staying dry any other time is a sure way to injury....water and sodium should be a priority throughout prep.

High water and high sodium intake does not = holding water. Electrolyte balance in the body is a very crucial thing....its a very complex system that regulates water/electrolyte inside and outside of the cell and very particular balance that the body is after. If sodium intake is very high, you just piss off the extra sodium and water within a pretty short time. The only time a natural really experiences significant bloat is if sodium swings wildly from one day to the next.

[Devils]

What effect does potassium levels make on stored muscle glycogen and subcutaneous water?

[AustrianOakJr]

What effect does potassium levels make on stored muscle glycogen and subcutaneous water?

I wish I understood all the intricacies of the way this all works.....the body is an amazing machine.....(how anyone could say this all came together by chance is beyond me). But the transport of sodium from inside to outside the cell is the driving force for glucose transport. This is why we need proper electrolyte intake to carb load properly. Muscle cells are required to maintain a certain electrical gradient in order to do the work we require of them. So, there is a certain concentration of sodium and potassium inside vs. outside of the cell.......the abundance of the sodium lies outside of the cell but there is a constant transport of the two ions through a gate in the cell wall that regulates these concentrations in order to maintain the correct electrical gradient across the cell membrane. This gradient is very specific and the body simply wont allow it to go out of whack.....so trying to "trick" the body with any kind of accuracy is a futile effort. Sure we may have days where we appear a bit drier than others but for the most part achieving this look is a bit of a crap shoot because the body is so efficient at regulating sodium/potassium. Its not natural for the body to hold excessive amounts of water outside the cell membrane, but a certain amount does NEED to be there. So IMOP, its much better to keep the ALL electrolytes cranked along with the water and let the body do its thing to sort it all out.