Official Predictions for UFC Fight Night Live 8/17

[bjjwraslter7]

I definitly underestimated judo. Those throws were so effortless and you didnt even see them set up, Deigo was up, then all of a sudden he was flying through the air. If someone was really good at judo and BJJ, they would be "unstoppable", judo throw into a instant submission set up. Are there any fighters out there that are well versed in BJJ and Judo?

Karo? Hell riggs even won his match with a judo throw followed by triangle choke. I would say anyone that's well rounded has judo and bjj.

[HardGainer82]

I definitly underestimated judo. Those throws were so effortless and you didnt even see them set up, Deigo was up, then all of a sudden he was flying through the air. If someone was really good at judo and BJJ, they would be "unstoppable", judo throw into a instant submission set up. Are there any fighters out there that are well versed in BJJ and Judo?

Judo does contain submissions as well, but it doesn't focus on them as much in the sport aspect.

[JAGERBOY]

Karo? Hell riggs even won his match with a judo throw followed by triangle choke. I would say anyone that's well rounded has judo and bjj.

Ya, I liked Riggs last night. But like HardGainer said, you usually dont see someone thats excellent at both, judo has some but not as many ass bjj wrastlin.

[bjjwraslter7]

Well I think the fact that there is only one really good primarily judo guy in ufc says something about it's effectiveness. I think the wrestling bjj combo is better, and that's why we see so many of those guys. I mean we did just see wrestling/bjj vs judo/bjj right?

[JAGERBOY]

Well I think the fact that there is only one really good primarily judo guy in ufc says something about it's effectiveness. I think the wrestling bjj combo is better, and that's why we see so many of those guys. I mean we did just see wrestling/bjj vs judo/bjj right?

Ya, but again, I havent seen EVERY fight, I dont see judo throws like that too often, just think it would be interesting if someone whos good at submissions like Babalu also had really good judo. Not arguing with you, just saying, after that fight (and riggs) I think alot of fighters may/should start focusing on judo a little more...

[bjjwraslter7]

Ya, but again, I havent seen EVERY fight, I dont see judo throws like that too often, just think it would be interesting if someone whos good at submissions like Babalu also had really good judo. Not arguing with you, just saying, after that fight (and riggs) I think alot of fighters may/should start focusing on judo a little more...

They already have you just haven't noticed. Most mma/bjj places incorporate judo throws into their training. Wrestling also uses the same throws, I learned most of that stuff in highschool. They just aren't as effective in most cases as a good shot and double/single leg. Also you may have noticed they got karo in trouble a few times. Like a couple times he flipped diego...but in the processes flipped himself too. Then when he missed the throws he put himself in bad positions. Judo throws can be great, but they can be risky too.

You think that because you watched riggs toss the hell out of von flue, and because karo made them look easy. What you fail to realize is that von flue was out of his league against riggs. Riggs is a much stronger, and better fighter than von flue which made it easy to toss him and made it look nice. Karo is just a phenominal judo guy that can pull that stuff off like noone else. They work, but not as well as last night would lead you to believe.

[JAGERBOY]

They already have you just haven't noticed. Most mma/bjj places incorporate judo throws into their training. Wrestling also uses the same throws, I learned most of that stuff in highschool. They just aren't as effective in most cases as a good shot and double/single leg. Also you may have noticed they got karo in trouble a few times. Like a couple times he flipped diego...but in the processes flipped himself too. Then when he missed the throws he put himself in bad positions. Judo throws can be great, but they can be risky too.

No, ive really never seen that amount of throws by anyone.Also my gym that I trained at teaches it as well, so I know that places teach it. Anything is risky, double leg take downs can get you put into a a guillotine, it happens.

Settle down.

[bjjwraslter7]

No, ive really never seen that amount of throws by anyone.Also my gym that I trained at teaches it as well, so I know that places teach it. Anything is risky, double leg take downs can get you put into a a guillotine, it happens.

Settle down.

I added to the post before you quoted...

Anyway don't get me wrong I'm not saying it sucks. It's deffinitly effective and I've seen a lot of guys use them in matchs before. I'm just saying last night isn't going to change the way anyone fights. Everyone already knows judo throws and know that they work, and a lot of people use them, but they aren't any better than other takedowns.

You're right I'll admit I had a big problem getting guillotined alot because I always shoot with my head on the outside. I didn't get tapped by it, but I'd always shoot, takedown, and then waste a lot of energy prying someones arm from my neck. I could see myself getting tapped that way by someone good.

I guess I was speaking more from a wrestling standpoint. In terms of takedowns they are much more risky in that they will end up getting you taken down if you screw them up.

[JAGERBOY]

I added to the post before you quoted...

Anyway don't get me wrong I'm not saying it sucks. It's deffinitly effective and I've seen a lot of guys use them in matchs before. I'm just saying last night isn't going to change the way anyone fights. Everyone already knows judo throws and know that they work, and a lot of people use them, but they aren't any better than other takedowns.

You're right I'll admit I had a big problem getting guillotined alot because I always shoot with my head on the outside. I didn't get tapped by it, but I'd always shoot, takedown, and then waste a lot of energy prying someones arm from my neck. I could see myself getting tapped that way by someone good.

I guess I was speaking more from a wrestling standpoint. In terms of takedowns they are much more risky in that they will end up getting you taken down if you screw them up.

Cool.

[TheBlueDevil]

Well I think the fact that there is only one really good primarily judo guy in ufc says something about it's effectiveness. I think the wrestling bjj combo is better, and that's why we see so many of those guys. I mean we did just see wrestling/bjj vs judo/bjj right?

Oh come on now this is just ignorance. Why dont we see that many people with judo and bjj backgrounds in the UFC? Quite simply because there arent that many schools around in the US for Judo. Pretty much every large high school has a wrestling team. More competition means that the average athlete coming out will be better. This also means that the individuals who excelled will be freaks.

What if every high school had judo teams as opposed to wrestling teams? We would see more Judo and BJJ guys than wrestling BJJ guys. The guys that would be coming out with high school and college judo would be way above the skill levels of club wrestlers.

Your argument is true there are more wrestlers that practice BJJ in the UFC than Judo guys but your reasoning is wrong.

[NINEZeRO]

bjjwrastler and other people here who actually train for MMA. How good of a shape are you guys in?

I do weightlifting and running but no techniques (Boxing, BJJ, Judo, Wrestling). I want to know what a 'good shape/conditioning' is. Tell me how fast/long you can run on a treadmill.

I just started running again so can only run around 7.5 mph for around 20-25 min atm. I am aiming to get to 8.5-9.0 mph for 20 minutes. Would this be good enough to hang with the people in great shape?

[BORN2LOSE]

Lister should be ashamed of himself for taking this fight with Sasaki so lightly. Completely out of shape look at the way he's keeping his hands down he's been doing it since midway through the second

You ever lost 20 pounds in your life? Have you ever done it while training for a professional fight? Its not that easy. We'll see how he really is during his next fight.

[bjjwraslter7]

Oh come on now this is just ignorance. Why dont we see that many people with judo and bjj backgrounds in the UFC? Quite simply because there arent that many schools around in the US for Judo. Pretty much every large high school has a wrestling team. More competition means that the average athlete coming out will be better. This also means that the individuals who excelled will be freaks.

What if every high school had judo teams as opposed to wrestling teams? We would see more Judo and BJJ guys than wrestling BJJ guys. The guys that would be coming out with high school and college judo would be way above the skill levels of club wrestlers.

Your argument is true there are more wrestlers that practice BJJ in the UFC than Judo guys but your reasoning is wrong.

True enough.

That's one of the reasons I get pissed off when people don't take wrestling seriously though. It's so widespread and mainstream and the level of competition is so high that even a mediocre highschool wrestler can demolish most people.

You are right though if they had judo teams in highschool and college, a ncaa champion judo player would be no joke.

Still though, no shooting or leg takedowns in judo and I hate that. If judo included that it would be ausome...but then again if it included that it would basicaly be wrestling.

I still think wrestling is better. Judos good too though, never said it wasn't.

[TheBlueDevil]

You ever lost 20 pounds in your life? Have you ever done it while training for a professional fight? Its not that easy. We'll see how he really is during his next fight.

YES i've lost twenty lbs before FOR a fight. I wrestled in the Big10 so i know a thing or two about cutting weight. Its pretty easy with the proper supplements to cut 20lbs of water weight 24-36 hours

[bjjwraslter7]

bjjwrastler and other people here who actually train for MMA. How good of a shape are you guys in?

I do weightlifting and running but no techniques (Boxing, BJJ, Judo, Wrestling). I want to know what a 'good shape/conditioning' is. Tell me how fast/long you can run on a treadmill.

I just started running again so can only run around 7.5 mph for around 20-25 min atm. I am aiming to get to 8.5-9.0 mph for 20 minutes. Would this be good enough to hang with the people in great shape?

Well running long distance doesn't really apply to mma as much I don't think. It's a different kind of endurance. I haven't been training recently though, I just moved and went through a bunch of **** and am about to start school fulltime while working fulltime. Regardless I havne't done long distance running sense highschool, I think I ran a 6:45ish mile. Right now I'm just lifting, and using instructional dvds and practicing with friends probably until next summer. I don't compete, I just really enjoy learning the stuff and training.

I would compete, but I know I don't stand a chance of ever making a living off of doing it so I have to get my priorities straight. Work and school come first. I mean even some guys in ufc don't make ****.

[TheBlueDevil]

LOL i didnt argue that wrestling wasnt better because i am CLEARLY biased. I agree wrestling and BJJ form an awesome BASE for mma.

[AaronC]

Well I think the fact that there is only one really good primarily judo guy in ufc says something about it's effectiveness. I think the wrestling bjj combo is better, and that's why we see so many of those guys. I mean we did just see wrestling/bjj vs judo/bjj right?

true in certain regards, but judo and bjj used to be one and the same back in the day. because of the sport judo today, newaza is highly overlooked, and rarely trained. i agree with you that wrestling and bjj compliment each other well, but so does judo.

look at fedor, the greatest mma fighter of our time, he's a sambo guy. same goes for arlovski. and it wasn't karo's judo that lost him the fight last night, it was his cardio. both wrestling and judo are great for mma!

[BORN2LOSE]

bjjwrastler and other people here who actually train for MMA. How good of a shape are you guys in?

I do weightlifting and running but no techniques (Boxing, BJJ, Judo, Wrestling). I want to know what a 'good shape/conditioning' is. Tell me how fast/long you can run on a treadmill.

I just started running again so can only run around 7.5 mph for around 20-25 min atm. I am aiming to get to 8.5-9.0 mph for 20 minutes. Would this be good enough to hang with the people in great shape?

Who knows? You might run a super fast mile or be capable of running long distances but when it comes to boxing or grappling its a whole different animal. I bet you'd be surprised at how out of shape you actually are. When I first started BJJ I "thought" I was in good shape...To get as close to training in a martial art without doing it I would do a high rep (15-20) with a max of two working sets per exercise with the heaviest weight you can safely handle and increase it when you get your goal reps for that week. Do a full body workout twice a week with mostly compound exercises with very limited rest in between sets. You should be breathing hard after each set. You may even want to look into kettle bells. (http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/mahler22.htm.) Work in some sprints (HIIT) and some lower intensity longer duration cardio during the week. Body weight exercise are good too. Check out this link http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/mahler19.htm. Those execises are no joke. You can see where you stand right away. During the week I usually train 2-3 times a week in BJJ, sprints on stairs, I lift twice and I have been jumping rope or just going on long runs. When I first started doing BJJ I could barely go 3 three minute rounds. Now we roll for an hour sometimes on Saturdays. This is approx at 6200 ft above sea level.

[bjjwraslter7]

true in certain regards, but judo and bjj used to be one and the same back in the day. because of the sport judo today, newaza is highly overlooked, and rarely trained. i agree with you that wrestling and bjj compliment each other well, but so does judo.

look at fedor, the greatest mma fighter of our time, he's a sambo guy. same goes for arlovski. and it wasn't karo's judo that lost him the fight last night, it was his cardio. both wrestling and judo are great for mma!

Sambo isn't judo. From what I understand...correct me if I'm wrong...sambo is very similar to wrestling. I actualy tried to find a combat sambo place around here because I think id love it but no such luck.

I think his judo did hurt him. A few times he put himself in bad positions, or threw diego and ended up landing in a bad spot. I'm not sure whether he gassed because of cardio, or because of how the fight ocurred. He spent a lot of that fight mounted, front and back, and fighting out of it. He did a spectacular job of it too, but fighting out of a dominant position like that takes A LOT out of you. Anyone thats wreslted knows this. You get put on your back in the first round and your pretty fuked energywise even if you don't get pinned. Diego used practicaly no energy on top compared to what karo used on bottom.

Also the shot he took to the eye in the begining really fukt him. You could tell he was squinting and looking to the ref for help in the very begining when he was on his back. That has nothing to do with judo though.

Edit- I think I worded that wrong...I shouldn't say his judo hurt him that's not right, it just got him in trouble a couple of time with the throws and his bjj and wrestling wasn't up to par with diegos.

[BORN2LOSE]

YES i've lost twenty lbs before FOR a fight. I wrestled in the Big10 so i know a thing or two about cutting weight. Its pretty easy with the proper supplements to cut 20lbs of water weight 24-36 hours

Losing the weight may be easy for you but fighting after being severly dehydrated and carb depleted is not.

[bjjwraslter7]

Losing the weight may be easy for you but fighting after being severly dehydrated and carb depleted is not.

Yeah that is true.

[TheBlueDevil]

You dont even need to carb deplete pop some lasix and sit in the sauna. Drop the weight, weigh in, and you have 24hours to rehydrate. Drink pedialyte between weigh-in and the fight and if need be have a medic run a bag of saline into you a couple hours prior.

For people that did it all the time in college making the transition to MMA is not hard at all. We know how to rehydrate. People that DON'T know how to cut weight complain about it. The first cut for most is always the hardest. After that they get better with it. For a college wrestler, making weight and then fighting isnt a big deal in the slightest

[AaronC]

Sambo isn't judo. From what I understand...correct me if I'm wrong...sambo is very similar to wrestling. I actualy tried to find a combat sambo place around here because I think id love it but no such luck.

I think his judo did hurt him. A few times he put himself in bad positions, or threw diego and ended up landing in a bad spot. I'm not sure whether he gassed because of cardio, or because of how the fight ocurred. He spent a lot of that fight mounted, front and back, and fighting out of it. He did a spectacular job of it too, but fighting out of a dominant position like that takes A LOT out of you. Anyone thats wreslted knows this. You get put on your back in the first round and your pretty fuked energywise even if you don't get pinned. Diego used practicaly no energy on top compared to what karo used on bottom.

Also the shot he took to the eye in the begining really fukt him. You could tell he was squinting and looking to the ref for help in the very begining when he was on his back. That has nothing to do with judo though.

i agree with you on his cardio, it wasn't necessarily because he gassed, but he took that nasty uppercut and did land in some pretty bad spots. thats the thing about judo, if you threw someone on the street like that, the fight would be over (concrete), but in the cage, it seemed that karo was ending up in bad positions. as for sambo, if you had to compare it to any style, it would definatly be judo. http://www.clarkeesbar.co.uk/British...tion/sambo.htm also, i had rounds 1 and 2 for karo, so i think he shoulda won the fight, but it could have went either way. diego is an animal.

[bjjwraslter7]

You dont even need to carb deplete pop some lasix and sit in the sauna. Drop the weight, weigh in, and you have 24hours to rehydrate. Drink pedialyte between weigh-in and the fight and if need be have a medic run a bag of saline into you a couple hours prior.

For people that did it all the time in college making the transition to MMA is not hard at all. We know how to rehydrate. People that DON'T know how to cut weight complain about it. The first cut for most is always the hardest. After that they get better with it. For a college wrestler, making weight and then fighting isnt a big deal in the slightest

It's probably easier because in wrestling, highschool at least, you almost always weigh in just a couple hours before your match. If you have 24 hours that makes a huge difference.

[bjjwraslter7]

i agree with you on his cardio, it wasn't necessarily because he gassed, but he took that nasty uppercut and did land in some pretty bad spots. thats the thing about judo, if you threw someone on the street like that, the fight would be over (concrete), but in the cage, it seemed that karo was ending up in bad positions. as for sambo, if you had to compare it to any style, it would definatly be judo. http://www.clarkeesbar.co.uk/British...tion/sambo.htm also, i had rounds 1 and 2 for karo, so i think he shoulda won the fight, but it could have went either way. diego is an animal.

Added an edit to that post, I didn't like how it sounded saying "his judo hurt him".

[HardGainer82]

His judo didn't "get him in trouble," but Diego was definitely prepared to counter it.

[bjjwraslter7]

Is there shooting and leg takedowns in sambo? I thought there was.

[BORN2LOSE]

You dont even need to carb deplete pop some lasix and sit in the sauna. Drop the weight, weigh in, and you have 24hours to rehydrate. Drink pedialyte between weigh-in and the fight and if need be have a medic run a bag of saline into you a couple hours prior.

For people that did it all the time in college making the transition to MMA is not hard at all. We know how to rehydrate. People that DON'T know how to cut weight complain about it. The first cut for most is always the hardest. After that they get better with it. For a college wrestler, making weight and then fighting isnt a big deal in the slightest

I understand how cutting and rehydrating works. (A very good cutting method in this article http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/drobson174.htm. Regardless, we don't know the whole story. Who knows he could have been injured. When Tito fought Griffen he wasn't able to train like the last month or so because of the knee injury that he got during training. I don't think a guy that trains with Tito Ortiz is going to come in to a fight out of shape on purpose. Tito takes a lot of pride in conditioning. Lister is no rookie and he's been around the block in the UFC and Pride. We'll see in his next fight. I do think his standup needs to get better in order to stick around.

[TheBlueDevil]

Link is dead?

[BORN2LOSE]

Oops. See if this works. http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/drobson174.htm

Its near the bottom near the weight lifting and glutamine stuff. I fixed the original.