Dorian - Ketogenic Diets

**admin** · 06-13-2002, 11:20 AM

What are ketogenic diets? How can keto diets help you lose fat quicker and feel better? Learn it all with this series of articles.

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/dorian6.htm

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**Big H** · 06-14-2002, 03:55 PM

Very good article Dorian and Fitnessman.. Very nicely done

**97LT1** · 06-15-2002, 05:10 PM

Always informative as usual. A must read for those considering Keto.

**mdx3k** · 06-17-2002, 11:52 AM

very good stuff..!

**linhardt** · 06-20-2002, 06:47 AM

Very good article. Been following your articles and the forum for a while now. Great job.

The one thing I would like to see along with the types of foods with KETO that you wrote about would be a good basic sample weekly meal plan for the 200 lb man example.

Seems everyone is on the forums giving thier meal plans and wanting replys if it is good or not.

I think that giving a weekly meal plan showing the 6 daily meals eaten (type of food, amounts, calories, protien, fats, and carbs) would give a good basic idea that people could adjust to thier likings for each meal.

Thanks, and keep the articles coming!!

**musmar** · 06-20-2002, 12:19 PM

Very good article, good job!

**Original Poster** · 06-21-2002, 05:19 AM

I think both articles are great. (part I and part II)
I love the picture of Fitnessman's kitchen counter with all the meats on them.
I would like to thank both Dorian and Fitnessman for these two great articles. They have and will help many.

The only thing, I think that would have been easier is a simple formula for ratios, instead of this long drawn out explanation of both fitnessman's and dorian's way to calc daily targets for F/P/C.
A simpler format for ratio's would be nice. IMHO

Something along the lines of..........

for a 200 lb person........

200 x 10 cal/lb = 2000 cals total target.

good starting ratio of 45/45/10 (F/P/C)

2000 x .45 = 900 cals from Fat per day
900 / 9 cals per gram = 100 grams of fat per day

2000 x.45 = 900 cals from Protein per day
900 / 4 cals per gram = 225 grams of protein per day

2000 x .1 = 200 cals from carbs per day
200 / 4 cals per gram = 50 grams of carbs per day (preferably green fiberous veggies)

The above formula can be adapted for anyone. With the only thing being, one may have to slightly change ratio's to get to and remain in ketosis as well as maintain workout intensity.

ie.. ......
...... if your not in ketosis.....lower carbs a bit more.
...... if your energy levels are low and workout's are suffering abit, increase fat intake a bit more.

AGAIN, GREAT ARTICLE's from the KETO GODS.

PEACE

**Kill Shot** · 07-25-2002, 02:13 PM

I was impressed with your article! I found it really helpful. Thanks!

**The Greg** · 01-04-2003, 09:26 PM

Thanks Dorian, very simple and easy to read.

Keep it up

**monolithdigital** · 12-25-2006, 09:55 PM

Other then some optimistic math, the rest seems fairly sound. Definatly loading the carb for breakfast in the diet makes more sense, but I would be apprehensive about skipping them entirely throughout the rest of the day, but thats just me.

I am seriously against this whole 1gram per pound btw, I have not seen any scientific study to support this. The closest I can see is a recommendation for 1.5-1.6 per kilo for intense exercise, on athelets or .8grams per pound, 20% less then what is suggested.*

This makes a difference, IMO, in the sense that those extra calories could be better spend on post workout and morning carbohydrate load to ensure lower energy loss during the day.

*Consolazio, CF jonson ... Skala JH: Protein metabolism of intensive physical training in the young adult. AM J Clin Nutr 38:39-35, 1795
*Darling, RC Jonson RE ... Robinson PF: Effects of cariations in dietary protein on the physical well being of men doing manual work. J Nutr28:273-281, 1955
*P. W. Lemon, M. A. Tarnopolsky, J. D. MacDougall and S. A. - Atkinson Journal of Applied Physiology, Vol 73, Issue 2 767-775, Copyright � 1992
*Peter W.R. Lemon, PhD = Journal of the American College of Nutrition, Vol. 19, No. 90005, 513S-521S (2000)

**BUSAHUNTER** · 07-14-2009, 10:49 PM

This is my first post ever on any forum or blog so be kind...Ok I just went over the artical on ketogenic diets and I would love to try it for a good 30 days to see if I like the lifestyle change or not. I looked all over youtube , google but I can't find any step by step hand holding instructions that I need. I never worked out before May of this year and I know nothing about food let alone their values. If it wasn't on a x-box game I don't know what it is.So if some one can help that would be great. O the only thing I don't want to stop doing is taking my Juice Plus they are a muti. Vitamin from whole foods one from vineyards also veg,fruits so 3 differnt pills . I hope that won't screw the diet up. My specs are as followed:

245 lbs (and losing) I want to end up in that 190-200 range some day. I am training for endurance so thats my latic acid system (I just found that out in May)

Suplements that I'm taking are as followed:

Juice Plus..Animal Paks....N.O Explode..X-pland Non Caf. Glutamine..Flex Solutions..Iso Flex.
The reason I mentioned them is to see if any will screw up my change

Foods I will and can eat anything.

alf323511 · 07-15-2009, 12:59 PM

Originally Posted by BUSAHUNTER

This is my first post ever on any forum or blog so be kind...Ok I just went over the artical on ketogenic diets and I would love to try it for a good 30 days to see if I like the lifestyle change or not. I looked all over youtube , google but I can't find any step by step hand holding instructions that I need. I never worked out before May of this year and I know nothing about food let alone their values. If it wasn't on a x-box game I don't know what it is.So if some one can help that would be great. O the only thing I don't want to stop doing is taking my Juice Plus they are a muti. Vitamin from whole foods one from vineyards also veg,fruits so 3 differnt pills . I hope that won't screw the diet up. My specs are as followed:

245 lbs (and losing) I want to end up in that 190-200 range some day. I am training for endurance so thats my latic acid system (I just found that out in May)

Suplements that I'm taking are as followed:

Juice Plus..Animal Paks....N.O Explode..X-pland Non Caf. Glutamine..Flex Solutions..Iso Flex.
The reason I mentioned them is to see if any will screw up my change

Foods I will and can eat anything.

I would suggest watching the Daily Video Trainer if you are beginner, it has everything you need to know laid out for you!

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/12_w...ainer_main.htm

WW

**BUSAHUNTER** · 07-15-2009, 03:17 PM

Thanks for the reply..I went and looked at the videos and it does look good. I was more looking for hep with starting a Ketogenic or CKD diet. I found all kinds of good info and some that don't sit well ethier but I can't find any meal plans that are simple enough for me to understand I guess.

**ecorrea2** · 07-20-2009, 10:35 AM

this is like Atkins diet but you can call it Atkins-Plus.
Very good article.
me personally did Atkins before and it worked for me.
Now will try this method that included Exercise combination.

THe diet is verry similar to Atkins but here i see the addition of Carbs and Whey protein,
i will post my results soon.

**SalimS.** · 08-07-2009, 02:37 PM

Good info

**jagooch** · 11-13-2010, 08:22 PM

Originally Posted by BUSAHUNTER

Thanks for the reply..I went and looked at the videos and it does look good. I was more looking for hep with starting a Ketogenic or CKD diet. I found all kinds of good info and some that don't sit well ethier but I can't find any meal plans that are simple enough for me to understand I guess.

It sucks that never got an answer. If he is watching this topic still, I hope he goes to ask the question in the forums.

When was this article written? It seems to be around 2002. I always want to know the timeliness of articles online, because things change or get super-ceded over time. Sure, some things stay the same, but new products and techniques can evolve, and it's good to update the article to stay up with the times

**bizconsultant** · 01-25-2016, 10:40 AM

I know this thread is very old but I'd like to point out, at the end of Part Two of the article it states "During the next article in this series we will discuss bulking up and it's ratios. I will also include some training tips to help maximize fat loss and bulk."

I can't seem to find the article regarding ketogenic diets and bulking up. I think Ketogenic diets are absolutely fabulous for fat loss and for athletes in endurance sports. But what about muscle building? Wouldn't your body be more efficient (how much more I have no idea) regarding bulking up with a higher carb intake to raise insulin levels post-workout? I've read that hypertrophy can occur up to 48 hours after workout. If you trained say, twice a week and upped carb intake to over closer to 100g/day for say 36-hours after the workout, wouldn't that eventually take you out of ketosis? Or can you just bump carbs slightly to help with the hypertrophy without pulling yourself out of ketosis?

I find it fascinating that a search for 'ketogenic' on this forum brings up a flury of threads from 2002 but almost nothing since? Wow.

**bizconsultant** · 01-25-2016, 05:48 PM

Anybody search ketogenic that runs across this thread you may find this article fascinating. (I can see you Keto people that new this 14 years ago nodding your head.)

Nutr Metab (Lond). 2006; 3: 9.
Published online 2006 Jan 31. doi: 10.1186/1743-7075-3-9
PMCID: PMC1373635
Very-low-carbohydrate diets and preservation of muscle mass
Anssi H Manninen

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Dorian - Ketogenic Diets

Fat Guy With Low I.Q Needs Help With Ketogenic Diets

shorn woolf

this is like Atkins diet but you can call it Atkins-Plus

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