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  1. #1
    Registered User singledigitman's Avatar
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    Lyle McDonald fatloss article is bull****

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  2. #2
    Cutting a lot BMEgrad's Avatar
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    ok....why?
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  3. #3
    Registered User LANGE's Avatar
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    I'm going to assume that because if someone is carrying around (50) pounds of fat, they could drop their caloric intake by (1550) calories per day which may be over half of what they actually take in. I do not think this would work well.
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  4. #4
    Professional Manscaper Bronkko's Avatar
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    http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=4231763

    that debate is going on in the above thread.

    some people think his stuff is gospel. others..not so much.
    **disclaimer** the above is only opinion. it contains no capitalization, too much punctuation and (most likely) includes spelling errors.
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  5. #5
    * Misc Mailman * vipergq's Avatar
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    I think his fat loss principles are right on.....
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  6. #6
    Registered User singledigitman's Avatar
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    Lets see why I think its bull

    Take a guy of 280lbs and 30%bodyfat

    he is carrying 84lbs of fat

    84x31=2604

    his maintainence would be

    280x15=4200

    So according to the article it would be acceptable for him to cut on

    4200-2604=1596 calores

    BULL****
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  7. #7
    Registered User Chin@man's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by vipergq View Post
    I think his fat loss principles are right on.....
    I really want you to take some picture of myself in the future.
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  8. #8
    Registered DarinK's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by singledigitman View Post
    Lets see why I think its bull

    Take a guy of 280lbs and 30%bodyfat

    he is carrying 84lbs of fat

    84x31=2604

    his maintainence would be

    280x15=4200

    So according to the article it would be acceptable for him to cut on

    4200-2604=1596 calores

    BULL****
    The numbers work out better for smaller leaner people.
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  9. #9
    Registered User singledigitman's Avatar
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    yes but he doesnt day that and most people that want to lose fat are big enough and will follow that advice
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  10. #10
    "Talon" ExtremeEnigma's Avatar
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    Are you aware that just because someone is petite and small boned, that doesn't mean they are skinny or fit. I have always had a slow metabolism, and it makes everything so difficult. But I decided to take charge, and look the way I want. I have poor digestion, I never wanted to eat during the day because my stomach bloats to the point it's just ridiculous, even after the smallest amount of food. Now, I am completely miserable, because I worked hard for my body, and put alot into it. Now I'm back to stage one, only worse. My life has fallen apart in so many ways. I want to find out how to improve and speed up my slow metabolism and digestion. Also, I want to find out how to take off the excess fat I gained, and build up muscle. Currently, I have serious anxiety and barely leave the house ever. It got so bad that I'm not in school right now, along with OTHER health reasons. I don't know where to start. I'm hoping this site will be able to help me continue with my life again! x0x It's hilarious how noone pays attention to you until you come back the next year with blonde hair, a dark tan, a fit bod, and basically looking totally different.. thats low, I'm still the same person at heart, and always will be. x0x I spend pretty much everyday hoping to make some kind of difference. The **** that people do to each other is ridiculous. Like I don't even know where to start. I'm proof that people focus to much on whats on the outside rather than inside. My looks are quite deceiving. Before I changed my look, growing up was horrable, I have no good childhood memories because of other people. The only memories I have are terrifying. Now that I look different, people actually listen to what I have to say..? It's insanely pathetic. x0x Not now, but when everything is stable, I want to be a model. It has always been my dream, and I'll do whatever it takes to achieve that goal. Image is what attracts the eye. But, Image is only part of it, and is not everything. It does NOT last forever. Once I have your attention, maybe you'll actually see what I'm REALLY about, and how I want to get a positive messages accross. Like ****, open your eyes, there are girls everyday trying to starve themselves just to be accepted. WHY? Because people are so cruel, it needs to STOP! Show some love, everyone is beautiful, everyone is superior. Learn to RESPECT.
    b.s. exercise science, nsca-cscs
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  11. #11
    Registered DarinK's Avatar
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    The "Are You Awares" stopped being funny about a year ago. But you put a lot of effort into this one so I did laugh.
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  12. #12
    Professional Manscaper Bronkko's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by dkf10425 View Post
    The "Are You Awares" stopped being funny about a year ago. But you put a lot of effort into this one so I did laugh.
    i was supposed to laugh?
    **disclaimer** the above is only opinion. it contains no capitalization, too much punctuation and (most likely) includes spelling errors.
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  13. #13
    Registered DarinK's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Bronkko View Post
    i was supposed to laugh?
    No, not really, but I got a brief chuckle from the "I want to be a model" part.
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  14. #14
    Surgeon By 2012 or Bust! -Aaron-'s Avatar
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    Originally Posted by CaV961 View Post
    Are you aware that just because someone is petite and small boned, that doesn't mean they are skinny or fit. I have always had a slow metabolism, and it makes everything so difficult. But I decided to take charge, and look the way I want. I have poor digestion, I never wanted to eat during the day because my stomach bloats to the point it's just ridiculous, even after the smallest amount of food. Now, I am completely miserable, because I worked hard for my body, and put alot into it. Now I'm back to stage one, only worse. My life has fallen apart in so many ways. I want to find out how to improve and speed up my slow metabolism and digestion. Also, I want to find out how to take off the excess fat I gained, and build up muscle. Currently, I have serious anxiety and barely leave the house ever. It got so bad that I'm not in school right now, along with OTHER health reasons. I don't know where to start. I'm hoping this site will be able to help me continue with my life again! x0x It's hilarious how noone pays attention to you until you come back the next year with blonde hair, a dark tan, a fit bod, and basically looking totally different.. thats low, I'm still the same person at heart, and always will be. x0x I spend pretty much everyday hoping to make some kind of difference. The **** that people do to each other is ridiculous. Like I don't even know where to start. I'm proof that people focus to much on whats on the outside rather than inside. My looks are quite deceiving. Before I changed my look, growing up was horrable, I have no good childhood memories because of other people. The only memories I have are terrifying. Now that I look different, people actually listen to what I have to say..? It's insanely pathetic. x0x Not now, but when everything is stable, I want to be a model. It has always been my dream, and I'll do whatever it takes to achieve that goal. Image is what attracts the eye. But, Image is only part of it, and is not everything. It does NOT last forever. Once I have your attention, maybe you'll actually see what I'm REALLY about, and how I want to get a positive messages accross. Like ****, open your eyes, there are girls everyday trying to starve themselves just to be accepted. WHY? Because people are so cruel, it needs to STOP! Show some love, everyone is beautiful, everyone is superior. Learn to RESPECT.
    How come you're trying to look like John Gotti Jr.?
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  15. #15
    Registered User john_29's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by CaV961 View Post
    Are you aware that just because someone is petite and small boned, that doesn't mean they are skinny or fit. I have always had a slow metabolism, and it makes everything so difficult. But I decided to take charge, and look the way I want. I have poor digestion, I never wanted to eat during the day because my stomach bloats to the point it's just ridiculous, even after the smallest amount of food. Now, I am completely miserable, because I worked hard for my body, and put alot into it. Now I'm back to stage one, only worse. My life has fallen apart in so many ways. I want to find out how to improve and speed up my slow metabolism and digestion. Also, I want to find out how to take off the excess fat I gained, and build up muscle. Currently, I have serious anxiety and barely leave the house ever. It got so bad that I'm not in school right now, along with OTHER health reasons. I don't know where to start. I'm hoping this site will be able to help me continue with my life again! x0x It's hilarious how noone pays attention to you until you come back the next year with blonde hair, a dark tan, a fit bod, and basically looking totally different.. thats low, I'm still the same person at heart, and always will be. x0x I spend pretty much everyday hoping to make some kind of difference. The **** that people do to each other is ridiculous. Like I don't even know where to start. I'm proof that people focus to much on whats on the outside rather than inside. My looks are quite deceiving. Before I changed my look, growing up was horrable, I have no good childhood memories because of other people. The only memories I have are terrifying. Now that I look different, people actually listen to what I have to say..? It's insanely pathetic. x0x Not now, but when everything is stable, I want to be a model. It has always been my dream, and I'll do whatever it takes to achieve that goal. Image is what attracts the eye. But, Image is only part of it, and is not everything. It does NOT last forever. Once I have your attention, maybe you'll actually see what I'm REALLY about, and how I want to get a positive messages accross. Like ****, open your eyes, there are girls everyday trying to starve themselves just to be accepted. WHY? Because people are so cruel, it needs to STOP! Show some love, everyone is beautiful, everyone is superior. Learn to RESPECT.
    lol that was quick
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  16. #16
    * Misc Mailman * vipergq's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by singledigitman View Post
    Lets see why I think its bull

    Take a guy of 280lbs and 30%bodyfat

    he is carrying 84lbs of fat

    84x31=2604

    his maintainence would be

    280x15=4200

    So according to the article it would be acceptable for him to cut on

    4200-2604=1596 calores

    BULL****


    Yes, absolutely. People with alot of fat can obviously burn more calories through a higher level of fat lipolosis. Have you not seen the biggest loser? Those guys are going on probably 3000-4000 below their calorie maintainance level.

    a 280lb guy carrying 30% BF can definitely handle a 2600 calorie deficit with minimal muscle loss. This is of course assuming all other factors are done perfectly including diet and workout.

    Hell I kept a 1500-2000 calorie a day deficit for a full month with minimal muscle loss.
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  17. #17
    Professional Manscaper Bronkko's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by vipergq View Post

    Hell I kept a 1500-2000 calorie a day deficit for a full month with minimal muscle loss.
    where was this statement in the thread about "starvation mode?"

    you left me hung out to dry after i invoked your case.
    **disclaimer** the above is only opinion. it contains no capitalization, too much punctuation and (most likely) includes spelling errors.
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  18. #18
    * Misc Mailman * vipergq's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Bronkko View Post
    where was this statement in the thread about "starvation mode?"

    you left me hung out to dry after i invoked your case.
    nope, I said I am not an advocate of Ultra low calorie diets. I said I never recommend going under 1500 calories for a male and to create a calorie deficit with exercise instead. I kept my calories at 2200-2400 calories even during my Extreme short term diet. Even at that, I had weekly refeed days to keep my metabolism and leptin levels in check.

    You posted my original thread that showed I said my calories were 2100-2300.

    I still stand by that. I believe You should NEVER cut calories below 1500 a day. ever. Even if you are ultra obese, you should only drop your cals to 1500 at most and create the rest of the deficit with exercise.
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  19. #19
    Registered User Skull Crusher's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by singledigitman View Post
    Lets see why I think its bull

    Take a guy of 280lbs and 30%bodyfat

    he is carrying 84lbs of fat

    84x31=2604

    his maintainence would be

    280x15=4200

    So according to the article it would be acceptable for him to cut on

    4200-2604=1596 calores

    BULL****
    Actually, my starting weight 2 months ago was 282, and I consume no more than 1500 calories per day (maybe even less), and I've had great results with minimal/no muscle loss (see my sig).
    06/23/07 - 282 lbs.

    07/14/07 - 263 lbs.

    08/04/07 - 263 lbs.

    08/25/07 - 250 lbs.

    09/15/07 - 243 lbs.

    10/06/07 - 233 lbs.

    10/27/07 - 230 lbs.

    11/17/07 - 225 lbs.

    Current: 224 lbs. (10/02/14)
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  20. #20
    Professional Manscaper Bronkko's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by vipergq View Post
    nope, I said I am not an advocate of Ultra low calorie diets. I said I never recommend going under 1500 calories for a male and to create a calorie deficit with exercise instead. I kept my calories at 2200-2400 calories even during my Extreme short term diet. Even at that, I had weekly refeed days to keep my metabolism and leptin levels in check.

    You posted my original thread that showed I said my calories were 2100-2300.

    I still stand by that. I believe You should NEVER cut calories below 1500 a day. ever. Even if you are ultra obese, you should only drop your cals to 1500 at most and create the rest of the deficit with exercise.
    then you didnt read my quote. i said sub 2000 cal diets. i was and have never advocated sub 1500 cal diets. but you ran close to 2000 along with myself and a few others with minimal muscle loss.
    **disclaimer** the above is only opinion. it contains no capitalization, too much punctuation and (most likely) includes spelling errors.
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  21. #21
    Train hard play harder Tommy W.'s Avatar
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    I've done very well with this agenda. I read it a while ago and it made perfect sense.
    You don't need to feed fat.
    period.
    The only suggestion I would make would be to gradually drop cals if you're highly overweight.

    You can tiptoe around this stuff all day long if you want.

    If you want to be 180 @ 10% then set your macro's and cals for this.

    Everyone tries to complicate this stuff.

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    Yes I'm 63 and natural but with a Test number of almost 800.


    At it for 43 years. No end in sight
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  22. #22
    Bavarian Warrior webhead's Avatar
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    Science isn't about making complex calculations, getting a number that you don't like and the calling it bull****. The sun would still be revolving around us if that were the case, the first time those numbers popped up I'm sure they looked like BS too.

    I took a glance at the article and the point seems valid and logical. Compare it to this: drink a gallon of oil and you'll probably be headed for the can halfway through. Why? There's no way of absorbing that much oil in one time. Why? The absorbtion is limited by the availability of enzymes (lipases), phospholipid connections and cholesterol salts. If it finally gets "dissolved" there still is a physical limit to how much you can absorb on the surface area of your intestines.

    There simply is a limit to how much fat you can mobilize from adipose tissue. A limiting factor would certainly be the available lipases in the cellular membrane of those adipose cells, as would the available apo-lipoproteins needed to bind and transport fatty acids in the blood, and the simple amount of veins and total blood transfusion would be a factor as well.

    I'm sure there's a way of quantifying this upper limit and that is exactly what they tried. I'm also sure that the provided number isn't holy and more a ballpark figure. Also, if you calculate some average examples for average people you'll see that the 31kcal/pound fat gets fairly close to the maximum deficit "golden rule" of 20% below maintenance which doesn't seem to be based on anything at all besides empirical observations. With this in mind you don't prove or dismiss a theory by using extremes as an example. A theory is usable when it holds up for the average majority. If you take extreme examples and get extreme numbers and then find it's BS, that's exactly what you should expect.
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  23. #23
    Registered User _Spiral's Avatar
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    My calories were low when I lost a lot of weight...didn't lose any muscle either. I truly think it depends on the persons body. Right now I probably eat in 1700 cal...some days I probably take in 1000. On the weekends I visit my family and tend to stuff myself. I guess the refeed is keeping my metabolism going. Within the last two weeks i've dropped around 6lbs, that's with eating low and jogging 4-5x a week.
    Only I can design me.
    [current status] Shaving fat away...

    Weight 194
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  24. #24
    Registered User Sowilo's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by vipergq View Post
    Yes, absolutely. People with alot of fat can obviously burn more calories through a higher level of fat lipolosis. Have you not seen the biggest loser? Those guys are going on probably 3000-4000 below their calorie maintainance level.

    a 280lb guy carrying 30% BF can definitely handle a 2600 calorie deficit with minimal muscle loss. This is of course assuming all other factors are done perfectly including diet and workout.

    Hell I kept a 1500-2000 calorie a day deficit for a full month with minimal muscle loss.
    i agree 100% and am about to do so, see my journal anyone interested
    Sowilo: The life-force, health. A time when power will be available to you for positive changes in your life, victory, health, and success.

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    http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?p=72893093#post72893093
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