Squat problems, fish or cut bait

[Cantplankwell]

Hi Folks

I seem to have run into a problem with my squats...high bar. Im wearing weightlifting shoes, and my mobility is very good, so I get well below parallel. I have given up doing heavy singles, and mostly work in the 70 to 90% region. For me heavy is 240, could probably work a bit harder and move that up...but why anymore? Its about staying fit now.

No vids, its verboten at the gym and they will throw you out if you get caught. I like this place and dont want to risk that.

a little more than a few weeks back I seemed to have tweaked my low back.... just out of the hole, not super painful...but enough to know something is wrong. I was sore for about a week or so and gradually it faded. I decided to take a few weeks off from the gym, as we were going south to get some sun anyway.

Back today, and fine with the empty bar, then 135 for a couple of reps...155, and there it is again, pain on the way up in my lower back, seemingly about the first 5-6 inches above my glutes. I cut it off there, and and went on to do the rest of my work..no issues once the weight is off my back. Sitting at work here I have iced, and taken an ibuprofen, but back to that dull low grade pain in the same area.

Im too busy to deal with this let alone an ongoing major issue and fwiw I have mild degenerative disks...more in the upper back (which has never really caused too much a problem), and I am weighing out the risk/rewards of squatting. I am C2 rowing about 20K meters per week now (Pete plan) so I dont want to have an issue with the rowing...its too beneficial.

Has anyone just walked away from traditional barbell squatting and what did you do to replace it and still get training stimulus for the legs. (basically I do 3 day a week full body). Im not bodybuilding, or power lifting, and I also dont do much oly lifting anymore...just power cleans. At this point its about staying fit, reasonably athletic looking and not being an eyesore.

[mtpockets]

Has anyone just walked away from traditional barbell squatting and what did you do to replace it and still get training stimulus for the legs.

Hip Belts Squats have replaced my BB Squatting forethemostpart. The only regret that I have is not starting them sooner.

Lunges are fun as well!

Good Luck.

[air2fakie]

Has anyone just walked away from traditional barbell squatting and what did you do to replace it and still get training stimulus for the legs. (basically I do 3 day a week full body). Im not bodybuilding, or power lifting, and I also dont do much oly lifting anymore...just power cleans. At this point its about staying fit, reasonably athletic looking and not being an eyesore.

Unless you have a severe injury, it's unlikely that you need to abandon bb squats especially at the weight you're lifting. Without a form video, hard to advise otherwise except to say that you don't need to go past parallel at all and that you may just need to take it easy while you heal - but see a doctor regardless if you have concerns.

That being said, any squat-like pattern will develop your legs just fine, especially when combined with DL or DL variations. Heavy goblet squats (e.g., repping out a 130 lb db) hits the quads great, trap bar DLs are great for all-around leg development, etc. Of course, if you have an injury or poor form, most compound leg movements can aggravate your back.

If you're just trying to stay reasonably fit and don't care about bodybuilding or powerlifting, it doesn't really matter what you do or if you do any leg exercises at all.

[OldFartTom]

FWIW.. and may have no relation to you, when I've had pain in the same sounding location, thankfully not as bad as you, has been because I let my back posture change slightly on the start of the drive up -- or tried to giant set Squats and OHP. Edit or done OHP before squats. Don't know if any of this is relevant for you

[ajdahlheimer]

Has anyone just walked away from traditional barbell squatting....

I took ~10 years off of squatting from 2002-13. I didn't have a squat rack in my home gym during those years and even though I was an above average squatter before that (IMO)--I was just much more focused on building up my shoulders, chest, and arms in that span anyway. So never really thought about it. Running seemed to maintain my legs okay. I got the half rack I have in my gym now in 2014, so have been back squatting once a week since then though. Focus way more on back than anything else nowadays I think as I find the lifts most injury-friendly........

-AJ

[crupiea]

I had something similar and it drove me nuts.

Could not even do one air squat without my right side lower back hurting. If i did a couple sets of actual squats with the bar it would hurt like hell for like a week and almost never seem to get better. Finally had to quit.

Didnt do anything for a long time and decided to try again and first warm up squat, there is was again, lasted all week.

Figured there was some imbalance and was determined to fix it.

Turns out it was my butt muscle being too tight.

I took the next couple weeks and did nothing but stretch it like 6-7 times per day every day. I would lay on my back, cross one knee over the other and stretch the butt muscle for about 30 seconds at a time for 3 sets. That was it.

After a few days I could feel it start to loosen up a bit and after a few weeks of it I was fine.

Now i can squat deadlift, whatever without any issues. If its acts up I do a few stretches throughout the day and its good to go again.

[LWW]

Back today, and fine with the empty bar, then 135 for a couple of reps...155, and there it is again, pain on the way up in my lower back, seemingly about the first 5-6 inches above my glutes.


Has anyone just walked away from traditional barbell squatting and what did you do to replace it and still get training stimulus for the legs. (basically I do 3 day a week full body)..

Sounds like cookie cutter set rep scheme in which you are not warmed up properly.

Few reps? = not properly warmed up.

People don’t do high rep warmups because they fear it will gas them out for heavy sets, if that’s the case that you get gassed out, than you need that conditioning.


It’s not that the squats need replacing, it’s just how they are being done.


A 50-100rep squat with very light weight only going parallel will build legs and lungs.

[Payton1221]

If you're just interested in staying fit and looking reasonably athletic looking, you could consider a combination of leg extensions, leg curls, and buldgarian split squats. I'd keep the BSS light if not BW only and do them with high reps (or perhaps rest/pause) to keep the strain off your back minimal.

[Cantplankwell]

Thanks for your replys, reps on recharge with some of you. some updates: have some kind of sciatica thing happening I think, its like a constant muscle spasm soreness in my left side calf, hamstring and same side glute now almost like a Charlie horse..mostly an issue at night. back is not sore now. I did one short rowing piece the other day, and a light gym day this morning consisting of: front squats, back extensions, OHP, farmers walks, and some shoulder work...all light and no issues.

Hip Belts Squats have replaced my BB Squatting forethemostpart. The only regret that I have is not starting them sooner.

Lunges are fun as well!

Good Luck.

Very, very interesting, there are a few land mine attachment thingys

Unless you have a severe injury, it's unlikely that you need to abandon bb squats especially at the weight you're lifting. Without a form video, hard to advise otherwise except to say that you don't need to go past parallel at all and that you may just need to take it easy while you heal - but see a doctor regardless if you have concerns.

That being said, any squat-like pattern will develop your legs just fine, especially when combined with DL or DL variations. Heavy goblet squats (e.g., repping out a 130 lb db) hits the quads great, trap bar DLs are great for all-around leg development, etc. Of course, if you have an injury or poor form, most compound leg movements can aggravate your back.

If you're just trying to stay reasonably fit and don't care about bodybuilding or powerlifting, it doesn't really matter what you do or if you do any leg exercises at all.

I dont think it severe either, but super annoying I would hate to give squats up, I normally squat 2 out of 3 gym sessions. But I am going to dial it back for awhile until I am done my rowing campaign, and throw in some other isolation leg stuff. Going to just parallel maybe a concession I have to make moving forward. I know my lifts are light but take pride in full range. Only thing is I do have a bit of but wink when low, and its never been a problem, but I understand that once you wink possibly there is no longer much glute recruitment...so hints at other issues as well.

FWIW.. and may have no relation to you, when I've had pain in the same sounding location, thankfully not as bad as you, has been because I let my back posture change slightly on the start of the drive up -- or tried to giant set Squats and OHP. Edit or done OHP before squats. Don't know if any of this is relevant for you

Something has definitely changed in my method...and the execution. Going to try a video soon, I will see if I can get one of the trainers to take it.

I took ~10 years off of squatting from 2002-13. I didn't have a squat rack in my home gym during those years and even though I was an above average squatter before that (IMO)--I was just much more focused on building up my shoulders, chest, and arms in that span anyway. So never really thought about it. Running seemed to maintain my legs okay. I got the half rack I have in my gym now in 2014, so have been back squatting once a week since then though. Focus way more on back than anything else nowadays I think as I find the lifts most injury-friendly........

-AJ

Thanks AJ, you have set a high standard, and done a great job. I try and stay away from running now, Its been totally replaced with C2 rowing, which does have a fair bit of leg involvement.

I had something similar and it drove me nuts.

Could not even do one air squat without my right side lower back hurting. If i did a couple sets of actual squats with the bar it would hurt like hell for like a week and almost never seem to get better. Finally had to quit.

Didnt do anything for a long time and decided to try again and first warm up squat, there is was again, lasted all week.

Figured there was some imbalance and was determined to fix it.

Turns out it was my butt muscle being too tight.

I took the next couple weeks and did nothing but stretch it like 6-7 times per day every day. I would lay on my back, cross one knee over the other and stretch the butt muscle for about 30 seconds at a time for 3 sets. That was it.

After a few days I could feel it start to loosen up a bit and after a few weeks of it I was fine.

Now i can squat deadlift, whatever without any issues. If its acts up I do a few stretches throughout the day and its good to go again.

Doing this same stuff 2-3 times a day, Interesting you mentioned the cross overs. Left leg over right side, I am good and flat, right leg over left and I am about 60% there. it hints at an imbalance. Going to keep working it.

Sounds like cookie cutter set rep scheme in which you are not warmed up properly.

Few reps? = not properly warmed up.

People don’t do high rep warmups because they fear it will gas them out for heavy sets, if that’s the case that you get gassed out, than you need that conditioning.


It’s not that the squats need replacing, it’s just how they are being done.


A 50-100rep squat with very light weight only going parallel will build legs and lungs.

LOL, Anything more than 5 reps for me is cardio, your a beast tho and can get away with it, me not so much. Most of my getting gassed comes from C2 rowing these days.

If you're just interested in staying fit and looking reasonably athletic looking, you could consider a combination of leg extensions, leg curls, and buldgarian split squats. I'd keep the BSS light if not BW only and do them with high reps (or perhaps rest/pause) to keep the strain off your back minimal.

Thanks Payton, I get most of my appearance inspiration from MMA fighters. Thats the look I would like. Bulgarian split squats are brutal I could probably sub that for my squat volume day just itself. I will have to wait in line for the machines now, the racks are always less popular.