USA Powerlifting lost a two-year court battle to a Tranny

[mtpockets]

USA Powerlifting lost a two-year court battle this week after a judge ruled that it had discriminated against transgender athlete JayCee Cooper by banning her from competing in women's competitions.

The ruling also mandated that the sports organization "cease and desist from all unfair discriminatory practices" because of sexual orientation and gender identity and that it revise its policy related to sexual orientation and gender identity within two weeks.

[Mark1T]

The way this is going, there will be only trannies competing against other trannies.

Sponsorships will dry up. The public for the most part won't want to see a circus.

[mtpockets]

The way this is going, there will be only trannies competing against other trannies.

Sponsorships will dry up. The public for the most part won't want to see a circus.

100% agree Mark, it's becoming quite the sh!t show. This bending over backwards to please the trannies is ridiculous and many female athletes who trained for years are put at a disadvantage in their sport. Sickening.

[sakustoms]

Unfortunately this stuff will continue until the female athletes just refuse to compete. No companies are going to sponsor events featuring all trans athletes nor are they going to sponsor those athletes. Then the federation will dry up or change their tune.

[thedickus]

Don't get me wrong, I like tranny porn as much as the next guy, but there's a huge difference in athletic abilities between men and women. Men and women are not the same. We have men and women divisions in sports for a reason.

[Karl_Hungus]

If they want to compete, just compete with the men -- problem solved. Will they be at a disadvantage? Probably, but this is a situation in which somebody will be at a competitive disadvantage, and I believe it makes much more sense for the 0.01% of the competitors to be disadvantaged than the 99.99%. We have seriously lost all manner of common sense around this stuff.

[mtpockets]

[7Seconds]

If they want to compete, just compete with the men -- problem solved. Will they be at a disadvantage? Probably, but this is a situation in which somebody will be at a competitive disadvantage, and I believe it makes much more sense for the 0.01% of the competitors to be disadvantaged than the 99.99%. We have seriously lost all manner of common sense around this stuff.

I agree this might be the fairest way to handle this. I also believe the MX category was created in the UK as a category for non-binary lifters who do not want to register as either male or female.


That being said she wasn’t suing only because she was told she couldn’t compete in the women’s division. According to her lawsuit she was told she could compete if she met X qualification, she paid to get the tests done to meet X qualification, paid for a membership, and then they re-negged on this promise and told her she could not compete.

Moreover, her initial TUE was granted by the USAPL board, then overturned later by the USAPL president on the basis of a policy that's illegal under Minnesota sex-discrimination law.

USAPL argued that trans people must be excluded on the basis of body composition characteristics, but their policy banned an entire category of people on the assumption that they have these characteristics, rather than attempting to check that whatsoever. So because they didn't check, the court said the argument was void. The only factors they used were current registered sex and sex assigned at birth, which is sex discrimination according to the court. Although this is not an opinion that extends beyond Minnesota because it is based on Minnesota anti-discrimination laws and their interpretation.

[startingat56]

Paging Tonya Harding

Tonya Harding please report to the registration desk

[mtpockets]

Paging Tonya Harding

Tonya Harding please report to the registration desk

LMAO nothing like a good shin job to get peoples attention.

[Bando]

In RPS to compete in the women's division as a person born male you have to provide medical documentation that you have been on estrogen for at least a year. I'm far from an expert but doesn't that type of therapy fuk you up pretty bad as far as being strong goes?

[7Seconds]

In RPS to compete in the women's division as a person born male you have to provide medical documentation that you have been on estrogen for at least a year. I'm far from an expert but doesn't that type of therapy fuk you up pretty bad as far as being strong goes?

There is still a difference in skeletal structure, hand size, levers, and bigger heart and lungs. Although i am not sure it really matters in this particular case as the person in question is not suing to win a powerlifting meet, if you look at her numbers she isn’t even competitive. She just wants to compete as the gender that she lives, works, and exists in. The one trans woman in the sport who would absolutely dominate a women’s division (Janae Kroc) is effectively retired and only competes in men’s divisions because she’s aware of the advantages she has because she spent 30 years as a man and her use of anabolics.


Maybe the idea of treating transitioning a bit like a failed drug test would work. In a lot of feds it'd force trans people to compete untested, where the drugs at play should kill at least a good chunk of any advantages.

[Karl_Hungus]

In RPS to compete in the women's division as a person born male you have to provide medical documentation that you have been on estrogen for at least a year. I'm far from an expert but doesn't that type of therapy fuk you up pretty bad as far as being strong goes?

No, there has been some research into this and while estrogen will decrease strength, men will still retain a sizeable strength advantage over women. You can't undo male puberty.

[7Seconds]

Just out of curiosity is there that big of a difference in the idea of a trans woman competing fairly with cisgender women because of hormones in puberty with Pete Rubish who is preparing to compete in a natural federation after lifting on gear for years? I understand his thing is that he likes lifting, wants to be fertile for his marriage, and wants to continue competing. But the sport is incredibly accepting of drug usage, and has loads of untested options for competitions. There’s 0 reason to compete in a tested fed if you’ve used drugs.

[LWW]

One year at our strongman contest they had a big strong women doing exhibition lifting.

I’ve lifted with some really strong girls before but this one was different, she had facial hair.

I think she was born a women and none of the hormone free women would of stood a chance, hell she was stronger than most of the fellas in our contest.

[Mark1T]

Just out of curiosity is there that big of a difference in the idea of a trans woman competing fairly with cisgender women because of hormones in puberty with Pete Rubish who is preparing to compete in a natural federation after lifting on gear for years? I understand his thing is that he likes lifting, wants to be fertile for his marriage, and wants to continue competing. But the sport is incredibly accepting of drug usage, and has loads of untested options for competitions. There’s 0 reason to compete in a tested fed if you’ve used drugs.

A trans is a trans, no matter how you slice it. The overall backlash doesn't have to be harsh. People will just start to tune-out the sports that allow trans athletes, like a slow death. When the courts go woke, it's all over. It is equity taken way too far.

[IronCharles]

The way this is going, there will be only trannies competing against other trannies.

Sponsorships will dry up. The public for the most part won't want to see a circus.

Would it be discriminatory to create a cisgender division?

[Karl_Hungus]

Just out of curiosity is there that big of a difference in the idea of a trans woman competing fairly with cisgender women because of hormones in puberty with Pete Rubish who is preparing to compete in a natural federation after lifting on gear for years? I understand his thing is that he likes lifting, wants to be fertile for his marriage, and wants to continue competing. But the sport is incredibly accepting of drug usage, and has loads of untested options for competitions. There’s 0 reason to compete in a tested fed if you’ve used drugs.

I'm not sure I am following here. Are you suggesting that a powerlifter coming off of gear to compete naturally is analogous to a man taking estrogen and blocking testosterone to compete with women? If so, the analogy doesn't work because gear generally doesn't cause physiological changes that produce permanent advantages that persist once the drugs are gone. Pete has said himself that his lifts have more or less reverted to their pre-drug levels. A man who has gone through puberty doesn't revert to the physiology of a woman simply because the hormones have changed. Lia Thomas is still 6'3" and physically much stronger than his female competitors. 7, you are a smart guy. Don't let appeals to open-mindedness and personal virtue gaslight you into formulating Rube-Golberg style arguments to convince yourself of sh!t that you know is false.

[7Seconds]

I'm not sure I am following here. Are you suggesting that a powerlifter coming off of gear to compete naturally is analogous to a man taking estrogen and blocking testosterone to compete with women? If so, the analogy doesn't work because gear generally doesn't cause physiological changes that produce permanent advantages that persist once the drugs are gone. Pete has said himself that his lifts have more or less reverted to their pre-drug levels. A man who has gone through puberty doesn't revert to the physiology of a woman simply because the hormones have changed. Lia Thomas is still 6'3" and physically much stronger than his female competitors. 7, you are a smart guy. Don't let appeals to open-mindedness and personal virtue gaslight you into formulating Rube-Golberg style arguments to convince yourself of sh!t that you know is false.

My view has changed on this, partly through discussions we have had on here in the past. So I agree no matter how you slice it, doesn't matter if a trans woman has tested within limits for testosterone for even a couple years, those physically formative years of puberty give an advantage over cis women in any similar weight class, and many other sports.

But I do see how both situations are unfair. This is why a lot of people in athletics call for a permanent ban after a failed drug test, I agree and the same should go for powerlifting. IIRC, feds like the IPF actually ban athletes from competing tested after any failed test and also charge a fine if the athlete wants to compete in their untested division.


I will say again that I believe this case is being made by some in the media to something it is not. She wanted to compete USAPL because the gym she trains in is a USAPL gym. So her gym was having a meet, all her gym friends were lifting in it, and she wanted to lift with her friends. As far as she knew, she followed all the rules. Telling her she can go compete at a remote meet apart from her friends in a different federation is a technical solution that allows for competition but dismisses the underlying reasons for competing in the first place (the whole social group).

[Karl_Hungus]

My view has changed on this, partly through discussions we have had on here in the past. So I agree no matter how you slice it, doesn't matter if a trans woman has tested within limits for testosterone for even a couple years, those physically formative years of puberty give an advantage over cis women in any similar weight class, and many other sports.

But I do see how both situations are unfair. This is why a lot of people in athletics call for a permanent ban after a failed drug test, I agree and the same should go for powerlifting. IIRC, feds like the IPF actually ban athletes from competing tested after any failed test and also charge a fine if the athlete wants to compete in their untested division.


I will say again that I believe this case is being made by some in the media to something it is not. She wanted to compete USAPL because the gym she trains in is a USAPL gym. So her gym was having a meet, all her gym friends were lifting in it, and she wanted to lift with her friends. As far as she knew, she followed all the rules. Telling her she can go compete at a remote meet apart from her friends in a different federation is a technical solution that allows for competition but dismisses the underlying reasons for competing in the first place (the whole social group).

^^ Fair and reasonable on all counts (I was speaking more generally rather than addressing the specifics of this case).

[Mark1T]

Would it be discriminatory to create a cisgender division?

Not to me A division for any person who is not a trans should have a division

[Bando]

No, there has been some research into this and while estrogen will decrease strength, men will still retain a sizeable strength advantage over women. You can't undo male puberty.

I guess my comment was geared more towards sentiments like "oh I'll just put in a hair bow and compete as a woman." It's not that simple.

[mtpockets]

[smokinal]

[Mark1T]

Teams in various sports are already being cancelled permanently because they do not comply with inclusive trans policies:

https://www.foxnews.com/sports/vermo...-trans-student

"We withdrew from the tournament because we believe playing against an opponent with a biological male jeopardizes the fairness of the game and the safety of our players. Allowing biological males to participate in women’s sports sets a bad precedent for the future of women’s sports in general,"

[mtpockets]

Teams in various sports are already being cancelled permanently because they do not comply with inclusive trans policies:

https://www.foxnews.com/sports/vermo...-trans-student

"We withdrew from the tournament because we believe playing against an opponent with a biological male jeopardizes the fairness of the game and the safety of our players. Allowing biological males to participate in women’s sports sets a bad precedent for the future of women’s sports in general,"

Sickening. Enough to gaga a maggot.

[7Seconds]

“We withdrew from the tournament because we believe playing against an opponent with a biological male jeopardizes the fairness of the game and the safety of our players. Allowing biological males to participate in women’s sports sets a bad precedent for the future of women’s sports in general,” a senior administrator at MVCS told Fox News Digital in a statement.

State law permits transgender females to play in girls sporting leagues and prohibits discrimination based upon gender identity.

I mean that’s really all you need to know. This is an organization the school joined and paid to be part of understanding the rules. Sounds like they need to find another organization to play in.

[7Seconds]

The school should also stop looking for public tuition dollars if they don’t want to adhere to the state’s anti discrimination laws.

https://vtdigger.org/2023/02/17/in-b...tion-laws/amp/

[Mark1T]

I mean that’s really all you need to know. This is an organization the school joined and paid to be part of understanding the rules. Sounds like they need to find another organization to play in.

The USA Power Team joined the Vermont Principals’ Association long before the Vermont Principals’ Association enacted its transgender policies. Unless you are saying that the Vermont Principals’ Association included transgender policies since its inception in 1915.

[7Seconds]

The USA Power Team joined the Vermont Principals’ Association long before the Vermont Principals’ Association enacted its transgender policies. Unless you are saying that the Vermont Principals’ Association included transgender policies since its inception in 1915.

You can read the letter the VPA sent to the school that has its policy attached.

violates VPA Policies which are aligned with Vermont state law. Specifically, the school’s actions do not meet the expectations of the VPA’s 1st and 2nd policy, Commitment to Racial, Gender-Fair, and Disability Awareness and Policy of Gender Identity, respectively.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1D8n...w?usp=drivesdk