10 months of training but not much progress

[msa7d]

Hi,

I've been working out consistently for 10 months 3-4 days a week (day after the other). for the first month I did a full body workout then started stronglifts 5x5 for 3 months and gained strength but did not get any bigger so I switched to another program that I've been following for the past 6 months. my strength decreased after stopping the 5x5 program and no visible mass was gained. I am 25 years old 180cm, 74kgs. according to this calculator(dot)net/calorie-calculator.html I maintain weight at 2400 kcal/day. I tried eating 3000 calories a day but I gained so much belly fat so I lowered my intake to 2200-2700 kcal/day.

current program (45mins)

Workout 1:
bench press 4x10
incline bench press 4x10
butterfly machine 4x10
V bar pushdowns 4x10
rope extensions 4x10

Workout 2:
Lat pulldown wide 4x10
chest supported seated row 4x10
seated cable row 4x10
barbell curls 4x10
cable arm preacher curl 4x10

workout 3:
squats 4x10
leg extension 4x10
leg curls 4x10
hyperextension 4x10
calf raises sitting 4x10

diet
I track everything using MyFitnessPal app. usually I eat 3 meals a day, this is an example of what I ate today
breakfast: Bread + mozzarella cheese + banana => 540 calories (25g protein)
snack 1: watermelon 0.5 kg 150 kcal
lunch: kebab sandwich + coca cola => 1000 kcal (50g~ protein)
snack 2: watermelon 0.5 kg 150 kcal
after workout: 1 scoop whey protein + banana = 250 kcal (25g protein)
dinner: bread + mozzarella cheese => 440 calories (25g protein)

total 2,530 kcal (125g protein)

what am I doing wrong?


Update 1:

It's been 3 months since I posted this, since then I followed the FIERCE 5 program, which takes about 1 hour to do. I've made some progress all my lifts have increased. I currently weight 75.6 kg (gained 1.6 kg since last time). however, I haven't gained any size in my arms or chest just a little in my thighs and gained some noticeable belly fat
I still don't know what am doing wrong.

progress:
Squat from 87.5 kg to 95 kg
bench 60 kg to 65 kg
Pendlay row 60kg to 62.5 kg
Romanian deadlift 60kg to 62.5 kg
Lat pulldowns 50kg to 55kg
bicep curls 20kg to 25kg
Tricep pressdowns 50kg to 55kg

Update 2:

it's been 3 month since my last update, since then I followed the program suggested by RapidFail in post #31. I did Version 2 of the workout and modified my diet to beef/chicken with rice and vegs, which is eaten 75% of the time so it's cleaner now.

starting weights / current weights:

Workout A

Squats from 70kg to 85 kg
Bench Press 50kg to 62.5 kg
Rows 15kg to 32.5 kg
Triceps Press Downs 45kg to 50 kg
Calf Raises 50kg to 60 kg

Workout B

Deadlifts 60kg to 97.5 kg
Pull-Ups (or Lat Pull-Downs) 50kg to 55 kg
Overhead Shoulder Press 25kg to 37.5 kg
Biceps Curls 20kg to 25 kg
Abs 20+ reps per set

In the beginning the progress was good but now it slowed down. At current weights I can't perform squats without breaking form, I also noticed that I'm running out of breath before my legs tire and on some days there is just no energy to push the weights or the energy is there but I just can't do more reps than last time. usually it's possible to do one or two reps more but I stop to avoid injury (some times I get backpain after squatting) or maybe just because I'm a lazy a**. But there has been a lot of progress made on many exercises with the same effort so I don't think that's why.

Are my weights good for someone who started lifting over a year ago? I know I didn't follow a good program during the entire period but there should be at least some difference, I still don't look like I workout at all lol. This is really demotivating, what am I doing wrong now???

[air2fakie]

You're not giving much of an effort if you're finishing those exercises/volume in 45 mins each workout. Similarly, 4x10 across the board isn't going to push you to progress.

Regardless, don't do the same program for 6 months if you're not seeing any results and your strength is decreasing.

[TolerantLactose]

It's hard to diagnose progress from a single snapshot. What were your starting weights and current weights in your program? What was your starting body weight and how fast were you gaining?

[msa7d]

It's hard to diagnose progress from a single snapshot. What were your starting weights and current weights in your program? What was your starting body weight and how fast were you gaining?

started at 72 kg currently 74.5kg. I didn't gain much weight at first, 5 months ago I increased my calorie intake and gained 2kg~ in 1 month, so I went back to eating a little above maintaince.

bench press - started 40kg now 50kg didn't change for 5 months
incline bench press - 20kg didn't change
butterfly machine - 40kg now 50kg didn't change for 5 months
V bar pushdowns - 40kg didn't change
rope extensions - 35kg didn't change
Lat pulldown wide - 40kg now 50kg but sometimes I cant finish 10 reps so I drop down to 45kg
chest supported seated row - 25kg still same
seated cable row - 40kg now 50kg I have to drop to 45kg sometimes
barbell curls 4x10 - 10kg didn't change, I can start with 12 but I cant finish set so I drop to 10
cable arm preacher curl 4x10
squats 4x10 - 40kg now 60kg
leg extension 4x10 - 35kg still same I drop to 30 on last set or I can't finish..
leg curls 4x10 - 50kg still same
hyperextension 4x10 - 10 now 15k
calf raises sitting 4x10 - 45kg still same

most these weights didn't increase in the past 5 month

[MyEgoProblem]

2.5kg is a big first poop and s long piss to start the day.....

Your nutrition needs addressing ASAP.
Your effort needs addressing ASAP.
Your program needs addressing ASAP.

Get on a novice program and ****ing eat right. With all due respect.

[jaxqen]

20 sets done in 45 minute {plus warmup sets} = cardio

What do you mean by 4x10? You always do 10 reps or when you get to 10 you increase weight?

2.5kg is a big first poop and s long piss to start the day.....

Your nutrition needs addressing ASAP.
Your effort needs addressing ASAP.
Your program needs addressing ASAP.

Get on a novice program and ****ing eat right. With all due respect.

What should he eat? Rice & chicken?
I am asking because I though you belong more to the idea of "if it fits your macros", don't know why.

[TolerantLactose]

according to this calculator(dot)net/calorie-calculator.html I maintain weight at 2400 kcal/day.

I track everything using MyFitnessPal app.

Why are you using a calculator when you're already tracking and have the actual data?

I tried eating 3000 calories a day but I gained so much belly fat so I lowered my intake to 2200-2700 kcal/day.

You gained 2kg. Get a grip. You should gain weight more slowly but get a grip.

for the first month I did a full body workout then started stronglifts 5x5 for 3 months and gained strength

Your numbers don't really suggest strength gain. The program you're on doesn't look good and it doesn't seem like you put sufficient effort in.

[msa7d]

Why are you using a calculator when you're already tracking and have the actual data?

I used my MyFitnessPal app when I gained so much weight so I thought it was inaccurate and started using the other calculator

You gained 2kg. Get a grip. You should gain weight more slowly but get a grip.

am I not supposed to eat big to get big or something like that? LOL
I just don't understand how people do it and manage to stay lean at the same time.

Your numbers don't really suggest strength gain. The program you're on doesn't look good and it doesn't seem like you put sufficient effort in.

what program should I follow?

[msa7d]

20 sets done in 45 minute {plus warmup sets} = cardio

What do you mean by 4x10? You always do 10 reps or when you get to 10 you increase weight?

it's usually 45-60 mins. I read that's a good time for a workout.
10 reps is goal if I reach 12 I increase weight.

[msa7d]

Your nutrition needs addressing ASAP.
Your effort needs addressing ASAP.
Your program needs addressing ASAP.

Get on a novice program and ****ing eat right. With all due respect.

what program do u suggest? I don't really know what to eat, the food log I showed is what I can eat realistically. I did try rice and chicken for 3 months out of the 10 but saw no results so I just started eating whatever, I just aim for at least 120g of protein.
I lift almost until failure is that called not putting in effort?

[SuffolkPunch]

10 months is not that long, these things take time. You've also run several programs in that time.

You should be aiming to gain strength in the rep range you are using. So if you are using 10 rep sets, your 10RM should be increasing over time. If it doesn't, you need a different approach, same applies to all programs. Even if your goal is not strength, it is still an indicator of new muscle tissue when viewed over a longer time scale.

This whole global 4x10 approach seems like you aren't really tuning in to what your body needs and responds to. If you use too much volume or too high a rep range, it's like trying to dig a hole with a spade that is too wide - it seems like you would dig a big hole faster but in practice it doesn't work if you aren't strong enough.

Perhaps try something like Fierce 5 upper/lower or canditos linear program.

[coachcalande]

Common theme on the forum among those complaining

Eating under 200 G protein yet are fat
Training on bro splits, poor frequency and 10-12 reps per set (way too light)
Avoiding training to failure because of what they read on these bs forums
Trying this, that, the other thing
Ignoring real advice from experienced big strong guys.

[jaxqen]

it's usually 45-60 mins. I read that's a good time for a workout.

10 reps is goal if I reach 12 I increase weight.

It can be, but you do 20 sets... plus warmup sets, I hope.
That's too much.
Also, 4x10 for every exercise can work , but is not recommended.
Also, you do a push pull legs routine, but without shoulders.
You train a muscle group once a week.
Not that great!

Than 12 is the goal, not 10. 12 is too much for some exercises like squats or bench press, for example.
Also, doing 4 sets x 10-12 reps might get you to cardiovascular failure, not actual muscle failure.

Nutrition = protein from several sources (chicken, eggs, fish, red meat, beans, cheese, yoghurt, protein powder), carbs (potatoes, rice, pasta, oats), healthy fats (nuts), vegetables, fruits.
You don't have to be very religious about it, but most of your food should come from these.
Also, the preworkout meal is quite important for performance. Plus hydration & sodium.

Eating under 200 G protein yet are fat

Training on bro splits, poor frequency and 10-12 reps per set (way too light)

Avoiding training to failure because of what they read on these bs forums

Well, if he would ate more protein, besides his meals, wouldn't he be even fatter?

So just like Jay Cutler & the rest of pro bb... 10-12 reps once a week

He says he goes to failure, though.

[msa7d]

10 months is not that long, these things take time. You've also run several programs in that time.

You should be aiming to gain strength in the rep range you are using. So if you are using 10 rep sets, your 10RM should be increasing over time. If it doesn't, you need a different approach, same applies to all programs. Even if your goal is not strength, it is still an indicator of new muscle tissue when viewed over a longer time scale.

This whole global 4x10 approach seems like you aren't really tuning in to what your body needs and responds to. If you use too much volume or too high a rep range, it's like trying to dig a hole with a spade that is too wide - it seems like you would dig a big hole faster but in practice it doesn't work if you aren't strong enough.

Perhaps try something like Fierce 5 upper/lower or canditos linear program.

I looked at the programs you mentioned they have low rep range like x6 or x8-x12, I already finish my exercise in 45 mins this one will take even less time it doesn't seem enough. other replies suggested that 10-12 is too light so I don't know.. this is getting confusing. I will still give the program a try..

[SuffolkPunch]

Why is 6 or 8 reps "too low"?

You might benefit from reading the size vs. strength sticky thread.

[TolerantLactose]

I used my MyFitnessPal app when I gained so much weight so I thought it was inaccurate and started using the other calculator

You went from using data from daily tracking to a calculator that spits out a generic number for a generic person. How smart is that?

am I not supposed to eat big to get big or something like that? LOL
I just don't understand how people do it and manage to stay lean at the same time.

You got scared of a 2kg weight gain. A 2 kg weight change doesn't scare people who get big.

what program should I follow?

Any of the programs stickied. All you are doing now with your program is getting momentarily tired.

[coachcalande]

It can be, but you do 20 sets... plus warmup sets, I hope.
That's too much.
Also, 4x10 for every exercise can work , but is not recommended.
Also, you do a push pull legs routine, but without shoulders.
You train a muscle group once a week.
Not that great!

Than 12 is the goal, not 10. 12 is too much for some exercises like squats or bench press, for example.
Also, doing 4 sets x 10-12 reps might get you to cardiovascular failure, not actual muscle failure.

Nutrition = protein from several sources (chicken, eggs, fish, red meat, beans, cheese, yoghurt, protein powder), carbs (potatoes, rice, pasta, oats), healthy fats (nuts), vegetables, fruits.
You don't have to be very religious about it, but most of your food should come from these.
Also, the preworkout meal is quite important for performance. Plus hydration & sodium.



Well, if he would ate more protein, besides his meals, wouldn't he be even fatter?

So just like Jay Cutler & the rest of pro bb... 10-12 reps once a week

He says he goes to failure, though.

More protein, adjust carbs and fat

Multiple sets 10-12 is definitely not failing- after a set of ten to failure youd be grinding to get 8-9.

[msa7d]

You went from using data from daily tracking to a calculator that spits out a generic number for a generic person. How smart is that?

I still use that data and track daily but what I meant is the the suggested maintaince from the calculator I mentioned is more accurate than what MyFitnessPal claims it to be.

You got scared of a 2kg weight gain. A 2 kg weight change doesn't scare people who get big.

when like 90% of it is fat then it's scary I had to switch things up. my goal is to get big with minimal fat.

[TolerantLactose]

I still use that data and track daily but what I meant is the the suggested maintaince from the calculator I mentioned is more accurate than what MyFitnessPal claims it to be.

It doesn't matter what it or the calculator says. You've kept track of your diet. You've kept track of your weight changes. There's your basis for your diet going forward.

when like 90% of it is fat then it's scary I had to switch things up. my goal is to get big with minimal fat.

90% of a miniscule amount is still miniscule.

Not that it matters if you don't start training properly.

[RapidFail]

While I think you'd be better off ditching your program and doing a novice full body routine, or an upper-lower split, I think the consistent 4 x 10 approach across all exercises is probably the biggest issue with your training.

If you're getting through all 20 sets in ~45 minutes, that means you aren't resting for long between sets. If you're doing 4 sets of 10, that probably means you are leaving several reps in reserve on the first couple of sets. That's not necessarily a bad thing, but I think you'd be better off working in a rep range - let's say 8-12 reps (this should differ between exercises) and when you can hit the top of the rep range on the first set, you add weight. All remaining sets should be in the 8-12 range, if they aren't, you can reduce the weight as necessary. So if you get 12, 10 and 8 reps with 50kg, the next week you can use 52.5kg.

Proximity to failure is important - I would recommend taking every set to the point where you don't know if you can do another rep with good form. For most exercises the last rep should be slow. For small isolation exercises like curls, feel free to go all the way to failure.

As for bulking - aim for 1kg of weight gained per month and if you're consistently progressing your lifts you should be able to gain about half muscle, half fat.

[msa7d]

Ok, thanks for all the replies I will change my program and see how it goes.

[msa7d]

Update

[TolerantLactose]

Update 1:

It's been 3 months since I posted this, since then I followed the FIERCE 5 program, which takes about 1 hour to do. I've made some progress all my lifts have increased. I currently weight 75.6 kg (gained 1.6 kg since last time). however, I haven't gained any size in my arms or chest just a little in my thighs and gained some noticeable belly fat
I still don't know what am doing wrong.

"Some progress"

It's like pulling teeth. Specify your progress.

[RapidFail]

"Some progress"

It's like pulling teeth. Specify your progress.

Exactly this - what weight did you start with for each lift and how much are you lifting now?

[msa7d]

"Some progress"

It's like pulling teeth. Specify your progress.

Squat from 87.5 kg to 95 kg
bench 60 kg to 65 kg
Pendlay row 60kg to 62.5 kg
Romanian deadlift 60kg to 62.5 kg
Lat pulldowns 50kg to 55kg
bicep curls 20kg to 25kg
Tricep pressdowns 50kg to 55kg

[RapidFail]

Squat from 87.5 kg to 95 kg
bench 60 kg to 65 kg
Pendlay row 60kg to 62.5 kg
Romanian deadlift 60kg to 62.5 kg
Lat pulldowns 50kg to 55kg
bicep curls 20kg to 25kg
Tricep pressdowns 50kg to 55kg

That's in three month of doing Fierce 5 Novice? Considering you had already been lifting for several months beforehand, I don't think this is too bad, though your RDL seems low compared to your other lifts. Have you been following the program to the letter? What do you do when you fail to hit the target reps?

I honestly wouldn't worry about fat gain at this point. 1.6kg gained in 3 months is quite conservative and unless you've got great genetics, diet and recovery, you're going to gain some fat when you bulk. At the same time, with such a small amount of weight gained, you shouldn't expect to see much change in musculatity. Just remember that muscle gain is a slow process. Eventually you'll get to a point where you want to diet away the fat you've gained and then you should be able to tell how much muscle you've gained. I'd give it at least another three months slow gaining first, though.

[msa7d]

That's in three month of doing Fierce 5 Novice? Considering you had already been lifting for several months beforehand, I don't think this is too bad, though your RDL seems low compared to your other lifts. Have you been following the program to the letter? What do you do when you fail to hit the target reps?

I honestly wouldn't worry about fat gain at this point. 1.6kg gained in 3 months is quite conservative and unless you've got great genetics, diet and recovery, you're going to gain some fat when you bulk. At the same time, with such a small amount of weight gained, you shouldn't expect to see much change in musculatity. Just remember that muscle gain is a slow process. Eventually you'll get to a point where you want to diet away the fat you've gained and then you should be able to tell how much muscle you've gained. I'd give it at least another three months slow gaining first, though.

Yes I did Fierce 5 Novice for 3 months. I try to follow the program to the letter about 90% of the time, but it says that I have to add 5lbs/10lbs each week to my lifts, which is near impossible. Most of the time when I add 5lbs (2.5kgs) I can't finish the set so I remove the added weight and lift the previous weight for another week. I understand that building muscle is a slow process but when the weight gain goes straight to my belly instead of the muscles that am training (for some reason), then it's a little discouraging so I'm being conservative about my food intake.

[air2fakie]

Yes I did Fierce 5 Novice for 3 months. I try to follow the program to the letter about 90% of the time, but it says that I have to add 5lbs/10lbs each week to my lifts, which is near impossible. Most of the time when I add 5lbs (2.5kgs) I can't finish the set so I remove the added weight and lift the previous weight for another week. I understand that building muscle is a slow process but when the weight gain goes straight to my belly instead of the muscles that am training (for some reason), then it's a little discouraging so I'm being conservative about my food intake.

You don't know where all the weight gain is going, you're just noticing fat that's in your belly because it's where most of us genetically store fat gain first & it's a concentrated area, while muscle distributed throughout the rest of your body is dispersed & as you say, a slow process.

That being said, if you're not following F5's failure reset protocol, you're not following the program. That, combined with the fact that you can never successfully complete a set when you do increase weight, means you probably should just pick a different program - perhaps with non-linear progression. It might be more suitable for your level of effort.

You should probably also make sure your calorie intake is consistent with your goals.

[TolerantLactose]

Squat from 87.5 kg to 95 kg
bench 60 kg to 65 kg
Pendlay row 60kg to 62.5 kg
Romanian deadlift 60kg to 62.5 kg
Lat pulldowns 50kg to 55kg
bicep curls 20kg to 25kg
Tricep pressdowns 50kg to 55kg

That's slow progress for 3 months. We'd have to see how much effort you are putting into your sets.

[superman704]

As long as there's progress that's all that matters