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  1. #1
    Registered User BeginnerGainz's Avatar
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    Think I wanna do a bro split?

    So I’ve been toying with the idea of a bro split for a while now I think I hit on the best way to do it. Any input is welcome.

    Back and rear delts
    -Upper lat row with need to stabilize for erector gains (T-bar row or seated cable row)
    -Lumbar lat row (probably a chest supported row)
    -Lower lat row (high row or kneeling cable row)
    -Teres movement (any lat pulldown/chin up/pull up)
    -Mid back movement (probably Pronated chest supported rows or meadows row)
    -A rear delt movement

    Chest and shoulders
    -A flat press variation
    -an incline press variation
    -Pec deck or flys
    -2 lateral raise variations
    -External rotator work at the end

    Legs
    -Calf raises/presses
    -Hip adduction machine
    -Leg extensions
    -Leg curl variation
    -Quad compound
    -Hip extension movement (usually SLDL or back extensions)

    Arms
    -Pressdowns variation
    -Long head Tricep movement
    -Incline curl
    -Preacher curl
    -Hammer curl variation
    -Reverse or Zottman curls
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  2. #2
    Registered User air2fakie's Avatar
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    Call me a bro purist, but not quite a bro split IMO.

    I'd call it a once a week PPL with arms specialization.
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    Registered User TAWS6's Avatar
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    Meh. I’d just do a ppl bro style Mon wed fri to maintain. Less days.
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    I’d either say go true bro-split or if you’re gonna do something “bro-lite” following a split similar to how John meadows or Jordan peters does it would be more beneficial.
    the latest and greatest in training...or whatever.

    https://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=177744461&page=3
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  5. #5
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    Originally Posted by air2fakie View Post
    Call me a bro purist, but not quite a bro split IMO.

    I'd call it a once a week PPL with arms specialization.
    Kind of this.




    Doesn’t look too bad overall though assuming you’re getting in enough sets/reps for each body part. For your unspecified rear delt movement do face pulls. I’d also recommend fitting in squats, and for your lateral raises just do sets for front and sets for sides. As mentioned above though, I think of a bro split more along the lines of an individual day for back, arms, shoulders, legs, chest, and possibly abs/core and only combine any two if they are disproportionally stronger than other areas.
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  6. #6
    Registered User BeginnerGainz's Avatar
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    Thanks for the input guys, come to think of it I can only generally do one heavy press per upper session now so might be better to have a separate shoulder day after all.

    Originally it was going to be chest and biceps/forearm flexors (my weaknesses) and shoulders and triceps.

    Since someone mentioned what I would do for rear delts, I’ve been doing swings and rear delt rows and found them superior to facepulls in just about every way (can get the rear delt fully shortened, loading potential). I think my favorite mechanical drop set is doing swings until failure then doing rear delt rows from there, also till failure.

    As far as squats go, I generally only do them when the mood strikes. I never really got a lot of quad growth out of them and since I can squat over 400 lbs with a SSB even without doing them regularly, I kinda wrote them off as a staple.

    I’m not looking to maintain, I’m trying to keep growing.
    Last edited by BeginnerGainz; 01-12-2022 at 03:24 AM.
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    Registered User TAWS6's Avatar
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    Well it’s difficult enough to grow on 2-3 times a week frequency as a natural. Going down to one will slow down progress even more but you probably already know that. There are definitely more efficient ways to bring up the lagging muscles you mentioned.
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    Registered User air2fakie's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by BeginnerGainz View Post
    Thanks for the input guys, come to think of it I can only generally do one heavy press per upper session now so might be better to have a separate shoulder day after all.

    Originally it was going to be chest and biceps/forearm flexors (my weaknesses) and shoulders and triceps.

    Since someone mentioned what I would do for rear delts, I’ve been doing swings and rear delt rows and found them superior to facepulls in just about every way (can get the rear delt fully shortened, loading potential). I think my favorite mechanical drop set is doing swings until failure then doing rear delt rows from there, also till failure.

    As far as squats go, I generally only do them when the mood strikes. I never really got a lot of quad growth out of them and since I can squat over 400 lbs with a SSB even without doing them regularly, I kinda wrote them off as a staple.

    I’m not looking to maintain, I’m trying to keep growing.
    Not many people do this, but consider doing a standard 4-day UL but stick an extra chill Upper day on Wednesday for isos only, 2 sets each. Whatever you want. You get a little extra work on weak spots for stuff that doesn't fit into the other Upper days, it doesn't interfere with recovery, and you still get weekends off.
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    Registered User TAWS6's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by air2fakie View Post
    Not many people do this, but consider doing a standard 4-day UL but stick an extra chill Upper day on Wednesday for isos only, 2 sets each. Whatever you want. You get a little extra work on weak spots for stuff that doesn't fit into the other Upper days, it doesn't interfere with recovery, and you still get weekends off.
    I’d do a specialized 4 day upper lower. Blast the two lagging muscles at the start of upper day for 6 weeks while maintaining everything else. That way all of your energy goes into weak points. Then rotate the next group in after that. This keeps frequency at 2, volume high for the specialized muscle and you’re only in the gym 4 days.
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  10. #10
    Registered User air2fakie's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TAWS6 View Post
    I’d do a specialized 4 day upper lower. Blast the two lagging muscles at the start of upper day for 6 weeks while maintaining everything else. That way all of your energy goes into weak points. Then rotate the next group in after that. This keeps frequency at 2, volume high for the specialized muscle and you’re only in the gym 4 days.
    Yeah my suggestion is more for the volume fiend that hides in most of us, that itches to do the PPLs that you love to hate.

    Mentally it feels like you're besting the system. Plus it lets you fit on all the isos that don't fit into your regular days or that you hate in the first place. As add-ons to bread & butter stuff they help a lot... face pulls, kelso shrugs, incline curls, cable crap, etc.
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    Talking

    Originally Posted by air2fakie View Post
    Yeah my suggestion is more for the volume fiend that hides in most of us, that itches to do the PPLs that you love to hate.

    Mentally it feels like you're besting the system. Plus it lets you fit on all the isos that don't fit into your regular days or that you hate in the first place. As add-ons to bread & butter stuff they help a lot... face pulls, kelso shrugs, incline curls, cable crap, etc.
    Hey I just recommended him a PPL above!
    Lol
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  12. #12
    Registered User BeginnerGainz's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by air2fakie View Post
    Not many people do this, but consider doing a standard 4-day UL but stick an extra chill Upper day on Wednesday for isos only, 2 sets each. Whatever you want. You get a little extra work on weak spots for stuff that doesn't fit into the other Upper days, it doesn't interfere with recovery, and you still get weekends off.
    That is pretty much what I do now.

    Except I do forearm flexor sh!t on my lower days first so they get the attention they need, also so I get to do both muscle groups I hate on the same day: legs and bis. Presses always come first on upper days, back gets saved for last in the order of lats> mid/upper back> rear delts.

    The whole 2x a week frequency thing kinda goes out the window once you get past a certain training age. There is only so much muscle that can be built as a natural lifter. Hence why damn near every natural bodybuilder is doing a body part split.

    Maybe I have to pretty good with what I’m doing now after all…
    Last edited by BeginnerGainz; 01-12-2022 at 11:12 AM.
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    Registered User TAWS6's Avatar
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    Body part splits where you hit everything once every 5th day can work “decent”. I’ll just never believe that a muscle needs a full week off. I spun my wheels doing that and definitely regret wasting my time.
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    Registered User BeginnerGainz's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TAWS6 View Post
    Body part splits where you hit everything once every 5th day can work “decent”. I’ll just never believe that a muscle needs a full week off. I spun my wheels doing that and definitely regret wasting my time.
    As a beginner a bro split isn’t the best choice, but it has been a pretty consistent 14 months for me.
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    Originally Posted by BeginnerGainz View Post
    As a beginner a bro split isn’t the best choice, but it has been a pretty consistent 14 months for me.
    As long as you have a progression plan and are making progress. That’s what matters. When I ran it progress was at a snails pace for me lol
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    Unregistered User MyEgoProblem's Avatar
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    14 months may aswell still be a beginner tho tbh...
    When it comes to muscle mass potential and how long it takes to reach anything close to potential. Especially if you have to account for a cut to a sub 15% bf and the loss of lbm that comes with rust.

    Do the bro split tho, if it keeps you training its better than anything more 'optimal' that you arent doing.

    Bonus: "natural" bodybuilders usually aren't.. 😉 And those few that actually are.. Are top tier genetics.
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    Masters lifter.. With a lot less F's left to give
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    Back in the 80s-90s…”The Weider system of bodybuilding “ was king.

    You essentially followed either a 3 on 1 off or a 4 on one off….and some gave up the day off to “bro split”…my personal favorite splits:

    Day 1- chest and back, abs
    Day 2- legs, calves
    Day 3- shoulders arms, forearms

    Off

    Repeat.


    Or..Lee Haney influenced split…

    Chest and arms
    Legs and calves
    Back and shoulders
    Off
    Repeat


    Now to bro split and give up off days…

    Chest
    Back
    Shoulders
    Arms
    Legs
    Repeat


    The 4 on 1 off…

    Chest/tris
    Back bis
    Shoulders
    Legs/calves
    Off


    Anyhow, the old Weider tapes are on YouTube and I recently went through a few of them for a laugh.
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    Originally Posted by MyEgoProblem View Post

    Bonus: "natural" bodybuilders usually aren't.. 😉 And those few that actually are.. Are top tier genetics.
    Just wanted to add.

    Haycock, Trudell and Borge (top coaches) also report better results even with juice monsters with twice per week frequency.
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    Originally Posted by MyEgoProblem View Post
    14 months may aswell still be a beginner tho tbh...
    When it comes to muscle mass potential and how long it takes to reach anything close to potential. Especially if you have to account for a cut to a sub 15% bf and the loss of lbm that comes with rust.

    Do the bro split tho, if it keeps you training its better than anything more 'optimal' that you arent doing.

    Bonus: "natural" bodybuilders usually aren't.. 😉 And those few that actually are.. Are top tier genetics.
    I’m not talking about the Mike O’Hearns of the world, but the legitimately natural lifters. The kind whose muscles look super flat because they are dehydrated on stage.

    Meh.

    I’ll probably stick to what I’ve been doing TbH
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    Registered User TAWS6's Avatar
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    By the time you get to that point you’re pissing against the wind anyways.. you’re grinding for a lb a year at best. Meh go buy a ps5. Less chance of injury.
    Last edited by TAWS6; 01-12-2022 at 03:13 PM.
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    Originally Posted by TAWS6 View Post
    By the time you get to that point you’re pissing against the wind anyways.. you’re grinding for a lb a year at best. Meh go buy a ps5. Less chance of injury.
    I’m an Xbox guy. Got the new series X recently and I’m loving it so far.
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    Originally Posted by TAWS6 View Post
    Body part splits where you hit everything once every 5th day can work “decent”. I’ll just never believe that a muscle needs a full week off. I spun my wheels doing that and definitely regret wasting my time.
    The only time frequency becomes beneficial is once you need to get a certain amount of volume in for training.

    If someone is just hammering 6-10 sets per body part a week there’s no real difference if they spread that over 2 days or 1.
    the latest and greatest in training...or whatever.

    https://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=177744461&page=3
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    Originally Posted by Filmbuff81 View Post
    The only time frequency becomes beneficial is once you need to get a certain amount of volume in for training.

    If someone is just hammering 6-10 sets per body part a week there’s no real difference if they spread that over 2 days or 1.
    Ya. I’m also fully recovered in about 2-3 days after I train a muscle. That’s why I prefer twice per week.
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    Originally Posted by Filmbuff81 View Post
    The only time frequency becomes beneficial is once you need to get a certain amount of volume in for training.
    I'd say this for people who respond well to bro splits, which isn't everyone. From my limited personal window of observations, skinny people with narrow frames/small bones tend to respond better with other setups. Other people may have diff experiences & observations of course.

    Originally Posted by Filmbuff81 View Post
    If someone is just hammering 6-10 sets per body part a week there’s no real difference if they spread that over 2 days or 1.
    Most people's bro splits have way more than 6-10 sets per body part a week.
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    Also isn’t protein synthesis only elevated for 48 hrs or so?
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    Originally Posted by TAWS6 View Post
    Also isn’t protein synthesis only elevated for 48 hrs or so?
    Yeah, and for this reason and others I never understood why once a week is advisable for anyone who isn't quite new to it.

    I personally do best with 2-3x/week also, although the only isolations I train regularly are curls and lateral raises. Someone constructing their training with more of them probably could get away with higher frequency.
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    Originally Posted by EliKoehn View Post
    Yeah, and for this reason and others I never understood why once a week is advisable for anyone who isn't quite new to it.

    I personally do best with 2-3x/week also, although the only isolations I train regularly are curls and lateral raises. Someone constructing their training with more of them probably could get away with higher frequency.
    Yeah I haven’t been keeping up with the studies at all lol. I feel like you could probably get away with a 1.5 times per week frequency (every 5th) day and still make slow progress. I might actually go to something like that for maintenance soon.
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    Check out Steve Shaws video “bro splits are back”…
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    Originally Posted by coachcalande View Post
    Check out Steve Shaws video “bro splits are back”…
    I think people get so caught up in protein synthesis as if that is the only factor that matters, and Steve really hit the nail on the head: just because we are hitting a muscle group more frequently, does that mean we are stimulating MPS more frequently AND optimally, or just stimulating it “enough”.
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    Originally Posted by BeginnerGainz View Post
    I think people get so caught up in protein synthesis as if that is the only factor that matters, and Steve really hit the nail on the head: just because we are hitting a muscle group more frequently, does that mean we are stimulating MPS more frequently AND optimally, or just stimulating it “enough”.
    Plus you eventually hit your genetic limit and have to embrace the suck of a natural lifter. Whether you get there in 4 years or 6, the end result will probably be about the same no matter what you do.
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