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  1. #1
    Registered User Bang973's Avatar
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    237 g of protein in a day? How?

    So your supposed to take about a gram of protein for every pound of body weight.

    I weigh 237 pounds, I did research and you can only absorb 35 grams of protein in one meal, so that's 6 meals.

    But then your supposed to eat every 3 hours. How am I supposed to fit 6 meals in one day and get proper rest for the next day?

    Can I just take 5 meals a day? I don't want to miss out on any gains.
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    My morning breakfast is a serving of Greek yogurt, a scoop of whey, serving of milk, 2 raw jumbo eggs and a cup of fresh lambs blood (optional) all mixed in a cup. That's 60 grams. I shoot for 150 grams a day. You don't need 237 grams.
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    Originally Posted by Bang973 View Post
    So your supposed to take about a gram of protein for every pound of body weight.
    Not really. You can shoot to hit the minimum of 0.7 g of protein per lb of bodyweight. If you're in a caloric deficit (losing weight) or really trying to optimize bodybuilding, yeah you could shoot for more, but it won't make a massive difference.

    Originally Posted by Bang973 View Post
    I weigh 237 pounds
    Unless you are already a professional athlete or professional bodybuilder, odds are you are carrying excess body fat at that weight. In this case, don't aim for 0.7 g of protein per lb of bodyweight. Instead aim for 0.7 g per lb of your ideal / target weight.

    Originally Posted by Bang973 View Post
    I did research and you can only absorb 35 grams of protein in one meal
    The idea of a protein absorption ceiling means you were probably reading opinions rather than actual research. Sure, the more protein you consume, the less efficient your body will breakdown the total protein into amino acids and absorb it into the blood stream, but the body also regulates the speed at which protein moves through the small intestine to make sure to absorb it all.

    Actual Reserch:
    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/10867039/

    So yeah, if you want to have a meal with 70 g of protein, go for it. Your body will probably figure it out.

    Originally Posted by Bang973 View Post
    so that's 6 meals.
    It can be 6 meals if you want. Or 3 meals. Or 4 meals. Etc. If you want to be hyper efficient about it, sure, more meals helps. But it's far more important to meet your macro and calorie targets, consistently, than to make sure you eat X number of meals a day. In terms of the hierarchy of importance in nutrition for hypertrophy, eating 6 meals a day ranks pretty low. 3 or 4 meals is fine.

    Originally Posted by Bang973 View Post
    But then your supposed to eat every 3 hours.
    I try to space my meals about every 2.5 to 3 hours, but I'm taking this hobby seriously. You really don't need to religiously space your meals. Again, the overwhelmingly most important part is consistently meeting your macro and calorie targets EVERY DAY. If that means you only eat one or two meals in a day, good, at least make sure you eat your daily macro and calorie targets in those one or two meals.

    Originally Posted by Bang973 View Post
    How am I supposed to fit 6 meals in one day and get proper rest for the next day?
    Snacks and shakes help in the windows where you can't get a real meal. But again, you're getting obsessed with nutrient timing when it's really far down the totem pole of importance.

    Originally Posted by Bang973 View Post
    Can I just take 5 meals a day? I don't want to miss out on any gains.
    You can eat 5 meals, or 4 meals, or 3 meals a day, and your gains will be barely affected AS LONG AS YOU MEET YOUR DAILY MACRO AND CALORIE TARGETS.

    However, given your weight, it is likely that you are carrying excessive body fat. If you want to maximize your gains, consider dropping your weight to around 12% body fat first before making gains.

    Why? The higher your body fat %, the harder it will be for you to build muscle, to the point where you would have to be consuming so much extra calories that it would be wildly inefficient. Like, you'd add muscle, but the rate of fat gain would just be shooting through the roof.

    So don't worry about gains until you've dropped the fat.
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    Registered User Xpiro's Avatar
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    You don’t need that much but getting there isn’t hard, I top that occasionally when I really want to go ham on the chicken at dinner but I’ve already had my shakes
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    I love my power hour MrCarrot's Avatar
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    I think you can go for 0.8g per pound of LEAN bodyweight (or your target bodyweight).

    If you're 50 pounds overweight then that's 50g of protein you don't need.
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  6. #6
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    Originally Posted by Camarija View Post
    Not really. You can shoot to hit the minimum of 0.7 g of protein per lb of bodyweight. If you're in a caloric deficit (losing weight) or really trying to optimize bodybuilding, yeah you could shoot for more, but it won't make a massive difference.



    Unless you are already a professional athlete or professional bodybuilder, odds are you are carrying excess body fat at that weight. In this case, don't aim for 0.7 g of protein per lb of bodyweight. Instead aim for 0.7 g per lb of your ideal / target weight.



    The idea of a protein absorption ceiling means you were probably reading opinions rather than actual research. Sure, the more protein you consume, the less efficient your body will breakdown the total protein into amino acids and absorb it into the blood stream, but the body also regulates the speed at which protein moves through the small intestine to make sure to absorb it all.

    Actual Reserch:
    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/10867039/

    So yeah, if you want to have a meal with 70 g of protein, go for it. Your body will probably figure it out.



    It can be 6 meals if you want. Or 3 meals. Or 4 meals. Etc. If you want to be hyper efficient about it, sure, more meals helps. But it's far more important to meet your macro and calorie targets, consistently, than to make sure you eat X number of meals a day. In terms of the hierarchy of importance in nutrition for hypertrophy, eating 6 meals a day ranks pretty low. 3 or 4 meals is fine.



    I try to space my meals about every 2.5 to 3 hours, but I'm taking this hobby seriously. You really don't need to religiously space your meals. Again, the overwhelmingly most important part is consistently meeting your macro and calorie targets EVERY DAY. If that means you only eat one or two meals in a day, good, at least make sure you eat your daily macro and calorie targets in those one or two meals.



    Snacks and shakes help in the windows where you can't get a real meal. But again, you're getting obsessed with nutrient timing when it's really far down the totem pole of importance.



    You can eat 5 meals, or 4 meals, or 3 meals a day, and your gains will be barely affected AS LONG AS YOU MEET YOUR DAILY MACRO AND CALORIE TARGETS.

    However, given your weight, it is likely that you are carrying excessive body fat. If you want to maximize your gains, consider dropping your weight to around 12% body fat first before making gains.

    Why? The higher your body fat %, the harder it will be for you to build muscle, to the point where you would have to be consuming so much extra calories that it would be wildly inefficient. Like, you'd add muscle, but the rate of fat gain would just be shooting through the roof.

    So don't worry about gains until you've dropped the fat.
    Thought P ratio had been largely debunked by the Stronger by Science guys? I still think you're right and cutting first would probably be a good idea, but I don't think the evidence points towards making leaner gains from starting at a lower bodyfat percentage.
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    Originally Posted by RapidFail View Post
    Thought P ratio had been largely debunked by the Stronger by Science guys? I still think you're right and cutting first would probably be a good idea, but I don't think the evidence points towards making leaner gains from starting at a lower bodyfat percentage.
    I think the evidence is still weak on both sides of that debate. That was sort of the takeaway in the forum discussion about this IIRC:

    https://forum.bodybuilding.com/showt...hp?t=179632473

    We need a randomized experiment with a group of people who cut then bulk and another group of people that bulk then cut keeping everything else constant to know who’s right!
    Last edited by EiFit91; 08-07-2021 at 06:53 AM.
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    Originally Posted by Camarija View Post
    Not really. You can shoot to hit the minimum of 0.7 g of protein per lb of bodyweight. If you're in a caloric deficit (losing weight) or really trying to optimize bodybuilding, yeah you could shoot for more, but it won't make a massive difference.



    Unless you are already a professional athlete or professional bodybuilder, odds are you are carrying excess body fat at that weight. In this case, don't aim for 0.7 g of protein per lb of bodyweight. Instead aim for 0.7 g per lb of your ideal / target weight.



    The idea of a protein absorption ceiling means you were probably reading opinions rather than actual research. Sure, the more protein you consume, the less efficient your body will breakdown the total protein into amino acids and absorb it into the blood stream, but the body also regulates the speed at which protein moves through the small intestine to make sure to absorb it all.

    Actual Reserch:
    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/10867039/

    So yeah, if you want to have a meal with 70 g of protein, go for it. Your body will probably figure it out.



    It can be 6 meals if you want. Or 3 meals. Or 4 meals. Etc. If you want to be hyper efficient about it, sure, more meals helps. But it's far more important to meet your macro and calorie targets, consistently, than to make sure you eat X number of meals a day. In terms of the hierarchy of importance in nutrition for hypertrophy, eating 6 meals a day ranks pretty low. 3 or 4 meals is fine.



    I try to space my meals about every 2.5 to 3 hours, but I'm taking this hobby seriously. You really don't need to religiously space your meals. Again, the overwhelmingly most important part is consistently meeting your macro and calorie targets EVERY DAY. If that means you only eat one or two meals in a day, good, at least make sure you eat your daily macro and calorie targets in those one or two meals.



    Snacks and shakes help in the windows where you can't get a real meal. But again, you're getting obsessed with nutrient timing when it's really far down the totem pole of importance.



    You can eat 5 meals, or 4 meals, or 3 meals a day, and your gains will be barely affected AS LONG AS YOU MEET YOUR DAILY MACRO AND CALORIE TARGETS.

    However, given your weight, it is likely that you are carrying excessive body fat. If you want to maximize your gains, consider dropping your weight to around 12% body fat first before making gains.

    Why? The higher your body fat %, the harder it will be for you to build muscle, to the point where you would have to be consuming so much extra calories that it would be wildly inefficient. Like, you'd add muscle, but the rate of fat gain would just be shooting through the roof.

    So don't worry about gains until you've dropped the fat.
    Excellent post with top notch information!

    Charles Poliquin was big on refusing to have an athlete add mass as a goal unless they could already see their abs.

    Focus on fat loss FIRST while maintaining muscle and increasing strength, then begin adding mass to your new found strength.
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  9. #9
    Train hard play harder Tommy W.'s Avatar
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    Protein requirements vary. Someone that holds a lot of bodyfat is best severed to figure protein based on lean mass and not body weight. You didn't mention your height however unless you're extremely tall you have a lot of fat and therefore should base protein on lean mass. As far as 35G at a time for absorption I wouldn't go much off that. The priority is getting in your total daily protein and the spacings are secondary.

    Say you're 30% BF. Lean mass would be about 180 so you really only need about 150g per day.
    Last edited by Tommy W.; 08-07-2021 at 12:16 PM.
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  10. #10
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    Originally Posted by RapidFail View Post
    Thought P ratio had been largely debunked by the Stronger by Science guys? I still think you're right and cutting first would probably be a good idea, but I don't think the evidence points towards making leaner gains from starting at a lower bodyfat percentage.
    You're referring to this podcast right?


    I don't think it works to disprove the notion of P Ratios, but I think it does convincingly challenge the evidence supporting the classic view of P Ratios.

    There's still a decent amount of disagreement:



    Ultimately, I still side with the classic view of P Ratios, mostly based on how weight gain has worked on my own body at different body fat %'s, but I respect people who take an opposing view there.

    I'm going to move the goal posts a bit, but for me the concluding recommendations of when to bulk or cut comes down to common sense.

    If someone is overweight or obese, I'm not going to recommend they bulk.

    From the point of view of overall health, it makes more sense to cut down first.

    From the point of view of avoiding extra stretch marks, or extra loose skin, when they finally do cut down to lower body fat %, it also makes more sense to cut down first.

    ...

    ....

    in before this thread gets derailed into another P Ratio debate
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  11. #11
    Train hard play harder Tommy W.'s Avatar
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    Originally Posted by RapidFail View Post
    Thought P ratio had been largely debunked by the Stronger by Science guys? I still think you're right and cutting first would probably be a good idea, but I don't think the evidence points towards making leaner gains from starting at a lower bodyfat percentage.
    Correct. Leaner gains come from having your diet dialed in.

    There is a point of diminishing returns as far as how lean to get before reverse dieting and going into a muscle building phase. After a certain point the extra time and energy it takes to get to a certain point of leanness could be muscle building time. You can't go by BF% either. You have to look in the mirror and decide. 12% on one person can look completely different on someone else.
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  12. #12
    Registered User Benchpresser350's Avatar
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    A big mixing cup.

    Milk (12 oz) x 3 (0%, 1%, 2%, whole as needed to adjust your calories)

    Whey Protein powder (that you like) 150 grams of protein worth.

    Raw Large Eggs 2 x 3 = 6 (also have 4 cooked eggs for breakfast) total of 10 eggs.

    Gainer = 1 scoop (optinal if you get too hungry between meals or need extra energy during the day).

    Bananas = 1

    Blend it up good so the eggs emulsify.

    Eat like this:

    Breakfast, 1/3 drink, Lunch, 1/3 drink, Dinner, 1/3 drink.

    That is your meals. 3 solid, 3 liquid.

    That leaves you about 30 or so grams of protein per solid meal which is easily achievable.
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    Originally Posted by Benchpresser350 View Post

    Raw Large Eggs 2 x 3 = 6 (also have 4 cooked eggs for breakfast) total of 10 eggs.

    .
    raw eggs... what is it with people and raw eggs?

    Poor bioavailability, risk of salmonella, no added good flavor for the calories you're adding...


    choose something else.
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    Raw eggs are not considered safe, but nether is getting under a fully barbell for a bench press.

    To me they add a lot of flavor and people say the RAW DNA builds muscle quicker.

    Plus it's more Crocodile Dundee like.

    And when you tell your Mom and friends you drink Raw Eggs, they always think of Rocky and how hardcore that is.
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    Originally Posted by Benchpresser350 View Post
    Raw eggs are not considered safe, but nether is getting under a fully barbell for a bench press.

    To me they add a lot of flavor and people say the RAW DNA builds muscle quicker.

    Plus it's more Crocodile Dundee like.

    And when you tell your Mom and friends you drink Raw Eggs, they always think of Rocky and how hardcore that is.
    you seem smart

    i mean 'people say' is does stuff so clearly, we should all start doing it

    When have 'people' ever been wrong!?
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    Originally Posted by Camarija View Post
    You're referring to this podcast right?


    I don't think it works to disprove the notion of P Ratios, but I think it does convincingly challenge the evidence supporting the classic view of P Ratios.

    There's still a decent amount of disagreement:



    Ultimately, I still side with the classic view of P Ratios, mostly based on how weight gain has worked on my own body at different body fat %'s, but I respect people who take an opposing view there.

    I'm going to move the goal posts a bit, but for me the concluding recommendations of when to bulk or cut comes down to common sense.

    If someone is overweight or obese, I'm not going to recommend they bulk.

    From the point of view of overall health, it makes more sense to cut down first.

    From the point of view of avoiding extra stretch marks, or extra loose skin, when they finally do cut down to lower body fat %, it also makes more sense to cut down first.

    ...

    ....

    in before this thread gets derailed into another P Ratio debate
    Makes sense - you've got to do what works best for you. Ultimately I think the most important think to come out of those conversations is that even if p ratio doesn't matter, that shouldn't change the recommendations of when to bulk. Starting at a lower body fat makes sense to give yourself more room for a longer and more productive bulking phase.
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    Originally Posted by RapidFail View Post
    Makes sense - you've got to do what works best for you. Ultimately I think the most important think to come out of those conversations is that even if p ratio doesn't matter, that shouldn't change the recommendations of when to bulk. Starting at a lower body fat makes sense to give yourself more room for a longer and more productive bulking phase.
    there is a limit on how low to go before reverse dieting.
    If you don't get what you want you didn't want it bad enough
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    Originally Posted by AdamWW View Post
    you seem smart

    i mean 'people say' is does stuff so clearly, we should all start doing it

    When have 'people' ever been wrong!?
    2016 election
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    Originally Posted by desslok View Post
    2016 election
    Fake news!

    Build the wall!

    Build the wall!
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    Train hard play harder Tommy W.'s Avatar
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    Yep
    If you don't get what you want you didn't want it bad enough
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    Originally Posted by Tommy W. View Post
    there is a limit on how low to go before reverse dieting.
    Not quite sure what you mean and how that relates to what I said? Not complaining, just hoping you can educate me
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    Originally Posted by desslok View Post
    2016 election
    Grabbed it by the pu$$y!
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    Originally Posted by Benchpresser350 View Post
    Raw eggs are not considered safe, but nether is getting under a fully barbell for a bench press.

    To me they add a lot of flavor and people say the RAW DNA builds muscle quicker.

    Plus it's more Crocodile Dundee like.

    And when you tell your Mom and friends you drink Raw Eggs, they always think of Rocky and how hardcore that is.
    I eat a variety of raw animal products: eggs, fish and beef.

    For the fish it’s either been tuna, salmon or eel. For beef it’s tartar steak from filet mignon or beef carpaccio (you HAVE to try it). Eggs I’ll only eat raw if they’re pasture raised and I wash them before cracking them. Both hens eggs and to a much lesser extent quail. I’ve actually had a raw quail egg on top of raw tuna many times, zero issues.

    Never had any problems from any raw foods but then again I’ve been doing the 5 second rule since I was in diapers….your immune system needs practice.
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    Originally Posted by Benchpresser350 View Post
    A big mixing cup..
    That post sounds like you are plagarizing me 3x. Just kidding. My normal breakfast is 1/3 of what you posted. Been having 2 raw eggs a day since July 1, no problems.
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    My daily intake is 500g u don't see me crying
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    Depends in which purpose You need.
    For normal maintenance is ok 1gr per B.W...
    For some extra gain 1.5gr of protein per B.W.

    Have a nice day

    💪
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    Originally Posted by Benchpresser350 View Post
    A big mixing cup.

    Milk (12 oz) x 3 (0%, 1%, 2%, whole as needed to adjust your calories)

    Whey Protein powder (that you like) 150 grams of protein worth.

    Raw Large Eggs 2 x 3 = 6 (also have 4 cooked eggs for breakfast) total of 10 eggs.

    Gainer = 1 scoop (optinal if you get too hungry between meals or need extra energy during the day).

    Bananas = 1

    Blend it up good so the eggs emulsify.

    Eat like this:

    Breakfast, 1/3 drink, Lunch, 1/3 drink, Dinner, 1/3 drink.

    That is your meals. 3 solid, 3 liquid.

    That leaves you about 30 or so grams of protein per solid meal which is easily achievable.


    Nice combo 👍😎
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    Milk, whey, Greek yogurt, eggs. The cornerstone of any nutritious breakfast.

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    Originally Posted by paulinkansas View Post
    Milk, whey, Greek yogurt, eggs. The cornerstone of any nutritious breakfast.

    Love the ol' Big Kahuna Burger ;o)
    "When I die, I hope it's early in the morning so I don't have to go to work that day for no reason"
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    Originally Posted by AdamWW View Post
    Love the ol' Big Kahuna Burger ;o)
    Check out the big brain on Brett!
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