Usman or GSP (Goat WW)

[Cartiac]

While I appreciate Usman's current dominance, GSP's kill list is a who's who of UFC champions and Usman has not even fought anyone really worth bragging about.

[Cartiac]

Jon Jones cannot be goat, would you put Sammy schilt as k1 goat? Then I guess shaq is basketball goat? Just shove defenders away using your 400 lbs ass and put the ball in the basket using your 25 feet tall height, who needs Jordan skill?

Goat has to be someone who actually has skills, that overcome size disadvantage, Jones is actually not among the most skilled fighters, just a genetic freak steroid using athlete who enjoys massive reach and size advantage over his opponents. Jones is basically participating in special olympics while not being retarded. Jones is setting a female world deadlift record while identifying as a female. Jones’s body simply tolerated more drugs and weight cut. He was cleanly beat by machida and several others until they simply could not any longer cope with his size as the fight went on.

Technically speaking Jones’s style and skill set is basically this:

Take a trident in each hand, poke your opponent with it. The end.

I’m sorry. This is not skill. It’s something Jones should thank his parents for,

You clearly don't even watch MMA and only Judge Jones wbecause you are only repeating what you think will get you liked with the feminist twitter crowd. Long before any controversy with Jon Jones, he came into the UFC with skills far beyond absolutely anyone the sport has ever seen, while he created some rightful criticism of his character due to his actions outside of the cage , there is absolutely no questioning his skills as a fighter.

Completely ignoring Jon Jones or anyone elses' skills or lack there of, please explain how anyone can use size advantage as an excuse in a sport where both parties are required to meet the same weight requirement?

[lowkey94]

Gsp..

[kusok]

you youre saying Khabib is that Goat?

Overall MMA GOAT? Fedor obviously. Anderson Silva, GSP, Jones, Khabib in 2nd place depending on your judging criteria and personal preference.

[zhengterry]

GSP, just because he is also MW champ!

[mp83]

GSP at this point, but I think if they fought Usman would beat even prime GSP.

If that makes sense

[theparttimenerd]

He said goat of this division.

Given Kamaru's record and dominance he is definitely the contender for goat of his division. He's actually far more dominant than GSP ever was. If they were to fight I think Kamaru would hurt him very bad. Nonetheless we have to see how long he holds the belt for.

Also people hate Usman OP so most people are going to side with GSP based on personality (almost something a woman would do...).

Lmao you think Marty would hurt someone who's been consistently training with DDS? You think Usman is even in the same level of grappling as Gordon Ryan, Renzo Gracie, John Danaher, Firas, etc.? Dafuq is Usman gonna do? KO GSP? No way in hell is he beating him on the ground. He rolls with the best of the best. He trains with specialists.

[kusok]

Inb4 and in after annual and monthly and weekly threads where whoever is the Champion that particular year or month is compared to all time legend GOATS.

[Ravishing_Rick]

Cough*

[DDoc]

A prime vs prime fight between them would've been huge. I give GSP the advantage in every area except chin and maybe punching power, though I think any difference in the latter category is negligible.

[stayhomeneet]

The goat is whoever just won the last ufc PPV main event.

[Cartiac]

Like clockwork... every few months a new “GOAT” appears. Noob fans... when will they learn?

You are all so naive and gullible.

LOL

LOL, if you weren't such a naïve, gullible, noob yourself you would know Usman has been around a lot longer than a few months, regularly defending his title with decisive victories over the top contenders of the division laying legitimate claim to the best Welterweight ever. I was a big fan of GSP but he wasn't exactly dominating in his later fights and it is hard to give GOAT status to a guy that tapped to strikes.

[Gizzyhardcore]

So what? I watched first UFC and before, before you were born, I also actually train LOL

Here is a rule: if some new guy won a few fights you do NOT get to compare him to Tyson, Ali, Fedor, GSP etc. You just don’t get to do it, unless you want to sound like a moron. Over the years there have been SOOOO many of these threads. It’s so stupid.

lmao, says he trains, then makes a dumb statement that proves he doesn't train.

[ninetynine8]

He said goat of this division.

Given Kamaru's record and dominance he is definitely the contender for goat of his division. He's actually far more dominant than GSP ever was. If they were to fight I think Kamaru would hurt him very bad. Nonetheless we have to see how long he holds the belt for.

Also people hate Usman OP so most people are going to side with GSP based on personality (almost something a woman would do...).

I stick by this. I think he's very close to surpassing GSP. The guy looks untouchable in this era... GSP arguably lost

[Gainzzz]

I stick by this. I think he's very close to surpassing GSP. The guy looks untouchable in this era... GSP arguably lost

How is Usman more dominant?

GSP did not lose a single round for like 6 straight years, as champion. Let that sink in.

He would dominate guys in every facet of MMA.

Up until 2 years ago, Usman was the biggest crotch sniffer on the roster.

Through all the hype and shenanigans (it even got me), people started to believe Masvidal was an elite level fighter. The whole "resurrection" thing was incredibly good marketing with incredibly good timing during incredibly favorable fights.

GSP would have 50-44'd Masvidal.

GSP's record is so much better that anyone trying to compare it to Usman's should be embarrassed.

Usman has fought:

post-Covid Burns (his cardio looked superhuman vs Woodley, looked chit vs Usman)
6 day notice Masvidal (Usman held on for dear life and foot stomped his way to a decision)
Colby (who was up 3-1 on two scorecards before the questionable stoppage)
A washed up Woodley (he's on a 3 fight skid, starting with the Usman fight)
RDA (a lightweight)

We're comparing this to GSP? Is this a sick joke?

If we're talking skill vs skill, a hypothetical fight, it's still not close. GSP was the best athlete we have ever seen in MMA. He was also one of the smartest and most skilled fighters.

This is depressing (ded fkin Srs)

GSP was too well rounded, too smart, and too physically gifted.

[CaliSuperSport]

I stick by this. I think he's very close to surpassing GSP. The guy looks untouchable in this era... GSP arguably lost

I don't see why last night should add much to Usman's GOAT talk. I know he KO'd Masvidal but Jorge's also goin on 37 and has been fighting for almost 20 fukin years....

If anything, it's Jorge's clue to start looking past MMA. GSP was a damn wizard and also moved up in weight class. I mentioned in another thread that Usman has a REALLY STUPID reason for not moving up, which conveniently self-justifies him never fighting Adesanya. One major reason he won't ever be above GSP.

[TappingTheZen]

GSP. GSP is the GOAT period, and the people who watched him back then will know how legit his competition was, including multiple hall of famers. Their resume is not even close ATM.

Even though the sport moves on, GSP was years ahead of his time, fight IQ through the roof, the wrestling probably balances out and GSP's standup is significantly better. I think prime GSP would beat Usman currently.

Usman needs at least a few more defenses, and a belt at another weight before it's even a discussion. In terms of legacy, I think he's some fights away from matching Hughes let alone GSP (NOTE i am not saying matt Hughes was a better fighter in absolute terms, but relative to the competition at the time).

And he needs to survive USADA until then as well... but he could do it.

Welterweight top 3 in terms of legacy is probably(IMO):
1. GSP
2. Hughes
3. Usman
4. Woodley
5. Miletich

It actually makes me sad how forgotten hughes legacy is these days, he held the belt 3x, 7 total defenses, and was the first guy to beat GSP, and also beat Penn. Dominated the competition until Penn/GSP came along. He was 41-4 before his 2nd fight against GSP, with one of those losses to Penn and the others early in his career.

A prime vs prime fight between them would've been huge. I give GSP the advantage in every area except chin and maybe punching power, though I think any difference in the latter category is negligible.

I think GSP hit harder TBH, the problem is his follow up right never had all the power it could have, because he leaned into his jab on his lead leg. His jab is probably the best jab in MMA though.

[skinnyfat88]

Some of the opponents prime GSP faced maybe weren't as big/strong as the current WW's and it would have been fun to see him challenge himself against him but his resume still exceeds Usman and his MMA wrestling was still unlike anything we've ever seen before the way he took his opponents down with ease as soon as they committed to a power strike.
Very curious to see if he would've put Usman/Colby on their backs and/or if he would've utilized leg kicks the way so many fighters have begun doing over the last few years.

[TappingTheZen]

Some of the opponents prime GSP faced maybe weren't as big/strong as the current WW's and it would have been fun to see him challenge himself against him but his resume still exceeds Usman and his MMA wrestling was still unlike anything we've ever seen before the way he took his opponents down with ease as soon as they committed to a power strike.
Very curious to see if he would've put Usman/Colby on their backs and/or if he would've utilized leg kicks the way so many fighters have begun doing over the last few years.

I can see him doing something like he did vs koscheck vs colby lol.

[Schnitzl]

TBH I don't even know if GOAT can be looked at in a vacuum. The game evolves so much that it's like asking "which car is better, F40 or SF90? Sure the F40 was the crown jewel of its era but technology advances just like fighters studying the game advances.

Maybe in the future we will not say GOAT but GOTT or greatest of their time.

[sooby]

GSP has 9x title defences lul

He avenged his only two losses, fought some absolute killers along the way.

Kamaru isn't even close until he can get 9 title defenses. Even then it's arguable based on competition and Kamaru would have to dominate each of those title defenses.

Not saying it's impossible but a large hill to climb.

[skinnyfat88]

I can see him doing something like he did vs koscheck vs colby lol.

I doubt Colby sits back and lets GSP jab him all day though. Colby would come forward but I think GSP solves that puzzle.

[Ravishing_Rick]

Cough*

[ninetynine8]

Even though I wanted colby to win my opinion hasn't changed. Usman is the goat ww and would basically dominate GSP.

[taskmob]

Lmao @ this thread. In what section of the game does Usman beat GSP in?

[taskmob]

Some of the opponents prime GSP faced maybe weren't as big/strong as the current WW's and it would have been fun to see him challenge himself against him but his resume still exceeds Usman and his MMA wrestling was still unlike anything we've ever seen before the way he took his opponents down with ease as soon as they committed to a power strike.
Very curious to see if he would've put Usman/Colby on their backs and/or if he would've utilized leg kicks the way so many fighters have begun doing over the last few years.

Lol what??? GSP dominated roided up phàggots while Usman is beating natural fighters while being a roided up phàggot.

[ninetynine8]

Lmao @ this thread. In what section of the game does Usman beat GSP in?

literally in every way other than GSPs ability to adjust

[Schnitzl]

Once Usman finishes Edwards, Luque & Khamzat (maybe Burns again), he will definitely be a GOAT. The game has moved on and GSP was dominating from 2007 to 2013 but Usman is already in the game for over 10 years. Especially in todays era where everyone is very well rounded and can commit their lives fully to becoming the best in terms of nutrition, recovery, training.

[Gainzzz]

MMA fans have to be the most reactionary group of sports fans on the planet. There is a new GOAT or potential GOAT after every other event. A lot of it comes from Dana saying it to promote fighters and build their profile (to make more money) but fans latch onto it.

Usman is comfortably #2. If he beats the remaining contenders who Schnitzl mentioned, then there can be an argument.

Right now, just no.

Usman has dropped 4 rounds to Colby and got lit up by Burns in the first round. He won both of those fights but GSP in his prime dominated every round of every fight with tactics and intelligence and athleticism like we have never seen before. He was loved and hated at the time but I always found his fights extremely impressive. Kind of like watching Mayweather. It's not exciting but you have to appreciate the greatness. Watching Usman feels nothing like that. He looks vulnerable very regularly in fights.

It's sad how fast people forget.

[sooby]

He's definitely #2 IMO, would put him over Hughes. 5 title defenses is impressive. Wonderboy, Luque and Edwards probably don't beat him. I think the only one who can at this point is Chimaev, a longer, bigger fighter with top tier power, striking and wrestling. But we haven't seen his cardio be tested yet and who knows if covid put a dent in that. But he's likely one top opponent win away from contending for the title, he'll have to fight somebody like Wonderboy or Luque to get that chance.