Will you get vaccinated?

[x-trainer ben]

people lost their jobs for not getting the shots and you cheered. But now you want to talk about not caring about other medical decisions.

I never cheered, that is a mutherfkn lie!
I was told about the policy but never ever cheered for someone to lose their job?
People need to work and pay bills, so please spare me with that fkd up lie which in no way shape or form represents my thoughts ever.

Rules to live by....never wish death upon others and never wish unemployment.
I wish these posters had integrity and a good fkn memory about who said what and when.
You are dismissed.

[_zman]

How is it some of us did see through the propaganda and others fell for it hook line sink.

Dad and Mom always used logic when bitching about peoples' decisions. It taught me to always question authority and decisions people make I guess. Skepticsm is probably a bit genetic too, cuz all my family way down the line questioned all of it; except the liberally educated ones that went to major universities, yet their male sibilings questioned it.

[Paul Kreul]

[latverian41]

No, not even Trumps vaccine, I’ve not been sick free for decades, if it ain’t broke, don’t fix.

This. You couldn't pay me to take it I was reading they are doing just that on some places

Do you people really think the powers that be actually gives a ****z if you get sick or not?

Hell they don't even give dying patients medication they can afford to buy that will let them live yet now you think they are paying people to get this shot because they are so worried about your health and well being?

No thanks. I'll do it the natural way. So far so good.

[mtpockets]

This. You couldn't pay me to take it I was reading they are doing just that on some places


Do you people really think the powers that be actually gives a ****z if you get sick or not?


Hell they don't even give dying patients medication they can afford to buy that will let them live yet now you think they are paying people to get this shot because they are so worried about your health and well being?


No thanks. I'll do it the natural way. So far so good.

You have been misled, this is fake news,,, Here is the rest of the story.

No, not even Trumps vaccine, I’ve not been sick free for decades, if it ain’t broke, don’t fix.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^LWW, AKA Tater, Bagel Boy, Mighty Mouth, My Little Pony or whatever flavor he is calling himself today actually got vaccinated shortly after this^^^^^^^^^^^^



His wife had other plans. she made a set of his and her appointments and he had to roll up his sleeve and get the shot.

He took it like a champ though.

[Deathstroke]

Simple answer on Trump taking a vax. He never wanted to mandate it.

[latverian41]

No not at all, never even gotten a flu shot, ever and ironically I never had the flu, don't even know what it feels like to have the flu.

If it's the actual flu trust me you don't want to know.

But no, if won't be getting it either.. they can find their guinea pigs elsewhere

[mtpockets]

Kind of a tiny little award isn’t it?

I expected a Noble Prize to be something glorious,

I have nicer looking plaques from winning Fishing Tournaments


Up your game Alfred

[Mark1T]

Kind of a tiny little award isn’t it?

I expected a Noble Prize to be something glorious,

I have nicer looking plaques from winning Fishing Tournaments


Up your game Alfred

At least they are more attractive with the masks on

[mtpockets]

At least they are more attractive with the masks on

[JustTheDad]

I love all of you getting together for a seance here.

Cuz it means I can see more of Pocket's posts!

[mgftp]

Kind of a tiny little award isn’t it?

I expected a Noble Prize to be something glorious,

I have nicer looking plaques from winning Fishing Tournaments


Up your game Alfred

Size doesn't matter

[Gabbar99]

Kind of a tiny little award isn’t it?

I expected a Noble Prize to be something glorious,

I have nicer looking plaques from winning Fishing Tournaments


Up your game Alfred

That's not the Nobel prize. That's them receiving some award in Japan a year and a half ago.

Whoever implied to you that's the Nobel prize is a liar and you should never listen to anything they say ever again.

The Nobel prize awards a medal. An Olympic gold or the Medal of Honor are also small.

Here they are at the U Penn press conference for the award:

[induced_drag]

No vax here in our house. My son had a sniffle during covid....turns out he had the plague.... He ran a 101 fever for 1/2 a day and was done. My wife felt a little down, she took a test and was positive. She felt mild flu like for a day. During that time, I tried my hardest to get it. I thought I had, I got a mild fever for a day and a half.

I feel bad for anyone who was forced to take it. I also have to question the notion of anyone who got it willingly (and was not in a VERY high risk group). I have ZERO room for anyone who was responsible for giving this to ANY child! They are in the same category to me as people who 'transition' (translation: mutilate) their children. Just the possibility of unknown outcomes should have been enough to scare people away. But the risks I fear will be realized in many years to come. But I am sure it will be blamed on something else.

The shame of what they have done is unforgivable to me. The cost to human life and more importantly entire young generations of people that have been harmed by their lockdowns. All the business owners, workers who worked in those businesses. This entire thing is the largest dose of concentrated evil I have ever seen. I hope it wakes up people to take their liberties back and NEVER surrender them under the guise of 'public good'.

[fishnbrah]

52 year old hunting buddy was coerced to get vaxxed for his job. had a heart attack last week. they put a stent in, hes ok for now.

[fishnbrah]

I have nicer looking plaques from winning Fishing Tournaments

show us

[JustTheDad]

show us

This thread could have become more educational if you had responded to mgftp's last post that way instead.

(I don't want to hear about your 9' rod now fishnbrah, you can just take it tarpon fishing instead)

[x-trainer ben]

Have they ever figured out why some reacted with a 24 hour headache and lived to tell about it(me), and others got wrecked, destroyed, fkd up, with major scary reactions.

I understand not wanting to experiment(Tuskeege experiment) but there should have been a lot more damaged people.

[Deathstroke]

Looks like I have to add Ben to my long list of friends and loved ones who got the vax. Nephew told me his school requires it so he can go to school there. It’s taken enough lives. All ages. Srs

[mtpockets]

Size doesn't matter

LMAO

I know right?

That's what I tell the missus all the time, she never agrees..

I am going to show her your post.

[induced_drag]

My world is not very big, but I know (directly...like their contacts are in my phone) of 2 guys, 35 and 52 who had to be admitted to the hospital within 48 hrs of vax for heart conditions. Both very healthy individuals. The 52yo was in for 2days.

The 35 is a professional pilot and lost his flight medical w/ abnormal EKG. He did not want the vax and waited till last possible date to get it (without being fired as his job demanded it). Took him a year and half to get back to where he could pass a flight physical and return to work. He considers himself lucky. (no fudging a 1st class medical exam with the FAA).

Anyway, that is just 2 people that I know directly in my little world. MANY MANY MORE and many for years to come who where not so lucky.

[JustTheDad]

Have they ever figured out why some reacted with a 24 hour headache and lived to tell about it(me), and others got wrecked, destroyed, fkd up, with major scary reactions.

I understand not wanting to experiment(Tuskeege experiment) but there should have been a lot more damaged people.

Are you talking about from the vaccine or from the virus?

So many variables either way. Who knows how many thousands of virus strains you've been exposed to that caused your immune system to adapt and alter itself. Who knows what your HLA markers are or what other genetic variations played into adverse reactions, or which specific antigen they were to in the case of the virus. With the virus, you'd have to add in the variations in the strains, how much exposure you got.

All we can say with any certainty is that the vaccine was a lot safer than a vaccine naïve infection the virus. If you caught the virus before getting the vaccine, you were probably going to get a whole lot more circulating spike protein than you got with a vaccine first. The vaccine is just giving your immune system a heads up on what may be coming, and it only exposed you to one of the 29 proteins the virus produced. Or one of the 4 structural proteins. And even that protein was attenuated.

Doesn't mean people didn't have problems from the vaccine. Just means they probably would have had a much worse outcome if they'd actually caught the virus. But having a bad outcome because you chose to get a vaccine, or worse, because someone pressured you to get it, will always feel bad. Doesn't matter that it probably would have been worse if you hadn't gotten the vaccine because that's a fact you'd have to accept based just on the science, not one you could go and prove. One of my reports died, a cousin who was an anti-vax campaigner died, a neighbor who caught the virus before he was able to get vaccinated still can't do as much work as he could do before he had covid. I know at least 10x as many people who got vaccinated as I know who didn't simply because of my line of work, and I don't know anyone who had a bad outcome from the vaccine. I even know some who have had more than 6 shots because of travel requirements and timing.

We didn't handle the politics or PR around the vaccine well, but that's old news and I'm surprised we're still discussing it again when it's not an election year.

[induced_drag]

Are you talking about from the vaccine or from the virus?

So many variables either way. Who knows how many thousands of virus strains you've been exposed to that caused your immune system to adapt and alter itself. Who knows what your HLA markers are or what other genetic variations played into adverse reactions, or which specific antigen they were to in the case of the virus. With the virus, you'd have to add in the variations in the strains, how much exposure you got.

All we can say with any certainty is that the vaccine was a lot safer than a vaccine naïve infection the virus. If you caught the virus before getting the vaccine, you were probably going to get a whole lot more circulating spike protein than you got with a vaccine first. The vaccine is just giving your immune system a heads up on what may be coming, and it only exposed you to one of the 29 proteins the virus produced. Or one of the 4 structural proteins. And even that protein was attenuated.

Doesn't mean people didn't have problems from the vaccine. Just means they probably would have had a much worse outcome if they'd actually caught the virus. But having a bad outcome because you chose to get a vaccine, or worse, because someone pressured you to get it, will always feel bad. Doesn't matter that it probably would have been worse if you hadn't gotten the vaccine because that's a fact you'd have to accept based just on the science, not one you could go and prove. One of my reports died, a cousin who was an anti-vax campaigner died, a neighbor who caught the virus before he was able to get vaccinated still can't do as much work as he could do before he had covid. I know at least 10x as many people who got vaccinated as I know who didn't simply because of my line of work, and I don't know anyone who had a bad outcome from the vaccine. I even know some who have had more than 6 shots because of travel requirements and timing.

We didn't handle the politics or PR around the vaccine well, but that's old news and I'm surprised we're still discussing it again when it's not an election year.

Sounds like it was written by someone who got the vax themself and has to convince themself that it was a good idea.

So in my little world, I know 2 people hospitalized by Vax ('knowing' being that I have their contact in my phone and if you look them up, I have text exchanges with them on a personal level).

-I know NO ONE that was hospitalized by covid. Again, defining 'knowing' as I have their personal info and text with them.

-I know NO ONE who knows of anyone who died or was hospitalized of COVID that was outside high risk groups. VERY obese w/ significant underlying health issues, or over 80.


Using the 'know someone who know's someone' standard though applied to significant VAX side effects, I know MANY! So I know MANY MANY more people affected by the Vax than COVID. Affected significantly by VAX twice removed standard MANY, affected by COVID itself, BIG FAT 0. (In my circle the affected high risk include one guy 47 who was 350lbs and decade long diabetic who already had heart attack, and some people who know people 80+ who died in nursing home).



Make yourself feel better that you saved yourself if you want. Drink the kool-aid.

[x-trainer ben]

The vaccine i meant, i never got Covid, sorry if i was not clearer and i had Pfizer.
I also was dealing with a relative with Cancer(18 months) so i was lucky to never get Covid-19( thanks god/chemo radiation)
Thanks as always for your detailed reply and explanations.

As an aside here in DC and NJ/Philly we got the good real vax, lol, and no one had any adverse shot reactions just strong reactions after having covid.
1. weakness, energy, fatigue
2. loss of taste smell 2 years running
3. heart issues 3 years
4. headaches

Are you talking about from the vaccine or from the virus?

So many variables either way. Who knows how many thousands of virus strains you've been exposed to that caused your immune system to adapt and alter itself. Who knows what your HLA markers are or what other genetic variations played into adverse reactions, or which specific antigen they were to in the case of the virus. With the virus, you'd have to add in the variations in the strains, how much exposure you got.

All we can say with any certainty is that the vaccine was a lot safer than a vaccine naïve infection the virus. If you caught the virus before getting the vaccine, you were probably going to get a whole lot more circulating spike protein than you got with a vaccine first. The vaccine is just giving your immune system a heads up on what may be coming, and it only exposed you to one of the 29 proteins the virus produced. Or one of the 4 structural proteins. And even that protein was attenuated.

Doesn't mean people didn't have problems from the vaccine. Just means they probably would have had a much worse outcome if they'd actually caught the virus. But having a bad outcome because you chose to get a vaccine, or worse, because someone pressured you to get it, will always feel bad. Doesn't matter that it probably would have been worse if you hadn't gotten the vaccine because that's a fact you'd have to accept based just on the science, not one you could go and prove. One of my reports died, a cousin who was an anti-vax campaigner died, a neighbor who caught the virus before he was able to get vaccinated still can't do as much work as he could do before he had covid. I know at least 10x as many people who got vaccinated as I know who didn't simply because of my line of work, and I don't know anyone who had a bad outcome from the vaccine. I even know some who have had more than 6 shots because of travel requirements and timing.

We didn't handle the politics or PR around the vaccine well, but that's old news and I'm surprised we're still discussing it again when it's not an election year.

As for this:"We didn't handle the politics or PR around the vaccine well, but that's old news and I'm surprised we're still discussing it again when it's not an election year."

people are still mad and will be forever.

[JustTheDad]

Sounds like it was written by someone who got the vax themself and has to convince themself that it was a good idea.

So in my little world, I know 2 people hospitalized by Vax ('knowing' being that I have their contact in my phone and if you look them up, I have text exchanges with them on a personal level).

-I know NO ONE that was hospitalized by covid. Again, defining 'knowing' as I have their personal info and text with them.

-I know NO ONE who knows of anyone who died or was hospitalized of COVID that was outside high risk groups. VERY obese w/ significant underlying health issues, or over 80.


Using the 'know someone who know's someone' standard though applied to significant VAX side effects, I know MANY! So I know MANY MANY more people affected by the Vax than COVID. Affected significantly by VAX twice removed standard MANY, affected by COVID itself, BIG FAT 0. (In my circle the affected high risk include one guy 47 who was 350lbs and decade long diabetic who already had heart attack, and some people who know people 80+ who died in nursing home).



Make yourself feel better that you saved yourself if you want. Drink the kool-aid.

As an analogy for Covid and the Covid vaccine let's make up a game that's analogous to the statistics.

We'll think of the virus as a MLB pitcher with 10 racks of billiards balls and 10 cue balls standing at second base. He plays for the Red Suns, and has a 95mph fastball and a decent curve ball. He can change things up a bit.

We're going to give everyone a pair of 6 sided dice and if their first role is double sixes, they get a free happy meal at McDonalds and are done playing the game. That's the equivalent of never getting exposed to the virus. (1 in 12 is probably a lot better than the real odds of never getting exposed to the virus, but we’ll build the analogy biased against the vaccine.)

If a player doesn't roll 6-6, the MLB pitcher (let's call him Spike) is going to throw balls at the player while they're chained to first base. The rules are he has to bruise a player with a cue ball in order to be allowed to throw the other 150 billiards balls at them. If they're young and not too fat, they should be able dodge every cue ball and walk away without even a bruise. Even if they get a bruise, they can still probably avoid getting killed from the other 150 billiards balls he throws. If they survive the game, which we expect 99.9% of them will, we give them a 3’x5’ plexiglass shield to use in case their number ever comes up to play again.

Now at some point after the game starts, we’ll add a new twist. Now, we have a minor league pitcher who has 3 cue balls wrapped in leather to throw at the player. He has a 90mph fastball but his curveball is pretty lame so he's predictable.

Any player can decide to let the minor league pitcher throw before the major league pitcher. Some players are actually required to choose this. But after our minor league pitcher, we’ll call him Pfizzy Johnson, throws his 3 padded cue balls, the player will get a 3’x4’ plexiglass shield. At this point, they are going to play the rest of the game in a way that's close to the original game. If our now somewhat better prepared player doesn’t roll 6-6, Spike will get to throw 6 cue balls (plus another 80 colored balls if he bruises them with a cue ball). The player can use their 4' tall shield during this part of the game and if they survive, which we expect 99.999% of the will, they'll get the bigger shield. I know, I know, mgftp says size doesn’t matter… .

The only problem I can find with my analogy, is that if the game were played in your world, only the people who have the minor league pitcher throw padded balls first and then have a shield to block Spike's throws will ever get hurt. That’s despite them only facing 3 padded balls before they get a shield and having less unpadded billiards balls to dodge. It seems to defy logic, statistics, and physics, but hey, you live in your world, so you should make your choices based on it too. I'll make mine based on my world and we will hopefully both live long happy lives.

Edit:

As for this:"We didn't handle the politics or PR around the vaccine well, but that's old news and I'm surprised we're still discussing it again when it's not an election year."

people are still mad and will be forever.

Hopefully not forever.

Also, sorry I can't answer the question well. We're still just stupid humans prescribing rat poison and leech spit. We know they work, but our knowledge is far from complete or perfect. Despite that, the data says we still got it mostly right on Covid Vaccines

[x-trainer ben]

it sounds like prayer, it works but we cant tell you why,lol

[JustTheDad]

it sounds like prayer, it works but we cant tell you why,lol

Nah, why it works is easy.
Why a few people in a million have a different systemic response that can lead to a bad outcome is the mystery.

But think about a different question. In a situation like the pandemic, and even after it, how hard should we look for those reasons?


If we had evidence the vaccine had a serious side effect that getting the actual virus wouldn't, or that it cause the same ones to and equal or greater degree, then it would be worth pursuing the etiology of that. But we haven't found any evidence of that and it's hard to even hypothesize a way it could happen.

Think about an alphabet of viral proteins. So 26 different proteins. Covid has a few more, but you know I like easy analogies.

The mRNA vaccine results in a little of protein s, a non-functional version of protein S, being made by your body. The virus results in a lot of every letter including S, being made by your body.

It's possible we could have made an s that actually caused more problems than S. The goal was to have the antigenic portion of s and S be the same, but make the portion of S that actually helps the virus propagate not work. That functional part is not the part your immune system actually pays a lot of attention to. Means you get antibodies that recognize either s or S, but if you catch the virus at the same time as you get s from the vaccine, the s won't actually help the virus.
There was some truly brilliant work that was done to create the vaccines. Fear is apparently a good motivator. So was money lol.

Oh, and Coumadin is rat poison, and Hirudin is from leeches. Both are anticoagulants. I was serious, we do still use rat poison and leech spit Medicine be scary stuff dude, and scientists can be egotistical @-holes. Which is why I don't have issues with anyone arguing against the vaccines. We're usually safer because of it.

[Bando]

As an analogy for Covid and the Covid vaccine let's make up a game that's analogous to the statistics.

We'll think of the virus as a MLB pitcher with 10 racks of billiards balls and 10 cue balls standing at second base. He plays for the Red Suns, and has a 95mph fastball and a decent curve ball. He can change things up a bit.

We're going to give everyone a pair of 6 sided dice and if their first role is double sixes, they get a free happy meal at McDonalds and are done playing the game. That's the equivalent of never getting exposed to the virus. (1 in 12 is probably a lot better than the real odds of never getting exposed to the virus, but we’ll build the analogy biased against the vaccine.)

If a player doesn't roll 6-6, the MLB pitcher (let's call him Spike) is going to throw balls at the player while they're chained to first base. The rules are he has to bruise a player with a cue ball in order to be allowed to throw the other 150 billiards balls at them. If they're young and not too fat, they should be able dodge every cue ball and walk away without even a bruise. Even if they get a bruise, they can still probably avoid getting killed from the other 150 billiards balls he throws. If they survive the game, which we expect 99.9% of them will, we give them a 3’x5’ plexiglass shield to use in case their number ever comes up to play again.

Now at some point after the game starts, we’ll add a new twist. Now, we have a minor league pitcher who has 3 cue balls wrapped in leather to throw at the player. He has a 90mph fastball but his curveball is pretty lame so he's predictable.

Any player can decide to let the minor league pitcher throw before the major league pitcher. Some players are actually required to choose this. But after our minor league pitcher, we’ll call him Pfizzy Johnson, throws his 3 padded cue balls, the player will get a 3’x4’ plexiglass shield. At this point, they are going to play the rest of the game in a way that's close to the original game. If our now somewhat better prepared player doesn’t roll 6-6, Spike will get to throw 6 cue balls (plus another 80 colored balls if he bruises them with a cue ball). The player can use their 4' tall shield during this part of the game and if they survive, which we expect 99.999% of the will, they'll get the bigger shield. I know, I know, mgftp says size doesn’t matter… .

The only problem I can find with my analogy, is that if the game were played in your world, only the people who have the minor league pitcher throw padded balls first and then have a shield to block Spike's throws will ever get hurt. That’s despite them only facing 3 padded balls before they get a shield and having less unpadded billiards balls to dodge. It seems to defy logic, statistics, and physics, but hey, you live in your world, so you should make your choices based on it too. I'll make mine based on my world and we will hopefully both live long happy lives.

wut

[JustTheDad]

Wut can I say, I was in a boring online meeting. But the analogy actually fit's pretty well with how vaccines work.

You take a fraction of the risk up front: Pfizzy had a lower number of balls, they were padded, and he threw slower.

The vaccine may not provide as much protection as surviving an infection with the actual virus, but for a while, you still have a lot of circulating antibodies: you get a shield that's 4' tall, not 5' tall after Pfizzy throws.

If you face the virus after the vaccine, your immunity will probably be even better: You got the upgraded 5' shield if you survived Spike's turn using the smaller shield you got from surviving Pfizzy's turn.

After a vaccine, if you get exposed to the virus, your immune system will have memory cells: that's a head start similar to already having dodged half of Spike's billiard balls and is why Spike got less chances to kill you when he went after Pfizzy. I could have added that if you ever faced Spike again in the future, he'd always have less billiards balls to throw, but the call ended so I went back to actually working.

I'm easily entertained I guess.

[Mark1T]

I had two shots and no boosters and no Covid.

I am not against the shots, but I most likely will not get another. However, I will take a shot of good whiskey as an honorary shot.