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  1. #151
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Tribidon View Post
    So from what I'm getting is the first 3 exercises - 4 sets (2 warm-ups and 2 work-sets), and the last 4 exercises (just 2 work-sets without warm-up), i.e. warm-ups are optional?
    Yup. Allpro 1.0 had a warmup for every exercise, and too many people were failing, especially the OHP. So that should tell you the volume limit, and how silly it is when n00bs want to add 2-3 more exercises from the get go
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  2. #152
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    Is there any good Liss I can do indoors without equipment? Like a circuit style? It’s getting very wet here and running is become a chore
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  3. #153
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by nezaboy View Post
    Is there any good Liss I can do indoors without equipment? Like a circuit style? It’s getting very wet here and running is become a chore
    Sustainable jump rope in a room with a high ceiling? Dancing to youtube? Ive been telling people to get those peddle bikes that go under your desk. Im not sure what your threshold is for "equipment". You can even get a stand for your real bike to make it stationary.

    Or you can go down the dark corridor on youtube and find plenty of "womens" workout that are basically LISS or sweating-to-the-oldies.

    But it just needs to be sustainable for 45min, so if the "legs" section of the aerobics is only a 5min long before your are huffing, that doesnt count.
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  4. #154
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    Oh god it sounds like the women’s work outs for me then! Ceilings won’t allow a jump rope and short on space inside here. I have no bike and rarely sit at a desk, I’m on my feet a lot.

    I’m asking because I’m on week 2 and 9 reps feels hard. I’m eating enough and well, I’m sleeping great too. So I’m guessing it’s a lack of moving on non training days.z. My running has suffered a lot recently. English winters are no fun
    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    Sustainable jump rope in a room with a high ceiling? Dancing to youtube? Ive been telling people to get those peddle bikes that go under your desk. Im not sure what your threshold is for "equipment". You can even get a stand for your real bike to make it stationary.

    Or you can go down the dark corridor on youtube and find plenty of "womens" workout that are basically LISS or sweating-to-the-oldies.

    But it just needs to be sustainable for 45min, so if the "legs" section of the aerobics is only a 5min long before your are huffing, that doesnt count.
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  5. #155
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    Alright so since switching from low bar to high bar squat I obviously had to drop weight. This means I’m currently benching more than I squat. So that I’m not wasting time on this ive recorded it today to check my form. I’m keen to push my squat weight up as quickly as possible. At 62 kg this currently feels very heavy. Thoughts?

    https://streamable.com/kbu5mz

    Originally Posted by nezaboy View Post
    Oh god it sounds like the women’s work outs for me then! Ceilings won’t allow a jump rope and short on space inside here. I have no bike and rarely sit at a desk, I’m on my feet a lot.

    I’m asking because I’m on week 2 and 9 reps feels hard. I’m eating enough and well, I’m sleeping great too. So I’m guessing it’s a lack of moving on non training days.z. My running has suffered a lot recently. English winters are no fun
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  6. #156
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    Originally Posted by nezaboy View Post
    Alright so since switching from low bar to high bar squat I obviously had to drop weight. This means I’m currently benching more than I squat. So that I’m not wasting time on this ive recorded it today to check my form. I’m keen to push my squat weight up as quickly as possible. At 62 kg this currently feels very heavy. Thoughts?

    https://streamable.com/kbu5mz
    Bro, that rack thing looks super dangerous. Hopefully soon you can get some better equipment. I hope you’re not benching under that thing. You do not want that weight dropping on your jaw / head. Be careful and happy gains
    **^^ Work hard AND more importantly, work smart ^^**
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  7. #157
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    I know! To be fair it’s quite solid. It’s temporary until the gym opens up.
    Originally Posted by TryingBB View Post
    Bro, that rack thing looks super dangerous. Hopefully soon you can get some better equipment. I hope you’re not benching under that thing. You do not want that weight dropping on your jaw / head. Be careful and happy gains
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  8. #158
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by nezaboy View Post
    Alright so since switching from low bar to high bar squat I obviously had to drop weight. This means I’m currently benching more than I squat. So that I’m not wasting time on this ive recorded it today to check my form. I’m keen to push my squat weight up as quickly as possible. At 62 kg this currently feels very heavy. Thoughts?

    https://streamable.com/kbu5mz
    Form looks good. Kinda dont like the grip. Ive never been a fan of the bent wrist form. If anything you should be pulling down for tightness/bracing. And if you have a bent wrist, there is a chance of some of the weight to be transferring through the wrist vs 100% on the shoulders.
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  9. #159
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    Sorry another. Question I’ve had. What is the purpose of light day? Is it just to keep muscles moving, or is it helping with growth also? I ask this as one thing I miss doing this program is things like push ups and pulls up. Wondered if these could be incorporated into light day instead of row and bench. Or would this be a waste of time? I enjoyed circuit training before I started This program
    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    Form looks good. Kinda dont like the grip. Ive never been a fan of the bent wrist form. If anything you should be pulling down for tightness/bracing. And if you have a bent wrist, there is a chance of some of the weight to be transferring through the wrist vs 100% on the shoulders.
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  10. #160
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by nezaboy View Post
    Sorry another. Question I’ve had. What is the purpose of light day? Is it just to keep muscles moving, or is it helping with growth also? I ask this as one thing I miss doing this program is things like push ups and pulls up. Wondered if these could be incorporated into light day instead of row and bench. Or would this be a waste of time? I enjoyed circuit training before I started This program
    2 Reasons. #1 the joke is "if you can do 3 heavies a week you are not going heavy enough" So a light day allows you to go heavy "er" vs 3 mediums or heavy light medium. #2 is allpro does not have a deload protocal, so its like an active recovery day for your connective tissue, but you still get growth since your muscles are still fatigued from medium and heavy day.


    In terms of GPP or accessories, they can be added at the end of medium or heavy day for an hour or more if you want(or "sports"). I just dont like adding much after light day and before heavy day, since you really need that recovery window.
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  11. #161
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    Hi all,

    On Round 3, Week 3. Just did the hard day of it yesterday evening. Definitely seeing some changes in my body. Rounder legs, Upper body definitely more solid and tighter in sense. Looking way better than probably ever before. Also I don't get as fatigued as I did before and I can push myself way beyond of what I used to. Also recovery seems to be tad bit faster than it used to. Seriously thank you! If I ever were to see you at a bar I wouldn't just buy you a drink, I'd pay for your whole night!

    Anyway, there's still a place where I'm lacking and that is my back (row). It isn't progressing at similar pace to the other (main) lifts. I was thinking of adding few sets of lat pulldowns at the end of each session from here on out? Would that be a stupid idea? I can't do more than like 1-2 pullups and there's really nothing at the small gym I go to that I could use to do pulldowns. Or is there a whole different exercise I could do?

    Thanks!
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  12. #162
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by eemuman View Post
    Hi all,

    On Round 3, Week 3. Just did the hard day of it yesterday evening. Definitely seeing some changes in my body. Rounder legs, Upper body definitely more solid and tighter in sense. Looking way better than probably ever before. Also I don't get as fatigued as I did before and I can push myself way beyond of what I used to. Also recovery seems to be tad bit faster than it used to. Seriously thank you! If I ever were to see you at a bar I wouldn't just buy you a drink, I'd pay for your whole night!

    Anyway, there's still a place where I'm lacking and that is my back (row). It isn't progressing at similar pace to the other (main) lifts. I was thinking of adding few sets of lat pulldowns at the end of each session from here on out? Would that be a stupid idea? I can't do more than like 1-2 pullups and there's really nothing at the small gym I go to that I could use to do pulldowns. Or is there a whole different exercise I could do?

    Thanks!
    Long term most will need lat and side delt work.

    Lat pull downs, krock rows, grease the groove chinups (do 1 chinup, 10-20 times a day). You want some that is the opposite grip of your row. And if its not a form breakdown/lose momentum issue with your row, you want 1 set in the 16-24 rep range. If it is a form break down, or you are dogging the weight just to get your row reps up (not using full force each rep), then you want to do the opposite. 2-3 reps for a few sets. And for heavy work, nothing beats a few eyeball busting pendlays
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  13. #163
    Registered User eemuman's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    Long term most will need lat and side delt work.

    Lat pull downs, krock rows, grease the groove chinups (do 1 chinup, 10-20 times a day). You want some that is the opposite grip of your row. And if its not a form breakdown/lose momentum issue with your row, you want 1 set in the 16-24 rep range. If it is a form break down, or you are dogging the weight just to get your row reps up (not using full force each rep), then you want to do the opposite. 2-3 reps for a few sets. And for heavy work, nothing beats a few eyeball busting pendlays
    Thanks for the advice! My biggest problem with the row is with me running out of steam as the reps go up, so that means I'd do the single set with higher reps correct?

    Don't really have a place on my single room apt to do any pullups at, so I'll stick with the lat pulldowns. Also reverse grip of the row (overhand), so I'll do them with chin up grip correct? Sorry if I'm being stupid, just want to be sure lol
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  14. #164
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by eemuman View Post
    Thanks for the advice! My biggest problem with the row is with me running out of steam as the reps go up, so that means I'd do the single set with higher reps correct?

    Don't really have a place on my single room apt to do any pullups at, so I'll stick with the lat pulldowns. Also reverse grip of the row (overhand), so I'll do them with chin up grip correct? Sorry if I'm being stupid, just want to be sure lol
    Yup if you are runing out of steam you want the accessory to be a higher rep than the main. And yes it just needs to be a different grip vs your main row, it could even be hammer grip.
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  15. #165
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    Hey first of all nightanole, want to thank you for all your help here and staying with this thread so long. Your knowledge is invaluable. I have been running allpro with dumbbells for a few months now not missing any workouts and eating in a deficit (fat loss is my main goal, sidenote down from 222 to 179 so far and definitely have gained muscle!)

    I am curious of a few things: What are signs I need to change routines? Is there a max on my main lifts where I need to move over to a different routine? I've been operating with assumption I can keep this going until about 12% bf but also wondering if there is a time once the weights get so heavy I should switch from 3x a week full body.

    What are some accessories I can add, and when should I? For reference, I started with:

    27.5 lbs in each hand for bench - Now using 42.5 in 9 rep week
    27.5dumbbell for goblet squat - Now also 42.5
    50 lbs row (I use either an ez bar for row, or there is a station at my gym with a barbell in a corner, you lift one end up and using a sort of v shape grip thing) now to 70lbs. I have also used dumbbells occasionally where I just take the total weight in half for each side (70 lbs= 35 lb dumbbell each side). Is that reasonable?
    Shoulder press- 22.5 each hand to now 27.5 each hand. I do arnold press here, I failed last press, but feeling faiely strong this go around
    Deadlift- started 22.5 lb dumbell each hand, now using 32.5
    curl - started 15lbs in each hand, now on 20s, I believe I had one fail on my 2nd cycle.

    After my heavy and medium, I generally do AMRAP weight assisted pull ups. I've progressed on this as well, started need 60lbs offset doing about 5, got up to 10/11 reps, so now only using 50lbs getting about 7 reps.

    I also finish my workout with grip work as I've read here dumbbells aren't the best for this and grip will become limiting factor eventually. Trying to avoid that as long as possible, I have no spotter, dumbbells are much easier to push myself on safely.

    I'm getting good results and don't think I need to change much right now, just curious as I move forward on what I could add, when I should, etc. For more info, I also do cardio almost always at least 1 a week 20-30 min LISS, and sometimes 2 depending on general energy level. I know I can go up more on deadlift and squat, but I've had hip issues running this program before with a barbell (years ago) so I wanted to start low on squat and avoid the barbell, I don't get the general ache from goblets on my hip like I do for squat. Deadlifts same thing, I would get weird almost hernia esque feeling starting too heavy, wanted to start low and build up. I'm in no rush to get to big numbers and I'm cutting, so I figured I can start low and eventually I'll keep passing those while having a fail here and there for other lifts. Is that a reasonable way to view this? I figured in the lifts I started lower I will just keep progressing when I may fail others like press, and after 6-8 months total of running this routine I should have enough info to know if I truly have a lagging area of not.

    Also, I've been eating right and doing basic calisthenics since March shutdown, I was 222 at that point, I haven't gone from 222 to 179 in the roughly 3ish months I've been on allpro, I couldn't handle that type of deficit lol.

    Appreciate your thoughts here! Thank you! For anyone reading my comment and thinking of starting or not, it has been working well for me!
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  16. #166
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by RageRoolz View Post
    Hey first of all nightanole, want to thank you for all your help here and staying with this thread so long. Your knowledge is invaluable. I have been running allpro with dumbbells for a few months now not missing any workouts and eating in a deficit (fat loss is my main goal, sidenote down from 222 to 179 so far and definitely have gained muscle!)

    I am curious of a few things: What are signs I need to change routines? Is there a max on my main lifts where I need to move over to a different routine? I've been operating with assumption I can keep this going until about 12% bf but also wondering if there is a time once the weights get so heavy I should switch from 3x a week full body.

    What are some accessories I can add, and when should I? For reference, I started with:

    27.5 lbs in each hand for bench - Now using 42.5 in 9 rep week
    27.5dumbbell for goblet squat - Now also 42.5
    50 lbs row (I use either an ez bar for row, or there is a station at my gym with a barbell in a corner, you lift one end up and using a sort of v shape grip thing) now to 70lbs. I have also used dumbbells occasionally where I just take the total weight in half for each side (70 lbs= 35 lb dumbbell each side). Is that reasonable?
    Shoulder press- 22.5 each hand to now 27.5 each hand. I do arnold press here, I failed last press, but feeling faiely strong this go around
    Deadlift- started 22.5 lb dumbell each hand, now using 32.5
    curl - started 15lbs in each hand, now on 20s, I believe I had one fail on my 2nd cycle.

    After my heavy and medium, I generally do AMRAP weight assisted pull ups. I've progressed on this as well, started need 60lbs offset doing about 5, got up to 10/11 reps, so now only using 50lbs getting about 7 reps.

    I also finish my workout with grip work as I've read here dumbbells aren't the best for this and grip will become limiting factor eventually. Trying to avoid that as long as possible, I have no spotter, dumbbells are much easier to push myself on safely.

    I'm getting good results and don't think I need to change much right now, just curious as I move forward on what I could add, when I should, etc. For more info, I also do cardio almost always at least 1 a week 20-30 min LISS, and sometimes 2 depending on general energy level. I know I can go up more on deadlift and squat, but I've had hip issues running this program before with a barbell (years ago) so I wanted to start low on squat and avoid the barbell, I don't get the general ache from goblets on my hip like I do for squat. Deadlifts same thing, I would get weird almost hernia esque feeling starting too heavy, wanted to start low and build up. I'm in no rush to get to big numbers and I'm cutting, so I figured I can start low and eventually I'll keep passing those while having a fail here and there for other lifts. Is that a reasonable way to view this? I figured in the lifts I started lower I will just keep progressing when I may fail others like press, and after 6-8 months total of running this routine I should have enough info to know if I truly have a lagging area of not.

    Also, I've been eating right and doing basic calisthenics since March shutdown, I was 222 at that point, I haven't gone from 222 to 179 in the roughly 3ish months I've been on allpro, I couldn't handle that type of deficit lol.

    Appreciate your thoughts here! Thank you! For anyone reading my comment and thinking of starting or not, it has been working well for me!
    I updated the faq for this thread;

    Q15: The starting diet
    A:
    Your first goal is to get to 13% as quickly as manageable.
    Your end goal is BMI 24 while at 13% body fat. This normally is around the 9-12 month mark. This is normally achieved by cutting to bmi 22-23, and then slow bulking till bmi 25(to reach graduation lifting stats), followed by a 1-2 cycle cut.

    Q10: How do you know when you have "graduated" ALLPRO?
    A: 10 reps of BW bench
    10 reps of 1.25x-1.5x BW squats


    But pretty much everything you just asked is now in the new FAQ that i updated after 10 years

    If you still needs some assistance, or to help others on what to look forward too, post again.
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  17. #167
    Registered User RageRoolz's Avatar
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    Thank you for the reply! Should have been more clear! I was curious if the numbers are the same for dumbbell or not. I've heard dumbbells are harder, wasn't sure if that translated to the "graduation" or if I should just bank on the same stats as if I was doing this all with barbell and just understand it may take a little longer/ be a little more difficult?

    Also, when should I add more additional work? I don't feel anything lagging and don't want to over do it and compromise my progression, but I feel I have a little more in the tank sometimes and curious when it is appropriate to add more, or if I should just stay the course until I start failing heavy day 12 reps and then consider what else I need. Basically, should I be proactive to work on known areas not really hit great from this routine, or be reactive with additional work once my body starts sending me signals via my results in the gym.

    I don't want to mess up the routine of the progression I've experienced, but as I get in better shape I have more stamina and wonder if doing more would help. Thanks again!
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  18. #168
    Registered User nightanole's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by RageRoolz View Post
    Thank you for the reply! Should have been more clear! I was curious if the numbers are the same for dumbbell or not. I've heard dumbbells are harder, wasn't sure if that translated to the "graduation" or if I should just bank on the same stats as if I was doing this all with barbell and just understand it may take a little longer/ be a little more difficult?

    Also, when should I add more additional work? I don't feel anything lagging and don't want to over do it and compromise my progression, but I feel I have a little more in the tank sometimes and curious when it is appropriate to add more, or if I should just stay the course until I start failing heavy day 12 reps and then consider what else I need. Basically, should I be proactive to work on known areas not really hit great from this routine, or be reactive with additional work once my body starts sending me signals via my results in the gym.

    I don't want to mess up the routine of the progression I've experienced, but as I get in better shape I have more stamina and wonder if doing more would help. Thanks again!
    DB will be 5-10% harder depending on the lift and sub(squat will be 10%, while doing the arnold press vs OHP might be zero).
    If you are not lagging, but still want to do some things, you can do some GPP work directly after the workout, such as hill sprints or farmer carries, burpees etc. If you want to do zero work, you can aways just reduce rest time on days you feel fresh, this will add more "quality" reps to the second set, which will promote a bit more growth. 90 seconds is the max, but some reduce this down to 30 seconds on 8 rep light day.

    But generally n00bs will start to lag in some of these;grip, lats, or cosmetic side delts. So just keep an eye on those areas.
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    DB will be 5-10% harder depending on the lift and sub(squat will be 10%, while doing the arnold press vs OHP might be zero).
    If you are not lagging, but still want to do some things, you can do some GPP work directly after the workout, such as hill sprints or farmer carries, burpees etc. If you want to do zero work, you can aways just reduce rest time on days you feel fresh, this will add more "quality" reps to the second set, which will promote a bit more growth. 90 seconds is the max, but some reduce this down to 30 seconds on 8 rep light day.

    But generally n00bs will start to lag in some of these;grip, lats, or cosmetic side delts. So just keep an eye on those areas.
    Thank you for the informative response! I has my 9 rep medium day this morning and focused on cutting my rest time. Felt strong today, excited to keep it going. It's weird, this is the first time in my life I actually go to bed looking forward to waking up to hit the gym in the morning haha.
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  20. #170
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    Hello Night...thanks for all your work here, it's hugely beneficial. I'm in the category of working out for 10 years but still a newb because I'm not in spec...I"m in my second cycle and if I don't fail any cycles I should be there in about 2 to 3 more. Anyways, a few questions:

    1. You said, eat this diet until you know how to feed yourself, what do you mean? I'm struggling with getting 200 or more carbs and keeping my protein that low...I'm getting more like 140 protein and 165 carbs...is this ok or do I have to get to the 100/200...getting my protein that low is very difficult for me.

    2. for abs....you said to add abs starting with second cycle, but only if you're not fatigued...what do you define as fatigued?

    Thanks for your help!
    Last edited by mrmoneymatters; 01-13-2021 at 11:01 PM.
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  21. #171
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    Originally Posted by mrmoneymatters View Post
    Hello Night...thanks for all your work here, it's hugely beneficial. I'm in the category of working out for 10 years but still a newb because I'm not in spec...I"m in my second cycle and if I don't fail any cycles I should be there in about 2 to 3 more. Anyways, a few questions:

    1. You said, eat this diet until you know how to feed yourself, what do you mean? I'm struggling with getting 200 or more carbs and keeping my protein that low...I'm getting more like 140 protein and 165 carbs...is this ok or do I have to get to the 100/200...getting my protein that low is very difficult for me.

    2. for abs....you said to add abs starting with second cycle, but only if you're not fatigued...what do you define as fatigued?

    Thanks for your help!
    SIMPLE BEGINNERS ROUTINE

    I assume you just learned the difference between a rep and a set a week ago.


    The beginner diet is the min, not the max. Maybe i didnt put that line in... But anyway that is the min diet to "perform", you can always go higher. Once you have say 20lbs of extra lean mass, you can cut at 4000 cals, and it will be impossible to get much less than 200g of protein with whole foods

    You can do abs if you got some miles under your belt, again written for someone who just got off the couch. Start off with doing them directly after the workout since that affects recovery the least. If you want to do "an abs routine" on off days, wait at least 1 cycle. It takes about 6-8 weeks to adapt to a major change in a routine, and i dont want a beginner to be learning/perfecting the squat with a fatigued core.
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  22. #172
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    SIMPLE BEGINNERS ROUTINE

    I assume you just learned the difference between a rep and a set a week ago.


    The beginner diet is the min, not the max. Maybe i didnt put that line in... But anyway that is the min diet to "perform", you can always go higher. Once you have say 20lbs of extra lean mass, you can cut at 4000 cals, and it will be impossible to get much less than 200g of protein with whole foods

    You can do abs if you got some miles under your belt, again written for someone who just got off the couch. Start off with doing them directly after the workout since that affects recovery the least. If you want to do "an abs routine" on off days, wait at least 1 cycle. It takes about 6-8 weeks to adapt to a major change in a routine, and i dont want a beginner to be learning/perfecting the squat with a fatigued core.

    ok thanks....No, I didn't just learn the difference...I've actually got some decent muscle development, done numerous programs, but I just never took the time to develop strength and always felt a little weak so your post on this was timely in pointing out I was correct. I'm currently sitting at 5'10 and 194 at 16.5%BF. My goal is to get into spec for each lift, but really get my BF down to 10%, I'll take the 13% you guided us toward.

    As for the diet, you mentioned we can't recomp, but we can lose body fat while going up in our lifts? We can be in a calorie deficit but only get 100 grams of protein without losing muscle, is this because we are leveraging the 100 grams of fat? I'm not questioning you...just trying to learn.

    As for the abs...makes sense...thanks for the feedback!
    Last edited by mrmoneymatters; 01-14-2021 at 08:27 AM.
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  23. #173
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    Originally Posted by mrmoneymatters View Post
    ok thanks....No, I didn't just learn the difference...I've actually got some decent muscle development, done numerous programs, but I just never took the time to develop strength and always felt a little weak so your post on this was timely in pointing out I was correct. I'm currently sitting at 5'10 and 194 at 16.5%BF. My goal is to get into spec for each lift, but really get my BF down to 10%, I'll take the 13% you guided us toward.

    As for the abs...makes sense...thanks for the feedback!
    Well lets crunch some numbers...

    You are currently 163 LBS of lean mass and 31lbs of fat.

    Your goal on this program is 167lbs (bmi 24) while at 13% BF (22lbs of fat).


    So your years of working out have not been in vain. The question is how much lean mass you will lose trying to drop about 10 pounds. This is normally 3-4 lbs of fat per pound of muscle, either bulking or cutting.


    The last question would be are you really 16%, or are more like 22-24%. 16% is pretty lean, considering power lifters/mma/football players hover around 18% for peak performance.

    If you rerun your numbers for 23%, you are looking at 150lbs of lean mass and 44lbs of fat. This seems more in line, in which case you may be able to cut that fat level in half without loosing much muscle, and would put you more in line with "most" beginners after a year of good training.
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  24. #174
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    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    Well lets crunch some numbers...

    You are currently 163 LBS of lean mass and 31lbs of fat.

    Your goal on this program is 167lbs (bmi 24) while at 13% BF (22lbs of fat).


    So your years of working out have not been in vain. The question is how much lean mass you will lose trying to drop about 10 pounds. This is normally 3-4 lbs of fat per pound of muscle, either bulking or cutting.


    The last question would be are you really 16%, or are more like 22-24%. 16% is pretty lean, considering power lifters/mma/football players hover around 18% for peak performance.

    If you rerun your numbers for 23%, you are looking at 150lbs of lean mass and 44lbs of fat. This seems more in line, in which case you may be able to cut that fat level in half without loosing much muscle, and would put you more in line with "most" beginners after a year of good training.
    I do believe I'm at 16. I started last year at 22%...I track with both my scale that shoes BF percentage and calipers..which I know both aren't perfect, but I've seen BF numbers go down on both and my strength hasn't suffered at all. Plus, I also track body measurements monthly and have lost inches where I carry most of my fat, upper/lower waist, hips, etc.... I've seen some definition starting to come in nicely in shoulders, back, legs, and even a little in chest . If I'm really at 22%, damn I don't need that kick in the balls ;-)

    Actually, after reading your message again, the scale says I'm 16.5% BF, but 155ish on LBM....
    Last edited by mrmoneymatters; 01-14-2021 at 09:55 AM.
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    Hi Night. Wondered your thoughts on this. I tend to weigh myself each month as well as at the end of the cycle. Today is my weigh day, and this is my 3rd bulk month. This month I gained 2kg. 1kg planned obviously but also 1kg we can blame on Christmas! My plan was to keep bulking to end of March before going on a cut in April and may for summer. Looking at this photo comparing last month and this month I can certainly see fat gain. Have I taken it too far and need a cut month now? Or am I just worrying to much and should bulk through tro March like planned

    https://ibb.co/yqwPqpH

    Originally Posted by mrmoneymatters View Post
    I do believe I'm at 16. I started last year at 22%...I track with both my scale that shoes BF percentage and calipers..which I know both aren't perfect, but I've seen BF numbers go down on both and my strength hasn't suffered at all. Plus, I also track body measurements monthly and have lost inches where I carry most of my fat, upper/lower waist, hips, etc.... I've seen some definition starting to come in nicely in shoulders, back, legs, and even a little in chest . If I'm really at 22%, damn I don't need that kick in the balls ;-)

    Actually, after reading your message again, the scale says I'm 16.5% BF, but 155ish on LBM....
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    Originally Posted by nezaboy View Post
    Hi Night. Wondered your thoughts on this. I tend to weigh myself each month as well as at the end of the cycle. Today is my weigh day, and this is my 3rd bulk month. This month I gained 2kg. 1kg planned obviously but also 1kg we can blame on Christmas! My plan was to keep bulking to end of March before going on a cut in April and may for summer. Looking at this photo comparing last month and this month I can certainly see fat gain. Have I taken it too far and need a cut month now? Or am I just worrying to much and should bulk through tro March like planned

    https://ibb.co/yqwPqpH
    "six to eight weeks away from abs" Is the rule of thumb. I tell people to bulk till "flexed abs, smooth when relaxed". So you still have plenty of core definition so id say you can still bulk for quite a while. Most people just mess it up by trying to "micro bulk" and think they can bulk for 2-3 weeks, and then cut a week, repeat, or try to bulk every other cycle. Id say a min bulk would be 90 days.

    Also on a bulk you will be carrying several kg of water weight just due to the offset of carbs. As soon as you drop the carbs 50-100g, you will drop several kg of water weight and end up with more "shrink wrapped" skin instead of puffy.

    Plus losing 4kg of fat makes you look like you gained 8kg of muscle in pictures
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    Ok good. So I’m just being a fanny
    Originally Posted by nightanole View Post
    "six to eight weeks away from abs" Is the rule of thumb. I tell people to bulk till "flexed abs, smooth when relaxed". So you still have plenty of core definition so id say you can still bulk for quite a while. Most people just mess it up by trying to "micro bulk" and think they can bulk for 2-3 weeks, and then cut a week, repeat, or try to bulk every other cycle. Id say a min bulk would be 90 days.

    Also on a bulk you will be carrying several kg of water weight just due to the offset of carbs. As soon as you drop the carbs 50-100g, you will drop several kg of water weight and end up with more "shrink wrapped" skin instead of puffy.

    Plus losing 4kg of fat makes you look like you gained 8kg of muscle in pictures
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    Originally Posted by nezaboy View Post
    Oh god it sounds like the women’s work outs for me then! Ceilings won’t allow a jump rope and short on space inside here. I have no bike and rarely sit at a desk, I’m on my feet a lot.

    I’m asking because I’m on week 2 and 9 reps feels hard. I’m eating enough and well, I’m sleeping great too. So I’m guessing it’s a lack of moving on non training days.z. My running has suffered a lot recently. English winters are no fun
    Maybe the starting weight is too hard? For me the first set of 5 weeks was ok, next set jumping 10% was brutal and I wound up dropping some of the weight to between 4-10%. For example shoulder press was 4% 115 to 120lbs and bench was ~6% 175 to 185. I'd rather be able to get to the 11 week than fail on 9, 10, 11 and 12. I'm 50 years old so maybe that has something to do with it as well. I usually take one extra day rest after light day to get rested for heavy+1rep day as well.
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    So I understand this right. Could this program boil down to 6 days per week then? 3 days per week lifting on non consecutive days, as well as "The recomended cardio is 3x 10k jogs per week." while also being on non consecutive days?
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  30. #180
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    Originally Posted by Streetjudas View Post
    So I understand this right. Could this program boil down to 6 days per week then? 3 days per week lifting on non consecutive days, as well as "The recomended cardio is 3x 10k jogs per week." while also being on non consecutive days?
    If you have recovery issues, do accessories and cardio directly after the workout, so you are not "robbing" recovery. If you want to put a lot of effort into the accessories(personal goals, sports, armed forces PT test) and cardio, yes you can do the 6 days with accessories/cardio on off days.
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