AllPro: A Simple Beginner's Routine part VII

[nightanole]

hi

So last week I did the two workouts at reload (50% off heavy day) and everything else the same

I went to do my first workout this week heavy day at 11 reps. I got to squat, did 11 reps with both sets although very hard.. then bench I got 11, then 7. I always rest 90s on heavy day. I could not continue after bench. I felt so out of it and beat up after the squats and bench. Before I was sick the 10 rep heavy day was also very hard although I got through it

I have been eating some days at a deficit, some days at maintenance. I'm at a all time low bw at 139-140. What should I do? I don't think I could continue this program

Again you might not be able to cut much further, and its time to bulk. You cant just cut to 10%, and expect to stay at 10% continuously, it is extremely hard for even actors with nutritionists to do. At best you could sustain it in your very early 20's when you are technically still growing.

You are going to have to gain weight to progress on any program. Once you gain say 2-3kg, you can then cut 1kg and repeat. But the majority of the time you should be in surplus are you are going to perform like crap.

For all i know you are WAY too low, and your cold, is the same one that "fasters" get towards the end, with the constant runny noise etc.


The next pattern to try is the greyskull LP pattern.

Its not too different:

2 submaximal sets of 5 reps with a minimum 3 minute rests. followed by an AMRAP set. This third set, sets the progression. If you get at least 5 reps, you add 2.5lbs next session. If you get over 10 reps, you add 5lbs next session. If you get less than 5 reps on the third set you deload 10% next session, which should cause the third set to shoot up to 7-10 reps again. Deloads you play by ear, and is the standard 50% for a week.

[STT816]

Again you might not be able to cut much further, and its time to bulk. You cant just cut to 10%, and expect to stay at 10% continuously, it is extremely hard for even actors with nutritionists to do. At best you could sustain it in your very early 20's when you are technically still growing.

You are going to have to gain weight to progress on any program. Once you gain say 2-3kg, you can then cut 1kg and repeat. But the majority of the time you should be in surplus are you are going to perform like crap.

For all i know you are WAY too low, and your cold, is the same one that "fasters" get towards the end, with the constant runny noise etc.


The next pattern to try is the greyskull LP pattern.

Its not too different:

2 submaximal sets of 5 reps with a minimum 3 minute rests. followed by an AMRAP set. This third set, sets the progression. If you get at least 5 reps, you add 2.5lbs next session. If you get over 10 reps, you add 5lbs next session. If you get less than 5 reps on the third set you deload 10% next session, which should cause the third set to shoot up to 7-10 reps again. Deloads you play by ear, and is the standard 50% for a week.

It was strep throat and I get them frequently for whatever reason so I know it’s not directly from cutting.

So you think even a maintenance calories wouldn’t suffice?

It’s just that I like how my body looks now and wouldn’t wanna gain much weight

[nightanole]

It was strep throat and I get them frequently for whatever reason so I know it’s not directly from cutting.

So you think even a maintenance calories wouldn’t suffice?

It’s just that I like how my body looks now and wouldn’t wanna gain much weight

I am not a nutritionist. You are going to have to find a feeding pattern to sustain your weight and fat levels, and your performance. Right now your maintenance is not enough to perform on. And over a long enough timeline, low performance will lead to muscle loss. You are going to have to look into some "offseason" bodybuilder diets. They would keep the person 6-8 weeks away from show ready, and should be sustainable all year around.

For all i know that could be as simple as carb timing to offset 2-3lbs of water/fat weight to keep you from being "fluffy" and keep that skin shrink wrapped look you are going for.

[STT816]

I am not a nutritionist. You are going to have to find a feeding pattern to sustain your weight and fat levels, and your performance. Right now your maintenance is not enough to perform on. And over a long enough timeline, low performance will lead to muscle loss. You are going to have to look into some "offseason" bodybuilder diets. They would keep the person 6-8 weeks away from show ready, and should be sustainable all year around.

For all i know that could be as simple as carb timing to offset 2-3lbs of water/fat weight to keep you from being "fluffy" and keep that skin shrink wrapped look you are going for.

Ok so I bumped up to 2550 calories and that’s going to be mostly a carb increase.

What do you think I should do program wise? I definitely could do medium day for 11 reps on Sunday but I’m not sure how I’ll be for next weeks 12 rep heavy day…then what to do after?

You’ve been very helpful through all of this thank you

[nightanole]

Ok so I bumped up to 2550 calories and that’s going to be mostly a carb increase.

What do you think I should do program wise? I definitely could do medium day for 11 reps on Sunday but I’m not sure how I’ll be for next weeks 12 rep heavy day…then what to do after?

You’ve been very helpful through all of this thank you

Well lets be honest here, you want to maintain your body and eat at maintance. So who cares if you fail to get 12 reps on test day. You will just cycle again with the same working weights. You will just spend 5 weeks again going through the rep ranges. Allpro could maintain you for life, and you may even progress every 2-3 cycles for a good while. It would be healthier(since you would be auto deloading every 5 weeks) to just use normal allpro and fail every cycle on 11-12 rep weeks, vs doing a "to failure" program till you need to deload, and repeat.

[STT816]

Well lets be honest here, you want to maintain your body and eat at maintance. So who cares if you fail to get 12 reps on test day. You will just cycle again with the same working weights. You will just spend 5 weeks again going through the rep ranges. Allpro could maintain you for life, and you may even progress every 2-3 cycles for a good while. It would be healthier(since you would be auto deloading every 5 weeks) to just use normal allpro and fail every cycle on 11-12 rep weeks, vs doing a "to failure" program till you need to deload, and repeat.

Thanks

This is day 4 or so on 2550 calories which should be around +10% surplus, but it's like that sick week set me back by a lot, not sure what happened there. I just did medium day at 11 reps and missed the 2nd set of OVHP and was too wiped to do the 2nd set of sldl, I did do the 2 sets of curls though..

Is it possible that this program is "too novice" for me at this point? I did get a lot out of this program and just wondering if I'm stalling on my linear gains regardless of calories/bodyweight. Just thinking maybe I should be switching to a intermediate program.

Not only am I failing to get reps but I'm becoming extremely exhausted during the workout and everything just "feels heavy"

[nightanole]

Thanks

This is day 4 or so on 2550 calories which should be around +10% surplus, but it's like that sick week set me back by a lot, not sure what happened there. I just did medium day at 11 reps and missed the 2nd set of OVHP and was too wiped to do the 2nd set of sldl, I did do the 2 sets of curls though..

Is it possible that this program is "too novice" for me at this point? I did get a lot out of this program and just wondering if I'm stalling on my linear gains regardless of calories/bodyweight. Just thinking maybe I should be switching to a intermediate program.

Not only am I failing to get reps but I'm becoming extremely exhausted during the workout and everything just "feels heavy"

A program is "too novice" when progression becomes too fast, and volume becomes too low to push progression.

On allpro its kinda a hard stop. You will do a 10% bump at some point in time, and just fail to get in 11-12 reps for 2-3 cycles+. And 3 cycles is over half the program for lifters with "some experience" that are not overweight.


Novice programs have your working at or near failure for only a few sets. The novice is neither capable of over taxing themselves, nor do they have much work capacity. You can beat the crap out of them, and do it again in a few days with even more weight. Add another set and they just die however.

The joke for advanced lifters is, if you put them on Stronglifts 5x5 with 80-85% of their 1rm, they will be in the hospital in 1-2 weeks, even if you never added weight to the bar.


"intermediate routines" will have "multiple sub maximal sets" followed by maybe 1 AMRAP set, and then finishing the session with "volume work" with normally 1-2 joint 15-40 rep sets. novices will think "these working weights are way too low" but will go white in the face looking at the session volume.


If you want to do some reading, check out greyskullLP and 5/3/1 with the BBB lifts on alternate days. These are "early intermediate" variants that can be ran for 2-3 years. You can even search for the allpro intermediate program, its a rotational(6-8 weeks) program of 3-4 core sessions.

[STT816]

A program is "too novice" when progression becomes too fast, and volume becomes too low to push progression.

On allpro its kinda a hard stop. You will do a 10% bump at some point in time, and just fail to get in 11-12 reps for 2-3 cycles+. And 3 cycles is over half the program for lifters with "some experience" that are not overweight.


Novice programs have your working at or near failure for only a few sets. The novice is neither capable of over taxing themselves, nor do they have much work capacity. You can beat the crap out of them, and do it again in a few days with even more weight. Add another set and they just die however.

The joke for advanced lifters is, if you put them on Stronglifts 5x5 with 80-85% of their 1rm, they will be in the hospital in 1-2 weeks, even if you never added weight to the bar.


"intermediate routines" will have "multiple sub maximal sets" followed by maybe 1 AMRAP set, and then finishing the session with "volume work" with normally 1-2 joint 15-40 rep sets. novices will think "these working weights are way too low" but will go white in the face looking at the session volume.


If you want to do some reading, check out greyskullLP and 5/3/1 with the BBB lifts on alternate days. These are "early intermediate" variants that can be ran for 2-3 years. You can even search for the allpro intermediate program, its a rotational(6-8 weeks) program of 3-4 core sessions.

thanks so I did more researching about where I stand with my lifts.

https://symmetricstrength.com/standards#/140/lb/male/30

I used the above site and did 10 rep maxes and compared it with my recent 11 reps I just did. I used a rep max calculator to make the 11 reps into 10 reps. Mind you the "actual" wouldn't even be true rep maxes because I could have done at least a couple more/did another set....Here are the results:

Squat—intermediate—167.5x10…Actual 192x10
Bench—intermediate—125x10….Actual 146x10
Row—intermediate—115x10….Actual 133x10
OVHP—intermediate—80x10…Actual 77x10
RDL—intermediate—165x10…Actual 182x10


I feel like this would explain why I'm failing out.

I'm still feeling very tired and out of it and I feel like its from my body not being able to recover, so I do think I need to switch to a percentage based intermediate routine like you said above..I was looking into some 2 day a week routines. 531 has one as well.

Even though I just took a deload last week do you think I should just jump into another program this week or deload again given how I'm feeling? I just want to be careful because like my doctor was saying don't push too hard. I felt like I had a good balance of feeling good and lifting hard up until a few weeks ago. Like I said as well I bumped up my calories to 2550 which should be around 10% surplus so maybe that'll help my body recover too..

Do you think me being tired and out of it makes sense given the numbers above as well?

Thanks

[nightanole]

thanks so I did more researching about where I stand with my lifts.

https://symmetricstrength.com/standards#/140/lb/male/30

I used the above site and did 10 rep maxes and compared it with my recent 11 reps I just did. I used a rep max calculator to make the 11 reps into 10 reps. Mind you the "actual" wouldn't even be true rep maxes because I could have done at least a couple more/did another set....Here are the results:

Squat—intermediate—167.5x10…Actual 192x10
Bench—intermediate—125x10….Actual 146x10
Row—intermediate—115x10….Actual 133x10
OVHP—intermediate—80x10…Actual 77x10
RDL—intermediate—165x10…Actual 182x10


I feel like this would explain why I'm failing out.

I'm still feeling very tired and out of it and I feel like its from my body not being able to recover, so I do think I need to switch to a percentage based intermediate routine like you said above..I was looking into some 2 day a week routines. 531 has one as well.

Even though I just took a deload last week do you think I should just jump into another program this week or deload again given how I'm feeling? I just want to be careful because like my doctor was saying don't push too hard. I felt like I had a good balance of feeling good and lifting hard up until a few weeks ago. Like I said as well I bumped up my calories to 2550 which should be around 10% surplus so maybe that'll help my body recover too..

Do you think me being tired and out of it makes sense given the numbers above as well?

Thanks

Tired and out of it may be because you are working at or close to failure, and being an intermediate. The closer you get to failure the more it robs recovery and fries your CNS.

While you are shopping for a program, you still have to do at least one peak set per week. So this could be as simple as 1 AMRAP set per exercise per week, with a weight you can lift 7-10 reps.

You could break up the session into two days, just match the exercises:

Squat+SLDL
Bench+OHP
Row+curl variant

You could fill in the rest of the sessions with GPP work such as farmer walks, hanging leg raises, hill sprints, chinup program. There are plenty of "military fitness test" prep programs you could run. Basically just "stuff" that is sustainable for several minutes at a time. Even HIIT sessions.

[Diddii]

Currently on 3rd cycle and heavy days are getting really hard. Is it possible to do heavy squats on one day and heavy bench the other day. I'm absolutly crused getting into heavy bench after finishing squatting.
My idea was
day1: Heavy legs, medium pull exercises, light push exercises
day2: light legs, heavy pull exercises, medium push exercises
day3: medium legs, light pull, heavy push exercises

[nightanole]

Currently on 3rd cycle and heavy days are getting really hard. Is it possible to do heavy squats on one day and heavy bench the other day. I'm absolutly crused getting into heavy bench after finishing squatting.
My idea was
day1: Heavy legs, medium pull exercises, light push exercises
day2: light legs, heavy pull exercises, medium push exercises
day3: medium legs, light pull, heavy push exercises

Nope, you just turned it into "same effort every session".

What you can do is rearrange the exercises and add rest time between exercises. Squat/bench/row need to be done first in no particular order, followed by the rest in no particular order. Its only arranged in OP so that you can get the program done in less than an hour. Feel free to add unlimited time between exercises, plenty of the 40+ crowd spend 10min sitting on the bench after squats, and even after bench.

[Diddii]

Nope, you just turned it into "same effort every session".

What you can do is rearrange the exercises and add rest time between exercises. Squat/bench/row need to be done first in no particular order, followed by the rest in no particular order. Its only arranged in OP so that you can get the program done in less than an hour. Feel free to add unlimited time between exercises, plenty of the 40+ crowd spend 10min sitting on the bench after squats, and even after bench.

Thanks, that makes sense. I'll try and change the order.

[Diddii]

Nope, you just turned it into "same effort every session".

What you can do is rearrange the exercises and add rest time between exercises. Squat/bench/row need to be done first in no particular order, followed by the rest in no particular order. Its only arranged in OP so that you can get the program done in less than an hour. Feel free to add unlimited time between exercises, plenty of the 40+ crowd spend 10min sitting on the bench after squats, and even after bench.

Another question. It's said to workout on non-consecutive days of the week. Starting with heavy - medium - light. Your medium days may seem hard becauase you just hit hard 48 hours earlier. I typically have the most free time on friday, can get to gym earlier and have more access to each equipment.
Is it ok to workout
Friday = heavy
Monday = medium
Wednesday = light

Or should i try and stick to:
Monday = heavy
Wednesday = medium
Friday = light

[nightanole]

Another question. It's said to workout on non-consecutive days of the week. Starting with heavy - medium - light. Your medium days may seem hard becauase you just hit hard 48 hours earlier. I typically have the most free time on friday, can get to gym earlier and have more access to each equipment.
Is it ok to workout
Friday = heavy
Monday = medium
Wednesday = light

Or should i try and stick to:
Monday = heavy
Wednesday = medium
Friday = light

The only rule is no lifting for 72 hours before any heavy. Plenty of people have their heavy day on the weekend.

[killakam99]

Hi GM nightanole!

Ive been away from lifting for almost 2 years and wanted to start back.
I tested my weights today, and figured out my 10 rep max.

As far as diet goes, I had a few questions. Im 140lb 5'8" and probably 20%+ bf roughly speaking.
My maintenance TDEE is 2400calories.
Should I keep eating in slight surplus or cut to bring bf down first?

[nightanole]

Hi GM nightanole!

Ive been away from lifting for almost 2 years and wanted to start back.
I tested my weights today, and figured out my 10 rep max.

As far as diet goes, I had a few questions. Im 140lb 5'8" and probably 20%+ bf roughly speaking.
My maintenance TDEE is 2400calories.
Should I keep eating in slight surplus or cut to bring bf down first?

Primary goal is always to get to 13% reasonably fast while learning the lifts, then switch to a slight surplus.


140lb 5'8" and probably 20%+ bf
YOUR LEAN BODY MASS: 112 LBS
YOUR BODY FAT: 28 LBS

Your goal:
157lbs
YOUR LEAN BODY MASS: 136.6 LBS
YOUR BODY FAT: 20 LBS

[killakam99]

Primary goal is always to get to 13% reasonably fast while learning the lifts, then switch to a slight surplus.


140lb 5'8" and probably 20%+ bf
YOUR LEAN BODY MASS: 112 LBS
YOUR BODY FAT: 28 LBS

Your goal:
157lbs
YOUR LEAN BODY MASS: 136.6 LBS
YOUR BODY FAT: 20 LBS

Thanks for responding.
Since I'm very familiar with the program, and the lifts, I should be up to speed within the first 2 weeks.

Getting to 13% will take some decent amount of time, and likely require me to cut a decent amount of calories daily.
Would that be the way to go here? Cut calories for a few cycle(s) until 13% is achieved and then start adding surplus.

Are macros something I should worry about besides meeting the daily Protein goals?

[nightanole]

Thanks for responding.
Since I'm very familiar with the program, and the lifts, I should be up to speed within the first 2 weeks.

Getting to 13% will take some decent amount of time, and likely require me to cut a decent amount of calories daily.
Would that be the way to go here? Cut calories for a few cycle(s) until 13% is achieved and then start adding surplus.

Are macros something I should worry about besides meeting the daily Protein goals?

I advise to go up or down at least 1kg in body weight per cycle. It looks like you only need to lose 8lbs of fat in the long run. Im not going to rerun the numbers, but odds are its only 10lbs of fat if you keep the same muscle mass right now. If you did a deep cut, eating just enough to maintain lifts, you would be able to lose about 2kg per cycle. So 2 cycle cut and you are done, then you can start the 1kg per cycle bulk.

At some point you will need to do another 1-2 cycle cut to remove the baby fat, as even gods gift to lifting can only gain 4lbs of muscle for every 1lb of fat. And for most its going to be closer to 2.5-3lbs of muscle per pound of fat gain.


As for macros, i posted a general idea in OP. Generally you can go lower in fat if you can feed yourself properly, but to make it idiot proof i just made it 100g. Other than that, if you are having recovery issues on the cut, up the carbs at the expense of protein. You body has no problem making non essential amino acids out of carbs, but the body does not run well off of trying to convert protein to energy.

[killakam99]

I advise to go up or down at least 1kg in body weight per cycle. It looks like you only need to lose 8lbs of fat in the long run. Im not going to rerun the numbers, but odds are its only 10lbs of fat if you keep the same muscle mass right now. If you did a deep cut, eating just enough to maintain lifts, you would be able to lose about 2kg per cycle. So 2 cycle cut and you are done, then you can start the 1kg per cycle bulk.

At some point you will need to do another 1-2 cycle cut to remove the baby fat, as even gods gift to lifting can only gain 4lbs of muscle for every 1lb of fat. And for most its going to be closer to 2.5-3lbs of muscle per pound of fat gain.


As for macros, i posted a general idea in OP. Generally you can go lower in fat if you can feed yourself properly, but to make it idiot proof i just made it 100g. Other than that, if you are having recovery issues on the cut, up the carbs at the expense of protein. You body has no problem making non essential amino acids out of carbs, but the body does not run well off of trying to convert protein to energy.

I appreciate the response, thank you so much!

[batmanrulz]

It might seem like a dumb question but I was wondering can I do cardio on the off days so it will be cardio 5 days a week and weights 3 days a week?

[nightanole]

It might seem like a dumb question but I was wondering can I do cardio on the off days so it will be cardio 5 days a week and weights 3 days a week?

You can do anything you want any time other that true HIIT, HIIT counts as a lifting session that robs recovery. The optimal is low intensity steady state (LISS) for up to several hours each day. If you are having recovery issues you want to the cardio directly after the workout.

[STT816]

hey nightanole.

I decided on 531 2 day a week. I changed a little bit just to suit me. I was wondering what you thought about rest times. When I did the 30-45s rest times I feel like it was actually beneficial to the aesthetics of my body vs how I used to rest in powerlifting for 3-5 mins between sets....Let me know what you think of the below

Day 1
Squat
Warm-up (I'm going to try and only do one set with the first two compounds like I was doing for allpros, it seemed fine)
Work Set
Work Set
AMRAP Set
-------------
Paused Close Grip Bench Press (I was researching and I heard some coaches say because close grip brings you through more range of motion that it could be superior to medium grip. That it also works the chest just as much)
Warm-up
Work Set
Work Set
AMRAP Set
------------
Barbell Rows (still considering either normal "bodybuilder" type bent over row, vs pendlay row here)
2x8-12
-----------
Barbell Curl
2x8-12





Day 2
Stiff Leg Deadlift (not Romanian like I was doing on allpros)
Warm-up
Work Set
Work Set
AMRAP Set
----------------
Overhead Press
Warm-up
Work Set
Work Set
AMRAP Set
-----------
Chin Ups
2x8-12
----------
Barbell Curls
2x8-12

[nightanole]

hey nightanole.

I decided on 531 2 day a week. I changed a little bit just to suit me. I was wondering what you thought about rest times. When I did the 30-45s rest times I feel like it was actually beneficial to the aesthetics of my body vs how I used to rest in powerlifting for 3-5 mins between sets....Let me know what you think of the below

Day 1
Squat
Warm-up (I'm going to try and only do one set with the first two compounds like I was doing for allpros, it seemed fine)
Work Set
Work Set
AMRAP Set
-------------
Paused Close Grip Bench Press (I was researching and I heard some coaches say because close grip brings you through more range of motion that it could be superior to medium grip. That it also works the chest just as much)
Warm-up
Work Set
Work Set
AMRAP Set
------------
Barbell Rows (still considering either normal "bodybuilder" type bent over row, vs pendlay row here)
2x8-12
-----------
Barbell Curl
2x8-12





Day 2
Stiff Leg Deadlift (not Romanian like I was doing on allpros)
Warm-up
Work Set
Work Set
AMRAP Set
----------------
Overhead Press
Warm-up
Work Set
Work Set
AMRAP Set
-----------
Chin Ups
2x8-12
----------
Barbell Curls
2x8-12

Rest times are based on how close to your 1 rep max you are working with. If you are doing 20 reps, you only need 30-45 seconds of rest. Much longer than that and you end up with "two first sets". On allpro you get more "quality reps" out of the second set due to the short rest. Once you start working in the 3-5 rep range, its better to have 3min+ reps to avoid injury from sloppy reps.

The joke with 5/3/1 and greyskull LP (and even starting strength/stronglifts) is if you are going to miss a rep that session, it should be on the first set, else you rushed the sets by not resting long enough. So you could use that as a judgement on if you are resting long enough. It is ok to feel like you have less reps in the tank on the last set vs the first set, at the same rep count.

Bench is a good choice. yes the wider the grip, the lower the ROM, the more weight you can swing, and the higher the chance of injury. I always recommend "narrow as comfortable" with maybe a few sessions a month with "competition grip" if you are competing or have a football PT test of bench.

Other than that i would mix up the rep ranges on the accessories so its not aways "8-12". Since you are doing squat and dead every week, you may not need "standard row" and can do a back supported row such as kroc, with a 20+ rep range.

Same with your curl variant, since you are already doing a pull in the 8-12 rep range, you dont have to curl in the 8-12 rep range. It is an accessory, so it should be way heavier or way higher rep range than the main. I normally use the curl to "get the pump", since you want the pump at the end of the workout, since once you got it, you are pretty much incapable of doing anything worth while after that.

[STT816]

Rest times are based on how close to your 1 rep max you are working with. If you are doing 20 reps, you only need 30-45 seconds of rest. Much longer than that and you end up with "two first sets". On allpro you get more "quality reps" out of the second set due to the short rest. Once you start working in the 3-5 rep range, its better to have 3min+ reps to avoid injury from sloppy reps.

The joke with 5/3/1 and greyskull LP (and even starting strength/stronglifts) is if you are going to miss a rep that session, it should be on the first set, else you rushed the sets by not resting long enough. So you could use that as a judgement on if you are resting long enough. It is ok to feel like you have less reps in the tank on the last set vs the first set, at the same rep count.

Bench is a good choice. yes the wider the grip, the lower the ROM, the more weight you can swing, and the higher the chance of injury. I always recommend "narrow as comfortable" with maybe a few sessions a month with "competition grip" if you are competing or have a football PT test of bench.

Other than that i would mix up the rep ranges on the accessories so its not aways "8-12". Since you are doing squat and dead every week, you may not need "standard row" and can do a back supported row such as kroc, with a 20+ rep range.

Same with your curl variant, since you are already doing a pull in the 8-12 rep range, you dont have to curl in the 8-12 rep range. It is an accessory, so it should be way heavier or way higher rep range than the main. I normally use the curl to "get the pump", since you want the pump at the end of the workout, since once you got it, you are pretty much incapable of doing anything worth while after that.

so one of the main reasons I added the barbell row/pendlay row is because I work out in my home gym and my dumbbells only go up to 50lbs each. I thought before I outgrow it, it would be better to do something barbell related instead so I can have it in the program for a while and progress with it.

But also, the all pro's program has squat and SLDL in it but also has a barbell row, so I'm confused why you'd say to use a high rep accessory row instead? Basically since I work out only 2x a week, I wanted to make sure I'm getting the most bang for the buck exercises, and I felt like these exercises are it. All of them work full body.


Would you also change the rep range on the chin ups? I was going to keep a rep range for them and start out bodyweight but then add weight when I progress with it.

[nightanole]

so one of the main reasons I added the barbell row/pendlay row is because I work out in my home gym and my dumbbells only go up to 50lbs each. I thought before I outgrow it, it would be better to do something barbell related instead so I can have it in the program for a while and progress with it.

But also, the all pro's program has squat and SLDL in it but also has a barbell row, so I'm confused why you'd say to use a high rep accessory row instead? Basically since I work out only 2x a week, I wanted to make sure I'm getting the most bang for the buck exercises, and I felt like these exercises are it. All of them work full body.


Would you also change the rep range on the chin ups? I was going to keep a rep range for them and start out bodyweight but then add weight when I progress with it.

Beginner routines are designed to "beat the crap out of the back" and have the back be the pace for the program. If your back cant recover, you are doing too much.

Once you transition to intermediate it turns into " how can i deadlift more frequently" or "how can i squat more frequently". By this time you are swinging a large amount of weight. Having basically EVERY exercise hit the lower back, is counter productive.

Pendlay row is a great compromise since you get at least a bit of rest each rep as the weight lays on the ground. If you want to continue doing it, go for it. However if you want to cosmetically hit your back more, then you may want to use a more back friendly pull. You are already doing chinups, which is a very back friendly heavy pull.


As for rep ranges, you want a primary and an accessory. Your chinup i classify as a primary, the accessory would be the curl. So i would have the primary and the accessory at different rep ranges. Normally this is having the primary cause cns fatigue, and the accessory cause metabolic fatigue. So i would not go high rep on the chinup, if anything you may even go low rep with a 45 chained to your waist, and do multiple sets (5 sets) of 3-5 reps vs 2 sets of 8-12.
But the point is to program the row (pendlay/chinup) to cause CNS fatigue. You are shaking a bit at the end, but not "wore out". You should feel like you could easily handle a 50% working weight set after the primary sets. Like wise you want the curl variant to make you feel uneasy about picking up a glass of water afterwards for fear of dropping it.

[Screamingabdabs]

Hey Nightanole,

I’ve been doing a 2 x 4-6 rep full body 3 times a week strength programme for 6 months in which I’ve seen a decent increase in my strength. I have however been feeling pretty beat up lately and fancied getting back into All-Pro’s to try and increase my endurance, stamina and hopefully a little bit of “leaning up” losing this gut I’ve unfortunately put on whilst trying to increase my strength.
My 4 rep maxes were as follows:

Squat 132.5kg
Bench 85kg
Row 100kg
OH Press 55kg

My stats are 5’10”, 88kg, 38yrs old.

Using a 1 rep max calc online I worked out what my 10 rep max would be and used it for my first week of All Pro’s yesterday. I just achieved the 8 reps on all my lift but was thinking at the time I think I’d certainly struggle to achieve 12 reps on week 5?
Would it have been an idea to take a slight “reset & recovery” reduction in the weights? For my first cycle? Say knock 10% off and work my way back up?
Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

[nightanole]

My 4 rep maxes were as follows:

Squat 132.5kg
Bench 85kg
Row 100kg
OH Press 55kg

My stats are 5’10”, 88kg, 38yrs old.
I just achieved the 8 reps on all my lift but was thinking at the time I think I’d certainly struggle to achieve 12 reps on week 5?
Would it have been an idea to take a slight “reset & recovery” reduction in the weights? For my first cycle? Say knock 10% off and work my way back up?
Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

At those strength levels you are only 2-3 cycles away from the program being too fast of progression. So the odds of passing every cycle are pretty low.

I normally tell people to pick a weight that they can guarantee to hit 12 reps on in 5 weeks. However this is for people who have never lifted/out of shape/large amount of fat to drop.

For you id just roll with your current numbers as long as you "think" you can hit 2 sets of 10 in the allpro fatigued state in 3 weeks. Worse case you start missing reps on 11-12 rep weeks and fail, but this is ok if you are "leaning up" because you are still increasing your power to weight ratio.

But if you start too light, and are cutting, that is not a good combo, especially since you are working with a 10 rep max instead of your old 5 rep working weight.

Check back in on 9 rep heavy day, if it feels like you wont hit 10 reps on heavy day the following week, drop the weight 10%.

You do not want to be missing reps on 8-10 rep weeks.

[Raidersfan13]

Looking to get back into this after several years off. I’m familiar with the lifts, but in my time off I’ve gained a lot of fat (currently at 210 lbs at 5’7” height). I’ve spent the last 6 months really focusing on getting my nutrition and discipline back, doing mostly bodyweight work or cardio.

Any targeted advice for a heavier guy like me to be mindful of as I begin the first cycle? Or am I good to go following the faq without modifications?

[nightanole]

Looking to get back into this after several years off. I’m familiar with the lifts, but in my time off I’ve gained a lot of fat (currently at 210 lbs at 5’7” height). I’ve spent the last 6 months really focusing on getting my nutrition and discipline back, doing mostly bodyweight work or cardio.

Any targeted advice for a heavier guy like me to be mindful of as I begin the first cycle? Or am I good to go following the faq without modifications?

You need to lose about 50 pounds to get to 13% at 5.7. Since you know how to lift, it may be wiser to do the fat ass mod and simply add any weight lost to the bar, as a the form of progression on the squat. So say you can squat 150lbs as a working weight now, by the time you are done with the cut, you will be squatting 200lbs @ 150lbs. Even if the estimate was off, and you are squatting 100lbs, that still would put you at body weight for 10 after the cut, and only 2 cycles away from graduation numbers.

[FlyingV1990]

Quick question about the stiff-legged deadlifts - in the Video Instruction section, the first video is unavailable, but the second one shows the guy starting from the upright position, going down, and finishing the rep at the top. I was under the impression that SLDLs actually start from the floor, and that starting from the top would be more of a RDL, at least according to most of the videos I've seen comparing the two. To be clear, I'm not so much concerned with splitting hairs over the correct name as I am with making sure I'm actually doing the right exercise to target the posterior chain, as mentioned in the FAQ. I've been doing the exercise in the video for about 5 cycles at this point, just want to confirm that's actually the correct one.