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  1. #151
    Registered User JustMoved24's Avatar
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    Wouldn’t even believe her on the sex thing. Not that it matters anyway. But you really can’t trust anyone anymore. Listing numbers as diff names in contact info just crazy bro. You’ll be alright.

    Good luck
    New York
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  2. #152
    Registered User DustinTheHuss's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by NosyJossie View Post
    Well brah, can't polish a **** turd.

    Stay off Hinge (or whatever the fuk you guys use these days).

    Current GF of two years two months, I met in person at college (during the day at the cafeteria).

    Sorry brah but I gotta do this

    Now you can't do that because everyone is at home online.

    This Covid makes meeting women so hard.
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  3. #153
    Registered User Imnew1's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by JustMoved24 View Post
    Wouldn’t even believe her on the sex thing. Not that it matters anyway. But you really can’t trust anyone anymore. Listing numbers as diff names in contact info just crazy bro. You’ll be alright.

    Good luck
    Damn one of my best friends had his ex wife do that exact same thing. Every single person in her phone magically became a girls name but she had to take every call in private lol. Luckily he divorced her ass and she still tries to come back 4 years later because the grass wasn't greener.

    It's game over once you have to snoop the phone and you find that kind of stuff. All trust is gone forever and that's on the person doing wrong instead of the person for snooping bc their gut told them something was wrong.

    If you find messages to family and friends mixed with work conversations, you've truly found a great woman and are lucky. Unfortunately way too many of these women have no virtues and what you'll sadly find is a few family related messages and work related messages mixed with a bunch of exes that they're entertaining, zero female friends that they're regularly talking to about life, and a bunch of just random phone numbers with no name of guys from snapchat and instagram or people that they've met in the real world that are hounding them to date them sending dick pics or whatever, while they flirt back just to keep them on the string. They entertain all this for attention and options and are broken souls. Count it a blessing if you saved a life long headache of this. Nothing would be different with a rock on the finger of a woman like this.
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  4. #154
    🅳🅰🆂 🅸🆃 Luc1fer's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by JustMoved24 View Post
    Wouldn’t even believe her on the sex thing. Not that it matters anyway. But you really can’t trust anyone anymore. Listing numbers as diff names in contact info just crazy bro. You’ll be alright.

    Good luck
    Indeed, I don't even need to speculate. Decision is clear regardless.
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  5. #155
    Registered User EctoPlasmic217's Avatar
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    my guess is, you had to hit on her first
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  6. #156
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    Here's my story, it's sad but true
    It's about a girl that I once knew
    She took my love then ran around
    With every single guy in town

    Yeah, I should have known it from the very start
    This girl would leave me with a broken heart
    Now listen people what I'm telling you
    A-keep away from-a Runaround Sue, yeah

    I miss her lips and the smile on her face
    The touch of her hand and this girl's warm embrace
    So if you don't wanna cry like I do
    A-keep away from-a Runaround Sue

    She likes to travel around, yeah
    She'll love you and she'll put you down
    Now people let me put you wise
    Sue goes out with other guys

    Here's the moral in the story from the guy who knows
    I fell in love and my love still grows
    Ask any fool that she ever knew, they'll tell ya
    Keep away from-a Runaround Sue

    Yeah keep away from this girl
    I don't know what she'll do
    Keep away from Sue!

    She likes to travel around, yeah
    She'll love you and she'll put you down
    Now people let me put you wise
    She goes out with other guys

    Here's the moral in the story from that guy who knows
    I fell in love and my love still grows
    Ask any fool that she ever knew, they'll tell ya
    A-keep away from-a Runaround Sue

    Stay away from that girl
    Don't you know what she'll do now
    Keep away from that girl
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  7. #157
    🅳🅰🆂 🅸🆃 Luc1fer's Avatar
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    F**kin sucks tbh, back to the grind of dating.

    I feel like saying that it really sucks that she did what she did, and it was pretty good aside from that - but I realize that's flawed logic.

    The reality is I had constructed an image of her in my mind as a better/different person than she actually was. She was always that incompatible person with ****ty values, I just realized it after a year. It would have eventually surfaced.

    Still really crappy that people do this stuff and lie etc.

    Is there a faster way to figure out if someone has that integrity? Looking back I recognized that she didn't seem to have a solid set of principles (or principled thought patterns) like myself, so maybe I could've picked up on that.
    Last edited by Luc1fer; 09-19-2020 at 10:28 PM.
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  8. #158
    Registered User Legz422's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Luc1fer View Post
    F**kin sucks tbh, back to the grind of dating.

    I feel like saying that it really sucks that she did what she did, and it was pretty good aside from that - but I realize that's flawed logic.

    The reality is I had constructed an image of her in my mind as a better/different person than she actually was. She was always that incompatible person with ****ty values, I just realized it after a year. It would have eventually surfaced.

    Still really crappy that people do this stuff and lie etc.

    Is there a faster way to figure out if someone has that integrity? Looking back I recognized that she didn't seem to have a solid set of principles (or principled thought patterns) like myself, so maybe I could've picked up on that.
    I'm sure it's easier to tell in some people quicker, but if it's small things like with your ex gf it's not as easy to pick up and decide to end it. Sometimes it takes the bigger things to force you to make that decision.
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  9. #159
    🅳🅰🆂 🅸🆃 Luc1fer's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Legz422 View Post
    I'm sure it's easier to tell in some people quicker, but if it's small things like with your ex gf it's not as easy to pick up and decide to end it. Sometimes it takes the bigger things to force you to make that decision.
    Ye, back to an earlier point I had some minor signals of this but it wasn't enough to really end it. I don't want to get too strict, and want to strike the right balance.
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  10. #160
    Registered User Legz422's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Luc1fer View Post
    Ye, back to an earlier point I had some minor signals of this but it wasn't enough to really end it. I don't want to get too strict, and want to strike the right balance.
    That's the tough thing. You either are too strict and end things earlier and possibly make a mistake in ending it because those minor things don't ever become major things, or you take the risk of finding out later that they've become major. Sometimes I think you have to take the risk. It's just hard finding that balance.
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  11. #161
    Registered User ChemicalBuilder's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Luc1fer View Post
    There was a guy I was kinda suspicious about, some comments on her social media etc. I also know they had some sexual history.

    I confronted her last night and point blank asked her if she had met up with him since we started in the relationship. She denied it. Repeatedly. Over and over. Very convincing.

    I demanded she open her messages if she was being honest and she actually showed me. His first name wasn't correct in the contact list; she had some stupid explanation. I scrolled and saw some back and forths a couple of months after we were exclusive; I saw that she had asked to meet for drinks and they met.

    She then claimed that she had forgot they met.

    In March, I saw another back and forth about plans to go to a restaurant. She had just started living with me at this point (coronavirus lockdowns). The plans fell through because she was sick.

    That's the end of their messages.

    She then kinda admitted to meeting him, but said there was no sex. They had only had sex twice years ago. They were just friends.

    I told her it was done and she has to move out immediately. It's happening now.

    We were due to move into an apartment together next week; I will now be moving alone and fronting the full rent which sucks.
    Gj bro
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  12. #162
    Registered User DustinTheHuss's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Luc1fer View Post
    F**kin sucks tbh, back to the grind of dating.

    I feel like saying that it really sucks that she did what she did, and it was pretty good aside from that - but I realize that's flawed logic.

    The reality is I had constructed an image of her in my mind as a better/different person than she actually was. She was always that incompatible person with ****ty values, I just realized it after a year. It would have eventually surfaced.

    Still really crappy that people do this stuff and lie etc.

    Is there a faster way to figure out if someone has that integrity? Looking back I recognized that she didn't seem to have a solid set of principles (or principled thought patterns) like myself, so maybe I could've picked up on that.
    I think you went too young with her. Much younger women are more likely to want to ride the carousel. This one was in her early 20s?

    Stick to women within a 5 year age gap if you want marriage and kids.
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  13. #163
    Registered User DustinTheHuss's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Rabbitjb View Post
    How old was she?
    I think she was early 20s, more than 10 years younger than OP. Late 20s early 30s are more likely to be more grounded and interested in marriage and kids.

    This is overall, of course, there could be exceptions.

    But in this era I don't think a 22 year old is ready for marriage, especially one in a big city. Maybe in the Midwest part of the US?
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  14. #164
    🅳🅰🆂 🅸🆃 Luc1fer's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Rabbitjb View Post
    You only know retrospectively

    A lot of judging people is gut feelings and experience

    But also people change and adapt and its the nature of relationships that you both develop together and adjust yourselves to fit each other or accept each other

    I get the impression your personal rigidity has relaxed over the last 4 years, which is heartening. I’m not totally sure how much.
    I've relaxed a lot on constraints. I realized women can grow on me, even if they don't match my ideal set of things. Also, people are complicated and imperfect - there's a certain beauty to that.

    That said, I have to strike the right balance there. There were certain promiscuous behaviors, and hyper-liberal mindset on sex within her friend group that made me a bit uncomfortable. But I did try to figure out why/how I felt that way, and honestly I think maybe I was too far one way, but she was too far the other. So there's a middle ground there. I'm not actually that conservative, but compared to them, ye.

    I do still believe there's a line of reasoning between promiscuity and likelihood to cheat (sex isn't a big deal). However, much more important than that is the persons values and respect for the relationship - which she didn't have. And like you said, people can change and I believe many people introspect and figure themselves out mid-late 20's.

    Originally Posted by DustinTheHuss View Post
    I think you went too young with her. Much younger women are more likely to want to ride the carousel. This one was in her early 20s?

    Stick to women within a 5 year age gap if you want marriage and kids.
    I'm dating a bit older now. She was 23. Beyond this incident, the age and generational gap was a little weird. But I'm not gonna rule out everyone, probably a bit more conservative would be okay.

    But ye, target range is closer to 28-32 now.
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  15. #165
    Registered User DustinTheHuss's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Luc1fer View Post
    I've relaxed a lot on constraints. I realized women can grow on me, even if they don't match my ideal set of things. Also, people are complicated and imperfect - there's a certain beauty to that.

    That said, I have to strike the right balance there. There were certain promiscuous behaviors, and hyper-liberal mindset on sex within her friend group that made me a bit uncomfortable. But I did try to figure out why/how I felt that way, and honestly I think maybe I was too far one way, but she was too far the other. So there's a middle ground there. I'm not actually that conservative, but compared to them, ye.

    I do still believe there's a line of reasoning between promiscuity and likelihood to cheat (sex isn't a big deal). However, much more important than that is the persons values and respect for the relationship - which she didn't have. And like you said, people can change and I believe many people introspect and figure themselves out mid-late 20's.



    I'm dating a bit older now. She was 23. Beyond this incident, the age and generational gap was a little weird. But I'm not gonna rule out everyone, probably a bit more conservative would be okay.

    But ye, target range is closer to 28-32 now.
    That's true. As you mentioned in the other thread, it's hard to find conservative women where you live. I'm sure they exist, but more out to the Central Valley or North of you would be more ideal, especially now that people are working remote.

    Great that the range is 28-32! I know you don't want to get much older for having kids.
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  16. #166
    🅳🅰🆂 🅸🆃 Luc1fer's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by DustinTheHuss View Post
    Great that the range is 28-32! I know you don't want to get much older for having kids.
    Yup, I told her I'd ideally like to have kids ~40, she'd be ~28. She acted a bit like that was too soon for her.

    28 is fine imo (?!), I guess women now want to wait until 30's. Although I think it was more of thing she never really considered heavily (due to her age again).
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  17. #167
    Registered User TugOfPeace's Avatar
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    OP, how old are ye? Would you consider yourself a "Chad" (I hate that cringe term) to have pulled off a 10 year age gap relationship? Like, do you think if you weren't at that level you'd have been able to do it?

    Btw, did you know women lose 90% of their eggs by 30?
    Last edited by TugOfPeace; 09-20-2020 at 10:06 AM.
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    Originally Posted by Luc1fer View Post

    Is there a faster way to figure out if someone has that integrity? Looking back I recognized that she didn't seem to have a solid set of principles (or principled thought patterns) like myself, so maybe I could've picked up on that.
    You had wind of this guy earlier on and your gut told you something was off, yes?

    Honestly idk what kind of sleuth work or upfront conversations could've been had to figure it out at that point but the lesson learned would be your gut was right (and will probably be right more often than not).
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    Originally Posted by Luc1fer View Post
    Interesting theory, but it's difficult to know the truth here. That's like the opposite of monkey-branching. I do know that a couple of weeks ago she said to me "I feel like I'm not good enough for you" and was anxious I might not stay. So I think she did perceive me as higher value. I met her parents, and saw messages she sent talking about marrying me. She talked about kids too and how it would work, where we should move etc.
    This means nothing. Women will tell you they will love you forever at 6PM on a Friday and by Sunday afternoon they’re ready to move on with some random dude they used to hang with. Men don’t understand it because we’re not wired that way. A man can actually love two women (or more) at the same time. A woman cannot. She has to forcefully end it and make you irrelevant in her mind before she can latch onto someone else. The war bride theory explains that pretty well.

    Then there’s the culture aspect of it. You just have to realize that modern western women are broken. It’s not even really their fault. Their biology combined with modern technology-assisted attention whoring makes sure that they just absolutely cannot ever be satisfied. Every man living in the US or any other western country needs to realize this, learn to be comfortable with it, and use it to their advantage.

    That line from Heat;
    “Don’t ever get attached to anything you can’t walk away from in 30 seconds flat, if you feel the heat around the corner”

    -is is as accurate and helpful of a statement as it gets when dealing with modern women. That’s exactly how most of them view you, and they only truly respect you if you feel the same about them. Doesn’t mean you can’t have fun, but all rides end eventually. As a male in the modern era, you just have to come to terms with the fact that while you may be awesome, good looking, have a good life and are charismatic, etc., chances are that you’re never going to meet someone that’s going to stay in your life forever.

    Most of us won’t, and that’s ok. Enjoy the journey and have fun.
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    Originally Posted by FastBack6 View Post
    This means nothing. Women will tell you they will love you forever at 6PM on a Friday and by Sunday afternoon they’re ready to move on with some random dude they used to hang with. Men don’t understand it because we’re not wired that way. A man can actually love two women (or more) at the same time. A woman cannot. She has to forcefully end it and make you irrelevant in her mind before she can latch onto someone else. The war bride theory explains that pretty well.

    Then there’s the culture aspect of it. You just have to realize that modern western women are broken. It’s not even really their fault. Their biology combined with modern technology-assisted attention whoring makes sure that they just absolutely cannot ever be satisfied. Every man living in the US or any other western country needs to realize this, learn to be comfortable with it, and use it to their advantage.

    That line from Heat;
    “Don’t ever get attached to anything you can’t walk away from in 30 seconds flat, if you feel the heat around the corner”

    -is is as accurate and helpful of a statement as it gets when dealing with modern women. That’s exactly how most of them view you, and they only truly respect you if you feel the same about them. Doesn’t mean you can’t have fun, but all rides end eventually. As a male in the modern era, you just have to come to terms with the fact that while you may be awesome, good looking, have a good life and are charismatic, etc., chances are that you’re never going to meet someone that’s going to stay in your life forever.

    Most of us won’t, and that’s ok. Enjoy the journey and have fun.
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    Originally Posted by Luc1fer View Post
    This stuff was a bit of a red flag for me. Her friends were hyper sexual, they sing those slutty song lyrics (like that WAP song), send sexual stuff together. They would talk about how big a guy's dik is, did they fuk on the first date etc. All stuff I think is more private.

    Very lewd, and it isn't even witty, you know? I asked her why they think it's so funny, but we could never align.

    It registered with me as a concern (I felt very uneasy about it), but just thought maybe I'm just being a prude and who cares. It seems like a lot of young women are in this hyper sexual world? Maybe I just needed to become okay with being more sexually liberal if I wanted to settle down, because this seems to be the norm.

    Her favorite show was Sex And The City, and I felt uncomfortable about that. If she grew up watching this show, has she normalized the vile behaviors in the show (cheating etc)? Then I snapped back out of it and thought it's just a damn TV show.

    In my mind I was thinking, if her friends are so sexually liberal, doesn't that mean they are diminishing sex to some degree? And if they diminish the act, then aren't they more likely to cheat.

    That said I think you need a combination to cheat, you also need to lack of principles/values. But that may even go hand in hand with the above stuff tbh.
    Dude, more red flags than a Chinese parade. She basically made it easy for you to tell that she’s a slut but your big head followed your little head through a patch of briars and you came out on the other end all bloody, and saying “that wasn’t THAT bad.”
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    Originally Posted by FastBack6 View Post
    This means nothing. Women will tell you they will love you forever at 6PM on a Friday and by Sunday afternoon they’re ready to move on with some random dude they used to hang with. Men don’t understand it because we’re not wired that way. A man can actually love two women (or more) at the same time. A woman cannot. She has to forcefully end it and make you irrelevant in her mind before she can latch onto someone else. The war bride theory explains that pretty well.

    Then there’s the culture aspect of it. You just have to realize that modern western women are broken. It’s not even really their fault. Their biology combined with modern technology-assisted attention whoring makes sure that they just absolutely cannot ever be satisfied. Every man living in the US or any other western country needs to realize this, learn to be comfortable with it, and use it to their advantage.

    That line from Heat;
    “Don’t ever get attached to anything you can’t walk away from in 30 seconds flat, if you feel the heat around the corner”

    -is is as accurate and helpful of a statement as it gets when dealing with modern women. That’s exactly how most of them view you, and they only truly respect you if you feel the same about them. Doesn’t mean you can’t have fun, but all rides end eventually. As a male in the modern era, you just have to come to terms with the fact that while you may be awesome, good looking, have a good life and are charismatic, etc., chances are that you’re never going to meet someone that’s going to stay in your life forever.

    Most of us won’t, and that’s ok. Enjoy the journey and have fun.
    Possibly, but that's an extremely cynical view. I think there's truth embedded in what you write (I've read a lot of red pill stuff), but it's massively cynical and lumps all women into a single category which is flawed.

    The general erosion of values in a world of attention whoring, modern culture that almost promotes cheating, highly promiscuous behavior, and general degeneration of society and class are valid concerns.

    Given the context I have based on her actions, what she said to others etc. and what she did, my version makes more sense. Is it also possible she might have dropped me for this guy if the climate was right? Yup, that's possible too. Regardless, the deception, lying and secretly meeting this guy is enough in any case.

    However I will urge you to re-consider your position on painting all women with exactly the same brush.
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    Originally Posted by Luc1fer View Post
    Ye, back to an earlier point I had some minor signals of this but it wasn't enough to really end it. I don't want to get too strict, and want to strike the right balance.
    This is just my opinion, but you don't need a big reason to end a relationship. I remember you mentioning several times that you didn't really see her as future wife material, and I think that's more than enough reason to end things before things get too serious. When you're young you can let relationships just go on and on, but at our age I think it's pointless unless you see real potential with her. Maybe that's cold, but it's better than wasting each other's time. Better for the woman too.

    I think it's useful to have clear boundaries. Some girls are for fuking. Some girls are for dating. And some girls are for marrying. I know that there's more nuance to this and it's not always cut and clear, but at the end of the day, your head probably knows what's good for you better than your heart or your dick.

    I often ended things at the drop of a hat, and it worked out for me eventually. And I wasn't even looking for marriage. That said, it could've been just dumb luck on my part, so I don't really know if that is the right answer.

    Originally Posted by DustinTheHuss View Post
    I think you went too young with her. Much younger women are more likely to want to ride the carousel. This one was in her early 20s?

    Stick to women within a 5 year age gap if you want marriage and kids.
    As opposed to women who have finished riding the carousal? No offense man, but you often aim for "rehabilitated" drug users and such. Age isn't the main issue here. That said, there are arguments to be made for going older, especially if that's what he's more compatible with.

    Originally Posted by TugOfPeace View Post
    OP, how old are ye? Would you consider yourself a "Chad" (I hate that cringe term) to have pulled off a 10 year age gap relationship? Like, do you think if you weren't at that level you'd have been able to do it?

    Btw, did you know women lose 90% of their eggs by 30?
    You hardly need to be a "Chad" to pull much younger. But it does help to not be ugly, be in decent shape, and not autistic. The idea that it would be that difficult is what makes it harder.
    Last edited by MediocreGains; 09-20-2020 at 06:01 PM.
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    Originally Posted by MediocreGains View Post
    This is just my opinion, but you don't need a big reason to end a relationship. I remember you mentioning several times that you didn't really see her as future wife material, and I think that's more than enough reason to end things before things get too serious. When you're young you can let relationships just go on and on, but at our age I think it's pointless unless you see real potential with her. Maybe that's cold, but it's better than wasting each other's time. Better for the woman too.

    I think it's useful to have clear boundaries. Some girls are for fuking. Some girls are for dating. And some girls are for marrying. I know that there's more nuance to this and it's not always cut and clear, but at the end of the day, your head probably knows what's good for you better than your heart or your dick.

    I often ended things at the drop of a hat, and it worked out for me eventually. And I wasn't even looking for marriage. That said, it could've been just dumb luck on my part, so I don't really know if that is the right answer.
    Good post, you're right about my early mentality on this chick. I definitely did see her as just fun given the early signals.

    But I keep getting criticism on here (and some irl) about being too strict/picky. So ye, I relaxed and just went with the flow just like people say to do. And tbh she was starting to grow on me a bit.

    But sure, maybe I'm too old to be going with the flow and should just go with my early instincts. It's just a tough call, I get conflicting opinions about this. I have to "give a girl a proper chance" and at the same time cut her off earlier.

    So you found a wife, any tips? Or just keep looking and get lucky?
    Last edited by Luc1fer; 09-20-2020 at 10:23 PM.
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    Originally Posted by MediocreGains View Post

    As opposed to women who have finished riding the carousal? No offense man, but you often aim for "rehabilitated" drug users and such. Age isn't the main issue here. That said, there are arguments to be made for going older, especially if that's what he's more compatible with.
    LOL you are right about the "former" drug users, although thankfully I haven't been with one since April. I just think that someone who is 34 (I'm guessing OP's age) who dates a 23 year old is going to run into some problems. Just like my "former" drug users have been a lot younger.

    Women change a lot in their 20s. It sounds like OP is aiming for women who start at 28 though. Yeah maybe they finished riding the carousel and are now looking for a provider. It's all a risk, for both sexes. She could get Chad married and he's cheating on her left and right.
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    Sorry to hear Luci but always trust your gut. ALWAYS.


    Its good that you did this prior to moving into the new place with her, you dont want that doubt consuming your life.


    Edit: Medicore is right on the money. This was not a GF caliber girl to begin with, but you were having fun and stuck around.
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    Noticed she blocked me on everything, wasn’t contacting her.

    Pretty cold tbh, if the shoe were on the other foot I would’ve apologized etc at least for doing something clearly wrong and disrespectful. Meanwhile she was badmouthing me as “untrusting”.

    People suck.
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    Originally Posted by Luc1fer View Post
    Noticed she blocked me on everything, wasn’t contacting her.

    Pretty cold tbh, if the shoe were on the other foot I would’ve apologized etc at least for doing something clearly wrong and disrespectful. Meanwhile she was badmouthing me as “untrusting”.

    People suck.
    That just proves you made the right decision.

    Blocking you may be to help get over you though, not to be purposely "cold."
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    Originally Posted by skinnyfat88 View Post
    That just proves you made the right decision.

    Blocking you may be to help get over you though, not to be purposely "cold."
    Still should’ve apologized or something, but ye that’s the value/ethic mismatch.
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    Originally Posted by Luc1fer View Post
    Still should’ve apologized or something, but ye that’s the value/ethic mismatch.
    Agree. An apology would have been the right thing to do. Sadly, a lot of people can't own up to their stuff and do the right thing.
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