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    24 hour fast two days a week?

    Edit: This thread is about cutting.

    If my maintenance is 2300 and I fast twice a week for full 24 hours - and eat maintenance the other 5 days that would result in 4600 weekly deficit = 1.3lbs

    Let’s say I could deal with the hunger, would there be any other negative impacts like muscle loss? I could eat a big dinner at 10pm and fast through the next day - stay busy working or something?

    Would eating a small 350 calorie meal in the middle be helpful? 50 calorie asparagus or broccoli, 200 calories worth of chicken breast and a 100 calorie slice of bread with some nice buffalo sauce.

    Tried searching threads but couldn’t find any useful results. Here is a google search results. https://www.google.com/search?q=24+h...&client=safari
    Last edited by TryingBB; 07-13-2020 at 08:35 PM.
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    team ketchup AdamWW's Avatar
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    Better question: why would you WANT to not eat for 24 hours?

    Is there something unappealing about eating 3-5 times a day?
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    Originally Posted by AdamWW View Post
    Better question: why would you WANT to not eat for 24 hours?

    Is there something unappealing about eating 3-5 times a day?
    I have cut from 200lbs to about 161lbs.

    500 daily deficit sucks ass. I would rather feel miserable a few hours a week than deal with it 7 days a week.

    I love food so I’d like to eat maintenance 5 days a week.
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    team ketchup AdamWW's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TryingBB View Post
    I have cut from 200lbs to about 161lbs.

    500 daily deficit sucks ass. I would rather feel miserable a few hours a week than deal with it 7 days a week.

    I love food so I’d like to eat maintenance 5 days a week.
    How would not eating for 24 hours only cause a ‘few’ hours of hunger?

    Why not just add in 200-300 calories worth of cardio, such that you can eat more?

    Hopefully you’re already eating high volume foods... if I had to cut weight I’d eat like 5 pounds of salad a day.
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    Protein bar nightcap? desslok's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TryingBB View Post
    I have cut from 200lbs to about 161lbs.
    Great! Then time to build muscle and a fast is the LAST thing I would do when trying to builld muscle.
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  6. #6
    I'm huge in Japan! xsquid99's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TryingBB View Post
    I have cut from 200lbs to about 161lbs.

    500 daily deficit sucks ass. I would rather feel miserable a few hours a week than deal with it 7 days a week.

    I love food so I’d like to eat maintenance 5 days a week.
    A 500 cal deficit = 1 lb a week, which would mean you've been cutting for 39 weeks already?

    No way should a 500 calorie daily deficit make you miserable, I doubt I would barely notice such a small deficit like that.

    How tall are you? Based on your June 2020 photos on your profile you're still in the 25%-ish bodyfat range.
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  7. #7
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    I’ve made my share of mistakes.

    I started this journey in Nov 2018.

    There are some pics in body space.

    I quit for three months last year and ate at maintenance, I stayed at maintenance while working out about 5 or so months and I cut initial months and currently also cutting. I also did a couple small bulks.

    Long story short, I finally learnt im no special snowflake lol and I need to cut or bulk. So I’ve been cutting for last two months and down from 171 to 161. Target weight was 160, and obviously I’m too high bodyfat still. New target is 157 and by then I should be starting a new Allpro cycle and plan to start a bulk then (still way above my target bodyfat or 14% - I was thinking based on my calculation that if I start cutting at 30% and 171lbs by 160lbs I’ll be 14.5% but nowhere even close. I’m still 20% bodyfat apparently. So either I’m loosing muscle or I started at a 24% bodyfat)

    Anyhow, overall I’m 161lbs now and plan to start a slow bulk next month once I get down to 157lbs. 4 more weeks to go.

    I’m tempted to start bulk now but too much bodyfat.

    I think I lost muscle mass during my cut. Or did I not? Pics in bodyspace
    Last edited by TryingBB; 07-13-2020 at 09:15 PM.
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    Originally Posted by xsquid99 View Post
    A 500 cal deficit = 1 lb a week, which would mean you've been cutting for 39 weeks already?

    No way should a 500 calorie daily deficit make you miserable, I doubt I would barely notice such a small deficit like that.

    How tall are you? Based on your June 2020 photos on your profile you're still in the 25%-ish bodyfat range.
    Not really miserable unless it’s a day like yesterday and I sneak in a couple orios, popcorn, eat pizza (home made) and have a couple pieces of Godiva heaveness.

    This does not happen a lot / yesterday was movie night at home and I was not gonna make everyone and myself miserable lol

    Today I paid for it tho - I’ve eaten toast and egg for breakfast, chicken breast and buffalo sauce for lunch and evening snack - total 750 calorie.

    Dinner will be 375 calories and maybe I’ll borrow 150 calories from tomorrow.

    I’m managing pretty well and loosing 1lb to 1.2lbs a week. I am used to fasting and can fast 24 hours easy. Last 4 hours will be a drag but I can tolerate it.

    Wondering if that’ll yield good results or do I risk loosing muscle fasting 24 hours / days a week.
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    team ketchup AdamWW's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TryingBB View Post
    I’ve made my share of mistakes.

    I started this journey in Nov 2018.

    There are some pics in body space.

    I quit for three months last year and ate at maintenance, I stayed at maintenance while working out about 5 or so months and I cut initial months and currently also cutting. I also did a couple small bulks.

    Long story short, I finally learnt im no special snowflake lol and I need to cut or bulk. So I’ve been cutting for last two months and down from 171 to 161. Target weight was 160, and obviously I’m too high bodyfat still. New target is 157 and by then I should be starting a new Allpro cycle and plan to start a bulk then

    Anyhow, overall I’m 161lbs now and plan to start a slow bulk next month once I get down to 157lbs. 4 more weeks to go.

    I’m tempted to start bulk now but too much bodyfat.

    I think I lost muscle mass during my cut. Or did I not? Pics in bodyspace
    Impossible to know if you lost muscle

    Did you stop lifting? That’s usually the best way to know how much muscle you lost

    Bottom line, if you’re dead set on losing more fat, I would highly advise eating multiple times a day even if for whatever reason you’re only consuming 1800 calories (tho id day you should just add more activity so you can eat more)

    Even if you did IF, that’d be better.... I’d rather try something like:

    12pm: 700 calories

    4pm: 300 calories (mainly protein)

    7pm: 800 calories

    And just do that every day

    If you eat plenty of veggies, lean protein, and Whole Foods, you’d be amazed how large a 700-800 calories meal can be.

    Why anyone would eat Oreos to get calories when they’re on such low TDEE is beyond me...
    Last edited by AdamWW; 07-13-2020 at 09:21 PM.
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  10. #10
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    Originally Posted by AdamWW View Post
    Impossible to know if you lost muscle

    Did you stop lifting? That’s usually the best way to know how much muscle you lost

    Bottom line, if you’re dead set on losing more fat, I would highly advise eating multiple times a day even if for whatever reason you’re only consuming 1800 calories (tho id day you should just add more activity so you can eat more)

    Even if you did IF, that’d be better.... I’d rather try something like:

    12pm: 700 calories

    4pm: 300 calories (mainly protein)

    7pm: 800 calories

    And just do that every day

    If you eat plenty of veggies, lean protein, and Whole Foods, you’d be amazed how large a 700-800 calories meal can be.
    I eat about 1850 to 1950 a day and loosing 1.2lbs a week. I cardio (road bicycle) only couple days a week as I don’t have time / don’t enjoy as much.

    Usually I eat 3 times a day and couple coffees. No issues there as weight is coming off.

    By looking at pics can’t tell if I lost bodyfat? My lifts are almost the same as before I started my cut though.

    How does stop lifting help figure out if muscle was lost?
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  11. #11
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    Yeah I'm sorry but you're not at 20% bodyfat, you're 25% +/- based on your June photos @ 163 lbs. You would probably need to drop another 20-ish lbs to get anywhere near 15% bodyfat.

    Unfortunately I don't think you should bulking, you have quite a bit of fat to lose before considering that.
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    Nutrient timing has no effect on fat loss.

    Nutrient timing has a small to moderate effect on muscle gain (I'd say moderate for 24h fasts).

    Eating (the same total calories) more often will help you build more muscle. Eating (the same total calories) less often will not help you lose more fat. So it would appear that these fasts, especially since they span entire days, are not only entirely useless but also counterproductive.

    However, the best diet is one you can follow consistently. If this works better for you than normal meal timing, then by all means go ahead.

    But please, please don't be fooled by all the IF health gurus claiming it cures cancer and feeds Africa.
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    Originally Posted by xsquid99 View Post
    Yeah I'm sorry but you're not at 20% bodyfat, you're 25% +/- based on your June photos @ 163 lbs. You would probably need to drop another 20-ish lbs to get anywhere near 15% bodyfat.

    Unfortunately I don't think you should bulking, you have quite a bit of fat to lose before considering that.
    Oh chit. I’m 5ft 8inches.

    If I lost 20lbs I might disappear. Fuk!

    Is there a better strategy? I can not loose anymore weight past 157lbs for several reasons. My medium shirts from 10 years ago are fukkkkin loose on me already.

    If I am 23% bodyfat why am I not gaining strength at 500 deficit like so many people claim.

    I’m lifting on allpro and am lifting hard imo (usually till failure week 4 and 5 of the program)

    Edit: I did a slow bulk from jan till May. 2lbs a month. And I think all I gained was fat. Is that Cuz I’m Still high 24% bodyfat?
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    I'm huge in Japan! xsquid99's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TryingBB View Post
    Oh chit. I’m 5ft 8inches.

    If I lost 20lbs I might disappear. Fuk!

    Is there a better strategy? I can not loose anymore weight past 157lbs for several reasons. My medium shirts from 10 years ago are fukkkkin loose on me already.

    If I am 23% bodyfat why am I not gaining strength at 500 deficit like so many people claim.

    I’m lifting on allpro and am lifting hard imo (usually till failure week 4 and 5 of the program)
    Yeah at 5'8" with not a lot of training history I wouldn't expect you to be in the 15% range unless you're in the 145 +/- 5-ish lbs zone. Sorry man, thats just the way it is.
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    Originally Posted by xsquid99 View Post
    Yeah at 5'8" with not a lot of training history I wouldn't expect you to be in the 15% range unless you're in the 145 +/- 5-ish lbs zone. Sorry man, thats just the way it is.
    K. This fuking sucks. I’ll try not to cry myself to sleep tonight (not srs lol - but this does suck Ballz)

    If I stop loosing fat at 157lbs, what’s the next best I can do?

    I’ve tried lifting at maintaince on fierce 5 and gains just don’t come.

    What else can I do after getting to 157lbs if goal was to be more aesthetic and build more muscle and reduce bodyfat? I mean obvious answer is cut more but what if that option was off the table?

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    team ketchup AdamWW's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TryingBB View Post
    Oh chit. I’m 5ft 8inches.

    If I lost 20lbs I might disappear. Fuk!

    Is there a better strategy? I can not loose anymore weight past 157lbs for several reasons. My medium shirts from 10 years ago are fukkkkin loose on me already.

    If I am 23% bodyfat why am I not gaining strength at 500 deficit like so many people claim.

    I’m lifting on allpro and am lifting hard imo (usually till failure week 4 and 5 of the program)

    Edit: I did a slow bulk from jan till May. 2lbs a month. And I think all I gained was fat. Is that Cuz I’m Still high 24% bodyfat?
    If you’re not adding weight on your lifts, you’re not building muscle tissue.

    Why aren’t you adding weight? That’s the whole point of a program...


    And you won’t disappear at 145... hell im 6 foot and weigh 142 and even tho I’m very skinny I don’t look like death (tho I used to)... but that’s only because I have some underlying lean tissue

    You can buy new shirts.
    Last edited by AdamWW; 07-13-2020 at 09:58 PM.
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    Originally Posted by AdamWW View Post
    If you’re not adding weight on your lifts, you’re not building muscle tissue.

    Why aren’t you adding weight? That’s the whole point of a program...


    And you won’t disappear at 145... hell im 6 foot and weigh 142 and even tho I’m very skinny I don’t look like death (tho I used to)... but that’s only because I have some underlying lean tissue

    You can buy new shirts.
    Maybe cuz I’m in a Caloric deficit that’s why I’m not adding weight to the bar? I mean I push as hard as I can.

    I’m unable to Commit to 8 to 9 Hours of sleep a night. I get mostly 6 hours, sometimes 7 hours and one week or once every other week 8 hours or more a night. That’s the one thing I can think of. (Recovery was off basically).

    I attempted allpro and failed test week last week while loosing 1lb per week.

    I was so sure of starting a slow bulk in a few weeks. Not so anymore haha

    Wut do?

    Do I just need to accept that I’ll be a fatty and start a slow bulk now and cut when I have some more muscle?

    I was thinking of gaining 16 or so pounds in a year starting next month :-/

    But due to nutrition partitioning I’m worried I’ll just end up gaining more fat and lesser muscle if I went on a slow bulk.
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  18. #18
    team ketchup AdamWW's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TryingBB View Post
    Maybe cuz I’m in a Caloric deficit that’s why I’m not adding weight to the bar? I mean I push as hard as I can.

    I’m unable to Commit to 8 to 9 Hours of sleep a night. I get mostly 6 hours, sometimes 7 hours and one week or once every other week 8 hours or more a night. That’s the one thing I can think of. (Recovery was off basically).

    I attempted allpro and failed test week last week while loosing 1lb per week.

    I was so sure of starting a slow bulk in a few weeks. Not so anymore haha

    Wut do?

    Do I just need to accept that I’ll be a fatty and start a slow bulk now and cut when I have some more muscle?

    I was thinking of gaining 16 or so pounds in a year starting next month :-/

    But due to nutrition partitioning I’m worried I’ll just end up gaining more fat and lesser muscle if I went on a slow bulk.
    Dude cutting doesn’t mean you can’t add weight to the bar...

    I don’t know what the progression scheme is for that routine, but regardless of cutting or bulking at your level you should be adding resistance/volume regularly.

    Whatever weight you’re lifting now, you need to increase it steadily... that’s how muscle is built... you have plenty of stored energy on hand from which your body can pull to build muscle if your protein intake is adequate.
    The power of carbs compels me!
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    Originally Posted by AdamWW View Post
    Dude cutting doesn’t mean you can’t add weight to the bar...

    I don’t know what the progression scheme is for that routine, but regardless of cutting or bulking at your level you should be adding resistance/volume regularly.

    Whatever weight you’re lifting now, you need to increase it steadily... that’s how muscle is built... you have plenty of stored energy on hand from which your body can pull to build muscle if your protein intake is adequate.
    Could being close to 40yrs have anything to do with it?

    Gains are not coming on a deficit and I’ve tried fierce 5 for four months.

    Then switched to allpro and I failed last week.

    Allpro progression is 8-12reps of the same weight. Increase a rep every week.

    If you get all 12 reps on week 5 (12 rep week), you bump the weight 10% and start at 8 reps again.
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    Why would you try to make retaining muscle harder during a deficit?

    Limit fasting to 16 hours per day if you care about retaining muscle.
    Last edited by Mrpb; 07-13-2020 at 11:31 PM.
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    Originally Posted by TryingBB View Post
    Could being close to 40yrs have anything to do with it?

    Gains are not coming on a deficit and I’ve tried fierce 5 for four months.

    Then switched to allpro and I failed last week.

    Allpro progression is 8-12reps of the same weight. Increase a rep every week.

    If you get all 12 reps on week 5 (12 rep week), you bump the weight 10% and start at 8 reps again.
    As a novice lifter your age shouldn’t be a factor.

    What do you mean you ‘failed’?
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    Yep, nothing wrong with weighing in the 140s at 5'8" - I'm 6'1 and had to get down to 155lb to start seeing my abs at around 14%.

    Focusing on bulking now and back in the 170s. Abs are gone, but I'm filling out a t-shirt better than ever.
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    OP, how long have you been lifting and what are your current lifts for the big compound exercises?
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    All Pro is supposed to be a good routine to use when cutting due to its slower progression. If you've just switched to it and have already failed to get the target reps it means you started out with too heavy weights. I suggest reducing the loads by 15% and starting again from scratch.
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    Originally Posted by RapidFail View Post
    OP, how long have you been lifting and what are your current lifts for the big compound exercises?
    I’ve been lifting off and on for about a year but I do have poverty laughable lifts still. I progressed real fast initially and then the gains slowed down majorly. I started with the bar on squats and OHP. Deadlift I started with 75lbs or something. Bench started with the bar.

    These were my fierce 5 maxes
    - Bench: 135x5 (figured out 4 weeks ago that I had form issues. On top bar was over my nose area instead of over the shoulders causing major instability. This had caused me to stall at 135lbs for a while)

    - Squat: 115x5 (had form issues that I’ve finally figured out)

    - Deadlift: 215 x 5 (stalled and reset at 165, then 185, then 200, then 205 then 215)

    These are allpro maxes (finished My first cycle last week but failed to get 12 reps in the second set on everything but SLDL)

    Bench: 110x12
    Squat: 96x12
    Deadlift: No deadlift In the program but 105x12 on SLDL

    Originally Posted by RapidFail View Post
    All Pro is supposed to be a good routine to use when cutting due to its slower progression. If you've just switched to it and have already failed to get the target reps it means you started out with too heavy weights. I suggest reducing the loads by 15% and starting again from scratch.
    If I drop weight 15% it’ll be too easy...still I should do it you think looking at those lifts?

    I started with my 10RM like the program called for. I switched from Fierce 5 to allpro after being on fierce 5 for 4 months.

    On fierce 5, I was getting beat pretty hard and was not resetting correctly. Now I know better tho.
    Last edited by TryingBB; 07-14-2020 at 12:05 AM.
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    Originally Posted by TryingBB View Post
    I’ve been lifting off and on for about a year but I do have poverty laughable lifts still. I progressed real fast initially and then the gains slowed down majorly. I started with the bar on squats and OHP. Deadlift I started with 75lbs or something. Bench started with the bar.

    These were my fierce 5 maxes
    - Bench: 135x5 (figured out 4 weeks ago that I had form issues. On top bar was over my nose area instead of over the shoulders causing major instability. This had caused me to stall at 135lbs for a while)

    - Squat: 115x5 (had form issues that I’ve finally figured out)

    - Deadlift: 215 x 5 (stalled and reset at 165, then 185, then 200, then 205 then 215)

    These are allpro maxes (finished My first cycle last week but failed to get 12 reps in the second set on everything but SLDL)

    Bench: 110x12
    Squat: 96x12
    Deadlift: No deadlift In the program but 105x12 on SLDL



    If I drop weight 15% it’ll be too easy...still I should do it you think looking at those lifts?

    I started with my 10RM like the program called for. I switched from Fierce 5 to allpro after being on fierce 5 for 4 months.

    On fierce 5, I was getting beat pretty hard and was not resetting correctly. Now I know better tho.
    Never mind, I didn't read your previous post properly - best to follow the program as-written.
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    So concensus is for me to cut? I’ll be lighter than teenagers in my family lol

    I guess it’s just something mental - being skinnyfat / fat for all my life pretty much and being borderline obese last few years.

    If I didn’t wanna drop below 157lbs, would I be sorry I bulked at such high bodyfat if I did a 200 calorie surplus? Would I benefit from reducing surplus to 100?

    Maintenance is chit - at least with fierce 5 it was total chit. I kept grinding the same weight for weeks
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    Originally Posted by Mrpb View Post
    Why would you try to make retaining muscle harder during a deficit?

    Limit fasting to 16 hours per day if you care about retaining muscle.
    Cool - will just continue the 500 deficit that I’m on currently and continue loosing that 1lb per week hopefully
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    You don't have to do all your cutting at once.

    And 24 hour fasts are not recommended. I would never do that because protein synthesis.
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    Originally Posted by TryingBB View Post
    Cool - will just continue the 500 deficit that I’m on currently and continue loosing that 1lb per week hopefully
    I'm trying to load your pictures but it's not working at the moment.

    Cutting is the right course of action if fat loss is your goal.

    How did you establish body fat percentage? Electronic scale?
    Last edited by Mrpb; 07-14-2020 at 12:42 AM.
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