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  1. #211
    team ketchup AdamWW's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Mrpb View Post
    Yup. So many people seem to not grasp that.
    It's funny, I hear people say things like "masks do nothing"...

    I always respond with something like: "Ok, try coughing or sneezing 1 foot away from your bathroom mirror WITHOUT a face covering... then try it WITH one... let me know if the mirror looks the same after each".
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  2. #212
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    Originally Posted by Mrpb View Post
    Yup. So many people seem to not grasp that.
    Originally Posted by AdamWW View Post
    It's funny, I hear people say things like "masks do nothing"...

    I always respond with something like: "Ok, try coughing or sneezing 1 foot away from your bathroom mirror WITHOUT a face covering... then try it WITH one... let me know if the mirror looks the same after each".
    Yup. I think it'd be a good health PSA to let people know that the masks aren't just about not getting sick, but about getting LESS sick if you do get it. Most people think it's like a cold or flu where if you're sick you're sick and it doesn't matter how many virus particles you were exposed to, when that just simply isn't the case.
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  3. #213
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    Big Vaccine news today!

    Pfizer’s Covid-19 Vaccine Proves 90% Effective in Latest Trials
    U.S. drugmaker and partner BioNTech could ask FDA to permit wide use of vaccine for the new coronavirus by end of November

    A vaccine developed by Pfizer Inc. PFE 0.03% and partner BioNTech SE proved better than expected at protecting people from Covid-19 in a pivotal study, a milestone in the hunt for shots that can stop the global pandemic.

    The vaccine proved to be more than 90% effective in the first 94 subjects who were infected by the new coronavirus and developed at least one symptom, the companies said Monday.

    The positive, though incomplete, results bring the vaccine a big step closer to getting cleared for widespread use.

    Pfizer said it is on track to ask health regulators for permission to sell the shot before the end of this month, if pending data indicate the vaccine is safe.
    https://www.wsj.com/articles/covid-1...d=hp_lead_pos1
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  4. #214
    Gaintaining Mrpb's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Strawng View Post
    Yup. I think it'd be a good health PSA to let people know that the masks aren't just about not getting sick, but about getting LESS sick if you do get it. Most people think it's like a cold or flu where if you're sick you're sick and it doesn't matter how many virus particles you were exposed to, when that just simply isn't the case.
    Originally Posted by AdamWW View Post
    It's funny, I hear people say things like "masks do nothing"...

    I always respond with something like: "Ok, try coughing or sneezing 1 foot away from your bathroom mirror WITHOUT a face covering... then try it WITH one... let me know if the mirror looks the same after each".
    It's one thing I've noticed a lot lately, black & white thinking is maybe the most common thinking error that people tend to make.

    'PCR tests are useless', 'vaccines aren't safe', 'masks don't protect' etc.
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  5. #215
    Registered User Heisman2's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by BromanianDL View Post
    Now that the election is over, time to focus on covid again as cases are rising. I saw this article posted and didn't really understand what Human recombinant soluble ACE2 is. Is this something that could be mass produced quickly? The death rate seems to have fallen, but hospitals in my area are completely full again.

    https://www.nature.com/articles/s41392-020-00374-6
    Human means the human version as opposed to animal. Recombinant essentially means it's a protein we can create in a lab. Soluble means it will go through the bloodstream to reach different places in the body. ACE2 is the protein itself. It could be produced on a large scale relatively quickly if it was proven to be a slam dunk very effective & safe treatment. Practically that would take awhile.

    Regarding the vaccine, very encouraging news to be sure. Good write up here: https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipelin...fe39mIn4qL2wnI
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  6. #216
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    Originally Posted by Mrpb View Post
    Big Vaccine news today!

    Pfizer’s Covid-19 Vaccine Proves 90% Effective in Latest Trials
    U.S. drugmaker and partner BioNTech could ask FDA to permit wide use of vaccine for the new coronavirus by end of November

    A vaccine developed by Pfizer Inc. PFE 0.03% and partner BioNTech SE proved better than expected at protecting people from Covid-19 in a pivotal study, a milestone in the hunt for shots that can stop the global pandemic.

    The vaccine proved to be more than 90% effective in the first 94 subjects who were infected by the new coronavirus and developed at least one symptom, the companies said Monday.

    The positive, though incomplete, results bring the vaccine a big step closer to getting cleared for widespread use.

    Pfizer said it is on track to ask health regulators for permission to sell the shot before the end of this month, if pending data indicate the vaccine is safe.
    https://www.wsj.com/articles/covid-1...d=hp_lead_pos1
    I was glad to read this as well yesterday. One of my big concerns with any vaccine was the ability to mass produce, but it sounds like once approved Pfizer has the capacity to produce 200 million doses in 2020 and another 1.5 billion in 2021.

    Is this the vaccine that requires a -70C storage temperature? I feel for the countries who don't have the infrastructure to support this.
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  7. #217
    team ketchup AdamWW's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Mrpb View Post
    Big Vaccine news today!

    Pfizer’s Covid-19 Vaccine Proves 90% Effective in Latest Trials
    U.S. drugmaker and partner BioNTech could ask FDA to permit wide use of vaccine for the new coronavirus by end of November

    A vaccine developed by Pfizer Inc. PFE 0.03% and partner BioNTech SE proved better than expected at protecting people from Covid-19 in a pivotal study, a milestone in the hunt for shots that can stop the global pandemic.

    The vaccine proved to be more than 90% effective in the first 94 subjects who were infected by the new coronavirus and developed at least one symptom, the companies said Monday.

    The positive, though incomplete, results bring the vaccine a big step closer to getting cleared for widespread use.

    Pfizer said it is on track to ask health regulators for permission to sell the shot before the end of this month, if pending data indicate the vaccine is safe.
    https://www.wsj.com/articles/covid-1...d=hp_lead_pos1

    Thats awesome.

    I have to say tho... the timing is... just... I mean you know what I'm gunna say. All this happening right around the election day/week seems to oddly coincidental.

    Not trying to spread ideas... but very interesting it unfolded like that.
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  8. #218
    Registered User Strawng's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by AdamWW View Post
    Thats awesome.

    I have to say tho... the timing is... just... I mean you know what I'm gunna say. All this happening right around the election day/week seems to oddly coincidental.

    Not trying to spread ideas... but very interesting it unfolded like that.
    Agreed. I’m not one for conspiracies, but I had to slap on my tinfoil hat for that one. I presume they waited to release the results to garner more investors. In any case, I’m very optimistic about a potential vaccine.
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  9. #219
    team ketchup AdamWW's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Strawng View Post
    Agreed. I’m not one for conspiracies, but I had to slap on my tinfoil hat for that one. I presume they waited to release the results to garner more investors. In any case, I’m very optimistic about a potential vaccine.
    Same... I just know the conspiracy theories are going to keep mounting over and over and over... in another life a vaccine would have been a universal cause for celebration, yet now it just turns into another political talking point or weapon.
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  10. #220
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    Yeah it's an interesting timing to say the least. We can't really know if it was timed or coincidence. But let's say the guys in charge at Pfizer did it on purpose. They thought 'let's delay it a few days because we don't want to boost Trump's chances of winning'. I wouldn't really mind. To me it makes sense that they would rather have a president that believes in science than one that makes up his own science.
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  11. #221
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    Originally Posted by Mrpb View Post
    To me it makes sense that they would rather have a president that believes in science than one that makes up his own science.
    Or a President who will not limit the amount they can charge for some drugs, like Trump did???? I'd bet "money" over "principals". ;-)
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    Originally Posted by CommitmentRulz View Post
    Or a President who will not limit the amount they can charge for some drugs, like Trump did???? I'd bet "money" over "principals". ;-)
    Isn't that backwards? Biden just put out a speech that included reducing the cost of drugs.

    Politics aside, there was a good conversation on sky news today with an Indian virologist who was pretty convinced that the Pfizer vaccine won't be our main vaccine soon anyway because of others in heavy testing phases with less stringent cooling requirements.
    No specifics unfortunately, sorry.
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  13. #223
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    Originally Posted by CommitmentRulz View Post
    Or a President who will not limit the amount they can charge for some drugs, like Trump did???? I'd bet "money" over "principals". ;-)
    The reason I gave may be money motivated too.
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  14. #224
    team ketchup AdamWW's Avatar
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    Let’s not divert this too much into politics.

    I was merely commenting the timing is highly suspicious given the election drama.

    Only comment mildly related to that subject I will make is that THIS vaccine effort by Pfizer etc was the only of the several in testing process that did NOT accept money from the “project warp speed” thing.

    So it’s interesting how VP Pence and others are claiming its promising results are somehow a result of the current administrations efforts... it is actually the opposite if anything: this vaccine did not in any way benefit from the government-funded programs.
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  15. #225
    Registered User Strawng's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by AdamWW View Post
    Let’s not divert this too much into politics.

    I was merely commenting the timing is highly suspicious given the election drama.

    Only comment mildly related to that subject I will make is that THIS vaccine effort by Pfizer etc was the only of the several in testing process that did NOT accept money from the “project warp speed” thing.

    So it’s interesting how VP Pence and others are claiming its promising results are somehow a result of the current administrations efforts... it is actually the opposite if anything: this vaccine did not in any way benefit from the government-funded programs.
    I was thinking the same.

    Semi-political rant: I also have to say that I'm so fuking sick of everything from public health initiatives, to sports, to movies, to music, to fuking porn these days is all political. I'm so fuking fed up with politics. I literally cried tears of joy when Biden won, and not even because I'm some sort of hardcore Democrat or anything, but because I'm so sick of living in such a divided nation where every damn thing comes down to an "us vs them" political and ideological circle-jerk...even a goddamned virus. Imo the man was just too damn polarizing. For every outlandish thing Trump did, the news media's constant childish tattletaling was just as weak and pathetic. Our reaction to him was chittier than the a$$holerry he helped encourage, and in many cases, equally favoring of ideology over facts. /Endrant.

    Back to strictly Covid talk, a new study's going around that surveyed Marine recruits and found that the vast majority were asymptomatic. These were young (83% between 18-20), otherwise very healthy men, so I don't view this as too surprising. This perhaps lends weight to the idea that young people are spreading this thing around without realizing it.
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    Here's an interesting CNN piece on why people are more likely to survive Covid now compared to the spring:https://www.cnn.com/videos/health/20...newday-vpx.cnn.
    Cliffs: The main demographic with the disease is younger now and more disease-specific treatments like steroids, remdesivir, antibodies, blood thinners, and turning patients on their side have greatly reduced the mortality rate of the hospitalized. Also, they seem a bit hesitant to admit it, but they admit that the previous strategy of putting everyone on ventilators was possibly killing more people than it was saving. I remember scoffing at this as a nutjob conspiracy at first, but everything I've read over the last several months has suggested the ventilators truly do hurt more than they help in most cases.
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    team ketchup AdamWW's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Strawng View Post

    Semi-political rant: I also have to say that I'm so fuking sick of everything from public health initiatives, to sports, to movies, to music, to fuking porn these days is all political. I'm so fuking fed up with politics. I literally cried tears of joy when Biden won, and not even because I'm some sort of hardcore Democrat or anything, but because I'm so sick of living in such a divided nation where every damn thing comes down to an "us vs them" political and ideological circle-jerk...even a goddamned virus. Imo the man was just too damn polarizing. For every outlandish thing Trump did, the news media's constant childish tattletaling was just as weak and pathetic. Our reaction to him was chittier than the a$$holerry he helped encourage, and in many cases, equally favoring of ideology over facts. /Endrant.
    The very things that SOME people admire in Trump (his candor, his 'thinking out loud', his ostensibly 'macho' projections/facade...) are perhaps the most dangerous things about him as a President.

    He didn't offer calm, compassion, etc, and a leader in a country so divided THAT is what you need.

    Instead, he insights anger, fear, conspiracy, and doubt across the board... against science and against his political rivals.

    People these days are too easily lead by headlines, Tweets, and non-sense news accusations to have someone like that in the White House. Staying up and tweeting/retweeting the kinds of things he does without a second thought to how his base will react to it is incredibly irresponsible.

    We at LEAST need someone who communicates like an adult... so while, like you, I'm not a Biden 'fan' per se, he at least talks like an adult and we don't need to worry about being the laughing stock of the world anymore.
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    More correlational evidence suggesting that vitamin D levels may be quite important for outcomes: https://www.nature.com/articles/s415...inJxOzdARIGzHA

    I think it's reasonable for every generally healthy person to supplement 2,000-4,000 IUs of vitamin D during this pandemic.
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  19. #229
    team ketchup AdamWW's Avatar
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    Not real 'news', but my dad (ER doc) received his first COVID vaccine 2 days ago.

    As of now, spoke to him and he says he has zero side-effects thus far. I guess he's getting another one in a couple weeks.

    Didn't realize it was already out there.
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    Registered User Heisman2's Avatar
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    I'm getting my first one Thursday. Most people are not reporting any significant side effects thus far (at least that I'm aware of).
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    Originally Posted by Heisman2 View Post
    I'm getting my first one Thursday. Most people are not reporting any significant side effects thus far (at least that I'm aware of).
    Yeah most I’ve heard in the reporting is just the common stuff we see with most vaccine: site pain, very mild flu-like symptoms, etc.
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  22. #232
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    https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020...emains-unclear

    Wonder how this will affect the overall effectiveness of the vaccine (and what the properties of this mutation is in terms of the probability of severe disease, if the risk factors are the same, etc.)

    I guess if the effect on the reproduction number is an increase in about 0.4 as some sources claim, this will also push the threshold for herd immunity higher, so that the vaccination rate in the population needs to be higher to get the same overall protection...
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  23. #233
    Gaintaining Mrpb's Avatar
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    I think/hope the initial reaction to the new strain was a bit exaggerated. They're already talking about lifting the travel ban.

    Infection numbers in The Netherlands have been going down the last 4 days so that could be a good sign. Not sure how prevalent the new strain is here. Today they found two people with it.

    Update: travel bans have been lifted now.
    Last edited by Mrpb; 12-23-2020 at 12:22 AM.
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