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  1. #1
    Registered User BeginnerGainz's Avatar
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    Chin-ups/ pull-ups vs rows

    During a pull-up or chin-up, the shoulder joint goes from full extension to full flexion.During a barbell row, the shoulder joint goes from slight extension to full flexion. Other wise they work more or less the same muscles (correct me if I’m wrong, please).

    So with that said, am I wasting my time doing barbell rows when I can just do chin-ups/pull-ups/pull downs?
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    Registered User beowulf359's Avatar
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    Well one is a horizontal pull and the other vertical. While they generally work the same muscle groups they do it from different angles. I think many people would recommend including both horizontal and vertical pulling during your week. Even just alternating allows you to change the stimulus and break a plateau.
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    Registered User BeginnerGainz's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by beowulf359 View Post
    Well one is a horizontal pull and the other vertical. While they generally work the same muscle groups they do it from different angles. I think many people would recommend including both horizontal and vertical pulling during your week. Even just alternating allows you to change the stimulus and break a plateau.
    Forgot to add to my question that I know one is vertical, and one is horizontal. Thank you for reminding me! (serious, no sarcasm)
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    Registered User LifterWest's Avatar
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    I'd think the same argument can be made for bench and OHP....
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    Registered User air2fakie's Avatar
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    Not sure why you're judging the effectiveness of vertical and horizontal pulls by shoulder joint flexion. Judge them by gains.

    If you feel you're wasting your time doing barbell rows then you're doing them wrong. You should do both, but heavy rows don't take a back seat to vertical pulls, esp chinups and lat pulldowns.

    Rows are also good for your shoulders IMO, to balance out all the presses.
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    Registered User BeginnerGainz's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by air2fakie View Post
    Not sure why you're judging the effectiveness of vertical and horizontal pulls by shoulder joint flexion. Judge them by gains.

    If you feel you're wasting your time doing barbell rows then you're doing them wrong. You should do both, but heavy rows don't take a back seat to vertical pulls, esp chinups and lat pulldowns.

    Rows are also good for your shoulders IMO, to balance out all the presses.
    Currently I do both but on different days 4x8 close grip reverse lat pulldowns (working on chin ups now ) on Monday and 5x5 rows@235 on Friday. I feel them in the same muscles, hence the question.

    I row not upright like as in a Yates row, but I deadlift the bar, push the hips back and basically row into my stomach. I hold it at the top for a split second and control the eccentric to feel my lats and upper back stretch. No I don’t use momentum, rows have always been a strong movement for me.
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    Registered User BeginnerGainz's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by air2fakie View Post
    Not sure why you're judging the effectiveness of vertical and horizontal pulls by shoulder joint flexion. Judge them by gains.

    If you feel you're wasting your time doing barbell rows then you're doing them wrong. You should do both, but heavy rows don't take a back seat to vertical pulls, esp chinups and lat pulldowns.

    Rows are also good for your shoulders IMO, to balance out all the presses.
    That is exactly why I started doing them and found out quickly I’m good at them. The curl bros all stop and stare...
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    Registered User BeginnerGainz's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by LifterWest View Post
    I'd think the same argument can be made for bench and OHP....
    Thank you for not referring to OHP as simply “the press”
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    Registered User air2fakie's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by BeginnerGainz View Post
    The curl bros all stop and stare...
    Well then it's a waste of time - we don't do rows for the bros. Just like you don't do curls for the bros.
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  10. #10
    Replies in 1/2 hr - 3 day GeneralSerpant's Avatar
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    The bottom traps and the rear delts are the prime movers of the elbow when going behind the body. The lats pull the arm in all the way up to that point, which is fractional rom compared to full shoulder adduction from abduction.
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