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  1. #391
    Registered User Le234's Avatar
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    I thought Reyes won..3,,maybe 4-1..3-2..?
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  2. #392
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    Originally Posted by nomnom1989 View Post
    jones was advancing most of the fight

    face it he won
    Ok, can we all just agree on these two things:

    1) Him advancing shouldn’t have won him any rounds. Especially round 2, where he was outstruck by a decent margin. You walk towards your opponent. Your opponent punches you at a 2-1 ratio. Somehow you’re winning? Jones outstruck and overall won rounds 4 and 5 regardless of just being the guy advancing.
    2) The takedowns were completely irrelevant. Jones wins rounds 4 and 5 regardless of the takedowns. So stop saying “he advanced, he won rounds 4 and 5, he had 2 takedowns”. Those takedowns did not help him win rounds 2, or 3 (the rounds in question)

    So the argument for Jones winning has to revolve around what he did in round 2, or 3 to win one of those rounds.
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  3. #393
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    So they gave round 2 to Jones but that was the round in the metrics that Reyes had the most significant strikes diff vs jones comparing to the other rounds? I think it was like a 13 strikes diff and close to double thrown for Reyes. What did Jones do that round that won him it?
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  4. #394
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    Originally Posted by OttomanEmpire View Post
    So they gave round 2 to Jones but that was the round in the metrics that Reyes had the most significant strikes diff vs jones comparing to the other rounds? I think it was like a 13 strikes diff and close to double thrown for Reyes. What did Jones do that round that won him it?
    Walked towards Reyes

    and then scored take downs...but in different rounds.

    Thus, Jones wins the 2nd.
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  5. #395
    Registered User Groce's Avatar
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    Reyes won that 3-2.
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  6. #396
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    lol @ ppl giving Dana sh!t, he (and his fighters) is telling you in your face that it's entertainment for the 14th time and your feathers are rusltlus maximus

    UFC format now is between unmarketed legit olympian events, and WWE money grubbing and fan attracting flamboyance, which one is it heading towards?

    brb Brock Lesnar one of the biggest UFC stars with an 8 fight lifetime record

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  7. #397
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  8. #398
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    So the judge basically says that he gave the rounds to Jones because he advanced during those rounds. He then posts the rules he used to score, which clearly say that aggression (I.e. advancing) “is only to be assessed if effective striking/grappling is 100% equal for both competitors”.

    Round 2:
    Jones - 22/37
    Reyes - 33/68

    Round 3:
    Jones - 19/34
    Reyes - 26/45

    Total for Rounds 2 and 3:
    Jones - 41/71
    Reyes - 59/113

    Jones threw 63% of the number of significant strikes. Landed 69% of the number of significant strikes. But yeah... let’s just call that “100% equal for both competitors” and award the round to the guy who walked forward.
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  9. #399
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  10. #400
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    this should put to rest any thoughts of Jones ever moving up to heavyweight. And besides, GSP & Silva are in the GOAT conversation for their title reigns. You don't need to move up, you just need a bunch of title defenses. We can clearly see now that Jones isn't levels above everyone, the competition has caught up.
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  11. #401
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    Originally Posted by kenjoshx View Post
    lol @ ppl giving Dana sh!t, he (and his fighters) is telling you in your face that it's entertainment for the 14th time and your feathers are rusltlus maximus

    UFC format now is between unmarketed legit olympian events, and WWE money grubbing and fan attracting flamboyance, which one is it heading towards?

    brb Brock Lesnar one of the biggest UFC stars with an 8 fight lifetime record

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  12. #402
    Registered User iloveus's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Groce View Post
    Reyes won that 3-2.
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  13. #403
    Registered User zhengterry's Avatar
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    Reyes landed more strikes but were they that effective? Jones landed more than half of attempted strikes, so I can see how that one judge gave him more rounds than others when also factoring effective aggression and octagon control.
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  14. #404
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    Originally Posted by zhengterry View Post
    Reyes landed more strikes but were they that effective? Jones landed more than half of attempted strikes, so I can see how that one judge gave him more rounds than others when also factoring effective aggression and octagon control.
    I get where you're coming from, but there is no fair way to establish damage done each strike, significant strikes are used and they decide which fighter was better that night. And since Reyes tanked Jones' 2 takedowns and didn't give him any advantages, their weight is weak; stats often aren't that straightforward to induce from, yet the judges mucked it up spectacularly.

    For perspective, Jones' last fight against T. Silva was won by a pubic hair margin split decision (very nearly lost). The strike stats were in Jones favor



    Dominick Reyes won yesterday, and Jon Jones kept the belt.
    Props for Reyes' immediate reaction of accepting the result and aiming to come back stronger
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  15. #405
    Registered User zhengterry's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by kenjoshx View Post
    I get where you're coming from, but there is no fair way to establish damage done each strike, significant strikes are used and they decide which fighter was better that night. And since Reyes tanked Jones' 2 takedowns and didn't give him any advantages, their weight is weak; stats often aren't that straightforward to induce from, yet the judges mucked it up spectacularly.

    For perspective, Jones' last fight against T. Silva was won by a pubic hair margin split decision (very nearly lost). The strike stats were in Jones favor



    Dominick Reyes won yesterday, and Jon Jones kept the belt.
    Props for Reyes' immediate reaction of accepting the result and aiming to come back stronger
    -landing more than 50 percent of strikes usually wins tho.
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  16. #406
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    Originally Posted by zhengterry View Post
    -landing more than 50 percent of strikes usually wins tho.
    pls grow up, landing more strikes wins

    brb landed 10/10 punches, but ate 20/30; I win usually
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  17. #407
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    watching the fight i thought 2 and 3 were close but leaning a bit towards reyes. if reyes wins those rounds 75% of the time, jones basically has two chances to win a 25% roll (across three cards). jones winning wasn't a robbery nor was it the worst decision on the card (murphy vs lee was).

    this and the santos fight were jones losing one round and winning two rounds, then flipping for the other two rounds (and getting a bit lucky in those results).

    for everyone relying solely on stats, who won this fight? (inb4 "it's different"): http://ufcstats.com/fight-details/829b3ee4145a1ae6

    fwiw, i thought reyes won but i think 48-47 either way was acceptable (49-46 is a stretch but there have been worse)
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  18. #408
    Sultan Mehmed II OttomanEmpire's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by zhengterry View Post
    -landing more than 50 percent of strikes usually wins tho.
    So if someone throws 100 and lands 50 vs the guy that throws 400 and lands 100 the first guy wins?

    On a side note my bro came to watch the fight last rounds and hes not a ufc fan well watcher, and when he heard the commentary about jones putting on pressure last rounds and watching the highlights, he's like this is so you forget about the first rounds and dont get mad when they give it to Jones.

    They need more clear cut and consistant scoring, in the press conference Jones was mentioning his takedowns at the end and how soem judges award more for those then striking like "guys you know take downs are a big deal like some are more then strikes" and how he won 4th and 5th...ok you won 2 and lost 3 ...and octagon control, you've had fights where a guy controls the pace throughout the fight and is the one chasing his opponent but then loses on strikes or takedowns or if the statistics were close the octagon control and pressure meant nothing. you've had fights where a guy gets a take down last minute and does nothing with it and despite being outstruk that round wins it. You recall fights where commentary is like if he secures a take down last seconds the round us his.

    You guys fan of standing up fights in the higher weight classes like when the ref stood latifi or broke them off against the fence? It's a lot of energy to toss a guy that weighs over 260 lbs and a lot of energy saved just lying on your back and let the ref stand you. Yea sure the guy wasn't moving positions and striking Lewis sides which didnt have as big effect but if you can toss a 260 lbs+ around it's on him for allowing himself to be in that position? Sure it was a boring fight for the audience but if someone is over 6 feet and I'm under that and the guy is known as a knock out fighter why would I try to strike with him when my strengths are seeping his energy away and just grind him out with my wrestling. If you let yourself to be pinned on the ground, it's on you not to just look at the ref to help you stand?
    Last edited by OttomanEmpire; 02-10-2020 at 04:02 AM.
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  19. #409
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    I watched the fight again, it kinda was Jones pressuring Reyes almost all fight long and Reyes answering with high volume mainly. Jones almost always seemed like the guy at the wheel. Reyes should have switched up his output when Bones was hurt because JJ only needed to watch that left hand whenever things got intense. Reyes wasn't cold blooded enough to finish.

    I can understand why Jones got the nod it really wasn't a clear cut victory for Reyes imo. But still the judge's cards weren't correct imo.

    Also Reyes barely was able to walk out the octagon, JJ walked out of there as if he just took a shet.
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  20. #410
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    Originally Posted by Midgetkiller View Post
    Also Reyes barely was able to walk out the octagon, JJ walked out of there as if he just took a shet.
    i recall jones saying after the fight in an interview that there was a rumor backstage that reyes blew an acl in the fight
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  21. #411
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  22. #412
    Apostel of Black Jesus Midgetkiller's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by scooterbrah View Post
    i recall jones saying after the fight in an interview that there was a rumor backstage that reyes blew an acl in the fight
    Fuk, goodbye rematch in 2020.
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  23. #413
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    Watching the fight live I score it 2, 4, and 5 for Jones, and I was rooting for Reyes. Going to rewatch it now.
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  24. #414
    Last edited by kenjoshx's Avatar
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    Can we take a moment to acknowledge what DC did there.

    Do you even know his history with Jones


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    Lol @ anyone using striking stats and pretending they are even 1% relevant. You must be retarded to think that. There are no words to describe the stupidity of people who feel that way. I can barely even fathom it.

    Even if you forget the fact that the "official striking stats" is some random neckbeard being paid minimum wage for pushing a button during the fight. One strike could be more signifcant than twenty other strikes. Honestly it baffles me how people give any importance at all to these stats. Do you understand anythign about fighting at all if you give importance to these stats? I don't think so.

    Originally Posted by kenjoshx View Post
    I get where you're coming from, but there is no fair way to establish damage done each strike, significant strikes are used and they decide which fighter was better that night. And since Reyes tanked Jones' 2 takedowns and didn't give him any advantages, their weight is weak; stats often aren't that straightforward to induce from, yet the judges mucked it up spectacularly.

    For perspective, Jones' last fight against T. Silva was won by a pubic hair margin split decision (very nearly lost). The strike stats were in Jones favor



    Dominick Reyes won yesterday, and Jon Jones kept the belt.
    Props for Reyes' immediate reaction of accepting the result and aiming to come back stronger
    I'm sure you would be happy to punch Francis Ngannou 10 times and he gets to punch you back only once. After all it's only the number that counts. LMAO what an extremely retarded thing to say.
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    Originally Posted by Barteh View Post
    Lol @ anyone using striking stats and pretending they are even 1% relevant.
    I hear ya. The significant strike counters aren't qualified.
    How qualified do you think the judges are? fr

    You're right. The damage of a landed strike is a big factor in a fight.
    Say two fighters hit each other the same number of times. One had higher striking power, and the other had a toughness beyond comprehension (say Yoel Romero). Neither could put the other out. Who would you give it to? what about if the first one was gassed out? And the 2nd one was mentally drained and close to throwing in the towel?

    Originally Posted by Barteh View Post
    I'm sure you would be happy to punch Francis Ngannou 10 times and he gets to punch you back only once. After all it's only the number that counts. LMAO what an extremely retarded thing to say.
    If you can't measure a fighters' toughness, endurance, or his damage done from a strike or attempted submission (all essential factors in a fight), what do you do to be fair?
    And why is it ok for judges to hide their scorecards until after fight is done?

    If Ngannou punched me but didn't knock me into an Askren, I still wouldn't let inexperienced, very corruptible men in an organization with a shady past to judge it based on elusive and hidden opinions, without some sort of unbiased data that weighs big to keep them in check. We do need judges for those unmeasurable aspects, but their questionable decisions should have less importance than easy to prove stats.

    Can't say I agree with disqualifying the importance of stats, brah. But I hope I changed your mind
    Last edited by kenjoshx; 02-11-2020 at 08:42 AM. Reason: strong grammar
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    Reyes won 3-2 IMO, but I wasnt surprised they gave Jones the nod and neither was my gf.

    Jones is one of only a couple cash cows that the UFC has left, no way they were going to let him lose on a battle that close overall. Sucks because Reyes worked his ass off and clearly won IMO, but thats combat sports for you! Crooked/paid off judges galore
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    One of my main early moments looking into the fight when I thought Reyes had a good chance was the effortless way he got up from the takedown by Chris Weidman.

    It was just all squat power and felt really familiar when I would do the same in rolling practice when squat was maxed.

    Later when I imagined them clashing I was like uh-oh this guy is a problem. His movement and strikes were “athletic” (lol at that word becoming a meme this fight)

    Then later I had the realization, dude, Jon is gonna have to respect this guy and take him down!

    And then I once again remeber what he did vs weidman and I was like holy chit. This guy is a legit problem for jacksonwink to deal with.

    That’s why in the fight when he got up from the takedown like that it should not only not lose him the fight but it was actually triumphant. For 3 rounds he was the better fighter. Period.
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  29. #419
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    Originally Posted by knightofday View Post
    Reyes won 3-2 IMO, but I wasnt surprised they gave Jones the nod and neither was my gf.

    Jones is one of only a couple cash cows that the UFC has left, no way they were going to let him lose on a battle that close overall. Sucks because Reyes worked his ass off and clearly won IMO, but thats combat sports for you! Crooked/paid off judges galore
    What makes him a cash cow that they can rely on him not losing a fight for a long time? Like this card on YouTube barely any views.The press conference only 700k views and highlights less then 200k. Fight motion also a few 100k views lol they made jones the star in that fight motion highlights like if you didnt watch the fight would assume it was one sided. For someone with his record he doesnt get a lot of views on ufc youtube page.
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  30. #420
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    Not surprised at all in the decision. They already building the Jones vs Israel fight. Can't have him lose now or the mystique is gone. Jones winning is good for business, period
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