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  1. #1
    Registered User jdesey's Avatar
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    Rep ranges and weights.

    Okay. I seem to get bogged down on this. And there’s really no agreed upon protocol out there.

    Keep in mind my main goal is building muscle size, not strength or endurance. I do 5 exercises for 4 sets on each day. Chest, Back, legs, shoulders, arms

    So,,, i think that excludes 30% max weight and 15-20 reps.

    I then could go 60% at 8-12 reps, wherever failure is.

    Or 80% of max weight and go 5-8 reps.

    Opinions please. I think i see max growth with the last option, I just feel like I’m working harder.
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  2. #2
    Registered User paulinkansas's Avatar
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    You look halfway decent in your avatar. Just lift and eat right. I think most people overcomplicate a lifting program.

    Whenever I have some sort of problem, I ask myself "Does this involve brain surgery or rocket science?" If the answer is no, I fix the problem myself. 23 furnished rental houses, all bill paid, weekly rate. I rent them to refinery contractors that are in town for short term jobs.
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  3. #3
    Registered User jdesey's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by paulinkansas View Post
    You look halfway decent in your avatar. Just lift and eat right. I think most people overcomplicate a lifting program.

    Whenever I have some sort of problem, I ask myself "Does this involve brain surgery or rocket science?" If the answer is no, I fix the problem myself. 23 furnished rental houses, all bill paid, weekly rate. I rent them to refinery contractors that are in town for short term jobs.
    Thanks. And yes what I’m doing is working. Always looking to improve.
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    Bands and chains FurtadoZ9's Avatar
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    Registered User rsid97's Avatar
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    Most proper programs should have that somewhat figured out for you.

    I never really agreed with this mindset of trying to be in one camp or the other. If you have two tools at your disposal, why only use one?

    With most muscle groups I think there is an argument in favor of training in a variety of different rep ranges, depending on the muscle group and the excercise of choice.
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    REMAIN INDOORS SuffolkPunch's Avatar
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    You are looking for simple answers - if there was one true way of doing it, we would all be doing it.

    The answer is actually quite simple but probably not what you want to hear - and that is you can use anything from 30-85% of 1RM and make it work.

    You have to find what works for you because of the wide range of variation from one person to the next.

    Also, there could be some merit in combining higher and lower weights. Eg. heavy/lower reps for major compounds and lighter/higher reps for isolations <- closest thing to a "standard" approach you will find.
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    Registered User jdesey's Avatar
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    Hmmm. Time under tension

    There’s a whole different way of looking at it. Our muscles don’t really know if it is six reps or 12 reps or 18 reps. Depending on your tempo that could be all kinds of different totals of time under tension. Great video on posting below that recommends 40 seconds of effort. I did today on my shoulder routine by utilizing a stopwatch. I think this may be a superior way of looking at it and method of training.


    https://youtu.be/oKrso8dQLOk
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  8. #8
    Registered User DCSpartan's Avatar
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    Time under Tension isnt the miracle people make it out to be. It has a place, but for most of us we should just be adding poundage to the bar. I think paused bench presses and squats yiled more benefits for intermediates than TUT. YMMV.
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    Bands and chains FurtadoZ9's Avatar
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    It's fun to throw tempo work in, every now and then. Check this out Desey:

    https://forum.bodybuilding.com/showt...post_112784711

    Hopefully will shed some light or you could pull some ideas from there.
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  10. #10
    Registered User Filmbuff81's Avatar
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    Why not just work a variety of rep ranges?

    I work from 3 reps to 20 or more.

    Phat, phul, Eric helms’ routines, and many more use a lot of rep ranges and tend to stick to a more moderate range of like 6-12 because you can accumulate a lot of volume there and not beat yourself up.

    But they all will utilize reps above and below that.

    If you find a particular rep range works for you, you can target the majority of your work there and then sprinkle in higher and lower reps where you see fit.

    Edit: having said that if you don’t feel comfortable doing that, just pick a proven routine and run it into the ground or continue what you’re doing and keep working hard. That will yield just as good of results as anything else in the long run.
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  11. #11
    Registered User hardyboysare's Avatar
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    My view of TUT in a nutshell basically:-

    https://muscleevo.net/time-under-tension/

    And more stuff into it:-

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25601394

    https://www.strongerbyscience.com/ca...muscle-growth/ - about a fifth down the page for TUT discussion.

    Is overblown IMO is a short statement and will most likely negatively effective strength and volume output. Not to mention TUT would technically increase the more volume/ weight you moved so you are doing it anyway increasing how long you hold a lift I doubt is going to make a superior growth but if you like it carry on.

    As for rep ranges:-

    Originally Posted by SuffolkPunch View Post
    You are looking for simple answers - if there was one true way of doing it, we would all be doing it.

    The answer is actually quite simple but probably not what you want to hear - and that is you can use anything from 30-85% of 1RM and make it work.

    You have to find what works for you because of the wide range of variation from one person to the next.

    Also, there could be some merit in combining higher and lower weights. Eg. heavy/lower reps for major compounds and lighter/higher reps for isolations <- closest thing to a "standard" approach you will find.
    ^^^

    This
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  12. #12
    Registered User jdesey's Avatar
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    Omg!

    Omg! Wholly crap! After 40 years lifting I’m still learning. I took the advice in Greg’s video i posted and use a Tabata timer on my phone. Turns out I was done with my 6-8 rep set at 20 seconds. Damm! I slowed it down big time, lowered the weights and l40 seconds is a long time. So now at 16 sets per body part I’m under tension fir 640 seconds vs. my 20 sets that was like 400 seconds tut. My arms feel like jello. !
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  13. #13
    Registered User Filmbuff81's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by jdesey View Post
    Omg! Wholly crap! After 40 years lifting I’m still learning. I took the advice in Greg’s video i posted and use a Tabata timer on my phone. Turns out I was done with my 6-8 rep set at 20 seconds. Damm! I slowed it down big time, lowered the weights and l40 seconds is a long time. So now at 16 sets per body part I’m under tension fir 640 seconds vs. my 20 sets that was like 400 seconds tut. My arms feel like jello. !
    just because your arms feel like jello it doesn’t mean you’re going to grow more from
    The added time it took you to lift the weight.

    You may get the same or less growth(if you didn’t get close enough to failure since you were lifting less weight for less sets) for a bunch of added wasted time.
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    Registered User UK44's Avatar
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    Most fitting activities should have that somewhat comprehends for you.

    I never genuinely agreed with this attitude of endeavoring to be in one camp or the other. If you have two mechanical assemblies accessible to you, why simply use one?

    With most muscle packs I think there is a conflict for planning in a wide scope of rep ranges, dependent upon the muscle gathering and the action of choice.
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    Bands and chains FurtadoZ9's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by UK44 View Post
    Most fitting activities should have that somewhat comprehends for you.

    I never genuinely agreed with this attitude of endeavoring to be in one camp or the other. If you have two mechanical assemblies accessible to you, why simply use one?

    With most muscle packs I think there is a conflict for planning in a wide scope of rep ranges, dependent upon the muscle gathering and the action of choice.
    Wat
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  16. #16
    Registered User hardyboysare's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Filmbuff81 View Post
    just because your arms feel like jello it doesn’t mean you’re going to grow more from
    The added time it took you to lift the weight.

    You may get the same or less growth(if you didn’t get close enough to failure since you were lifting less weight for less sets) for a bunch of added wasted time.
    This.

    OP you could do a wall squat and hold for 5 mins and that will turn your legs to jello.

    Do you really think that would cause growth vs lifting moderate to heavy weight back Squats for a set amount of reps done in about 20 secs per set??

    But you will believe what you want and disregard anything that says otherwise so carry on.
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  17. #17
    Registered User rsid97's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by jdesey View Post
    Omg! Wholly crap! After 40 years lifting I’m still learning. I took the advice in Greg’s video i posted and use a Tabata timer on my phone. Turns out I was done with my 6-8 rep set at 20 seconds. Damm! I slowed it down big time, lowered the weights and l40 seconds is a long time. So now at 16 sets per body part I’m under tension fir 640 seconds vs. my 20 sets that was like 400 seconds tut. My arms feel like jello. !
    The individual that you speak about makes a ton of unsupported claims under the statement of,'I have a masters degree and held world records so just trust me, okay?!". Fact of the matter is, the things he says is vastly over simplified, argues against science when it doesn't support his personal opinions, tries to utilize science when it backs up a point he's making, and in the end, often ends up with a very narrow minded view of something (Although he does have a valid point in some other cases).

    TUT has it's place and time, but just scrapping aside intensity, proximity to failure, progressive overload in strength, type of muscle group being trained, overall volume, reps, sets and instead just dissolving all that into TUT is not the way to go about things. Just because your arms felt like jello doesn't mean you're making substantial and sustainable long term muscular development. If that was the case then everyone would just pick up the 1kg dumbells and go into an isometric hold till x seconds and then +1 second every week till they're in the gym for several hours. Or better yet, just flex infront of a mirror till you're bored, plenty of additional TUT. Doesn't work that way though.
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  18. #18
    Weak and foolish OldFartTom's Avatar
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    Usage can differ. When I use "volume" I'm using it to mean total tonnage shifted (total of weight * reps)

    Studies (too lazy to dig out now, available if needed) show that hypertrophy is dominated by adaption to volume, other factors exist but are comparatively very minor.

    The weekly volume for some muscle group is the most practical reliable indicator, and moooaaar is biggerrer.

    However, the stimulus needs to be above some intensity (using "intensity" to mean a percentage of 1rep max). So an ultra marathon runner may accumulate enormous volume but not develop freak enormous legs as intensity is low.

    Where's the "magic" intensity number to grow a muscle? There isn't an exact number and it's variable between individuals but let's say 65% for argument and it'll be near to that anyway.

    If you can juggle your weight/reps/sets to get the most volume done (and recover from it) then how you do it is up to you. That's why there are so many opinions on the best approach for hypertrophy.

    Personally I favour the idea of a few heavy sets followed by a bunch of lighter volume sets, but I can't back that up with credible research.
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    Originally Posted by jdesey View Post
    Okay. I seem to get bogged down on this. And there’s really no agreed upon protocol out there.

    Keep in mind my main goal is building muscle size, not strength or endurance. I do 5 exercises for 4 sets on each day. Chest, Back, legs, shoulders, arms

    So,,, i think that excludes 30% max weight and 15-20 reps.

    I then could go 60% at 8-12 reps, wherever failure is.

    Or 80% of max weight and go 5-8 reps.

    Opinions please. I think i see max growth with the last option, I just feel like I’m working harder.
    too much "science" in this.

    WORK HARDER bro! Go check out Greg Doucette on youtube.. funny professional out of Canada.

    100% effort all the time.

    think of it this way.. if when you put the weights down, someone said, for $1000 per rep, how many more could you do? if there is more in the tank, you aren't working hard enough. most people don't.
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