What do you think of Rogan's interview w/ Cmdr. David Favor re: UFO sighting he had?

[MiscInformed]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eco2s3-0zsQ

I usually dismiss the idea of extraterrestrial UFOs because:
- there's ZERO credible physical evidence.
- there is a very strong argument about time/space/distance that makes it highly improbable that even if there was other intelligent life, that we'd just happen to be close enough to them in both time and space, for them to have discovered that our planet contains life and be willing and able to visit us, with peaceful intentions.
- UFO field is full of nutters, scammers, and hoaxers.

All that said, the fighter pilot had some interesting things to say. I can't dismiss it or explain it, unless he's a practiced liar, which I don't think he is.

Keep in mind, I'm just asking what you think of the conversation between Rogan and the former fighter pilot. Disregard the millennial filmmaker (Corbell) who sat in on the show. He gives off a carnival barker and BS'er vibe to me.

[badbl00d]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eco2s3-0zsQ

I usually dismiss the idea of extraterrestrial UFOs because:
- there's ZERO credible physical evidence.
- there is a very strong argument about time/space/distance that makes it highly improbable that even if there was other intelligent life, that we'd just happen to be close enough to them in both time and space, for them to have discovered that our planet contains life and be willing and able to visit us, with peaceful intentions.
- UFO field is full of nutters, scammers, and hoaxers.

All that said, the fighter pilot had some interesting things to say. I can't dismiss it or explain it, unless he's a practiced liar, which I don't think he is.

Keep in mind, I'm just asking what you think of the conversation between Rogan and the former fighter pilot. Disregard the millennial filmmaker (Corbell) who sat in on the show. He gives off a carnival barker and BS'er vibe to me.

That's what I hated about it. I thought the podcast would have been so much better without him.

[Xavier336]

Started the podcast yesterday but haven't finished it. Not a fan of the Jeremy dude. One thing David said that stuck out to me is it's a pretty lonely universe if we are the only life forms. I agree with this, it's hard to believe as vast as the universe is we're the only beings. If UFO's or other forms of life exists is raises a lot of questions. Why do they "visit", what do they want, just how advanced is their civilization, etc. All in all, I'm not sure but I would like to believe. Just not there yet.

[Schnitzl]

So he described the "thing" flying really close by him, cbf searching but it was something like 500 feet away he said. How can he not describe it if he saw it that close? I don't know, with all the story and radar picking it up and them flying so close to them, only thing they have as a visual proof is some dot on the jet radar that disappears with the screen flickering like it's 1956.
We have smartphones that record 4k and had them back when the incident took place, how the **** can't we get a full HD SPACESHIP on the record *******s.
Fukken white and black blurry dots is the best we can come up with as proof of alien life? By the US military? Get the fook outta here, who the fook is this guy.

[numberguy12]

Nope, don't buy any of this. Sagan was on to something when he used the phrase "extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence"- none of this is extradorinary. It's always the same 3 vague blurry videos, which include things that can easily possibly just be terrestrial phenomena.

They are typically being promoted by UFO organizations like To the Stars Academy, and put on things like the History Channel right next to Ancient Aliens. A little research into this David Fravor guy (you spelled his name wrong in the title) reveals some guy that seems to be well known in UFO circles- a guy who clearly seems to have UFOs on the mind- heck he tells Joe how he used to try and fake UFO sightings for people on the ground- and hence a biased perspective. Just because you are a fighter pilot does not mean you are some perfect, unbiased source of information about these things. In fact, it is fairly well known that pilots etc are NOT the best observers regarding UFOs in the sky- they are busy with other things, for example keeping the aircraft up in the sky.

A brief google search for rational skeptic takes on these 3 videos shows you all you need to know. This is not extraordinary evidence, if we are taking about beings traversing many light years to play games with us in the sky (lol).

I highly recommend the book by Carl Sagan, "The Demon Haunted World".

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Demon-Haunted_World

[EmmaW4tson]

Always lol @ the "travel lights years to visit us" line. How do you know they dont fold space and time?

Go back 1000 years and show humans what we got now and see the reactions. Now imagine a race several thousands years ahead of us at this point. The universe is too big, even bigger than human ego for it to be empty.

[numberguy12]

Always lol @ the "travel lights years to visit us" line. How do you know they dont fold space and time?

Go back 1000 years and show humans what we got now and see the reactions. Now imagine a race several thousands years ahead of us at this point. The universe is too big, even bigger than human ego for it to be empty.

Without even getting into speculative notions like wormholes.....this wouldn't change, for example, the perspective much. Just replace "travel light years" with "folding space and time".

Occam's Razor:

-It's terrestrial phenomena in the videos
-Super duper advanced Alien beings managed to fold literally space-time and create wormholes, all to arrive at earth and play games of hide and seek in the sky.

In fact, from the standpoint of Occam's razor, this might even be worse lol.

[Mike86er]

Without even getting into speculative notions like wormholes.....this wouldn't change, for example, the perspective much. Just replace "travel light years" with "folding space and time".

Occam's Razor:

-It's terrestrial phenomena in the videos
-Super duper advanced Alien beings managed to fold literally space-time and create wormholes, all to arrive at earth and play games of hide and seek in the sky.

In fact, from the standpoint of Occam's razor, this might even be worse lol.

Brb, fold space time as you are so advanced you can do things we have no concept of how to even theoretically do it.

Brb, always seem to navigate this in crafts which look remarkably similar to what 1950s pulp writers imagined alien spacecraft to look like

[EmmaW4tson]

Without even getting into speculative notions like wormholes.....this wouldn't change, for example, the perspective much. Just replace "travel light years" with "folding space and time".

Occam's Razor:

-It's terrestrial phenomena in the videos
-Super duper advanced Alien beings managed to fold literally space-time and create wormholes, all to arrive at earth and play games of hide and seek in the sky.

In fact, from the standpoint of Occam's razor, this might even be worse lol.

The fact you're applying human relative thought to something far more advanced than ourselves outside of this world just proves my point about the human ego being incredibly massive.

You didnt disprove my point either about the 1000 years ago thing. If human tech came from 2000+ years in the future to now do you have any idea what we would have?

Whether these aliens visit us is a different thing entirely.

[5x10]

Legit to me
4 people saw it, all upper ranking military with time in the sky
3 radars saw it, 2 being very advanced radars
Government acknowledges it

[JohnTS1]

You gotta be an egotistical beta cuck to not believe aliens or other intelligent beings exist in our own solar system and beyond.

[numberguy12]

The fact you're applying human relative thought to something far more advanced than ourselves outside of this world just proves my point about the human ego being incredibly massive.

You didnt disprove my point either about the 1000 years ago thing. If human tech came from 2000+ years in the future to now do you have any idea what we would have?

Whether these aliens visit us is a different thing entirely.

Not really addressing the content of my post at all, so not worth a response.

Legit to me
4 people saw it, all upper ranking military with time in the sky
3 radars saw it, 2 being very advanced radars
Government acknowledges it

Sorry, some dude who is known in UFO circles going on about UFOs, using a vague video that can be explained otherwise, is not extraordinary evidence in itself. Why is it always the same 3 short clips being shown? The amount of surveillance of our skies is pretty staggering, from govts to science organizations to who knows what, even people looking out of airplanes. Amazing how it's not more common to see these alien crafts just wandering about out there, with real, repeatable scientific observations capable of being made. Nope, never any of this suspiciously.

The govt said it was Unexplained Aerial Phenomena. This isn't an acknowledgment of aliens lol. Anything can be unexplained aerial phenomena, including birds or balloons in the sky.

[arod204]

So he described the "thing" flying really close by him, cbf searching but it was something like 500 feet away he said. How can he not describe it if he saw it that close? I don't know, with all the story and radar picking it up and them flying so close to them, only thing they have as a visual proof is some dot on the jet radar that disappears with the screen flickering like it's 1956.
We have smartphones that record 4k and had them back when the incident took place, how the **** can't we get a full HD SPACESHIP on the record *******s.
Fukken white and black blurry dots is the best we can come up with as proof of alien life? By the US military? Get the fook outta here, who the fook is this guy.

Video was from 2004.

[AlvinDavenport]

So he described the "thing" flying really close by him, cbf searching but it was something like 500 feet away he said. How can he not describe it if he saw it that close? I don't know, with all the story and radar picking it up and them flying so close to them, only thing they have as a visual proof is some dot on the jet radar that disappears with the screen flickering like it's 1956.
We have smartphones that record 4k and had them back when the incident took place, how the **** can't we get a full HD SPACESHIP on the record *******s.
Fukken white and black blurry dots is the best we can come up with as proof of alien life? By the US military? Get the fook outta here, who the fook is this guy.

I saw a ufo back 2012. Inb4 "everything changed after 2012”. While looking at it I didn't think to even record it with my phone. Even if I did, the camera phones sucked back then.

[engj]

So he described the "thing" flying really close by him, cbf searching but it was something like 500 feet away he said. How can he not describe it if he saw it that close? I don't know, with all the story and radar picking it up and them flying so close to them, only thing they have as a visual proof is some dot on the jet radar that disappears with the screen flickering like it's 1956.
We have smartphones that record 4k and had them back when the incident took place, how the **** can't we get a full HD SPACESHIP on the record *******s.
Fukken white and black blurry dots is the best we can come up with as proof of alien life? By the US military? Get the fook outta here, who the fook is this guy.

I just listened, and the FLIR pod tracking it recording was supposed to be the plane station keeping at 20k feet.

Next time you fly somewhere by an ocean grab that phone and take a 4k video of a 40 foot boat on the water 2-5 miles away from 20k feet above at 200kts, I doubt it looks as good as this does. I spend a lot of time in really remote arctic regions and am always plane-spotting. I have tried to take pictures of planes 10k ft overhead (with a good camera/glass combo not a cell phone) and the images are never as clear as you would like.

Nope, don't buy any of this. Sagan was on to something when he used the phrase "extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence"- none of this is extradorinary. It's always the same 3 vague blurry videos, which include things that can easily possibly just be terrestrial phenomena.

There are no terrestrial phenomenon we know of that can make the maneuvers they are claiming, particularly with no engine plume on IR. So what that leaves is observer error or fabrication.

I have read some of the explanation on skeptics debunking with terrestrial explanations, birds and balloons and parallax error influencing perceived speed. What they don't address is that these are trained observers who have spent thousands of hours observing other air and water craft from the seat. They also fail to address this guy claiming/stating that there is radar telemetry recording that back the speeds and telemetry that the FLIR pod videos suggest.

I'm not sold on any of this, but unless you believe that these reports are a total fabrication or prank the Navy is playing on people I cant write it off entirely. I would be more likely to buy that this is some undisclosed technology being developed rather than something extra terrestrial. Even then this level of technology would suggest some level of breakthrough in physics, I have a hard time believing nobody would at least have some concept of a terrestrial explanation.

[5x10]

Not really addressing the content of my post at all, so not worth a response.



Sorry, some dude who is known in UFO circles going on about UFOs, using a vague video that can be explained otherwise, is not extraordinary evidence in itself. Why is it always the same 3 short clips being shown? The amount of surveillance of our skies is pretty staggering, from govts to science organizations to who knows what, even people looking out of airplanes. Amazing how it's not more common to see these alien crafts just wandering about out there, with real, repeatable scientific observations capable of being made. Nope, never any of this suspiciously.

The govt said it was Unexplained Aerial Phenomena. This isn't an acknowledgment of aliens lol. Anything can be unexplained aerial phenomena, including birds or balloons in the sky.

dont care what you think

[XterraRob]

Pilots see things all of the time, but it's not beneficial to anyone's career to report it. Just the stigma associated with UFOs. I was on shift during an incident that occurred over Iraq, but you'll never see that report. Or other reports like it. Or hear from people who haven't made reports. This isn't some phenomena that people are eagerly ready to just publicize as much as they can. People see things, acknowledge it seemed out of the ordinary and go on with their lives.

[numberguy12]

dont care what you think

Of course you don't. You'd rather just be gullible and believe whatever is thrown at you in a vague blurry video lmao. To hell with any kind of rational skepticism.

[numberguy12]

I just listened, and the FLIR pod tracking it recording was supposed to be the plane station keeping at 20k feet.

Next time you fly somewhere by an ocean grab that phone and take a 4k video of a 40 foot boat on the water 2-5 miles away from 20k feet above at 200kts, I doubt it looks as good as this does. I spend a lot of time in really remote arctic regions and am always plane-spotting. I have tried to take pictures of planes 10k ft overhead (with a good camera/glass combo not a cell phone) and the images are never as clear as you would like.



There are no terrestrial phenomenon we know of that can make the maneuvers they are claiming, particularly with no engine plume on IR. So what that leaves is observer error or fabrication.

I have read some of the explanation on skeptics debunking with terrestrial explanations, birds and balloons and parallax error influencing perceived speed. What they don't address is that these are trained observers who have spent thousands of hours observing other air and water craft from the seat. They also fail to address this guy claiming/stating that there is radar telemetry recording that back the speeds and telemetry that the FLIR pod videos suggest.

I'm not sold on any of this, but unless you believe that these reports are a total fabrication or prank the Navy is playing on people I cant write it off entirely. I would be more likely to buy that this is some undisclosed technology being developed rather than something extra terrestrial. Even then this level of technology would suggest some level of breakthrough in physics, I have a hard time believing nobody would at least have some concept of a terrestrial explanation.

"Maneuvers they are claiming".

Well that is indeed very questionable, as anyone knows people aren't in general great observers, and do not accurately report what they see. The words of a guy describing what happened he thought he saw 15 years ago is certainly not extradordinary evidence by any stretch of the imagination. From the wiki page about the incident:

According to Joe Nickell writing for the Skeptical Inquirer, there are differing versions of Fravor's account, including a "truly curious document that tells Fravor's story in the form of a military-style briefing" designed to create a "pseudo top-secret appearance". Nickell identified the document as "a third-person account of an interview with Fravor, produced by a fringe-ideas group called To the Stars Academy of Arts and Science". Regarding the visual sightings reported by Fravor, Nickell questioned how he could see "what a forty-foot object was doing from forty miles away" and characterized the "confusion and incompleteness in the reports" of the training mission as a "comedy of errors".[23] Nickell and astronomer and former Air Force pilot James E. McGaha speculated that reports of churning water could have been caused by a submerging submarine, the visual sightings could have been of a reconnaissance drone, and that "one video image showing an object suddenly zooming off screen was likely caused by the plane's banking while the camera was stopped at the end of its sweep".[23]

Nickell further explains that this was Fravor's first military assignment with the U.S. Navy's F-18 Super Hornet, and as a result, the experience "obviously rattled him."[23] He comments that several reports of the incident mention that when Fravor returned to the USS Nimitz following the encounter, most of the personnel on the carrier did not take the encounter seriously, reportedly making fun of Fravor and playing alien movies on the ship's onboard closed-circuit TV system, implying that perhaps they knew something Fravor did not. Nickell also notes that the incident had apparently not been considered serious enough to warrant a debriefing of either Fravor, the other pilots, or the radar operator.[23]

[engj]

Of course you don't. You'd rather just be gullible and believe whatever is thrown at you in a vague blurry video lmao. To hell with any kind of rational skepticism.

Everyone should be skeptical, but the loudest self proclaimed skeptics seem to fall instantly into the 'always a rational explanation/must debunk/lol at these tinfoil-hatters' category. There were educated people who laughed at doctors trying to wash evil spirits and invisible voodoo off their hands and instruments because nobody believed in microbiology yet. Its just a different flavor of sheep.

If people want to be intellectually honest they should also leave a little bit of room for extraordinary ideas possibly being right.

[engj]

"Maneuvers they are claiming".

Well that is indeed very questionable, as anyone knows people aren't in general great observers, and do not accurately report what they see. The words of a guy describing what happened he thought he saw 15 years ago is certainly not extradordinary evidence by any stretch of the imagination. From the wiki page about the incident:

You are writing off the related experience of a senior naval command officer by quoting the interpretation of an english major turned paranormal investigator who puts on costumes to speak at SCICON events.

There are unanswered questions allover this story, but you need something better than a professional skeptic saying 'oh it was a submarine and a drone and a weather balloon and you remember it wrong' before I will shut the door on it.

[numberguy12]

Everyone should be skeptical, but the loudest self proclaimed skeptics seem to fall instantly into the 'always a rational explanation/must debunk/lol at these tinfoil-hatters' category. There were educated people who laughed at doctors trying to wash evil spirits and invisible voodoo off their hands and instruments because nobody believed in microbiology yet. Its just a different flavor of sheep.

If people want to be intellectually honest they should also leave a little bit of room for extraordinary ideas possibly being right.

Lol the skeptical position simply takes the stance: it doesn't make sense to accept extraordinary claims like supernatural hypotheses, ghosts, crystal healing, UFOs from distant stars/galaxies away roaming our skies......until, for example, extraordinary evidence is provided. Seems pretty rational to me. Am I a "sheep" for believing that crystals don't have magic healing powers, that the alignment of stars in the sky don't have influence in your daily life (astrology), or that gold cant be produced from base metals by alchemy? Er....ok, lol.

The "evidence" presented in this thread is not extraordinary evidence for alien life visiting earth, nuff said.

[numberguy12]

You are writing off the related experience of a senior naval command officer by quoting the interpretation of an english major turned paranormal investigator who puts on costumes to speak at SCICON events.

There are unanswered questions allover this story, but you need something better than a professional skeptic saying 'oh it was a submarine and a drone and a weather balloon and you remember it wrong' before I will shut the door on it.

Ranking doesn't mean much here lol, in fact as I already stated above, this fighter pilot dude seems to be well known in UFO circles, and this to me immediately suggests there is an agenda afoot. Regardless, the points made in that Wiki quote are definitely something to acknowledge.

I don't care what your rank is, your personal story of what you thought happened years ago- a story btw, which seems to differ in different accounts- is simply not an example of extraordinary evidence, sorry.

[AltarOfPlagues]

its way more likely that a guy was insane or hallucinating and the flir did something fuked up, than to think that some creatures crossed space to fly around off the coast of san diego

so some alien creature has to

1. exist contemporaneously with us



2. choose to populate the milky way (400 billion stars)

3. go otherwise as of yet undetected (dyson swarm, asteroid mining, ships etc)

4. drive all the fukin way here to our solar system in an undetectable spaceship

5. then proceed to drive around off the coast of san diego in a ship that is orders of magnitude dumber tech (and often man-able sized??) than what they just crossed space with



no single person or even small group of people's eyewitness accounts are evidence enough to prove alien interstellar travel.

[elterrible987]

Without even getting into speculative notions like wormholes.....this wouldn't change, for example, the perspective much. Just replace "travel light years" with "folding space and time".

Occam's Razor:

-It's terrestrial phenomena in the videos
-Super duper advanced Alien beings managed to fold literally space-time and create wormholes, all to arrive at earth and play games of hide and seek in the sky.

In fact, from the standpoint of Occam's razor, this might even be worse lol.

Occam's razor these are Aliens.

Humans really only a few 100k old. Planet is 4 billion years old and universe is 15 billion, you telling me nobody out there way more advanced than us?

For those ships to be human made, they would have to be made in complete secrecy so far advanced from anything commercially available, it just is near impossible. It is more likely produced by Aliens.

lol at all the pathetic "solutions" that its not a space ship, oh its ball lighting, right like that gets radar hits.

[5x10]

Decades of unexplained military sightings , millions in military investigations

Miscers “weather balloons and people with bed eye sight”

Glad we got the miscers on the case

[elterrible987]

its way more likely that a guy was insane or hallucinating and the flir did something fuked up, than to think that some creatures crossed space to fly around off the coast of san diego

so some alien creature has to

1. exist contemporaneously with us



2. choose to populate the milky way (400 billion stars)

3. go otherwise as of yet undetected (dyson swarm, asteroid mining, ships etc)

4. drive all the fukin way here to our solar system in an undetectable spaceship

5. then proceed to drive around off the coast of san diego in a ship that is orders of magnitude dumber tech (and often man-able sized??) than what they just crossed space with



no single person or even small group of people's eyewitness accounts are evidence enough to prove alien interstellar travel.

negative.

It is:
1 - on radar on multiple ships
2 - on sonar, on multiple ships
3 - on black and white video
4 - on infrared flir video
5 - visually spotted by naked eye by multiple pilots

you telling me that all these systems had a fault at the same time and all these pilots hallucinated at the same time?

hogwash

[AltarOfPlagues]

Occam's razor these are Aliens.

Humans really only a few 100k old. Planet is 4 billion years old and universe is 15 billion, you telling me nobody out there way more advanced than us?

For those ships to be human made, they would have to be made in complete secrecy so far advanced from anything commercially available, it just is near impossible. It is more likely produced by Aliens.

lol at all the pathetic "solutions" that its not a space ship, oh its ball lighting, right like that gets radar hits.

it is (impossible to prove, arguably) more likely that a UFO is human misperception within a simulation created by a highly advanced alien, than a ship manned by a highly advanced alien.

negative.

It is:
1 - on radar on multiple ships
2 - on sonar, on multiple ships
3 - on black and white video
4 - on infrared flir video
5 - visually spotted by naked eye by multiple pilots

you telling me that all these systems had a fault at the same time and all these pilots hallucinated at the same time?

hogwash

bayesian inference says so. i believe that what they saw was another jet.

you have to understand a little bit about probability theory. its not based on feelings, and in fact often feels counter-intuitive.


edit- humans are by nature dogchit at probability, thats why theres so many cognitive biases

[dizzin9]

Oh just testing out dat Area 51 tech

[AltarOfPlagues]

https://nickbostrom.com/extraterrestrial.pdf