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  1. #1
    Registered User xrayoki's Avatar
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    Just a personal opinion for people losing fat or have body dismorphic disorder.

    I keep seeing posts about cutting or bulking, posts about what body weight to aim for, people running forever on treadmills eating like a rabbit trying to burn all of this weight. But one answer I never really see is how more lean muscle equals a higher metabolic rate. So for all of you trying to burn fat by starving yourselves, hear me out...

    I am 5'8" 170 pounds. At this body weight people accuse me of being on steroids, +/- 5 pounds of body weight depending on body frame size. But one thing I noticed, is at this point, I can eat just about anything I want during the day, and at night when I sleep it will all burn off just to feed the lean muscle mass, which is why it becomes hard naturally for me to put on more weight.

    My point is, perhaps busting ass on the weights and building some serious lean muscle mass will help the guys on here who can just not lose that stubborn belly fat. Once you build enough muscle, if you somehow cannot burn fat after that naturally, then there must be a serious macro calorie problem. But I promise you, if you have chests that can bench 300, legs that can squat 400, and a lower body that can deadlift 500, it is very freaking hard to put on body fat, at least for me.

    Feel free to post if you disagree, would love to see what anyone has to say that may experience this differently. Keep up the grind
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  2. #2
    Nerd That Lifts MeadxHole's Avatar
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    Good thoughts - never hurts to build lean muscle. But I think you're more than 10% bf - somebody feel free to disagree with me.
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  3. #3
    Train hard play harder Tommy W.'s Avatar
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    A pound of muscle burns around 6 calories a day so it helps but not as much as people think and OP, you're more like 15-16% BF.
    If you don't get what you want you didn't want it bad enough
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  4. #4
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    Originally Posted by Tommy W. View Post
    A pound of muscle burns around 6 calories a day so it helps but not as much as people think and OP, you're more like 15-16% BF.
    A pound of muscle burns 6.5 calories an hour according to Google
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  5. #5
    Registered User hardyboysare's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by SmashMyAnus View Post
    A pound of muscle burns 6.5 calories an hour according to Google
    We wish. You need to look a bit deeper then the first link as this doesn't have scientific research.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3139779/
    https://www.myoleanfitness.com/does-muscle-burn-fat/
    https://muscleevo.net/muscle-metabolism/

    6 calories per lb sounds about right. Remember this is metabolic rate (resting calories burnt) obvious lean body mass does need more calories when combined with weight training as damaged LBM does need more energy to repair.

    https://www.flyconpower.com/wp-conte...bolic-rate.pdf
    Last edited by hardyboysare; 04-23-2019 at 01:20 PM.
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  6. #6
    Train hard play harder Tommy W.'s Avatar
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    Originally Posted by SmashMyAnus View Post
    A pound of muscle burns 6.5 calories an hour according to Google
    Hahaha.....no. Would be nice though

    Organ or tissue Daily metabolic rate
    Fat 2 calories per pound
    Muscle 6 calories per pound
    Liver 91 calories per pound
    Brain 109 calories per pound
    Heart 200 calories per pound
    Kidneys 200 calories per pound
    Last edited by Tommy W.; 04-23-2019 at 03:06 PM.
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  7. #7
    Registered User mavd's Avatar
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    In this forum today.... 5'8" men are skeletal at 147# and accused of steroid abuse at 170#, and half the forum men claim to be able to sh!+ 5#. So the difference between jacked and skeletal is around 13 pounds! No wonder woman are so worried about getting bulky :'D
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  8. #8
    I'm huge in Japan! xsquid99's Avatar
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    Good thoughts, but yeah sorry you're nowhere near 10%.
    All it takes is consistency, effort, proper nutrition, good programming, and TIME.
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  9. #9
    Registered User TheUnderdog83's Avatar
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    I weigh just under 170 myself, unfortunately if I ate whatever I wanted all day I’d be at about 4,000 calories.
    S: 375 pounds x 1 - 168-pound bodyweight 5/2019
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    OHP: 180 pounds x 1 - 168-pound bodyweight 5/2019
    A great guide to nutrition: https://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=173439001&p=1481919401&viewfull=1#post1481919401
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  10. #10
    Registered User broganoff's Avatar
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    Seems that there are plenty of strongmen and powerlifters with beer bellies out there.
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    Train hard play harder Tommy W.'s Avatar
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    Originally Posted by broganoff View Post
    Seems that there are plenty of strongmen and powerlifters with beer bellies out there.
    Good excuse to not watch the diet
    If you don't get what you want you didn't want it bad enough
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  12. #12
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    Originally Posted by broganoff View Post
    Seems that there are plenty of strongmen and powerlifters with beer bellies out there.
    Aint that the truth!
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  13. #13
    Registered User deano110's Avatar
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    I'm 5'10 and currently 195 lbs. Those feels when no-one accuses me of being on steroids and I can't eat what I want without putting on fat.

    In all seriousness, I agree with the OP's sentiment, in the context of your metabolic rate muscle tissue is expensive so your TDEE will be higher. If someone is looking to lose weight then I think the best advice would be to apply a combination of calorie restriction and resistance training.
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  14. #14
    Registered User broganoff's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by deano110 View Post
    I'm 5'10 and currently 195 lbs. Those feels when no-one accuses me of being on steroids and I can't eat what I want without putting on fat.

    In all seriousness, I agree with the OP's sentiment, in the context of your metabolic rate muscle tissue is expensive so your TDEE will be higher. If someone is looking to lose weight then I think the best advice would be to apply a combination of calorie restriction and resistance training.
    I wonder if there is a metabolic advantage with a hypertrophy based, higher rep program over a lower rep strength based program? I realize there are lots of other reasons why bodybuilders tend to be leaner than powerlifters, many of them inherent in the natures of the different sports themselves, but I do here of some well known trainers who say their programs are better at increasing metabolic rate.
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    Originally Posted by xrayoki View Post
    I keep seeing posts about cutting or bulking, posts about what body weight to aim for, people running forever on treadmills eating like a rabbit trying to burn all of this weight. But one answer I never really see is how more lean muscle equals a higher metabolic rate. So for all of you trying to burn fat by starving yourselves, hear me out...

    I am 5'8" 170 pounds. At this body weight people accuse me of being on steroids, +/- 5 pounds of body weight depending on body frame size. But one thing I noticed, is at this point, I can eat just about anything I want during the day, and at night when I sleep it will all burn off just to feed the lean muscle mass, which is why it becomes hard naturally for me to put on more weight.

    My point is, perhaps busting ass on the weights and building some serious lean muscle mass will help the guys on here who can just not lose that stubborn belly fat. Once you build enough muscle, if you somehow cannot burn fat after that naturally, then there must be a serious macro calorie problem. But I promise you, if you have chests that can bench 300, legs that can squat 400, and a lower body that can deadlift 500, it is very freaking hard to put on body fat, at least for me.

    Feel free to post if you disagree, would love to see what anyone has to say that may experience this differently. Keep up the grind
    Starving is definitely not the option indeed especially if you also looking for a lightweight loss, but everything should eat healthy junk food would make you out of shape, a bit of tipping its indeed good, making it over is I don't think is the option or atleast good!
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  16. #16
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    Originally Posted by broganoff View Post
    I wonder if there is a metabolic advantage with a hypertrophy based, higher rep program over a lower rep strength based program? I realize there are lots of other reasons why bodybuilders tend to be leaner than powerlifters, many of them inherent in the natures of the different sports themselves, but I do here of some well known trainers who say their programs are better at increasing metabolic rate.
    I don't think so - or very insignificant compared to simply altering your intake.

    The main reason bodybuilders are leaner is because they want muscle definition and if they compete, they would never win anything at higher BF% regardless of how much muscle they built. Powerlifters and strongmen don't want to reduce their calorie intake because it might impact strength and muscle gain - which they can't afford to do unless forced to by weight classes.

    Even with weight classes, the smarter lifter will not try to fit into a weight class that is too low for them because they know that trying to diet all the time is going to be counterproductive even though they are competing against smaller guys.

    What's more, if a lifter is underweight, they often eat up to the top of the weight class because there is a chance they'll get slightly more muscle. I noticed in the 2012 Olympics that the larger looking lifters were actually weaker - because they weighed the same but had more fat and less muscle (muscle being denser than fat, they looked larger).
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  17. #17
    Registered User deano110's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by broganoff View Post
    I wonder if there is a metabolic advantage with a hypertrophy based, higher rep program over a lower rep strength based program? I realize there are lots of other reasons why bodybuilders tend to be leaner than powerlifters, many of them inherent in the natures of the different sports themselves, but I do here of some well known trainers who say their programs are better at increasing metabolic rate.
    I agree with what SuffolkPunch has said above.

    From my experience, bodybuilders reach much lower levels of body fat during contest preparation but in their off-season will often will carry a high percentage of body fat than your regular powerlifter. Whereas powerlifters experience less of weight fluctuations when you look at their weight over the course of the year.

    Of course this can easily be disproved on an individual level but when you look at groups as a whole it seems true more often than not. Doesn't necessarily completely expel your theory behind hypertrophy vs strength based programming, however I think it has very little to do with it in comparison to the differing approaches to nutrition.
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  18. #18
    Registered User broganoff's Avatar
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    Thanks for the replies Suffolk and Deano. Yes, I know that the disparities in bf% for bodybuilding is mostly aesthetic, while powerlifters don't mind the extra fat if it allows them to pack on more muscle, or even provide some leverage for deadlifts or strongmen type stuff.

    The reason I asked is I've been hearing the guys on mind pump podcast talking about using a higher rep, lower rest period routine as a means of boosting metabolism. I was curious to hear if there may be some truth to that or if it was mostly bro science. They talk up the idea of "building up metabolism" but I question how much one can actually bump their metabolism with weight lifting, even with a well chosen and executed routine.
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    Originally Posted by broganoff View Post
    Thanks for the replies Suffolk and Deano. Yes, I know that the disparities in bf% for bodybuilding is mostly aesthetic, while powerlifters don't mind the extra fat if it allows them to pack on more muscle, or even provide some leverage for deadlifts or strongmen type stuff.

    The reason I asked is I've been hearing the guys on mind pump podcast talking about using a higher rep, lower rest period routine as a means of boosting metabolism. I was curious to hear if there may be some truth to that or if it was mostly bro science. They talk up the idea of "building up metabolism" but I question how much one can actually bump their metabolism with weight lifting, even with a well chosen and executed routine.
    Well if you do light enough weights at a fast enough pace then at some point it essentially becomes a form of cardio, where the emphasis is on getting the heart rate up, not muscle growth.

    I don't know if it actually changes your underlying BMR, but I have personally found that doing regular cardio (running for me) does indeed significantly alter my TDEE; I believe this is not only from the calories burned during the workout itself, but it does something to the body that keeps it revving higher 24/7 (maybe just from the recovery needs from cardio). When I'm on a roll and running 5 days/week it feels like I can eat whatever I want and not put on weight.
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  20. #20
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    Originally Posted by broganoff View Post
    Thanks for the replies Suffolk and Deano. Yes, I know that the disparities in bf% for bodybuilding is mostly aesthetic, while powerlifters don't mind the extra fat if it allows them to pack on more muscle, or even provide some leverage for deadlifts or strongmen type stuff.

    The reason I asked is I've been hearing the guys on mind pump podcast talking about using a higher rep, lower rest period routine as a means of boosting metabolism. I was curious to hear if there may be some truth to that or if it was mostly bro science. They talk up the idea of "building up metabolism" but I question how much one can actually bump their metabolism with weight lifting, even with a well chosen and executed routine.
    Hey, no problem. I actually listen to the Mind Pump podcast as well, I find them very entertaining! There's all sorts at play when it comes to leverages and body fat levels, way out of my remit to expand on but again I would revert back to my previous point, although bodybuilders are more aesthetically driven, our off-season and contest shape are often vastly different.

    Unfortunately, you have to take terms like "boosting metabolism" with a pinch of salt. There may be some truth to it, you could certainly cherry pick studies to back it up (equally you'd be able to find a study which had the opposite outcome) but the actual significance of it will be small. You need to question whether the people who are coining these terms have any bias, in this case, they sell training programmes so to an extent what they're saying is inherently flawed because their desired outcome.

    As I mentioned, I really like the Mind Pump podcast, they're not dogmatic at all and provide some really good information but don't get hung up on a particular style of training as there are a lot of variables and 'bigger rocks' at play. There is always a trade off, for example if you really push yourself during a workout your non exercise activity thermogenesis (NEAT) might be greatly reduced, so effectively you burn more calories whilst training (which might be what someone would term 'metabolism boosting') but then over the course of 24 hours your net calorie expenditure is matched because you've reduced your NEAT to compensate.

    The law of thermodynamics (calories in vs calories out) always applies, I wouldn't try and reinvent the wheel or try and waste energy trying to find a unique style of training which will give you a cutting edge. Whatever your goal; adherence and consistency will be the main drivers of success.
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  21. #21
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    broganoff is offline
    Interesting point regarding Bodybuilders during the off season, I never considered that.

    Originally Posted by deano110 View Post
    Unfortunately, you have to take terms like "boosting metabolism" with a pinch of salt.
    Yes, agreed. Some of the claims they make in that regard are a bit lofty. They seem to be bearish on cardio, which fits my preferences and confirmation bias (lol), but they also throw HIIT into the category of metabolically disadvantageous "don't do's". Which I find strange and in conflict with what most trainers and fitness personalities seem to think is beneficial for fat loss and metabolic health.

    Overall, cool guys and enjoyable to listen too, and at least they don't have 5 minute breaks plugging Onnit or other supplements every 15 minutes.
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